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Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it?
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Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: GUEST,Pean O'Graffey Date: 19 Jun 02 - 11:51 PM What is this thing called happiness? Are you happy? Am I? Sometimes yep, sometimes nup. I think the question should be "Is he happier having done it than he would have been had he not done it?", and the answer to that is that he had to do it; he couldn't have lived any other way, which effectively nullifies the question of how happy he is about it. I don't think it turned out the way he expected it to. Was it worth it? He made the world an incalculably better place. It must have been worth it, whatever the sacrifice. |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Little Hawk Date: 19 Jun 02 - 11:16 PM "I've gained some recognition, but I've lost my appetite"
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 19 Jun 02 - 07:42 PM "Well, anybody can be just like me, obviously..." |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Tweed Date: 19 Jun 02 - 07:09 PM Well said Pete. |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Pete Jennings Date: 19 Jun 02 - 04:23 PM Is he happy? To my mind, put this way, this question ("are you happy") almost always implies the achievement of a prolonged state of a singular emotion, whereas in reality there is no such thing as we all go through many, often polarised, emotions in a single day. And, given the complexities of life, can anybody really be happy for a prolonged period of time? (Skipping down the road with your first real true love at seventeen excepted, on the basis that those few weeks seem to last a lifetime!). He's probably just like the rest of us - happy when the plane's on time (even if it's a Learjet rather than a 747), happy when he does a good gig, happy when he gets up on a perfect Spring morning, happy when he writes a song which HE thinks is good, etc. But, also like the rest of us, he's only human, so after the happiness will come a cycle of the other emotions, on a daily basis. Was it worth it? He'll be well beyond counting or valuing money by now, so he'll have the same personal self doubts we all get as we mature and start becoming more reflective upon our own lives. Here's my answer: We all think it was worth it just for "X", whatever "X" may be in each of our lives. IMHO, he could have done nothing before he wrote "Mississipi", and I'd still acknowledge the greatness of his writing, which is not dependant upon elapsed time in terms of human lifespan. Today, Wednesday 19 June, I've been tired, inpsired, hot, chilled, hungry, full, in Belgium, up at 30,000 feet, back on the ground, back in England, stuck in traffic and, right now, inspired as ever by Catters. My wife is sick upstairs in bed, but I'm reconciled to that, there's a glass of scotch and a guitar waiting for me when I finish in here, and it's still light outside and the sky is blue. And I think I've written a great song, needs some fine-tuning, but I'M pleased with it. That's sadness, that's happiness, that's worth, even if transient. It's the same for Dylan - he's no different to the rest of us. Pete
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: GUEST,Troll Boy Date: 19 Jun 02 - 03:05 AM Good words, Little Hawk. You're a fan. |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Willie-O Date: 18 Jun 02 - 03:05 PM I don't think he'd still be touring if he didn't like it. God knows he doesn't need the money. Guy sure is changeable. That seems to me to be his prevailing feature. So, sometimes happy, sometimes not, and looking back over forty years, how could it not have been worth it? W-O |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Little Hawk Date: 18 Jun 02 - 03:03 PM "People see me all the time, and they just can't remember how to act. Their minds are filled with big ideas, images, and distorted facts." |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: GUEST,The Jester Date: 18 Jun 02 - 12:00 PM The crystal ball upon the wall ain't shown me nothin yet. I've paid the price of solitude but at least I'm out of debt. |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Little Hawk Date: 18 Jun 02 - 11:49 AM Yeah, Tweed, you're right about that. It's the price of fame, though. You become "public property", whether you want it or not. When he was young he wanted to be "bigger than Elvis". As far as I'm concerned he did become bigger than Elvis, but if he'd known what it would be like he might not have done it. I wanted to be famous when I was young too. I have since decided that relative obscurity and a few good friends beats the hell out of fame! Big Tim - Good comments. I used to think maybe I could change the world too. I finally came around to seeing that the only really workable plan of action was to change myself. - LH |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Tweed Date: 18 Jun 02 - 06:43 AM It's a good thread but if he ever popped in here and read the thing, I bet it'd make him somewhat unhappy to find us takin' him apart and still trying to put labels on the pieces. |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: fat B****rd Date: 18 Jun 02 - 05:16 AM No idea regarding his mental state, I either listen to his stuff or I don't. Generally though I do. Nice thread LH. |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Big Tim Date: 18 Jun 02 - 03:14 AM I'd guess that Dylan has always been something of a pessismist, even as a child and teenager. As a young singer maybe he thought he could change the world but then realised that that the world has a habit of going it's own way regardless,and that many of his "allies" in the protest scene were just about as doctrinaire and intolerant as those they wanted to change. (Better, admittedly, to have been a Freedon Rider than a racist Mayor). Also there was fame, the music business ("music is spiritual, the music business is not" - Van Morrison)and complete loss of privacy (fans going through his garbage for "clues","dylanogy"), etc. Basically though I don't think Dylan likes humanity, and given the mess we've made of the world, who can blame him? "trainwrecks and the tearing down of the walls". Happy - sadly no, He far too thoughtful to possibly be happy. Are any of us happy? Worth it? - for me, yes definitely, in a class of his own. No matter who else I listen to I always come back to Bob Dylan. |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Bobert Date: 17 Jun 02 - 11:49 PM Yeah, Little Hawk, while a thread killer, a well written thread killer. Like the Tweezer, when I first heard Bob in 1964, my life was changed. Period. There is no other artist that has had that much impact on me. (And as for "Time Out of Mind"? It's all blues and I am the one who can listen to it and come away feeling fine...) Bobert |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Amos Date: 17 Jun 02 - 10:48 PM Two different questions. Was he happy? Sometimes. Was it worth it? Sure. Absolutely. A |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: GUEST,Frogmore Date: 17 Jun 02 - 10:46 PM Little Hawk, Well put. You're a damn good writer and clear thinker and if you lived down the street I'd walk on over for a visit. Frogmore |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 17 Jun 02 - 08:51 PM Happiness comes and goes. If you were happy all the time, you wouldn't be really happy at all, I fancy.
If you asked someone what their ambition in life was, and they said "to be happy" I think you'd feel they were missing out on something. Including happiness.
I doubt if you'd ever have found Dylan giving that answer. Except maybe at some time when he was really unhappy. |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Tweed Date: 17 Jun 02 - 08:34 PM Amen to that LH. He made me start thinking for the first time when I heard "Subterranean Homesick Blues" blasting from the transistor radio that was stuck in my canvas paperboy bag when I was 13 or 14. Changed my entire brain wave patterns that cold, miserable January day and have always been glad for it. Thanks Bob, I owe you one. |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Little Hawk Date: 17 Jun 02 - 04:24 PM Someone asked him in an interview once if he was happy...he said he'd never thought about it. I suspect he had no desire to answer such a question at all in the first place. My impression of Dylan is: He was ecstatically happy in the early days, when he managed to realize his adolescent dreams...by playing music onstage, by meeting many of his heroes (especially Woody Guthrie) in the flesh, and playing music with them, by recording his first album, by playing the legendary folk clubs and stages like Carnegie Hall. He positively bubbled in those days, was often hilarious onstage, cracking jokes, telling tall tales, and was full of high spirits. At the same time he had a lot of really serious and dark stuff on his mind to be writing the social protest material and the other poetry, and often had a torturous private life, trying to work out his personal relationship with Suze Rotolo, etc., and trying to handle outrageous success. She said he tended to see "the dark side" an awful lot. Later, by '65 and '66, he was becoming very alienated and prickly...because he was just too damn famous, and people expected him to do the impossible for them. He started being really hard on most other people then, and on himself too...he acted downright hateful at times in his efforts to protect himself from fans and from the press. That's what it amounts to. You wouldn't have said he was "happy", I don't think, but I imagine he still felt it was all "worth it". He certainly played like he thought it was. After he married Sara and cracked up on the motorcycle, he just wanted OUT. And he got out...for awhile...as best he could. He was definitely happy in the early years of the marriage....he seemed to have decided that marriage and children and a quiet domestic life were THE ANSWER. The love songs of that period (after the intense self-examination and spiritual searching of John Wesley Harding) certainly stronly reflected that on albums such as: Nashville Skyline, New Morning, and Planet Waves. He was happy...the music critics were less so...they preferred Dylan in a state of anger or angst. They got that Dylan...when the marriage started to fall apart and he started touring again on a regular basis. His first album in the new phase, Blood On The Tracks, is probably his very finest of all. It's really incomparable. The material that followed led down a road of greater and greater angst...if not real desperation...and that culminated in his born-again conversion with 3 "Christian" albums. They were often very impressive musically and emotionally, while sometimes very dour and doctrinaire in tone. Was he happy? I wouldn't exactly say that, but he was certainly inspired and filled with new purpose. That led into the 80's...a rocky period which included some great songs, some very poor ones, and some fairly disastrous live concerts, plus some darn good ones, plus a totally lousy movie that never should have been made. It was a real up and down decade. Was he happy? No point even asking, in my opinion... Then he did some more great stuff...with the Travelling Wilburys, and on albums such as Oh Mercy, World Gone Wrong, and others. Then he did maybe the darkest album ever...Time Out of Mind...it was pretty darn good, but if you can listen to the whole thing without getting depressed you have mastered detachment! It's clear from the songs on Time Out of Mind that Bob would far rather be young again! So would I, as long as I didn't forget what I've learned along the way. I imagine he'd rather be anonymous too. Most of his close friends say that's the gift they would give him if they could. Suze Rotolo said she would give him "youth, beauty, and no more biographies". Man, I would give him that too, and anything else if I could for what he has done. Was it worth it? Yup. It was for me, and it was for millions of other people, and it was for him. It was his chosen destiny. Would he choose to do it again (in another life)? I doubt it. Once through that whirlwind is enough for anyone. To close this I will quote Joan Beez from her own song lyrics:
"Happiness is temporary, believe me, I know I love them both dearly. They brought me more than happiness. - LH |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Clinton Hammond Date: 17 Jun 02 - 04:15 PM I think you'd have to ask him... |
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Subject: RE: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: Jerry Rasmussen Date: 17 Jun 02 - 03:48 PM He sure ain't much of a smiler. Never has been. :-) Jerry |
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Subject: Is/Was Dylan happy? Was it worth it? From: GUEST,JohnnieBGoode Date: 17 Jun 02 - 03:46 PM I wonder about this from time to time. Any one have any ideas? |
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