The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #41608   Message #608717
Posted By: Mark Clark
12-Dec-01 - 09:07 PM
Thread Name: Scared of Music theory? Faggggedaboudit!
Subject: RE: Scared of Music theory? Faggggedaboudit!
M.Ted, Yeah, I thought the A# looked like a typo. Someday when I've gone a year or two (or maybe even a day) without a typo, I'll start worrying about other people's typos. What is the quotation about getting the log out of my own eye before trying to remove the mote from someone else's. <g>

But I still have a question. You wrote:

First, I was writing about a different chord, F#A C E, which logically would be the F# dim7...

See, that's where I don't understand what you're trying to teach me. It seems clear to me—supported by two different authors—that the F#° chord must be spelled F# A C (Eb or D#). If I understand Evans and Baker (quoted above) correctly, naming the note D# is the enharmonic spelling sometimes used for clarity instead of the more conventional Eb. In either case, the named note must be a minor third above C or a diminished third above C#, the perfect fifth above F#.

F# A C E must properly be called F#-7(b5) as follows. A is the minor third of F# making it a minor chord, E is the dominant seventh of F# making it an F#-7 (minor seventh) and since C# is the perfect fifth of F#, C must be the flatted fifth, ergo F#-7(b5).

But then you wrote:

In F#, you would probably write it as F# A C D#, which is to say, your sharps are in the key signature, so you'd put natural signs next to the A and the C--in F, with one flat in the key signature, you'd put a accidental sharp next to the F and an accidental flat next to the E--

which exactly agrees with my enharmonic spelling for F#° and places each note a minor third above its predecessor.

I understand about the diminished triad occurring naturally in music without the diminished 7th. It's only by the convention of jazz and popular music that a diminished chord on a leadsheet is always assumed to refer to a diminished 7th. What I don't understand is a diminished 7th chord spelled with the diminished 7th note raised a half step to the dominant or minor 7th.

Where has my understanding gone awry?

      - Mark