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Origins: Love Come Twinklin' Down

Related thread:
(origins) ADD/Origins: Seek and Ye Shall Find (21)


Dicho (Frank Staplin) 19 Nov 01 - 08:34 PM
masato sakurai 19 Nov 01 - 08:39 PM
wysiwyg 19 Nov 01 - 09:42 PM
masato sakurai 19 Nov 01 - 10:52 PM
wysiwyg 20 Nov 01 - 11:43 AM
KathWestra 20 Nov 01 - 12:03 PM
Joe Offer 20 Nov 01 - 12:32 PM
Sandy Paton 20 Nov 01 - 02:43 PM
Sandy Paton 20 Nov 01 - 02:53 PM
Joe Offer 20 Nov 01 - 03:23 PM
KathWestra 20 Nov 01 - 03:59 PM
Dicho (Frank Staplin) 20 Nov 01 - 04:54 PM
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Subject: Love Come Twinklin' Down
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 19 Nov 01 - 08:34 PM

LOVE COME TWINKLIN' DOWN

Chorus
Oh, seek, seek, seek and ye shall find
Jes' knock, an' it shall be opened,
Jes' ask, and it shall be given,
An' the Love come twinklin' down.

My mother, you ought to a-been there,
Mother, you ought a-been there,
Mother, you ought a-been there,
When the love come twinklin' down.
Cho.
Oh, father, you ought to a-been there, etc.
Cho.
My sister, you ought to a-been there, etc.
Cho.
My brother, you ought to a-been there, etc.
Cho.

Vera Hall, Dock (Zebediah) Reed and Jesse Allison, near Livingston, AL. Lovely tune with finger-snapping beat.
John and Ruby Lomax 1939 Southern States Recording Trip. Click on Links at top of page and scroll down to Lomax Collection.
@religion @spiritual

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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Love Come Twinklin' Down
From: masato sakurai
Date: 19 Nov 01 - 08:39 PM

The sound recording is HERE.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Love Come Twinklin' Down
From: wysiwyg
Date: 19 Nov 01 - 09:42 PM

I love that twinklin' thing. I have seen spirituals where it's twinkling, tinkling, trickling, all sorts of permutations... probably tickling too...

~S~


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Subject: Lyr Add: When the Love Comes Twinkle-lin' Down
From: masato sakurai
Date: 19 Nov 01 - 10:52 PM

The version in Solomon, Honey in the Rock: The Ruby Pickens Tartt Collection of religious Folk Songs from Sumter County, Alabama (p. 33) is longer.

WHEN THE LOVE COMES TWINKLE-LIN' DOWN

-1-
Oh, brother, you oughter been there
Brother, you oughter been there
Brother, you oughter been there
When the love come twinkle-in' down.

-2-
My mother, you oughter been there
Mother, you oughter been there
Mother, you oughter been there
When the love come twinkle-in' down.

-3-
My elder, where were you
My elder, where were you
My elder, where were you
When the love come twinkle-in' down.

-Chorus-
Oh seek, seek, seek en you shall find,
Knock en the door shall be open,
Ask en it shall be given,
When the love come twinkle-in' down.

-4-
Oh my sister, where were you
My sister, where were you
My sister, where were you
When the love come twinkle-in' down.

-5-
Oh, sinner, you oughter been there
Sinner, you oughter been there
Sinner, you oughter been there
When the love come twinkle-in' down.

-6-
Oh, pretender, you oughter been there
Pretender, you oughter been there
Pretender, you oughter been there
When the love come twinkle-in' down.

Another version is in Religious Folk Songs of the Negro, new ed. (1920; AMS, 1973, p. 101; with music)["Seek and Ye Shall Find"].

James Weldon Johnson says (in the preface to The Book of American Negro Spirituals, vol. 1, p. 41), when he cites another spiritual (CRUCIFIXION, stz. 4: "De blood came twinkiln' down,/An' He never said a mumblin' word./De blood came twinkiln' down,/An' He never said a mumblin' word,/Not a word--not a word--not a word."), "The word 'twinklin'' ... is a Negro pronunciation of the word 'trinkling.' But in this way what a magical poetic phrase was stumbled upon, 'The blood came twinkling down.'"

Other sound recordings were made before World War II by Wood's Famous Blind Jubilee Singers (on Document)["Seek and Ye Shall Find"]; Pace Jubilee Singers ["Seek and Ye Shall Find"]; and The Pettways And Friends ["Seek And Ye Shall Find (And the Boold Come A-Twinking Down)"].

~Masato


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Love Come Twinklin' Down
From: wysiwyg
Date: 20 Nov 01 - 11:43 AM

Similar to:

Brother you ought to been there

To hear old Jordan Roll.

Roll, Jordan, roll,

etc.

~S~


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Love Come Twinklin' Down
From: KathWestra
Date: 20 Nov 01 - 12:03 PM

The traditional singer from whom Sandy Paton learned this song (Sandy -- who was it?) sang "trinklin' down". I like that too.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Love Come Twinklin' Down
From: Joe Offer
Date: 20 Nov 01 - 12:32 PM

Gee, Kath, do you think Sandy learned it from the Kingston Trio, who sang love comes a-trickling down (click)? More likely, they learned it from Sandy, changed it from trinkle to trickle, and slapped a copyright on it....
-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Love Come Twinklin' Down
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 20 Nov 01 - 02:43 PM

Caroline and I learned the song from a recording of E. C. Ball. He sang "Love come a-trinklin' down." We had trouble understanding the words of the "Seek and ye shall find" refrain, so we wrote to him asking for clarification. It sounded to us as though he was singing:

Seek and ye shall find with a skinny work,
Give a knock and the door shall be open,
And love come a-trinklin' down.

We received a lovely postcard from "E. C. Ball, Gas and Groceries, Rugby, Virginia," in answer. It turned out that what we had heard was exactly what he was singing! We have always assumed it to be a corruption of "ask and it shall be given" phrase, but we find it so appealing that we have continued to sing it through all these years just as we learned it from him. He and his wife were wonderful traditional singers and have a CD on Rounder (I think it's Rounder). GET IT! Dick Greenhaus at Camsco gan provide it as a good price, with a percentage going to Mudcat.

Sandy

p.s.: Joe: You know, I don't think I ever learned a song from the Kingston Trio. At the time of their popularity, I was being terribly snotty about people who were exploiting traditional music by making it sound like pop music. We went to England in 1957 to sit at the feet of Ewan MacColl because he seemed to be able to write NEW songs that sounded like traditional ones, quite the reverse of what was happening in the great commercial folk scare of the late fifties and sixties. I hope I've lost a bit of the snottiness over the decades, but I still lean toward the traditional stuff and the new songs that resemble the old ones, something I call "the continuing tradition."


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Love Come Twinklin' Down
From: Sandy Paton
Date: 20 Nov 01 - 02:53 PM

I'm sorry, folks. I should have added that the verses in the Ball song were simply the familiar "family" series:

Fathers, Jesus loves you,
Fathers, Jesus loves you,
And love come a-trinklin; down.

Refrain:
Seek and ye shall find with a skinny work,
Give a knock and the door shall be opened,
And love come a-trinklin' down.

Continuing with "Mothers" "Sisters" "Brothers," and we add "Neighbors." Please note the "opened" rather than the "open" I typed in my first e-missive.

Sandy


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Love Come Twinklin' Down
From: Joe Offer
Date: 20 Nov 01 - 03:23 PM

Sandy, I think I'd be disappointed if I knew you learned something from the Kingston Trio. If you heard something form that piqued your interest, I'm sure you'd go looking for the original sources. I wish those pop-folk performers had given more information about sources in the first place.

I see in this message (click), that another one of your "students" (Ray Frank, DADGBE) took note of the unusual lyrics from Ball.

-Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Love Come Twinklin' Down
From: KathWestra
Date: 20 Nov 01 - 03:59 PM

A bit of thread creep, just to keep things interesting. We were lucky enough to have a Folklore Society program last Saturday by Rugby Va's awesome fingerpicker Wayne Henderson. It must be something in Rugby's water. That teensy town has produced amazing musicians and guitar makers. Henderson is both. He learned a whole lot of his tunes from E.C. Ball, and performed some of them on Sat. If you EVER have a chance to hear Wayne, DO IT! He has three terrific CDs, the newest of which is "Les Pick", which is also his license plate.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Love Come Twinklin' Down
From: Dicho (Frank Staplin)
Date: 20 Nov 01 - 04:54 PM

Love Come Twinklin' Down, recorded by Southern Wonder Qt., 1940, on Document cd DOCD 5371 (title Belmont Silvertone etc.). Not heard.


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