Chipping away. At least we made our presence felt in the questions, and prompted Kim Howells into another publoc bit of misinformation, when in one of the few posts he responded to he asserted that the maximum penalty was "reserved" for managers who block fire exits and so forth. And of course the Bill says nothing of the sort.

Do you think he has actually got round to reading the Bill? He shows no sign of having done so. I did so last night - it's a really soggy bit of drafting.

One thing I hadn't realised - ot says you can't be a club under this Bill if you have fewer than 25 members. There are a few folk clubs around who'd have difficulty meeting that requirement.