Paul M.touche, a nice one. But I was making an observation, not an argument. Merely that the presence of songs about fights and fighters shows that they were heroes to the general public, as, I believe they still are. I'm fully aware of the futility of trying to defend boxing against the ban brigade. Boxing IS indefensible, you either approve or you don't. I don't much like the world of boxing business, it's sleazy and exploitative. But I have great respect for the skill and courage of the fighters themselves. Rick, yes, I have met Our Henry, and several other well-known ex-pro's. I am friendly with Barry McGuigan, former world champion,a lucid and eloquent worker for better, safer, conditions for all boxers. I did a radio programme with him about Bendigo, the bare-knuckle champion. Bendigo came from my home town. The statue of a lion built over his grave is now so weatherbeaten as to be unrecogniseable. BTW, I too could have answered the question about Marvin Hart.