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Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?

katlaughing 31 Dec 99 - 04:33 PM
Richard Bridge 31 Dec 99 - 05:16 PM
Áine 31 Dec 99 - 05:40 PM
wildlone 31 Dec 99 - 05:45 PM
Áine 31 Dec 99 - 05:51 PM
Áine 31 Dec 99 - 05:54 PM
Richard Bridge 31 Dec 99 - 06:03 PM
paddymac 31 Dec 99 - 06:11 PM
katlaughing 31 Dec 99 - 06:18 PM
Áine 31 Dec 99 - 06:20 PM
wildlone 31 Dec 99 - 06:28 PM
Richard Bridge 31 Dec 99 - 06:37 PM
katlaughing 31 Dec 99 - 06:49 PM
bseed(charleskratz) 31 Dec 99 - 08:22 PM
JenEllen 31 Dec 99 - 08:32 PM
Jon Freeman 31 Dec 99 - 09:10 PM
katlaughing 01 Jan 00 - 12:50 AM
01 Jan 00 - 01:36 AM
Áine 01 Jan 00 - 01:45 AM
Jon Freeman 01 Jan 00 - 01:46 AM
catspaw49 01 Jan 00 - 01:49 AM
Áine 01 Jan 00 - 01:50 AM
catspaw49 01 Jan 00 - 01:56 AM
Jeri 01 Jan 00 - 01:57 AM
Jon Freeman 01 Jan 00 - 01:58 AM
catspaw49 01 Jan 00 - 02:09 AM
katlaughing 01 Jan 00 - 02:14 AM
Jon Freeman 01 Jan 00 - 02:18 AM
catspaw49 01 Jan 00 - 02:21 AM
thosp 01 Jan 00 - 02:24 AM
katlaughing 01 Jan 00 - 02:27 AM
catspaw49 01 Jan 00 - 02:28 AM
Áine 01 Jan 00 - 02:30 AM
Jon Freeman 01 Jan 00 - 02:44 AM
McGrath of Harlow 01 Jan 00 - 06:34 AM
catspaw49 01 Jan 00 - 07:54 AM
Shimbo Darktree 01 Jan 00 - 08:28 AM
catspaw49 01 Jan 00 - 10:05 AM
katlaughing 01 Jan 00 - 10:21 AM
MMario 01 Jan 00 - 10:54 AM
Áine 01 Jan 00 - 11:06 AM
Rosebrook 01 Jan 00 - 06:30 PM
katlaughing 01 Jan 00 - 06:43 PM
wildlone 01 Jan 00 - 06:59 PM
Terry Allan Hall 01 Jan 00 - 07:12 PM
Bill D 01 Jan 00 - 08:15 PM
Bill D 01 Jan 00 - 08:18 PM
Bill D 01 Jan 00 - 08:20 PM
wildlone 01 Jan 00 - 08:23 PM
Bill D 01 Jan 00 - 08:23 PM
wildlone 01 Jan 00 - 08:24 PM
Mbo 01 Jan 00 - 09:11 PM
Mbo 01 Jan 00 - 09:13 PM
katlaughing 01 Jan 00 - 09:22 PM
catspaw49 01 Jan 00 - 09:35 PM
katlaughing 01 Jan 00 - 09:44 PM
Brendy 01 Jan 00 - 11:20 PM
_gargoyle 02 Jan 00 - 02:14 AM
Brendy 02 Jan 00 - 02:22 AM
katlaughing 02 Jan 00 - 09:18 AM
Jeri 02 Jan 00 - 11:37 AM
Margo 02 Jan 00 - 12:04 PM
katlaughing 02 Jan 00 - 12:17 PM
Margo 02 Jan 00 - 12:38 PM
Jeri 02 Jan 00 - 12:57 PM
katlaughing 02 Jan 00 - 01:20 PM
sophocleese 02 Jan 00 - 02:37 PM
Margo 02 Jan 00 - 03:06 PM
Mbo 02 Jan 00 - 03:31 PM
katlaughing 02 Jan 00 - 03:41 PM
wildlone 02 Jan 00 - 04:26 PM
_gargoyle 02 Jan 00 - 04:39 PM
Brendy 02 Jan 00 - 11:29 PM
_gargoyle 03 Jan 00 - 12:03 AM
Joe Offer 03 Jan 00 - 02:38 AM
bseed(charleskratz) 03 Jan 00 - 05:02 AM
Rosebrook 03 Jan 00 - 10:10 AM
MandolinPaul 03 Jan 00 - 10:30 AM
MandolinPaul 03 Jan 00 - 10:36 AM
MMario 03 Jan 00 - 10:38 AM
sophocleese 03 Jan 00 - 12:11 PM
Margo 03 Jan 00 - 01:02 PM
03 Jan 00 - 01:31 PM
Lonesome EJ 03 Jan 00 - 02:14 PM
wildlone 03 Jan 00 - 02:17 PM
Áine 03 Jan 00 - 03:29 PM
sophocleese 03 Jan 00 - 03:45 PM
wildlone 03 Jan 00 - 03:49 PM
katlaughing 03 Jan 00 - 04:32 PM
Áine 03 Jan 00 - 04:54 PM
Joe Offer 03 Jan 00 - 05:01 PM
katlaughing 03 Jan 00 - 05:13 PM
Margo 03 Jan 00 - 05:22 PM
Rick Fielding 03 Jan 00 - 05:38 PM
InOBU 03 Jan 00 - 05:50 PM
sophocleese 03 Jan 00 - 05:58 PM
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Joe Offer 03 Jan 00 - 06:55 PM
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DougR 03 Jan 00 - 07:34 PM
Mbo 03 Jan 00 - 07:46 PM
Jon Freeman 03 Jan 00 - 07:52 PM
Fred M. 03 Jan 00 - 07:55 PM
Richard Bridge 03 Jan 00 - 08:00 PM
DougR 03 Jan 00 - 08:32 PM
Bill D 03 Jan 00 - 09:08 PM
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Subject: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 04:33 PM

Do your fingers twitch when you get to the end of a thread?

Do feel your eyes glaze over, your brain go on Auto, while reading a thread, thinking of what you will say at the end?

CAN you read a thread all the way through and NOT post to it?

If you answered YES to the first two quetions and NO to the last, you may be suffering from Compulsive Posting Disorder.

If you enter into a Contract for Treatment at the Compulsive Posting Disorder Clinic* or CPDC, you will learn to

1) THINK before posting a reply;

2) ask yourself, if what you are about to post is really necessary;

3) determine if a thread is even worthy of any comment.

Mental health can be yours! Just take your hand off the mouse, look at your telephone dialing pad, and reach out to CPDC.

With ONE PHONE CALL, you can be on your way to HEALTHY posting. Just dial 1-555-2723, that's 1-555-CPDC.

Help is just a phone call away!

Hey! I called and they helped me! saved me from a long stay at the Neil Young Center for the Terminally Screwed. So what are you waiting for? Go ahead, call the good phoaks at CPDC, today!

*

This program is not endorsed by any authorities, nor does it represent any views of the management. We make no claims of individual progress.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 05:16 PM

Kat, I can safely say I am not guilty because I have been absent for some time. But I am worried by the spirit of censoriousness you display. I have seen this in the mudcat before - remember the thread "Has Gargoyle got piles"? Probably all of us post when it is not necessary. But what is necessary? Is any of what we do here (on this site) necessary? Would imposing too rigid a test lessen this forum? I suspect so. Tonight I can sit and post (a funny way to wait for the millennium, if it is the millennium) because my wife went into hospital earlier today so she can't stop me. So this reading and posting is helpful to me. Would you censor or disalow that because what I asy may not be necessary?

Or, perhaps, has someone else got up your nose? If so, why not spit it out? (check for correct colloquial meaning before replying to the sexual innuendo which is not the required meaning in context).

Have a good next thousand years.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Áine
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 05:40 PM

Dear Richard,

Just a couple of comments about your post (hope you come back more often!):

1) I do believe that Kat is just trying to be funny; especially since she is one of the more vehement supporters of free speech on this forum and always has been;

2) I've been sitting here, trying to contemplate HOW someone would spit out of their nose -- and I've been sitting here trying to figure out WHAT sexual innuendo you were attempting -- I can't figure it out, however. Illumination on my quandry would be appreciated . . . because I'm burning brain cells imagining all KINDS of things . . .

-- Áine


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: wildlone
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 05:45 PM

I know that oral sex is talking about it.
BUT Nasal sex? no it can't be.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Áine
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 05:51 PM

Mmmmmm . . . it does give a new meaning to the phrase 'blowing your nose', doesn't it?

-- Áine


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Áine
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 05:54 PM

. . . let's see, you can blow your nose, your friend can blow their nose, but, can you blow your friend's nose? . . . Mmmmmmmm


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 06:03 PM

How sad, the only response is on the innuendo.

Ther is a very old joke about a man with wide nostrils in a submarine, but it is not mudcatfit.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: paddymac
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 06:11 PM

Hey Kat - is that the place that delivers Guiness with your pizza? Make mine mushrooms and sausage, and please, guys, snot's not funny, just gross! Maybe I'm just too innocent for my own good, 'cause I didn't see any sexual innuendo in Richard's post, even though he suggested there was one.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 06:18 PM

Ah, Áine, you've got it right, 'twas meant to be a tongue-in-cheek bit of sarcasm.

Richard, I am sorry to hear about your wife, but it is nice to see you on here and Áine is correct in saying I am a staunch supporter of Mudder's right to be free wiht their mouths, other than GG, who, IMO, should really follow the advice above.

As for anyone getting up my nose, well....that is NOT the preferred orifice, but yes, I've had my back up a wee. The labourious and unending back and forth on thread content and certain peoples' obvious displeasure at my being here and being vocal has pissed me off to the point I am thinking of usurping the Curmudgeon for the Day title, for the whole next year.

I have come here and been myself, which is the only way I know to be. I won't say I am sorry about that. I followed-the-leader, when I came here a year ago, and played nice, before sticking my neck out and letting some of my views and personal experiences be known. Based on the positive reactions to that, I continued. Now people are pissed off about religion and philsophy being here, amongst the music, and I do NOT want THIS thread to turn into one more endless bunch of crap about to BS or not to BS, so I'll just say that I am pissed off, too.

I wouldn't stop unless the whole lot told me I wasn't wanted and to fuck off, so you're all stuck with me anyway. Too bad, huh, Gargoyle? Just can't get rid of me.

Maybe I should have named this the Rant & Rave thread, but I really do seriously think some people should really think before they post some of the things they do.

Thanks for listening and frankly, I don't care how they did it way back when. This is now and nobody will stop anyone from going Back to the Future of Threads for some good ole' reads.

kat


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Áine
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 06:20 PM

Dearest, dearest Kat --

I'M STUCK LIKE GLUE TO YOU, BABE!!!

Go girl!

-- Áine


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: wildlone
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 06:28 PM

Good on ya kat my sentiments exactly.
Richard i do not know you but i checked some of your old posts you seem to know a lot about UK folk so do you come from here,sorry to hear about your wife. I hope you continue to visit the Mudcat.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 06:37 PM

Aine,Kat

Yes, I used to be here quite a bit. Likewise my friend Legal Eagle. But he is I think gone for good. Time.........!

I wanted to understand why it was necessary to remind people not to post. Do we not mostly (with some exceptions) learn or potentially learn from postings? (off to the Bobby Sands thread next - an exception to the rule). If people post unwisely they will be pilloried or worse ignored. Why restrict them?

As for GG - I still want to know what drives him. Some of his stuff is helpful and intelligent - some just nasty (but enough about marriage). I was upset when people jumped on the "piles" thread.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 06:49 PM

Richard, I do remember you being on here and also Legal Eagle; you've both been missed. Please understand:

The first posting to this thread, WAS A JOKE! (And, I meant the last bit to be in small print,went the wrong way wiht html code.)

I do NOT believe people should be censored. I DO believe people who post deliberately vicious, personal, thoughtless and hurtful crap (see GG's post on the Suicidal Friend thread) should think twice, even three or four times, before hitting the submit button.

As for GG, I am with Mick, his redeeming qualities are far surpassed by his mean and vicious bullshit.

kat


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: bseed(charleskratz)
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 08:22 PM

Well, I caught your sexual innuendo, Richard. Your wife is in the hospital and you sit at home and POST? For shame.

--seed


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: JenEllen
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 08:32 PM

Lots of hugs Kat. And here's to hoping you continue to share with all of us and speak your mind when you see fit.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 31 Dec 99 - 09:10 PM

Well Kat, I think I might be afflicted with this condition. Trouble is a) I don't want to admit and b) don't really want to be cured.

Happy New Year,

Jon


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 12:50 AM

LOL, Jon! There's NO hope for you, my friend!**BG** And, thanks to you all for jumping in.

luvyaKat


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From:
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 01:36 AM

It appears someone hit the bubbly too heavy tonight.

Let it go.

Its a new year.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Áine
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 01:45 AM


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 01:46 AM

Now Aine, don't tell me that your fingers are so itchy that you even have to send without saying anything ;-)

Jon


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: catspaw49
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 01:49 AM

Good night all.

Just had to be said...............

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Áine
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 01:50 AM

Tee-hee -- Well, there ya go, I even post when I've nothin' to say! Yes folks, I am a sufferer of CPD -- and damn proud of it! Bubbly or no bubbly, Guinness or no Guinness, I'll post whenever and wherever and whatever . . . It's 2000 A.D. or C.E. (depending on your persuasion) and what's a forum for if ya can't post on it?

Happy New Year fellow compulsive posters, and more power to your elbow (or mouse finger -- depending on your persuasion)!

--- Áine


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: catspaw49
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 01:56 AM

Dammit Aine I said GOODNIGHT!!!!

How many times am I going to have to say this?

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Jeri
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 01:57 AM

My guess would be about 23.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 01:58 AM

Good night Catspaw

And so the last line is mine

GOOD NIGHT JON-BOY

Jon


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: catspaw49
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 02:09 AM

OK Jeri....goodnightgoodnightgoodnightgoodnightgoodnightgoodnight.. goodnightgoodnightgoodnightgoodnightgoodnightgoodnight goodnightgoodnightgoodnightgoodnightgoodnightgoodnight

goodnightgoodnightgoodnightgoodnight .. and goodnight.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 02:14 AM

Anon....I don't drink, can't stand the taste of most of it. Why do you have to hide to accuse me of such?

Do you find it hard to believe some of us can be naturally exuberant?


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 02:18 AM

Well Kat, you may not drink but I have probably drunk enough for both of us tonight and am still drinking and enjoying it. Still have 3 pints of Newcastle Bronw that insist on being consumed (yes they are screaming "drink me") before I go to bed.

Jon


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: catspaw49
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 02:21 AM

You'd think the 23 would've been enough, but OK.....

Good Night Katmyluv.

Good Night Jon Boy.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: thosp
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 02:24 AM

goodnite GrandSpaw!


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 02:27 AM

S'right!

Hey, Spaw, I was just thinking, yes, thinking! You and me, we could have our own show....we'd call it the

KatnSpaw Show!


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: catspaw49
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 02:28 AM

Well thank you thosp....and on that note I WILL say goodnight!!!

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Áine
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 02:30 AM

OK -- so all I git is a 'dammit' and Kat gets a 'luv' thang? Sure, go on to bed ya ole possum blower ya . . .


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 02:44 AM

OK Aine, you win, have the last word, see if I care ;-)

Jon


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 06:34 AM

Morning all.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: catspaw49
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 07:54 AM

Good Night Mac..........Oh, sorry, force of habit...............GOOD MORNING.....yeah, that's it......

Ah Aine, how could I have been so thoughtless to my favorite bonnie blue Texas lass.........Luvya too!!

Spaw - saggy tortoise ass possum blower


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Shimbo Darktree
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 08:28 AM

To all serious thread-posters,

There is no way I feel compelled to post to the end of a thread
and say nothing ...
Shimbo


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: catspaw49
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 10:05 AM

....or to respond to nothing either. I'm with you Shimbo.

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 10:21 AM

We could start using UTP to classify such as "Useless Thread Posting", thus eliminating a few more seconds of wasted time for the serious lot. i.e.

WARNING: UTP!! Just posting in a shameless bid to keep this thread going!


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: MMario
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 10:54 AM

*chortle* they weren't music, but I got a lot of laughs out of posting tonight...and that DOES make them the music of life.....

or maybe not.

morning all

MMario


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Áine
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 11:06 AM

Good morning all my fellow CPD sufferers -- especially to my favorite saggy tortoise ass possum blower!!

Hubby and I only got half way through the second bottle of bubbly last night (this morning?) before we fell into bed. Fortunately, I remembered to take my glass of water and three aspirins -- Hubby did not -- too bad, so sad -- and it's HIS parents we've got to go have dinner with today!

Luv ya, Áine (LMAO at himself holding his humble head!)


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Rosebrook
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 06:30 PM

I really don't get it.

I remember a thread not too long ago started by a person who chronicled details of her middle-of-the-night visit to the bathroom. And now we are being concerned about the appropriateness of thread context?

I am not one to add to threads compulsively. But I do get my hackles up when anyone tries to regulate anyone's posting behavior other than their own. I guess I just don't get it.

Rose


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 06:43 PM

Rose! IT IS A JOKE! THIS WHOLE THREAD WAS MEANT AS A JOKE, A BIT OF SARCASM!

I DO NOT BELIEVE IN CENSORSHIP I was only saying I believe it is a person's responsibility to think before posting something which may be personal, vicious, and hurtful.

Sorry for the caps, but I did say before that I was just poking fun. The ones who've been bytching about thread content, usually point to me or Spaw, as those who post so much that they consider fluff! I am just getting in their face for it!

Hope this helps to clarify things.

kat


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: wildlone
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 06:59 PM

wibble wibble blah-blah BS humph humph OS splutter groan moan censorship serious phatang blump music bloart old days
Sorry just trying to inject some intelligent conversation to this thread.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Terry Allan Hall
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 07:12 PM

Hmmmmmmmmm...........

OK, I'm gonna slide down to CPA (Compulsive Posters Anonymous) and the the 12-step rhumba...just as soon as I get back from PA (Procastinators Anonymous)...

And a grand new millenium to all, Mudcatters and the less evolved, too!

;-)


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 08:15 PM

*IGNORE THIS POST*


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 08:18 PM

if, by some chance, you have inadvertently paid attention the the preceeding post, you may, instead, disregard this addendum....


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 08:20 PM

...tsk...I see I made a typo in the preceeding post, but it is useless to go back and correct it,because I would NEVER follow up my own posts...and after all, you are all ignoring it...or disregarding it..aren't you?


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: wildlone
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 08:23 PM

never payed it any attention at all


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 08:23 PM

ah, ah..!! I see you! You are tempted, aren't you? Don't do it!!


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: wildlone
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 08:24 PM

too late


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Mbo
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 09:11 PM

I don't have CTP!

--Mbo


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Mbo
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 09:13 PM

I don't have CTP!

--Mbo


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 09:22 PM

Awright, now, will you all just STOP IT!??? I was expecting some very serious discussions about this very serious problem. I at least expected some naysayers to come in and give me/us hell! You all are just WAY TOO silly and nice! Bah! stomping off in a huff, the she-curmudgeon glares back over her shoulder, flings open the door, dramatically steps through, and slams it behind her with a large crash!


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: catspaw49
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 09:35 PM

What you mean "us" Kemosabe? LMAO!!!!!!

Spaw


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 09:44 PM

Oh yeah, baby, WE ARE IN THIS TOGETHER. It's you and me all the way. There's NO WAY, you're gitting outta this!

LOL.....luvyaSpaw-kat


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Brendy
Date: 01 Jan 00 - 11:20 PM

Well, I read it from the top, every one, and I rolled a cigarette, sat back , and wondered.....Will I post to this?
Then I made myself a cup of tea, read through a couple of them again, rolled another cigarette, smoked it.... and wondered again whether I should contribute to this thread.........so I did! HAAAAAAppy Newyear


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: _gargoyle
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 02:14 AM

I take it, that THIS is your New Year's Resolution.

Follow it, and we ALL will be better off.

Glad you have seen the light.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Brendy
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 02:22 AM

Ah _garg, every one a gem.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 09:18 AM

What light, where? Fawk off, garg, that's my resolution, not taking anymore of your shit quietly.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Jeri
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 11:37 AM

And here I thought it was a clever bit of irony, intentional or otherwise - Garg demonstrating his own CTP while pointing fingers at others.
Jeri
(Who also quite often falls victim to the "I know I shouldn't, but I just had to get my .02 in" syndrome.)


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Margo
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 12:04 PM

I disagree with you Kat. I don't think your "it's ok for everyone but Gargoyle" philosophy washes. Either you're not in favor of cencorship, or you are. No in between. If Gargoyle posts and is wierd or offensive, then all will see that. How can you identify your friends/enemys if they aren't allowed to show true colors? If you go back and read (objectivly) Gargoyle's post in this thread, then read your post, you'll see that your's is very rude and his is not. This what happens when you react emotionally to what you hate. You internalize it and it becomes a part of you. You have become ruder than Gargoyle.

Please understand I am speaking in total objectivity. I have no feeling whatsoever for Gargoyle. I think he is rude and wierd, but I just see that he is. He doesn't make my blood boil. If he did, then I would be tempted to be rude to. Get it?

Much love, Margo


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 12:17 PM

Margo, you should know me better than that. One gets tired of always being a pollyanna and turning the other cheek. Once in awhile, one can just be a righteous bytch, okay?!

NOW, PLEASE, PEOPLE, READ MY LIPS:

I am NOT, nor have I ever been in favour of censorship! I have never singled any one person out saying they should not be allowed to post. I have stated several times in this thread, already, is that people, myelf included, should think twice before they post anything which is a personal, mean, and/or vicious attack.

It astounds me that sensitive, caring people can be so politically correct that they immediately come to the defense of someone who not only has stalked one or more of our members, off the Mudcat, but who also posts such heinous vile as gregg did to emily, telling her to let her friend commit suicide, or to JU, telling him it's time to die.

Yeah, Jeri, I know, I've risen to the occasion; it's not real life phoaks, as one Mudder keeps reminding me. It's just a hobby and hobbies are suppposed to be fun, so I am not going to take crap in my part of this hobby, anymore.

katwhogotitalongtimeago


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Margo
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 12:38 PM

You misunderstood, Kat. I am not defending Gargoyle. I am pointing out that you are telling him to think twice before posting so he won't be himself. Yet you are posting with rudeness which is apparently something you don't think is bad. You have set a double standard. I think you're both rude. I never said anything about turning the other cheek. I'm saying that if you can post in whatever style you choose, don't tell him to change himself. Let him rant that all may see he is mad. I find it amusing that you call me politically correct. I am trying to promote a little objectivity. I am saying that Gargoyle's rudeness has been handled poorly and that the rudeness has spread because of it. Margo


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Jeri
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 12:57 PM

Margo, Amen. He's like a poison - you can choose to drink it and become like he is, or you can leave it alone. It isn't about who or what gargoyle is, it's about who you are and what sort of person you allow him to turn you into. If his goal is to poison this place, especially his hated BS threads, he seems to be succeding quite well. And it is real life, with real people reading real words, and feeling real feelings invoked by those words. I'd prefer his comments to go ignored than to have every thread he posts in become about him. His words don't matter very much to me. Yours do, Kat.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 01:20 PM

And, I feel both of you are trying to constrict me to the only the type of postings you are used to from me. Reminds me of when I was in school. On a quiet day for me, everyone thought something was wrong, when I really just felt like being quiet. Margo, is gg the only one allowed to vent his anger and be "rude"?

We've had discussions before on free speech and the pain it can cause and we apparently will never agree on it. I NEVER said that ONLY gargoyle should think about what he is posting. I SAID WE SHOULD ALL THINK TWICE BEFORE POSTING SOMETHING PERSONAL, MEAN, AND VICIOUS. I still say that.

Gargoyle is powerless to "make" me anything. This thread was started because I was tired of people who bytched about all the postings to BS threads. That he came up in it was inevitable. NOT talking about him or to him has done no good.

As I said before, if the majority tell me to get lost, I will, until then I intend to be vocal and opinionated. I will also make a sincere effort at self-censorship so that my postings do not contain anything vile, personal or vicious.

kat


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: sophocleese
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 02:37 PM

katlaughing I think the joke was a failure. Oh well you tried. You are a hot-tempered, opinionated and prolific poster. You cannot be that without getting flack. Clearly gargoyle pisses you off and despite valiant attempts you aren't able to bless and release in the way that you would like to. Others also react to gargoyle, you're not alone. You have the right to be rude and anybody else has the right to say I don't like your rudeness. If it pisses you off take a walk and realize that you also get far more compliments than most people on this forum.

One thing that has alternately amused and exasperated me are the threads which extoll the virtues and wonderful warmth and caring nature of this Mudcat community contrasted with the rudeness of many posts, and I'm not talking only of gargoyle. The rudeness of anybody reads like a bad taste. It is possible to disagree without being nasty. I often take ages to post when I am moved simply because I be clear in what I say and not hurt others. I only came here in September and don't have the history that others have here, but the view from where I am is that Gargoyle is sporadically rude and vicious and that others are equally arbitrary in their rudeness towards him. Its a dynamic I can't change I simply notice it, but it does mean that I take every comment about the pleasantness of the mudcat with a grain of salt.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Margo
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 03:06 PM

Thanks, Soph. Kat, I am saying precisely that if one is allowed to be rude then all ought to be allowed to be rude. If you don't like rude posters, don't be one of them. There are no rules here, and there are a few people who have the power of censorship which they don't use. (Daddy Max and Jobro) The only thing we have ownership in here in this forum are our words. I think we should use them carefully and with dignity. (After all, newbies drop by......) If you could be in the same room as me you could hear my tone of voice and facial expression, and you'd know I am affectionately yours, Margo


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Mbo
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 03:31 PM

Don't worry, Kat, I thought it was funny! Some people take things TOO seriously! They should lighten up! Ignore Gargoyle's weird remarks. I do, thought whenever he posts to my music threads, he usually is well-mannered. I don't need to get mad at him. I think Gargoyle is pretending to be weird, like Hamlet, and really not as mad as he seems. BTW I'm posting to this thread because I've got CTP!:{>

--Mbo


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 03:41 PM

Margo, I wish we were in the same room, because through here, your remarks sound condescending, but that is just MY interpretation.

I said, "The labourious and unending back and forth on thread content and certain peoples' obvious displeasure at my being here and being vocal has pissed me off to the point I am thinking of usurping the Curmudgeon for the Day title, for the whole next year."

and,

"I do NOT want THIS thread to turn into one more endless bunch of crap about to BS or not to BS, so I'll just say that I am pissed off, too."

I KNOW it is an open forum. Why does the simple suggestion that people THINK before they post something have to turn into such a BIG deal???!!!

Thanks, Embow and Soph, although I don't agree with you on taking the good with a grain of salt.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: wildlone
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 04:26 PM

I Will now ruin your thread kat by putting this on it

Bring Back

Sung to the well-known Scottish air

My brother lies over the ocean,
My sister lies over the sea,
My father lies over my mother
And that's how they got little me.

Chorus:
Bring back, bring back,
Oh bring back my Bonnie to me, to me.
Bring back, bring back,
Oh bring back my Bonnie to me.

My one skin lies over my two skin,
My two skin lies over my three,
My three skin lies over my foreskin,
So pull back my foreskin for me.

Pull back, pull back,
Oh pull back my foreskin for me, for me.
Pull back, pull back,
Oh pull back my foreskin for me.

There you are a song now maybe people will be happy.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: _gargoyle
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 04:39 PM

Brought a smile to my face!!!THANX


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Brendy
Date: 02 Jan 00 - 11:29 PM

What's it like to be a big hit with all the girls then, _garg?


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: _gargoyle
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 12:03 AM

Dear Kat...."Serenity Prayer" since you are sober???(AA)

Perhaps, "Sister Mary, comes to me, wisper words of wisdom, let it be,....let it be....(transendentalism)

When peace like a river attendth my soul
When sorrows like sea rivers roll.
What er' be my lot,
Thou hast taught me to say....

What ever your persuasion....you MUST LET GO!!!

May Peace Be With You!!

gargoyle

thanx for the good times


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Subject: Compulsive Thread Posting-Guilty?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 02:38 AM

I thought a long time about whether I should post to this thread or not. I try really hard to be nice, but I guess I have a right to occasionally succumb to continuous provocation.

The person who started this thread appears to have had nothing to do on New Year's Eve; so, in an attempt to liven things up and bolster her own ego, she made a valiant attempt to start what is known on the Internet as a "flame war." She made statements that were clearly intended to provoke strong responses from those who are annoyed with her. She is well aware that these negative responses would then draw equally vitriolic retorts from her supporters. And so on. And so on.
Well, I hope the flame war was interesting and constructive. Didn't seem so to me, though. It just got me upset, and made it very difficult for me to remain patient and kind and reasonable.

Let's examine that first post a little more carefully. I think there was some good advice there:
  • 1) THINK before posting a reply;
  • 2) ask yourself, if what you are about to post is really necessary;
  • 3) determine if a thread is even worthy of any comment.
That all seems like good advice to me. I wonder if the person who started this thread would like to honestly say whether or not she has lived up to those rules. If not, would it be unfair to ask her to try to follow those rules for just one week? It would be interesting to see what effect that might have on things around here.

Along that vein, I'd like to ask something. If a person walks into a respected folk music forum and posts thousands of messages that have nothing whatsoever to do with folk music, can she rightly expect to escape disagreement and criticism? Is it unfair of people to question that?

The poster claims to be vocal and opinionated. That's fine - I just have never figured out what it was that she was vocal and opinionated about. She claims a right of "free speech," but what is it she's talking about? Early last year, she posted a few newspaper columns she had written. The columns were fairly good, and they received a favorable response, even though they did not have anything to do with folk music. I've been trying to think of what she's said since then that has any substance, and I can't think of anything. Maybe she has said something of substance, but it is clouded in so much verbiage that her actual ideas can't be found.

Then she complains that people are angry about "religion and philosophy being here." Well, there's a difference between discussion of religious and philosophical ideas, and actual religious practices. I realize that's a thin line, but let me try to explain. If I were to post a prayer or a hymn here, for the purpose of discussing it from a musical or literary or cultural or philosophical standpoint, I think that would be appropriate. If I were to post a prayer here for the purpose of praying, then I'm not sure that would be appropriate - especially if the prayer were something of a sectarian nature, something that would make certain people feel unfomfortable or excluded. Personally, I think the Mudcat Healing Circle crossed that line, and it would be more appropriate to express such sympathies and rituals in private e-mail messages.

OK, that's the reasonable, philosophical discussion of this whole thing. Now I'll lay it on straight: Kat, this is a folk music forum, intended primarily to the discussion of folk music and related topics. You came in here a year ago and posted thousands of messages that have nothing to do with anything. All your messages do is fill up space and get people angry at each other. If you have something to say about folk music, or if you want to ask questions and learn something about folk music, stick around. If you don't, go away.

Thank you.

-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: bseed(charleskratz)
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 05:02 AM

Joe, that made me very uncomfortable. Although the language was temperate, the sentiment was, to coin a phrase, gargoylian--without Gargoyle's (often wicked) sense of humor. It is expressive of a rigid orthodoxy which has time and time again been rejected by the vast majority of members. I wish you had considered a bit longer before you posted.

--seed


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Rosebrook
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 10:10 AM

Thank you, Joe. You've well expressed what I have felt for a long time.

I guess my earlier post in this thread was a feeble attempt at trying to gently say something similar. I still don't get it, the double standard for thread appropriateness, and being shouted at doesn't help me get it.

I also echo your sentiments about the Mudcat Healing Circle. I have been uncomfortable with that. But not because of the content - I, too participate in earth-centered religious rituals and ceremonies - but because I am not in favor of in-your-face approaches to any religious activities. I understand that those threads are clearly marked and I don't have to read them, but anyone coming to the Mudcat Cafe who reads this forum board is faced with those thread titles. It is a representation of religious activity on this forum. And it is offensive - just as ANY religious activity would be.

The basis for the post - encouraging us all to post kindly and appropriately - is a good idea. And I disagree, I don't think that it is a joke.

Rose


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: MandolinPaul
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 10:30 AM

Hey Joe and Rose.

It's been said before: Most of the BS and Healing Circle threads are clearly labelled in the subject line. If it makes you uncomfortable, impatient, angry, whatever, don't click it.

Do you walk down the street looking for conversations you don't agree with, just so that you can feel badly? The good thing about having thread titles is that we can make a reasonable guess about whether we're interested, before we read it.

...and Seed said exactly what I was thinking about your post, Joe.

Paul


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: MandolinPaul
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 10:36 AM

Now honestly, who wouldn't have understood that the original post was a joke?

Get over yourselves, kids.

Paul.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: MMario
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 10:38 AM

Excuse me? religious activity is offensive? Well - THAT is probably the most offensive remark or comment I have heard in 18 months! Rosebrook, if you intended to push buttons, you certainly have. I don't ask ANYONE to believe as I believe or to do as I do for religious reasons, but don't even THINK of telling me not to have them or act by them.

MMario


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: sophocleese
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 12:11 PM

Paul S. The original posting was clearly a joke and it was carried a nice distance by others. However given the tension that exists regarding what are good postings and what are flimsy and unnecessary postings it was a joke with a sting in it. Joe's perception of it as a deliberate attempt to stir flames is valid. One thing I find strange on the Net is the way in which a written medium is taking on more and more characteristics of an oral one. There are many posts which seem less the result of careful composition than the immediate, snappy, backanswer of conversation.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Margo
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 01:02 PM

Here here, Soph and Joe.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From:
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 01:31 PM

Thank you Joe - you said what I felt and could not


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 02:14 PM

What we are seeing is the emergence of several self-appointed policemen in this Forum, whose sworn duty is to determine what is and isn't an acceptable subject for the Mudcat. If they have been deputized by Max, I am not aware of it. Could I please see your badge,Officer?

Neil's thread on Bobby Sands had little to do with Folk Music, though there were some half-hearted attempts at linking it to Bobby's song-writing, but it is in my opinion one of the best threads to come down the Mudcat pike in some time. Would the Forum Police have quashed this excellent discussion?

I have had a pretty high opinion of Joe Offer's view and statements in the past, but when he makes a statement like "the person who posted this thread had nothing to do on New Years and to bolster her own ego attempted to start a flame war" and other pieces of nastiness, I wonder that he would then have the nerve to tell her " if you want to learn something about folk music, stick around.If not go away." Again sir, may we see your badge?

I don't agree with all of Katlaughing's postings, but I believe she is a vital part of this community. I have never known her to lash out at someone, unless that someone took a swing at her first. And furthermore, I believe this Forum is a venue for the free exchange of ideas, and that music is the basis, but not the sum total of it's Reason for Being. To make attempts to threaten or coerce participants into abiding by THEIR rigid concept of what it should be poses a greater to the Mudcat than any bs or healing circle thread.

LEJ


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: wildlone
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 02:17 PM

Twice I have tried an atempt to inject humour into this thread however feeble or obscene now I will be serious,
The gift of healing is bestowed on people to use for good.I use a hands on approach using crystals or just a feel for were the problem lies I never do anything my subject will object to, I never ask for clothing to be removed in some cases this would be hard anyway as I also help animals.
I have never ask for or been given payment the only thing I get is what I recieve back in the form of seeing what I have done make the subject feel good in itself.
I cannot see that using such a gift given freely without question to those that ask here on the Mudcat should be construed as "IN YOUR FACE RELIGION".
I feel that Earth centred activities can disrupt the very energy that they tap IF YOU TAKE GIVE SOMTHING BACK if not you will end up with Glastonbury, with the World and his wife feeling the "vibes" kind of thing. Now I can only find small pockets of the Glastonbury of 30 years ago left.
Somtimes I feel like crying, for the poor old Earth can only give so much.
But there are still places of power in Dorset and a few people who will walk to get to them.
any UK residents that want me to tell them where they are I am sorry but I cannot until I know your motives.
Several times I have found the remains of dark activity on some of Dorsets more acsessible sites and have had to cleanse them.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Áine
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 03:29 PM

There once was a poster named Kat
Always saying something 'bout this and that
Sometimes she shouted
Sometimes she pouted
But all her friends loved her like that

I thought it was about time to lighten up on 'tsk-tsking' going on around here -- It was that, or tell some of you to take a short walk on a long pier and go fish for a sense of humour, while the rest of us wait here with big fluffy warm towels to dry you off and take you to dinner.

We *all* have good days and bad days, and days when someone doesn't a joke we tell . . . So, can we *all* keep a little bit of spirit of this season of renewal and hope and put off pointing at each other for being different from each other?

All of you who have posted so far on this thread have valid viewpoints -- instead of looking for a way of dividing us, why don't we look for a way of uniting us?

Take it easy, but take it -- Áine


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: sophocleese
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 03:45 PM

Yikes! I didn't think I was trying to divide anybody, I'm quite capable of falling apart on my own. But Áine I have to laugh, commanding people to find funny what they consider offensive is as useless as telling a bunch of ten year-old boys not to giggle when they read the word "breast' in a story.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: wildlone
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 03:49 PM

Look at him what makes Him your Brother?
See her there Why is She your Sister?
Do not say "they are different because"!
Say "they are the Same as me, Because"!


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 04:32 PM

Thank you, LeeJ, Aine, and wildlone. Since the gloves are off, let's get the record straight:

By his own, unsolicited admission, Joe is jealous and feels he's lost control. The following are direct quotes from a message to me in late November:

The changes I've complained about have been brought about almost single-handedly - by you. If there was a thread I was irritated with, it almost always was started by you.

I suppose I must sheepishly admit there might be just a touch of jealousy involved. Before you came around, I was pretty much able to dominate the tone of Mudcat.

At that point, Joe did apologise and we agreed to bury the hatchet and agree to disagree.

FOR THE RECORD: going back to Jan. 13, 1999 I have STARTED

117 threads ON MUSIC,

51 THREADS ON OTHER STUFF, of which ONLY ONE was on healing

and, I am proud to say I have filled in for PeterT, on most weekend days by starting approx. 104 THOUGHT FOR THE DAY THREADS. Peter has started most of the others which would round out to about 261.

Is that clear enough?

kat


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Áine
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 04:54 PM

Dear sophocleese,

Well, like I said, we all have days when some people don't get the jokes we tell; and, I guess I'm having one of those days. If you'll read back over my post, I hope that you'll see that I wasn't commanding anyone to do anything. I was attempting to subtly suggest that we should 'cool off' and get together.

I am the mother of a 9-year old son, and he *doesn't* giggle at the word 'breast' when he reads it in a story. I have explained to him what a breast is and what it does; thereby removing the mystery from that part of a woman's anatomy. I have found that people are often offended by and frightened of something that they do not understand. I have also found that when that something is explained to people, very often they are no longer offended or afraid.

I'll be waiting for you with a big fluffy warm towel when you're done. Would you rather go for burgers and beer, or a veggie plate and fizzy water?

-- Áine


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 05:01 PM

Nope, LEJ, I don't have a badge. Dick and Max didn't hand out any badges, and you will note that they make no effort whatsoever to police this forum themselves. You'll also note, however, that they rarely participate in the so-called "BS" threads. Maybe we should follow their example, instead of looking for some sort of "authority" to order us to do this or that.
It's up to us as a community to direct this forum where it should go. As a member of this community, I think I have a right to ask the community to take this forum back to where I think it should be - an intelligent discussion of folk music that is humanized by the warmth, passionate expression of opinion, and intelligent humor of people who really care about folk music.
There's nothing wrong with the healing or the humor or anything that Kat and her followers have posted. My question is whether it works in a folk music forum. I try to be pragmatic on how I gauge what's appropriate. I don't think it has anything to do with stodginess and wishing things were like they used to be. What I'm looking for here is a stimulating discussion about folk music, a place where I can learn songs and hear the stories behind them, and get leads to new places where I can explore the wonders of folk music.
I was wrong when I said I was here to talk about folk music - I'm here primarily to learn. I'm almost embarrassed to say that I may well be the best-known "authority" on folk music in the Sacramento area, a community of almost two million people. Why? Because I'm outspoken and I sing loud, and I know most of the songs in the Rise Up Singing songbook and own almost all of the Peter, Paul and Mary CD's. Sorry, people, but that's not enough to make me any kind of an expert, although I will admit to being very charming and to having a pretty good voice. I have a lot to learn, and that's why I'm here.
I spent the last week at Camp Harmony, the annual gathering of the San Francisco Folk Music Club. The part I liked best were the late-night sessions where the really good singers did their best stuff. I did sing a couple of songs for the group over that week of evenings; but mostly I listened, singing along when I could. There were a couple of "younger" (I use that word very loosely) people like Valentine Doyle and Blessings Barbara who sang a number of really good songs, but the best stuff came from people of another generation, people over the age of 70 who seemed to have an infinite number of amazing songs in their heads. Many of these older people were quite shy, and often a bit ornery and fussy - but they had a wealth of folk music to share with those willing to listen.
One night, a very talented couple were loudly singing classic rock 'n' roll songs in the next room. They really were good, but the distraction they created broke the magic of the song circle, and the real folk singers went to bed early that night. The next afternoon, I was in a Welsh songs workshop led by Shirley Jackson, a tiny, soft-voiced English lady with a head packed full of songs. Well, I'll be damned if that same rock 'n' roll couple didn't set themselves up in the next room, making it very difficult for us to hear the wisdom that Shirley was trying to impart.
When I come across a really knowledgeable folk musician, I do my best to encourage them to join in the discussion here. Many of them have been here, and many have found Mudcat not to be a place where they feel comfortable. A couple have mentioned Katlaughing by name as the reason why they don't spend time here. One well-known musician told me he started a thread here, to try to stimulate discussion of a song. Kat responded to his question in a well-intentioned but condescending tone, giving inaccurate information. The musician replied with information that corrected Kat's response, but nobody followed up after that; and the thread died and the musician didn't come back. Yeah, I'll admit that the guy is a little finicky, but he could have been a valuable resource here if he hadn't been turned away. We're very lucky that we have a few shining lights like Sandy Paton and Art Thieme and Dick Greenhaus and others who have been patient and gracious toward us lesser mortals, but we need to make this a place that is comfortable and welcoming to knowledgeable people who are not quite so patient.
I spent several years following the rec.music.folk newsgroup, and I still look in there every once in a while. The quality of discussion deteriorated there, and became cluttered with flame wars and spam and singer-songwriter self-promotions. Frankly, rec.music.folk became pretty boring. I was glad to find the Mudcat Café a couple of years ago, and to see the stimulating, friendly discussions that took place here. Over the first couple of years here, we had the feeling that the Mudcat Forum was becoming a folk music resource that was a valuable companion to the Digital Tradition, a searchable body of valuable background information that supported the lyrics in the database. Sure, there was lots of goofing around; but the primary content of the forum was folk music.
Well, things have changed in the last year. The longest threads aren't about folk music any more - they're birthday greetings and healing requests and trite insider jokes that have been repeated over and over again. You can't search the text of the Forum any more because it's too full of words - and most of those words now have nothing at all to do with folk music. All this chit-chat stuff is fine in a chat room, but does it work to make this a forum for good discussion of folk music? The really good folk musicians have fled to the mailing lists, resources that aren't easily accessible to the general public - is that what we want?
I'm not asking for censorship, and I'd lead a revolution if I saw Mudcat become a place where the Folk Police came and clobbered anybody who posted something the Police deemed inappropriate. However, I have to say that the Mudcat Café has become a place that is not particularly interesting to people who are really knowledgeable about folk music, and so they're staying away from us.
I know they were posted as some sort of joke, but the principles posted in the first message in this thread have a lot of value. I'd like to restate them: if you have something to say that has lasting value, go ahead and say it. If it's something that won't have any value tomorrow or the next day, maybe you'd better take it to a chat room. All the chit-chat and healing and one-liners and LMAO's and whatnot are fine, but they're driving the folk music discussions to the mailing lists, away from this wonderful place where we can learn so much.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: katlaughing
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 05:13 PM

Joe, you sqaid, "If it's something that won't have any value tomorrow or the next day, maybe you'd better take it to a chat room. All the chit-chat and healing and one-liners and LMAO's and whatnot are fine, but they're driving the folk music discussions to the mailing lists, away from this wonderful place where we can learn so much."

So....perhaps you could tell us, then, why you just posted to the nonsensical "I started a thread" thread?

And, I'd really like to know who I offended so badly that they couldn't just put me in my place, so to speak, and stick around for the gems like Sandy, Art, Rick, and Dick.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Margo
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 05:22 PM

I can see Joe's point. It does seem that it would be more appropriate for the bulk of the conversing here to be about music. I'll turn over a new leaf myself. Margo


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Rick Fielding
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 05:38 PM

I try to stay as far away from things like this as possible for obvious reasons.(No one changes their mind, and rarely even their tactics) I came in at this moment to attempt some humour and perhaps try to defuse a bit. Don't feel like doing it any more. No matter how silly an argument becomes, when someone makes public, a private e-mail, all I feel is sad. I no longer care who's right or wrong.

Rick


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: InOBU
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 05:50 PM

A word about CTP...
A native friend and I were sitting on a New York street corner, and I was tring to get him to come up to the res and sober up. Along comes a young wag who looks down at my friend and says How! Kimosabe! Vinny looked up at the guy and said, Nope, I am his brother, Kimotherapy!
See what I mean Vern?
God bless CTP Larry


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: sophocleese
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 05:58 PM

Think of a dog. It is happy and loved and waving it's tail. Outside this is wonderful. Inside, where the delicate china is kept, it is not wonderful. The dog is never the one who picks up the pieces. Eventually, if the dog is going to be allowed in the living room, the delicate china will be packed away and only the more robust objects left out.

I am NOT going to tell anyone what they should or should not post. I may point it out when I feel that others have been rude, if it has upset me and if I think it will be useful to do so, because I think we all benefit from civility. I will also, as one of the quieter people, point out that the louder, more exuberant, center-stagers take up a lot of space and often fail to note the subtler behaviours of those who are less exuberant and forthright. This is the way it always has been, and likely always will be, in any group of people. Standing in the middle of a room and proclaiming that "Anyone who wants to talk can talk over me," is not the same as sitting down, quietly listening, and giving people space in which to talk. Largely it seems to be a matter of culture and temperament. The ones who don't mind speaking out can't understand why others aren't speaking up and the quieter ones can't understand why the others won't shut up for long enough to let them get their say in.

Generally I'm quieter about these issues but over the last couple of days I've noticed people saying, or trying to say, some of the things that I've been thinking. I am trying to articulate these things in a way which will not hurt, I'm sorry if I do hurt others in the process. It is an issue though that has come up over and over again and there are people who are feeling very hurt over it. Lets face it, the people that wanted BS have won the argument, there is a lot of BS on the forum. Those in favor of BS can afford to be magnanimous towards those who aren't and avoid rubbing their noses in it.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: sophocleese
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 06:31 PM

By the way the Kiersey Temperament Sorter has labelled me a Champion. So all you rude buggers straighten up or I'll be after you.

Was that indicative of a sense of humour Áine? Maybe we could exchange fluffy towels and cheeseburgers are fine with me.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: MandolinPaul
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 06:51 PM

Hey Rick.

I initially suggested to Kat that she should release some of the exerpts from Joe's private message to her. I thought that it would help to demonstrate his opinion of his importance here, and his motivation for targetting her: he's not worried about the holiness of the 'Cat; his nose is out of joint because he has "lost control".

Yes, I've received some great info from Joe in the past, but I've also been PO'd by his sometimes superior attitude. You can read it in his posts in this very thread.

Joe: Do you realize how ridiculous and confrontational you sound when you refer to Kat "and her followers". Really now.

I'll be happy when this thread dies.

Paul.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 06:55 PM

Ah, kat, you illustrate my point so clearly. Once upon a time, everybody felt free to add a funny crack to a thread, and the humor around here was delightful. Now that the many forum discussions have deteriorated to insider jokes that are repeated over and over until they are beyond triteness, many people don't feel comfortable saying anything funny or off the subject, since the party crowd clogs the forum with so much of it. Do I betray the position I have stated here if I post a one-verse parody of a BeeGees song? I don't think so. It's all a matter of moderation and balance, and I think that delicate balance has been lost.
Same with my acquaintance who received the condescending put-down. If it happened once, I'd ignore it. However, this one musician is not the only one who has been made to feel uncomfortable around here by all the noisy expressions of nothingness. There are many well-known folk musicians who share folk music information in various obscure places on the Internet - why don't they do it here? Why do they submit lyrics to the Digital Tradition by e-mail, and not here in this public forum? I think it's because they don't feel comfortable here, and they don't see the Mudcat Cafe as a place for music discussion. I've heard many people disparagingly refer to the Mudcat Cafe as a "chat room." Is that what we want?
I'd really like to ask you to take an objective look at the two long messages I posted above. Try to remove yourself from the discussion for a few moments and look at it from a distance, without feeling insulted by anything that I've said. I'm trying hard to make my point without insulting you or hurting your feelings, but I know that's almost impossible.
All of this so-called "BS" stuff is good. If people are having fun with it, then there ought to be a way for it to continue. Maybe what we need is a good, reliable chat room or a separate "goof-off" forum that isn't archived or searchable. I'm open to suggestions, and I'm sure Max will be able to come up with just about anything we want. He built a separate help forum - why not a "chat" forum that gets cleaned out every month or so?
Like it or not, the Mudcat Cafe began as a folk music forum, intended primarily for the discussion of folk music. My question is, does the "BS" stuff affect the folk music discussion in a positive, negative, or neutral manner? I think the effect is negative, and becoming more so.
It's like attending a class where I really want to hear what the teacher has to say. The trouble is, the rest of the kids in the class are having a great time with a spitball war, and the teacher gets distracted and doesn't say anything of value. That's what I'm afraid is happening here. We have more and more words at Mudcat, and less and less substance.
Think about what I've said from an objective point of view, and see if you can come up with a solution that will satisfy everybody, not just a truce in our ongoing battle on this subject. This is not just a matter of the majority winning and the minority leaving. There are significant numbers on both sides of this debate, and we need to come up with a solution that is satisfactory to all.
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 07:18 PM

You're right, Paul. I don't feel very comfortable in a discussion like this, and the tone of what I say is not what's in my heart. I hate conflict, and I try my best to avoid it and still accomplish what needs to be done. I hate being in a discussion like this, and I don't want to be here. I want to be having fun learning about folk music. Trouble is, there is a matter of disagreement here, and it needs to be settled. I'd like it to be settled once and for all, with a solution that satisfies both sides.

Several weeks ago, I wrote a private message of apology to Kat because I had said some things that were kind of nasty to her. I really was sorry she got hurt, and I did my best to present a balanced explanation of how I bungled into saying something so hurtful. It doesn't seem quite fair to me that she would now choose to excerpt and post only those parts of that explanation that tend to support her position.

So, rather than arguing the pros and cons of all this, I think we need to realize that we have reached an impasse in this discussion. Both sides have valid points, and valid concerns that need to be honored. Now, can we come up with a solution to the problem? I've suggested a separate MudChat Forum. Any other ideas, or any comments on my suggestion?

-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: DougR
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 07:34 PM

Die, Thread!

DougR


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Mbo
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 07:46 PM

I know I really shouldn't be posting, but it seems to me in the last few days, the Mudcat has been full of arguments and disagreements. As War said "Why can't we be friends?" Let's do music stuff! I'm trying to figure out music file stuff, and no ones answering my questions! Let's stop all this metacommunication and get back to the music! BTW I'm over in the Mudcat Living Room (which actually IS a music thread, if people went there instead of here, which is NOT a music thread) and I need help!

--Mbo


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Jon Freeman
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 07:52 PM

DougR, I have a horrible feeling that even if this thread dies, the underlying issues won't die. It appears to me that this subject crops up more and more frequently with increasing bitternes each time and I sucpect that Joe is right in suggesting that the matter does need sorting out once and for all in a way that everyone can accept.

I sit pretty near the middle on the BS argument and likely to be satisfied with any soulution that puts and end to the unpleasantness.

I was recently asked by another Mudcatter (no one involved in this debate and not Max or Bert) about my feelings. Here is an extract from the email I sent in reply:

"I am here primarily for the music threads although I do read and contribute to some of the BS threads. I have mixed feelings over the BS and at times feel that maybe it should be separated but as other people have pointed out, sometimes music stems from the BS and visa versa. Antoher problem to me would be that people do not have the same opinions on what is or isn't BS. I have read many posts where my labeling would be different to the one chosen by the originator of the thread.

Overall, I think that the community feeling is a good thing and from a selfish point of view, I have made a few good contacts/ friends because of the willingness to exhange more than just hard musical facts. I suppose thread wise, one of my dislikes is when a musical question is asked and the thread degenerates into silly comments before any attempt is made to answer the question but that doesn't happen too often."

Jon


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Fred M.
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 07:55 PM

I'd hate to see any minority feel pressured to pick up and leave.

I am SADDENED by the deterioration of this neat place. I've learned lots here. I don't like the non-musical threads, or the healing threads, or the quote du jour, I'm tired of hearing about possums. I was astonished at how many threads were requesting that people from different geographic locations check in. And when the server is down, I feel irritated at how people carry on so about not getting their fix. Those are my negative feelings about this forum. They are my feelings.

But I pick up interesting stuff in the musical ones. That is the only thing that brings me back.

I'm a lurker. I don't have much insight to share musically, and I hope it's OK to contribute to a conversation, even a touchy and emotionally charged one.

I'd really like to see amicable resolution.

Fred


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 08:00 PM

We have had threads recently about guilt. Well, perhaps some of it is mine (no I'm fairly sober thanks). I had been away for some months (no, not "away" in that sense) and I trotted back in and posted (irony!)without huge reflection. Back then I don't think it would have been so sinful. But I did think a bit, and for the reasons I stated it was of help to me to be able to post to this thread. The Mudcat would be less for me if that function were removed.

Senseless posting helps no-one. Folk music depends often on the understanding o fhuman issues and to that extent it may be helpful to all of us to understand human issues. I would therefore not rule out human issues for posting. For that reason it is better to avoid the barrister's sneer.

I think some misunderstand Gargoyle (also seemingly named above as gregg). I make no claim to understand him fully. But usually his postings, even the sharp ones, are witty or well put. One of his above was obviously spiky, but perhaps was not read as intended. That may make it worse or better, but it indicates the need to think. Does that temptation, the temptation to say something witty whatever the cost (which cost Oscar Wilde so dear) drive him. Do we have to stop and ask if he means anything he says? If so does that exonerate him at all?

Perhaps indeed the better idea is to separate the Mudcat fromthe Mudchat. But (and I leave you to decide whether I am striking for an ironic point) one of the reasons I am less likely to go to the non-chat areaa is because so little of it is about folk music and so much about country or contemporary (usually American) acoustic music. Does that lead us to four fora? Does this argument lead to a reductio in absurdum?


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: DougR
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 08:32 PM

Jon: It's just that I've seen this discussed so much since I have been dropping in to the Mudcat, I seriously doubt it will ever be resolved. People are taking sides and I'm not convinced people on either side will ever change their position. As long as folks can type and Max and Dick set no ground rules, they are going to post whatever they want to.

I guess I fall into the middle too. I enjoy some BS threads and most music threads. If I'm not interested in a Thread, I just move on.

I really hate to see folks that I think are basically interested in the same thing and are good folks go at each other as has happend on this Thread.

DougR


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Bill D
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 09:08 PM

....I tried earlier to make a weak joke in the midst of all this, but I see that there is no way to keep it to that....I have been sitting here, arms folded in front of the screen for 30 minutes, trying to think what, or IF, I should all to it all. I have been in this forum for 3 years, like Joe, and I am very sad that it has come to this.

I was, frankly, startled that Joe said what he did, as I have met Joe in person and, although I knew he was upset at some things, I didn't think he'd say it 'openly'.

Is he right? *sigh*..yeah, sort of..Is katlaughing right about HER 'rights' and feelings...yeah, sort of...Is gargoyle right about HIS gripes and sore points...yeah, sort of...Is Margo? Is sophocleese? sure...we ALL have some truth in what we believe and feel....however......

There is an *art* to being right, that is, to saying what you are convinced is 'true' and 'fair' and 'reasonable' in a gentle and non-provocative way, and it seems to be a dying art. Gargoyle made HIS splash by making HIS points rudely and hatefully...and many here said so. Others have responded in kind, and thus made it worse. Some have tried to defuse things with wit and soothing posts, saying "there, there, kiddies..lets all be friends". But backs are now up, and no one will back down.

Don't you see?..This VERY DISCUSSION is driving the wedge deeper...and here I am trying to find a way to say

" you are ALL right...and also ALL wrong"

....Joe knows he can't 'stop' the BS posts...this place is like a big, open park- where people can do whatever they like short of murder and mayhem....all one can do is plead for a bit of restraint and awareness of the stated purpose of the place.

but statements like this.."frankly, I don't care how they did it way back when"...*sigh*, seem to me to be pretty heavy, in ANY context.

When a bunch of people are in the same area, they ALL must attempt to be conscious of how what they do affects others...Joe's example of the classroom.." the rest of the kids in the class are having a great time with a spitball war, and the teacher gets distracted and doesn't say anything of value." is pretty close to how it is.

Yes, I know, you can always 'choose' to not read a thread, or not respond, but in a park, if YOU want a quiet discussion and others are throwing balls and playing loud radios right around you, it is VERY difficult to ignore...and after all, the ball players have their rights!..(cynicism implied)

some threads I can, and do ignore..."healing and religion" are usually so marked, and I just dont bother with them...I do NOT think this is the place for it, but I have, mostly, ignored it. I cannot avoid, however noticing them in the list, and it does prickle and irritate. I do not see how personal things of that nature are anything more than prosyletizing in a forum like this....in this country, we have 'freedom of religion', a wonderful thing. But, implied in the concept of "freedom of religion" is that freedom FROM religion for those that so choose is also a right. So...what should one DO when one has a genuine need and desire to discuss and participate in religious and arcane concepts like 'healing' that not everyone appreciates?..It is possible today to have, free for the asking, a web site of your own..INCLUDING scripts to run a discussion forum!!!! Ask Alice..(in Montana) how it is done...then in here, if you want others to join you, you could make a BRIEF MENTION of the address, and the discussion or healing group could 'do it's business' there.

I am a member of a group whose charter says that what they do is "collect wood"...yet, some of the major players and old timers in the group are devout, born again Christian fundamentalists///and when I attend a meeting, EVERYONE is expected to stand and bow their heads while someone asks JESUS to bless us all. No one asks if there are any Jews or Muslims...or atheists present, and they will NOT just keep it to a ' moment of silence'..Yes, I do what most do...I stand there, saying nothing, and seething...and yes, it is my right to NOT attend the meetings...just as I am able to NOT open certain threads here...

well, I seem to have picked up a bit of steam in my misguided effort to post a concilitory and non-partisan message...*shaking my head*....I don't know if anyone has noticed, but I have been in here a lot less in recent months, and if you do, as katlaughing suggests "going Back to the Future of Threads for some good ole' reads.. ", you will find some names which simply are not here anymore...several have said PUBLICLY why they left, others never said...I suspect THIS sort of thing helped some decide.

I think this will be my only public posting in this matter...anyone who wishes may contact me if they need clarification of my ramblings.

"O wad some Power the giftie gie us
To see oursels as inthers see us!
It wad frae monie a blunder free us,
An' foolish notion;
What airs in dress an' gait wad lea'e us,
An' ev'n devotion!


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: MandolinPaul
Date: 03 Jan 00 - 09:34 PM

You make a lot of good points, Bill.

I'm going to type a phrase that has quite often brought about domestic peace for me.

I still think I'm right; you still think you're right ... but let's be friends again.

OK, it ain't deep, and it may only delay problems until a future date, but it can do a world of good when the involved parties are just plain tired of scrapping.

May this thread rest in peace. Amen, Praise Allah, Have a nice day.

Paul.


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Roger the skiffler
Date: 05 Jan 00 - 05:57 AM

Compulsive poster? Guilty as charged: defence? Learned a lot from the music threads, unable from ignorance to contribute in kind, so resort to offloading old jokes in BS threads.
Plea in mitigation: undergoing treatment at the Neil Young Center.
Awful warning: a few Christmas cracker jokes to offload this year!
BTW, I always marvel how modest and restrained Max is, as the begetter of this thing, he rarely contributes as himself, though I gather from his rare postings he is a knowledgeable bluesman, perhaps we could all try to emulate him! (fat chance!)
RtS


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Subject: RE: Compulsive Thread Posting-RUGuilty?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 24 Jul 02 - 10:12 PM

gilty as charged


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