The Mudcat Café TM
Thread #48495   Message #728861
Posted By: GUEST,SeanN
12-Jun-02 - 09:36 PM
Thread Name: Lyr Req: Lakes of Pontchartrain - Irish Words
Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Lakes of Ponchartrain - Irish Words
Malcolm, I agree that it is common courtesy to post English language translations for Irish songs, as one would for songs in any other language, in a predominantly English language forum.

I disagree with a number of your other points, though. I'm sure this won't be seen as pretty for some of the English posters here, but I'm going to have my say on the issue, regardless.

None of the reasons you cite for being "argumentative" (as you put it) are reasonable justifications for snide comments and remarks about Irish music. A mere 20 or so years ago, the exact opposite influence was afoot--everything Irish was presumed by most Americans to be English. What goes around, comes around as Vonnegut said.

These "origins" obsessesions are driven by a nationalist desire seen all too often among English and "British" folk. Among certain elements of the English folk scene in particular, that desire then becomes an obsession with dispossessing the Irish of any "ownership" of songs which can also be found in English or Scottish traditions, especially in international forums on the web.

Those sorts of "arguments" only matter to those of you who believe the indigenous music of those islands needs to be "owned" by the English or Scottish. It is the result of many years social conditioning among the English/British. We see this sort of anti-Irish English nationalism rearing it's ugly head all over the internet in forums where English and Irish interests are both discussed.

It would be nice if these same English/British folk would become a bit more self-aware of their own prejudices, and try to refrain from making these sorts of essentialist statements which have no real foundation or relevance to the matter at hand.

The original poster was looking for the Irish lyrics to an American song, not for a bigoted diatribe against the Irish, the Irish language, or even Andy Irvine for referring to himself as Irish.

Is mise le meas,