Playing by ear- advantage or disadvantage?

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: Ferrara
Date: 28 Aug 98 - 12:43 PM

Whether formal music background is an advantage or disadvantage is up to you. I know a fellow who has all kinds of formal training,years of both orchestral and choral work, etc. You should hear him jam in a folk or bluegrass setting, backing up a singer, or improvising gorgeous harmonies on his viola! - Wonderful. The training certainly hasn't hurt him any. You would never expect a viola to fit so well in a folk environment.

For myself, I took four years of piano when I was a kid, then the usual "music" classes in school and a couple years playing violin in the orchestra. It didn't cure any of my bad habits, it took singing with other folkies to do that. But there are times when reading notes, doing a bit of sight reading, or knowing a bit of theory is a great help.

Once in a great while, when I can't figure out or remember a melody, I transcribe it in standard musical notation using a guitar or piano to find the notes. Lots of effort, but it works. And somehow having the mental picture of the notes helps me remember the parts I had difficulty with.

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: Barbara Shaw
Date: 28 Aug 98 - 12:30 PM

I learned how to read music as a 5-year-old on the piano. Always felt like those people who could play without sheet music were the REAL musicians. A few decades later, I learned to play guitar and fiddle by ear. It's much more fun this way, and easier (for me). People who do one are typically intimidated by the other. I took 1 year of classical violin lessons, and my teacher (who plays with the New Haven Symphony) was amazed at my ability to play by ear. She was completely unnerved at a jam I dragged her to, when called on to take a break. And I was amazed at her ability to take a piece of music almost completely black with notes and swim through it with feeling and interpretation.

Being able to read music is a tremendous advantage. I can buy songbooks and find wonderful tunes in them that I would never know otherwise. I can pick up classical music and thoroughly enjoy myself on the fiddle/violin. I can read how the great composers intended their pieces to be played. And when I write a song, I can put the music onto my MusicTime software and print it down.

Being able to play by ear is a tremendous advantage. I can walk up to a group of strangers playing something I've never heard before and join in a jam. I can play in the dark. I can create music more spontaneously with minimum setup.

Anyway you can do it is fine, and any limits you set on yourself are your own. I recommend teaching children (and adults!) to do both.

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: lingolucky
Date: 28 Aug 98 - 12:15 PM

For me, there's no way to go but by ear. Still I have to hear a piece repeatedly before I have it, and I certainly need thr chord sequence if ther are more than three chords. I think you need a teacher, but not sight read- ing. Andthe bass runs are very important. Lane Goldsmith

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From:
Date: 28 Aug 98 - 11:07 AM

I play by ear --however sometimes it get caught in the strings --Art Can you help me?

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: The Shambles
Date: 28 Aug 98 - 10:27 AM

Aural / oral. lets call the whole thing off!

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: Allan C.
Date: 28 Aug 98 - 08:54 AM

I was taught to play by ear. My teacher would ask me to bring a recording of a song I wanted to learn and then would show me how to hear the bass line, chord changes, and melody line and apply them to my guitar. Many years later in order to fulfill curriculum requirements, I found myself in a music theory class. I was able to astound my instructor by being able (by ear) to identify by name most of the chords he played on the piano. Mostly, though, I was kept busy learning to write music by 17th and 18th century rules. Strangely, I have never since been called upon to use those forms! Despite all of the theory, I never really learned how to apply what I had learned to any instrument in any meaningful way. I will admit that in time, certain broad concepts from that class began to sink in. So I guess "It didn't hurt me none".

If you hold a gun on me, I can sit at a piano and painstakingly plink out a melody from a piece of sheet music. There are times when I envy those who can both read and apply written music to an instrument. From time to time I run across a book full of interesting-looking songs. But unless I can get someone to play them for me, I have little idea of how they should sound.

On the other hand, I love hearing songs performed by others and trying to figure out how to play what I hear. It feels like what I think of when using the words "folk music". And, by the way, I always thought it should be the "aural" tradition rather than "oral"!

I have to agree with Art, I like being a solo act. At least solo with regard to instrument. I always found it troublesome, at best, to try to teach another player the same sense of rythm and timing. However, I have always enjoyed singing with a partner. Somehow sharing vocal nuances seems easier - don't understand why.

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: Bo
Date: 28 Aug 98 - 04:41 AM

The more you do the more you can do.

If learning by ear fulfills you, you dont need more, but every skill you have is another club in your golfbag.

Bo

Who is trying to learn to sight read and computer system administrate at the same time.

( Guess which is more fun :))

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantage or disadvantage?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 28 Aug 98 - 02:49 AM

With 16 years of Catholic education, I had a lot of music callses - but I never learned to read music or to play an instrument. I've always sung, but learned everything by ear. The music training helped me understand it, though.
Lately, though, I've found a new technique for learning music - the opposite sex. I've been dating a woman who plays every instrument known to humankind. She can't play them all at once, however, so I'm expected to make a contribution. So, she and another woman play the violin or piano or accordion or whatever, and I play along on the guitar or harmonica. I find I half-read and half play by ear. Somehow, it works. It seems to me that doing it by ear works a little better for me, though. I tend to get behind if I read the music. My friend and the other woman are patient and supportive, and I find I'm learning very quickly - a lot quicker than I learned from the nuns.
-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: harpgirl
Date: 27 Aug 98 - 10:44 PM

Having learned first "by ear" to play and only recently learning to read music I found that learning to read allowed me to learn alot of new stuff fast such as Irish tunes and since I already had lots of idosyncratic approaches to autoharp and guitar, I could incorporate my picking styles to jigs, reels, polkas, and the like. Didn't John Hartford say "style is based on limitation." The grass is sometimes greener but you still have to mow it, I always say...I agree with Art, though. Playing alone means you never have to say your sorry!! to your bandmates...But when I play in DoneyGals, my schooled partner does teach me alot!!! harpgirl

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: Art Thieme
Date: 27 Aug 98 - 10:21 PM

Seed--

It is like a "Thieme song"----"theme".That's how we pronounce it. Not time = thyme. But I like the pun so much I couldn't NOT use it just 'cause my name is pronounjced differently.

Art

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: BSeed
Date: 27 Aug 98 - 08:37 PM

Art, with that pun you have certainly outdone yourself. And taught me how to pronounce your name (I'd wondered: "Theme? Thighm?" (Thow, thumb) --seed

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: Art Thieme
Date: 27 Aug 98 - 07:55 PM

I pretty much agree, Chet. I've always been an ear musician---and a musical loner. Never did try to exactly copy anybody. Just developed my own ways of doing the styles I respected most. Restricted by my own limitations, I created my own cliches; when you put enough of those together over the years, you develop a "STYLE" of your own as a byproduct. A little John Hurt--a little Merle Travis--a little Pete--a little Grandpa Jones--a little Bob Gibson--a ton of myself and my own stubbornness--and many, many other good people I met on those roads less traveled. If I had played "with" others more, I might've been forced to learn more music---even learn to read music. But doing it with others wasn't my forte--I preferred one person and their intrument to a band any day---a small combo to a big band. And being a solo was much easier than practicing with others; that's sad to some extent, but true, nonetheless. And nobody ever quit my group and had to be replaced! Playing by ear was sometimes limiting, but what I put out there for others to hear was the music I loved most--the story songs--not what other musicians wanted me to play.
My recordings were always just me and my instruments---no overdubbing---no other voices (except once; my friend Cindy Mangsen)
Once, as I've said in another thread, I did try to form a group one time. Elvis Presley, Patti Page, Rosemary Clooney, and me. Yep, we were gonns call ourselves "Presley, Page, Rosemary and Thieme"

Art

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: Susan-Marie
Date: 27 Aug 98 - 07:41 PM

As a non-reader, I find myself limited when I try to communicate with musicians who know theory and correct terminology. I've really enjoyed the "Music 101" threads we've had here over recent months.

That said, I do think learning by ear first is the way to go. Music needs to be absorbed and consumed before it is analyzed, or it's all just dots on a staff....

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: The Shambles
Date: 27 Aug 98 - 07:29 PM

Stacy. I liked the lines from the song, couldn't agree more with those sentiments. It made me think though, we do expect children to be able to talk before we expect them to read (and write). I think with music especially in England, we have expected our children to be able to read and write music before they can talk(play) it. The Victorian collectors transcibed our folk music for the piano, to be played politely in front rooms and we came to view any other form of music as not quite respectable. It was almost mandatory for the young ladies of the family to struggle with learning the piano and notation. An attitude responsible, I'm sure for turning some people off music for ever. Judging by the wonderful and free playing young musicians I see at sessions here, I think we must be doing it differently now, thank goodness. The point is that music exists, for a moment, in the air, not on the page. Notation is a way of recording the notes played and not the music itself. I would agree with Chet, learn the music first.

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: Roger Himler
Date: 27 Aug 98 - 07:11 PM

Dear Anonymous,

The answer of course, as in most of life, is both. As an avid non-reader, I am most familiar with those advantages and dis-advantages.

I think if your goal is to play primarily for your own pleasure, playing by ear is the way to go. It is an approach that allows you to address the song as a whole being and not just the sum of its parts. I suspect you can learn quicker that way, if you have an ear. If you are tone deaf, I think sight-reading is an advantage.

If you want to become the master of your instrument, you will want to learn to read music eventually. I say this, because as you learn to read, you needfully learn music theory, and that is essential to master an instrument. All of this stands aside if you are immensely musically talented. Does Doc Watson read music? I think not. And even if he was sighted, I suspect he would not have taken that course.

Learning to read music helps you to talk to others about the music. If you learned chords, but did not learn their names, it would be more difficult to communicate with others. If you learn their relationships, then you simplify communication even further.

Not reading music does not make you second rate. It is a limitation, but one with which you can live and truly enjoy your music. You can also grow by overcoming it, if you choose to grow in that direction.

Enjoy the music!!

Roger in Baltimore

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: Art Thieme
Date: 27 Aug 98 - 07:10 PM

And they asked Frank Profitt, the source for so many grand N.Carolina songs (including "Tom Dooley"), what he thought of Earl Scruggs' hot banjo pickin'. He said, "I'd like to be able to do it, and then not do it!"

Art Thieme

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: Stacy
Date: 27 Aug 98 - 06:48 PM

Hi ,

I agree with Chet in many ways. I am someone who came from a classical training background. I learned to read music, I learned music history and theory. When I first started to play by ear, I was terrified - frozen. It took some time to learn to depend on my own skills as opposed to depending on the piece of paper. That was, as Chet was saying a lot of repetition in hearing the music.

I have also learned to incorporate knowing theory and reading music to be an asset when I play music by ear. I can hear intervals, relative pitch. I can use that to my advantage when listening to what I want to learn.

To me, when I meet someone who has become adept at learning by ear I am envious. I think they are somehow "closer" to music than I am. I also think someone who can learn by ear has more freedom and leeway with the music.

This conversation reminds me of the lyrics to a Louis Prima and Keely Smith song 'The Lip'...

And when they ask me can I read I say
I read a little bit, but not enough to hurt me none.

Stacy

Subject: RE: Playing by ear-advantageor disadvantage?
From: Chet W.
Date: 27 Aug 98 - 06:27 PM

Don't know your name, but I'll give my advice. Reading and writing music is of course essential if you're going to be playing classical music or if you want to be a session musician in a studio. It is also occasionally handy if there's a tune that you can't learn any other way. But my advice to young musicians is don't bother to learn if you don't have to. The reason being, if you play some sort of folk music or jazz, there are certain subtleties that cannot be notated. For example, if you play old-time music (or whatever it's being called now), you'll find that many people can't tell the difference between what you're doing and bluegrass or cajun (all fine kinds of music) but if you listen carefully with an increasingly experienced ear, you'll find that there are little differences in the rythms that make all the difference in the world. Often it's just a little hesitation or anticipation of one beat here and there, but it's of much importance to the sound of the music and it cannot be notated with even the tiniest notes or rests. As far as learning the tunes is concerned, that is something that gets easier and easier as you progress so that soon you'll have all but the fanciest tunes down after one or two rounds. I have had the experience a number of times, joining a jam group or dance band or some such, when somebody who has formal training brings a book and puts it on a music stand and plays directly from that. It ruins the sound (unless you've got enough people to drown him out) and is extremely irritating. An analogy I have used is that learning a distinctive style of music, such as old time, Celtic, etc, out of a book is like learning to type in a language that you don't know. The biggest and most important part of learning any music is to get it firmly in your head what it's supposed to sound like, and then when you get it, it will be right. It's not enough just to know where to put your fingers and approximately when. So if what I've described resembles where you want to go musically, don't buy books or take formal lessons. Buy records and play with other people as much as you can. You'll get there.

Good luck, Chet W.

Subject: Playing by ear - - Advantage or disadvantage?
From:
Date: 27 Aug 98 - 06:01 PM

Only being able to play and compose music songs by ear, I have always felt a little second rate. I have however fairly recently come to the opinion that it is has been more of an advantage than a disadvantage. You could argue that the type of music that this site is designed for, being an orally transmitted form, it is less of a disadvantage than other forms, but I feel that it enables you to approach and play, all forms of music more freely. I would welcome your views on this subject.