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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Escamillo Date: 25 Sep 99 - 01:16 AM I'm glad to see that you agree, Alice. How could I express it more emfatically ? it is WHOOOOLEEE WOOOOOOOORRLDDDD of difference ! I regret so much to not having studied when I was 20 ! I would recall this phrase of yours, which I think is very important: "The best teacher is one who has lots of personal experience as well as the knowledge. " One last consideration: I respect every singer who doesn't want to take classes with an academic singer for one reason or another. There are many excellent singers who reach deeply in the audience's hearts with just a small voice and intimate style. But see that they will never FORCE their voices up or down. Another last: in fact, my teacher told me: "Don't play the MACHO, you are a tenor, like me" :)) Yours, Andrés Magré
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Jo Taylor Date: 25 Sep 99 - 07:45 PM Alice, thank you very much. I would very much like to learn to sing properly, only being something I've done from instinct over the years and sporadically at that. Would much appreciate the links to the previous threads about exercising , warming up etc. - I couldn't find them a while back. Thanks once again - Jo |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Alice Date: 25 Sep 99 - 08:03 PM OK, I will start putting them all together in a thread called "Threads on the Singing voice", and I will include a link to this one. Alice Flynn |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Wotcha Date: 26 Sep 99 - 11:42 AM I prefer to sing through my nose ! I guess I never got over Steeleyspan's "Gaudete" ... cheers, Brian |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Caitrin Date: 15 May 00 - 08:47 PM This thread was a bit before my time, so I never saw it before...very interesting! I've always sung second alto in chorus- I love those low harmonies! I've been tacked on to a few tenor parts when we were short of guys, and on to a few mezzo soprano parts when we were short of mezzos. I used to think there were notes I would never be able to hit...then, when I tried resinging a piece we did in ninth grade, there were notes that I could hit that I couldn't before. Practice and the willingness to stretch definitely improve range. So I've learned never to say that I can't sing something...it's always worth a try. |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: GUEST,Chocolate Pi(back in MacOS) Date: 15 May 00 - 10:13 PM I sing tenor much of the time; the drama teacher in junior high school loved me because, as a girl, I already had an adult voice while the boys were cracking all over the place, so I could play male roles; I did Mr. Bumble in Oliver, and various mummers roles, etc. Sacred Harp (I keep coming back to this, just like my Humanities prof goes back to the Tokyo subway no matter what we discuss from Marx to Blake to Baudelaire, because he's in the East Asian Studies dept) has doubling of parts by male and female singers; men and women sing treble, ususally a octave apart, and tenor, where some women sing the octave above and some sing as written (and some, like me, switch back and forth). Usually bass is just men and isn't doubled, but alto is occasionaly doubled. I've sung treble, alto, and tenor, and much prefer tenor. Chocolate Pi |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Peter Kasin Date: 15 May 00 - 11:22 PM I sang baritone in a choral class in college, but I was never a natural singer, and only found somewhat of a voice when I started singing chanteys, with my voiced pitched higher to get more volume. I have a one-dimensional voice: good for singing at full throttle, but not good for more subtle, softer ballads and such. So, volume is a consideration in finding one's voice as well. I guess that makes me a bargain counter tenor. |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Escamillo Date: 16 May 00 - 12:07 AM To the three late posters, thanks for your interest and opinions. Although very much has been said ("Threads on the singing voice"), you may well deserve as new members that we come back to a discussion on any questions you may have, so please keep posting. Un abrazo - Andrés (the bass who happened to be a baritone and later a tenor) |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Amergin Date: 16 May 00 - 03:23 AM Some one once told me I was a tenor, but I don't know. Untrained voice. Some one else more than once told me to shut up. Was never good at following directions anyways. Amergin |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Ella who is Sooze Date: 16 May 00 - 06:20 AM Before I found folk (sounds like I was in therapy) I used to be a classical singer and I am a soprano with over a two (nearly 3) octave range and when I was actually having my voice trained I could get right up to that top top c right above all the staves and bars the ones that float around at the top - and right down to A below middle C. Of course like an athelete I am out of training and could get those notes still but would pay for it the next day. Now I sing folk songs in an Irish band and at sessions. Its a lot more fun and less rigid than classical stuff. Plus you get to drink lots of guinnes at gigs and sessions. Ella Thank heavans I am not still singing classical! I don't think I did the classical diva thing very well! Far too stuffy |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Escamillo Date: 16 May 00 - 02:42 PM Amergin, don´t be good at following NEGATIVE directions :) This process (training voice) is very slow and needs an experienced teacher. One thing that most people are scared about when deciding to go to a teacher, is being converted into an opera singer. It´s a myth. Even when you realize, after some classes, that you are producing a sound that resembles a classical voice, that´s not bad at all, it signals a progress. Further on you decide how you will sound. Ella, that´s good ! Although the classical music loses many good voices for a lot of reasons, it´s good that other genres benefit with them. I´m sure your audience will appreciate the quality. Un abrazo - Andrés |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Peter Kasin Date: 17 May 00 - 02:49 AM Ella - Your comments are proof that "Guinness is good for you!" |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Ella who is Sooze Date: 17 May 00 - 05:00 AM Thanks Andrés I would certainly not totally write out ever singing classical stuff ever again. As I have a very wide music taste. If I was asked, or if something attracted me to sing a classical piece then I would go for it. As I am still fairly young, I could probably go back to it if I wanted to. But I get more fun from the folk stuff and I can improvise a bit more. Plus it makes me laugh how you can virtually sing for your supper at sessions. Chanteranger - Yes guinness is definately good for you - very soothing. ha ha! but makes you get no bones in your legs! (wobbly legs) What I love most about singing the folk songs, is the reactions in the pub/gig when I sing a more slower song without any backing (like A Stor Mo Chroi) I have turned a pub/gig from the usual din and chatter to complete silence and have everyone listening to the words. You could hear a pin drop. And it does wonders for the soul to have all those people listening to you. What a buzz. Ella |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Amergin Date: 17 May 00 - 05:07 AM Ella, I know what you mean about having the audience captivated and how high it makes you feel. I have experienced that same rush during poetry sessions (open mike). I love the feeling of every eye in the place looking up at me as I spout off my stuff. The reaction of the audience is the best damn drug ever made. Amergin |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Bagpuss Date: 17 Jul 00 - 06:54 AM I don't know where my voice belongs, and thats fine by me. At school, I was always made to sing Alto, because I could read music, and we didn't have enough alto's. In folk choir we usually did 3 part harmonies with men and women on each line (so really 6 part harmonies). I usually sang the highest line. When we sang stuff that was written in 4 parts, I used to sing the tenor line, but up an octave. When I lose my voice, I usually lose my top voice, but also my range gets extended about 3 tones lower at the bottom - notes which I can never normally reach. And if I am going to perform something in public, I have to raise it about 2 tones from the pitch I practice at, as I can get volume on my high voice, but not my low voice. And the break between my head voice and my chest voice seems to be different depending on whether I am going up the scale, or down. Bagpuss |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: GUEST,Nikki Date: 17 Jul 00 - 08:46 AM Apparently between the beginning of this thread and the time I saw it, the website about which voice you are disappeared - I got a message that said it had expired. Does anyone know where to find one like it? It sounds very useful and interesting. |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Escamillo Date: 18 Jul 00 - 04:18 AM Hi, Nikki. You can type "singing voice" without the quotes in the FILTER field, then 90 in the AGE field, and the title "Threads on the singing voice" will pop up. Anyway, feel free to ask any question you may have on this subject, and some Mudcatter will reply. Enjoy. |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Bagpuss Date: 18 Jul 00 - 05:14 AM I think Nikki was talking about a link to another website which is no longer there. Its the one that gives the range for eack of the types of voice. It was gone when I clicked on it too. Bagpuss |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Alice Date: 18 Jul 00 - 12:01 PM Here is a link to the table showing ranges. Remember that singers in each range can sing above and below these notes, too. They are not limited to what is shown on this scale. The table is provided as an aid for composers when writing parts for voices. Vocal Ranges, at a Yale site Here is the page for composers this table is linked to music cataloging at Yale. Many people don't know they can sing above the range of the speaking voice, and the best notes can be those that are more brilliant once you have learned how to reach them. Last week I met another singer who had been told he was a baritone, and had performed as a baritone in three Gilbert and Sullivan productions. He was used to pushing the voice (like belting) to get that volume as a baritone, but when I heard him sing higher, I said, I bet you are really a tenor. One guest conductor who had visited the town where he used to live had told him he was really a tenor. We went to my teacher, because I want to learn some duets to perform together, and she said to him, you are definitely a tenor. Now, he just needs to learn to sing with more relaxation throughout his whole range so he can connect the baritone range with the tenor range, where his voice really opens up to some brilliant tones. By learning not to push for volume, he can back off and blend his voice more with mine in harmonies. |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Alice Date: 18 Jul 00 - 12:09 PM Anyone who wonders what their true range may be (according to soprano, alto, tenor, baritone, bass) can send a tape to my teacher and she will respond by email after listening to it. Sing a scale from as low as you can to as high as you can and then a song. Send an email to her first. Here's her contact info: Suzanne Gorder |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: pastorpest Date: 18 Jul 00 - 12:51 PM If you want to hear coloratura listen to the Korean soprano Sumi Jo. Then wonder how in the world she can do it at all, let alone do it well, which she does. The King Singers have two counter tenors so their recordings are good places to hear them. I have always thought of myself as a tenor, but my voice teacher has told me I am a baritone, even though I sing higher than any other guy in the church choir. Voice lessons are one of the best investments I ever made. I have a teacher who is classically trained, a good performer herself, but is sensitive to folk music which she lets me focus on. Like any instrument the voice is one in which we easily have fundamentally wrong technique which we do not even realize and which when corrected allows us to be a whole lot better than we ever thought we could. |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Alice Date: 18 Jul 00 - 01:39 PM Just for fun... look for a sound clip of the coloratura soprano Amelita Galli-Curci This will give you a classic example of coloratura fluidity as well as the high range of a coloratura soprano (she holds a C at the end above the high A on the chart previously linked). Alice
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Bagpuss Date: 18 Jul 00 - 04:02 PM Looks like I can be a soprano or a mezzo-soprano, depending on how my voice is feeling at the time. And an alto occasionally. Thanks for the link. Bagpuss |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: dorareever Date: 27 Sep 01 - 02:29 PM Escamillo,I don't think your right.Okay maybe my "natural" approach is wrong and in 5 years I'll see the damage I've done to my voice,but I'm quite sure I'm doing well.I've met several singers(most rock singers,okay) that had no clue of how to really sing,even basilar things like diaphragm breathing were unknown to them! So they couldn't sing,just "mimick" a singer.I guess I'm an alto (voice loud and clear on the lower notes)but maybe I'd need a professional for telling me if it's really my voice.Did you feel really different when you sang before meeting your teacher? Like you were streching your voice too much? How's about speaking in a higher voice than our singing voice? To me is different.If I talk it's higher.So I guess is related to breathing.Obviously I breath in a different way.If I speak using diaphragmatic my voice sounds lower just like when I'm singing.Or maybeI just don't know what I'm doing...maybe I'm not a "real" alto. Anyway in folk music you can easily sing with your "nose-voice",don't think you can in classical.lol |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: GUEST,SoBeIt Date: 27 Jan 10 - 07:56 PM if you can sing a low G you are probably an alto or contralto, which is the lowest a female can sing in formal choir it (meaning contralto) is sung below alto and above tenor many altos in my high school choir have trouble singing below low G and the mezzo-sopranos have trouble singing low B i am unsure if i am an alto or a contralto because i can sing the highest out of all the altos in my choir and the lowest out of the choir(i am in an all girl choir)i can sing most of the bass part of the hallelujah chorus (and comfortably too) |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Genie Date: 27 Jan 10 - 09:05 PM If you don't have a piano or guitar or pitch pipe handy, here is Middle C I can (weakly) hit the C below middle C on a good day if I'm warmed up, but my choir directors and vocal coaches say I'm a second soprano. BTW, is "colatura" basically the same thing as "melisma?" |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Darowyn Date: 28 Jan 10 - 04:31 AM A coloratura soprano would use lots of melismas in her performance. So yes, its sort of the same thing, but coloratura is an adjective and melisma is a noun. Cheers Dave |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: GUEST,leeneia Date: 28 Jan 10 - 12:03 PM Hi, Genie. Colortura is a word for a high soprano who sings elaborate lines with lots of fancy features. A can name only one: Lily Pons If you go to YouTube and search for 'Lily Pons' you can hear her coloratura performances. 'Melisma' means that a person sings more than one note on a syllable. Anybody can do it. |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: GUEST Date: 10 Nov 10 - 01:20 AM a coloratura is a soprano. the voice is flexible |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Don Firth Date: 10 Nov 10 - 01:52 AM Coloratura soprano. Roberta Peters. Don Firth |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: Black belt caterpillar wrestler Date: 10 Nov 10 - 08:57 AM Just a little confused by terminology here. Is middle C C5? Where does the octave number change? Is the note below C5 B4? If so I go down to Bb2 and up to A4 so I'm below a Bass. |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: GUEST,Grishka Date: 10 Nov 10 - 10:25 AM Black belt caterpillar wrestler: yes. The "Vocal Range Information" above gives too small ranges, even for amateur singers performing choral music. See more accurate information on Wikipedia etc. Also note that "range" is not the whole truth about a voice and its training; it's the quality of each register that matters. If your Bb2 can fill an opera house with steady and modulatable sound, you're a rare bird, whereas mine can easily fill my shower room when I have a cold. However, to sing bass opera roles such as Ochs von Lerchenau, you must have an F3 as well. That takes years to decades of intensive professional training. If you compose for other singers (as I sometimes do), either consult them regularly or keep to the middle of the road. |
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Subject: RE: Help: How can you tell which voice you've got From: GUEST,Grishka Date: 11 Nov 10 - 04:45 AM (In my previous message F3 should be F5, i.e. the F above the middle C) |
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