Thanks Nutty, was at Alcester, and can see Beverley Minster from Mum's flat, so would not be allowed to camp (or drink!) just need a Helmsley monthly! We are booked for Shellbacks and Foxs most weekends until August an it is then that we wanted to get away with no respsonsibilities! Yes Janey that was me at Alcester it was a good do but I didn't get time to sit and sing in a singaround:-( Thank you for reminding me about the Old Dungeoen Ghyll, I went there in my first life 20 years ago when I wasn't into folk- Do they still have an Irish Wolfhound?