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Aussies ban American Bands
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Severn Date: 14 Aug 07 - 07:07 PM Looks like Joe removed siriuslek's introductory post, but left mine. Now it looks like I'm talking to nobody in particular. Hope seriouslek shows up again, or that my posts vanish from here, if the job's done and this person's serious about joining. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Rowan Date: 14 Aug 07 - 05:56 PM Greetings Bob. Yes, you're right. I can't think how I missed them (I can only plead I was in Central Australia at the time) but it should have read "The whole event was celebrated by all and sundry in as many ways as possible; the story got around that, from the number supplied to the athletes' village, every athlete would have used 10 condoms each and every night of the duration of the Games." Cheers, Rowan |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Bob Bolton Date: 14 Aug 07 - 07:10 AM G'day Rowan, Errr... did some fall out of (... or get censored from...?) your penultimate sentence... ? Regard(les)s, Bob |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Rowan Date: 13 Aug 07 - 07:51 PM Good advice Severn! I missed this thread the first time around, as I was too busy trying to avoid anything to do with the Sydney Games but, having read all the posts, I am impressed by the good nature of most 'catters. I was also intrigued to see there was no reference to a wonderful parody of SOCOG's antics that was being broadcast on ABC (Oz) tv at the time. "The Games" was a brilliantly prescient take on the political machinations; almost every episode was later mirrored by reality. The three main characters were John Clark, Brian Dawe and Gina Riley; the first two are still doing political satire every Thursday for a few minutes at the end of the ABC's "7.30 Report" a current affairs programme and I think their offerings are available on the web. Gina Riley will be known to anyone who has watched "Kath & Kim", which I gather has an international audience. And, as you all know, we survived the Olympics, helped along by Roy and HG's merciless commentary. I never found out what happened to the American bands but I know that Nikki Webster (the flying moppet in the opening) has been regularly satirised ever since. The whole event was celebrated by all and sundry in as many ways as possible; the story got around that, from the number supplied to the athletes' village, every athlete would have used 10 each and every night of the duration of the Games. Isn't satire satisfying! Cheers, Rowan |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Severn Date: 12 Aug 07 - 09:06 PM Hi, siriuslek! I'm Severn, some guy from Maryland near Washington DC. Pleased to meet you. Now why not go up to the top of things and learn how to start your own thread entitled, maybe, "Hi, I'm siriuslek!", so everybody else knows where you are. Not that many people will come look on a thread on an unhappy subject that hasn't been open since 1999, but with your own thread, you will find lots of warm greetings from people from all over the globe. Go register yourself, so that those interested can get in youch with you. Join in some discussions, and maybe come in with some of us in the chatroom. Look to talk to you soon! |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: katlaughing Date: 18 Jul 99 - 01:49 PM Right on & far out, Moonchild!:-) Thanks! KatlaughingradicallypeacefullyinthebackwoodsinmyBirks,too! |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: bbelle Date: 18 Jul 99 - 12:21 PM #1. The vinegar on my fries must be MALT ... an addiction I acquired years ago, whilst residing my the Bahamas; #2. Americans are comically egotistical ... we (and I use that term loosely!) think our everything is better than everyone elses. I haven't watched the Olympics in years because of all the bullshit, drugs, etc., however, why shouldn't a country, city, whatever, use the opportunity to showcase its local talent, rather than bringing in talent from elsewhere? #3. When will y'll learn NOT to respond to anything Gargle (not a misspell) posts? Kat... that was an unfair jab at you and I admire your restraint in not responding. #4. Max ... I am totally and absolutely against censorship, however, perhaps it is time for censureship. Mother always said I would mellow with age ... as I approach my 51st (7/20) I find I'm not mellowing at all. Barbara made a statement in response to one of my postings that said "there are certain common grounds a lot of us have here, and if you don't share those, you will find we don't fit you any better than you fit us." It was not a fair assessment of who I am, as it related to the thread, and, if she had read any of my previous postings, she would have known "me." Besides the music, this is the type of thread upon which I thrive ... the outpouring of humanity and intelligence is awesome. I'm not a needy individual whose only relationships are through the "net," however, I am needy when it comes to being able to "voice" my radical, peacenik, backwoods, Birkenstock, hippie-chick thoughts ... moonchild
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Subject: http://anon.free.anonymizer.com/RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Ian in Melbourne Date: 18 Jul 99 - 12:57 AM Thank you Mr. Catspaw49 and Ms. Katlaughing
May I return your kind invitation to drop by Melbourne on your trip down under? You are both welcome. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: bseed(charleskratz) Date: 17 Jul 99 - 04:42 PM ...and flat out racist. Altogether unpleasant and unworthy of this forum. I've been exposed to the spiteful and supercilious side of you for a year now, Gargoyle, but that's a new low even for you. Everyone else please forgive my flaming. --seed |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: LEJ Date: 17 Jul 99 - 03:40 PM Hey Gargoyle... that post wasn't funny or clever. Maybe it wasn't meant to be? I know you can be nasty and cantankerous (two traits that I sometimes admire), but that last one was just plain mean-spirited and malicious. LEJ |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: katlaughing Date: 17 Jul 99 - 03:37 PM Well, lets see, the Ozmen I know, came on a commercial flight, get paid the same wages as any of us, go home on vacation, have green cards, so the correlation is what? You know, gargle, I usually just ignore the little bait you leave behind. You know, as well as anyone on here, my views etc. do NOT mesh with that of the originator of this thread nor with yours. If falsely accusing others of similar bigotry makes you happy, well, I trust everyone to consider the source. Katlaughingwhilesharpeningherclaws |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: gargoyle Date: 17 Jul 99 - 03:25 PM to: ms. laugh cat..... U.S.labor laws are now... such that
tequilla swilling mexicans and wine drinkin blacks are best replaced by beer guzling aussys from the outback?
You appear as sterotypical as the originator of this thread.
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: katlaughing Date: 17 Jul 99 - 02:52 PM Ian, we've a lot of Aussies come to Wyoming to work ont ehr anches. ANd, we've a small microbrewery in town. Anytime ya want to came by for a "piss up" (I love that expression!), we'll do it! katlaughing |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Big Mick Date: 17 Jul 99 - 11:39 AM Ian, Well said, lad. Stop at Gun Lake any time you've a mind to. We'll roast some beef, drink a little (they sell Fosters at the corner) and I'll show you my hill. Bring a Low D whistle. Mick |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: catspaw49 Date: 17 Jul 99 - 07:01 AM Don't worry about it Ian, you're welcome at our house anytime. catspaw |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Richard Bridge Date: 17 Jul 99 - 03:59 AM Let's not be pompous. The original post was not dignified. But it was quite funny. |
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Subject: http://anon.free.anonymizer.com/RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Ian Date: 17 Jul 99 - 02:00 AM Reports of certain generalizations as to the nature, character and attitudes of Australians filtered to me as I lay in bed this morning enjoying an early morning cuppa (short for cup of tea.) As a proud Australian and, I hope, a good citizen of the world, I would like to put some perspective on the matter of the massed bands for the Sydney 2000 Olympics. First of all, SOCOG (Sydney Organising Committee for the Olympic Games) are a bunch of pinheads who could not organise a Piss Up (drinking binge) in a brewery.
Apart from bribing anyone who looked like they needed it, they have managed to offend just about every sector of Australian society, so don't feel special.
The best example is asking the federal government for funding, then calling it the Sydney Olympics. If they want Sydney to be the focus of the world then let Sydney pay for it. If they want Australia to pay for it then let s call it the Australian Olympic games -- (Sydney).
Their feather-bedding, pork-barrelling and general arrogance is making just about every one down under barf.
The general attitude in Australia (or at least my circle of family and friends, which extends to four states) is that they should never have asked overseas performers to our opening without asking us first.
No offence, guys, but we can sort of do these things ourselves, although it would have been an exciting spectacle.
OK, having made that blunder, they should have then stuck to their promises. Public opinion may have been fired up, but the sensibilities of a few anti-U.S. Australians (yes, the same ones who would beg for assistance if Indonesia got wise) to me is irrelevant against the disappointment which your bands, their families and supporters must be feeling.
It is to these victims of the most high profile incompetence this country has experienced (since the British landed us on Gallipolli) that this Australian seriously and sincerely apologises.
Australians are not two-faced, back-stabbing four-flushers (don't know what this means but I watch a lot of TV.) Don't judge us by a bunch of fools blinded by the power of His Excellency (and friend of Franco and Mussolini) Juan Antonio Samaranch and the lure of the free lunch.
This Australian only knows too well that if it weren't for you guys we would be eating sushi by now.
More recently you guys have also bore the brunt of Korea, Vietnam, Iraq and Kosovo, showing leadership and a willingness to spill the blood of the same young people who we choose to insult over this band bit.
Don't lose interest in us, America. Sue SOCOG for all they are worth. Boycott our games. Even send Paul Hogan back (ouch, that would really hurt.)
Just remember that our roots go back to WWI and I hope that when I finally get to visit the land of the brave and the home of the free that I won't be tarred and feathered.
IAN MALLISON Melbourne, Australia.
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Joe Offer Date: 04 Jul 99 - 11:36 PM Transferred from another thread. -Joe Offer-
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Matthew B. Date: 04 Jul 99 - 10:09 PM Well, I'm glad to know that the dancers of Canada are so unencumbered by garments. Now that's freedom. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 04 Jul 99 - 07:04 PM Matthew -- the ladies at Joe's old family homestead are wearing a lot less than tops. Absolutely nothing, as shocking as it would be to the Mayor of New York. It is in fact legal for women to go topless in public in Canada, so you can imagine that licenced bars for adults tolerate a bit more than that. Well, it **does** get pretty hot around here in the summer. Right now I'm looking to take off a few layers myself. . . |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 04 Jul 99 - 06:54 PM While the original post was rude and childish, I do think the motivation behind cancelling the band attendances was equally rude and childish. Most definitely they should have decided straight away to use their local bands, but once having made the commitment they should have stuck to it and not backed out. Bad manners all round here. No wonder I never watch the Olympics. I see two groups of petty and pig-headed nationalists going at it here. The American bands should let their anger be known, refuse to go even if the decision is reversed, and let the matter rest. You should never go where you are not wanted. Joe -- the entrance to the old Ouellette house is slightly off of Ouellette Ave., although at one time the front of it (now taken up with stores) had a lawn onto Ouellette Ave. The tract of land taken up by the Palace Theatre Building and the Armouries was once Ouellette Park, named after the same family. If it is any consolation, it is a very popular and upscale strip club. Poor old Vidal Ouellette would be rolling in his grave if he knew, as he was a staunch supporter of the Catholic church.:) On the topic of food, I should have also mentioned fiddleheads. The only true fiddleheads come from Maine up into eastern Canada and are the shoots of the Ostrich Fern. Others called fiddleheads found in other parts of North America are not the same fern and in fact are toxic and cancer-causing.
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: bseed(charleskratz) Date: 04 Jul 99 - 06:42 PM For sure the OzOC botched this up from the beginning--while the Olympics is an international event, the opening festival has always been a welcome by the host country: the American bands should never have been invited in the first place. I might have actually watched the opening if it featured digeridoo bands and dancing wombats. But once the invitation was made, once these kids had been promised a place in the opening cememony and raised the money to go, it was extreme bad form to recall the invitation--again, the fault of the OzOC, not of Ozzies in general. It is, of course, also bad form for the Americans to raise as much of a public stink over the issue, inflaming passions in both countries (and, I suppose, in Japan). Surely some acceptible compromise could have been negotiated--if cooler heads with active brains and governed by feeling hearts had represented both sides. --seed
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: katlaughing Date: 04 Jul 99 - 06:14 PM LMAO, Rick! |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Rick Fielding Date: 04 Jul 99 - 06:10 PM I always thought that javellin tossing should be part of the Rose Bowl Cat. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: katlaughing Date: 04 Jul 99 - 05:45 PM Well, I have to say 1)Rog used to love the meat pies his French Canadian mother made. 2)In Colorado, my parents and even my sister, bet, used to put salt in their beer (maybe that came from the Nova Scotia ancestry?) and, 3)that 16 yrs old who was quoted sounds a bit of a brat as do the "officials" from California. I do not like the sounds of their dermanding that one cannot take something away without replacing it of equal value. What a bunch of horse-doodoo! Americans can be so egotisitcal and brash, so sure that they rule the world and that everyone wants to be just like them! And, since when was the Olympics about high school marching bands? Esp. those from somewhere other than the host country? It should be the athletes and the host country's preparations. The marching bands should stick to things like the Rose Bowl parade, etc! katlaughing |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: catspaw49 Date: 04 Jul 99 - 03:33 PM I guess we Mericans nevil will get much a that culture stuff. Shute Peter I done thought them folks wuz ozzies. Cletus, doin' some bad puns |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Peter T. Date: 04 Jul 99 - 02:16 PM Fred Astaire (famous Australian) lowers periscope off abandoned San Francisco, and turns to Ava Gardner (famous Australian woman) and remarks: "Hard to tell -- atomic bomb or American culture?" (old On the Beach joke) |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: gargoyle Date: 04 Jul 99 - 01:16 PM From Sydney Morning Hearld Monday, July 05, 1999. SOCOG's attempt to put a lid on the marching bands fiasco collapsed last night after its compromise offer was rejected by United States band leaders and the company organising the event.
World Projects Corporation said it would not agree to any new Sydney 2000 roles without the support of the bands.
The compromise, reached after SOCOG held an emergency weekend phone conference, involved US and Japanese bands performing at preliminary soccer matches in Canberra and at events at the Opera House and Darling Harbour - but not at the opening ceremony as originally planned.
One Californian band director, Mr Roy Anthony, said he was shocked and disappointed by the deal. "This is not enough, this is unacceptable. You can't equate the two. You can't take away something if you are not going to give us back something of equal value, and this is not of equal value."
Mr Anthony and five other band directors will arrive in Sydney tonight.
A statement from the president of World Projects, Mr William Lutt, said: "A revised contract will be considered if Olympic performance venues are accepted by the foreign and Australian Sydney 2000 Olympic band delegation."
The Minister for the Olympics, Mr Knight, said he had an "in-principle agreement" on the compromise with World Projects but not a written contract.A SOCOG spokesman said later there was a written agreement but refused to release a copy.
One of the high school students who was to perform, 16-year-old San Diego baton-twirler Melissa Scholton, said: "It's hypocrisy to an extreme - to say you can have something and then take it back. It really hurts me. There's people and feelings behind the instruments."
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Barbara Date: 04 Jul 99 - 12:04 PM Before this thread creeps off into the Canadian sunset, let me say that I thought Gil was off the wall for tarring all Ozians for the actions of one Olympic committee. When someone I don't know posts a diatribe, I tend to shut up and hope it dies a natural death in short order, but I think maybe that attitude is unfair to my many wonderful OZ friends here at the 'Cat. Hey, y'all, I KNOW he's wrong about you. Besides as a US citizen, I have some faint hope of not being held accountable for all the idiocy my country, its official representatives and other affiliated organizations do worldwide. And I think everyone would agree the US has the highest profile for international idiocy (not to mention greed and opportunism).
I think the dude was holding the wrong end of the brush. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Banjer Date: 04 Jul 99 - 08:09 AM What tangent? Hell, it's nothing for a thread to go from high school bands to tiples to nipples in five or six steps. Oh and I forgot the trip through the Canadian outback in search of junk food! But on a serious note, (a very rare occurence for me, I'll admit) I do believe that on the subject of the bands not going to Australia: 1. The Autralians should use bands from their own country to showcase their youth sabilities, not import from other countries. 2. Think how WE would feel having foreign bands imported for such an event in our country, given all the talent right here at home. 3. That money raised by those kids for the defunct trip could well be spent on community service projects or improvements for and around the schools, thus still giving the kids a sense of accomplishment and pride in a job well done! 4. OR...How about selecting a site here in the US, centrally located for all the schools involved and having some sort of huge band compatition/display from all the schools? Travel should be no problem. They had already raised most of the funds! |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Matthew B. Date: 04 Jul 99 - 07:11 AM Joe, I wonder what that does to your sense of family heritage. Personally, I'd be proud to see a strip joint on my ancestral grounds - wherever that is (don't get me started about being from a line of wandering Jews). It would be my way of telling Rudy Guliani (the mayor of NYC, who forced all the topless dancers to wear tops because he's so afraid of women) what I think about the suppression of artistic expression. Boy, talk about taking this thread off on a tangent! |
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Subject: O Canada From: Joe Offer Date: 04 Jul 99 - 03:23 AM Sorry to get off on the food tangent, and I have to admit I lied. I loved the chips I got in Ontario last summer, especially with gravy or vinegar. Didn't know about them when I was a kid - my folks gave us only healthy food. Best of all was the corn, though. When I was little and living in Detroit, it seemed we went across the bridge to Ontario almost every weekend to go to the beach on Lake Erie and to buy produce. I didn't like the tomatoes and cantaloupe my mom forced on us, but the peaches and especially the sweet corn were terrific. I went to my cousins' cottage on Lake Erie last summer. On the way, we bought 3 dozen ears of corn, and the lady counted out 36 for us and then just kept counting - she gave us an extra half dozen free, Oh, it was good! By the way, Tim's office in Windsor is on a street named after my ancestors. The old family homestead is now a striptease joint. -Joe Offer, 1/4 French Canadian- |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: gargoyle Date: 04 Jul 99 - 01:24 AM Ah....the sad state of the Mudcat Ya take a serious subject and reduce it to Benny Hill
So....if ya wanna please Helen |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 03 Jul 99 - 11:44 PM Hi Mick, no I don't book bands in that sense. Only volunteer stuff for Santa. A jar is always nice, although I may soon be out of here for the east coast to visit my family. If you want bookings in Windsor, try Patrick O'Ryan's on Pitt Street; The Kildare House on Wyandotte Street East; or The Sandwich Mill on Sandwich Street. (Name of the last place comes from the fact that it is on the corner of Sandwich and Mill Streets, although you can in fact buy a sandwich there.) There will also be a Celtic Festival here on the waterfront the last weekend in July. I have the URL around here somewhere. Seed, the reason I haven't been posting is simple -- too much work! That lottery thread got me thinking . . . |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Big Mick Date: 03 Jul 99 - 11:30 PM Hey Tim, I had no idea that you were in Windsor, or I would have invited you to join George Henderson and I for dinner. You would have loved him. And while you are booking bands, why don't you book mine into a pub in Windsor? We would love to come over. Hhahahahahahahaha.......now we are booking gigs on the 'Cat. What's next????? Next time I am in Detroit, let's tip a jar. I will get in touch and make arrangements. All the best, Mick |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 03 Jul 99 - 11:18 PM Actually, I mean to visit Australia one of these days. I want to see if Roo Bars would be useful in parts of Canada where car/deer collisions are common. Maybe I can make my millions by becoming the sole importer. Don't think they've yet invented the bar sufficient for a car/moose collision. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Chet W. Date: 03 Jul 99 - 11:08 PM In Central Europe, such as the Czech lands, they eat them with tartar sauce. Pretty tasty too. I always declare a cholesterol amnesty when I'm over there. Chet |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: alison Date: 03 Jul 99 - 10:36 PM I like chips with gravy... gravy and cheese sounds good too....... slainte alison |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: bseed(charleskratz) Date: 03 Jul 99 - 10:26 PM Hey, Tim! Welcome back. Haven't seen you here for quite a while. Or have you just been avoiding the threads I haount--the BS ones? --seed |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 03 Jul 99 - 10:10 PM And I've never seen a chip waggon here without catsup. I rarely eat at them anyway -- where do they wash their hands? |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 03 Jul 99 - 10:01 PM Alison, how could one possibly eat fish and chips without vinegar? That had not even occurred to me. In good establishments one is offered clear, malt, cider, and wine vinegar at a minimum. Actually, I don't think vinegar with chips/fries is practiced across all across Canada. It is found mainly in Atlantic Canada and Quebec, with pockets in Ontario. I'm not sure about the westerners. I suspect they eat baked potatoes. Then again, in Quebec they eat the revolting poutine, and the less said about it the better. (Fries, gravy, cheese.) Even the McDonald's chain there sells it. The thing to eat there is their home-made meat pies, tortiere, and if you can get one with venison added to the mix all the better. They also used to make home-made spruce beer out of the gum of spruce trees. That is an, um, acquired taste to say the least. Happily, the practice of older generations of Canadians of putting salt into their draught beer has died out. This is making me hungry and thirsty. Time to head out to the pub to see what's up.:) |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: alison Date: 03 Jul 99 - 09:42 PM Hi, I have a point against the Aussies. they don't put vinegar on their chips either...... in fact most of the chip shops I've been in don't have it at all... just ketchup, or BBQ.. not even HP... YUCK **grin** slainte alison |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: LEJ Date: 03 Jul 99 - 08:02 PM Jeff- that was one of the funniest posts I have had the luck to encounter on the Mudcat! You could be the next Paul Hogan, mite! |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: LEJ Date: 03 Jul 99 - 07:56 PM |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: The Shambles Date: 03 Jul 99 - 07:46 PM Chet. Would that ban be John Newton Olivia then? |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 03 Jul 99 - 07:39 PM Yes, there are lots of those Fast Food Boiled Corn places on the roadsides in Quebec. I was at one that had a resident Muskovy (sp?) duck that begged corn from the people at the picnic tables by quacking piteously. Good cheap way for the farmer to keep his ducks fed, I reckon.
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 03 Jul 99 - 07:36 PM Well, Joe, I do have to confess that I detest the disgusting American habit of eating their fries WITHOUT vinegar. Ugh, barbarous. They are getting better though because most places will now get you vinegar if you ask for it, even if they have to go rooting about the kitchen to find some. As far as I am aware you still can't get it in fast food joints down there but I don't eat at fast food joints anyway. You guys still can't make a cup of tea to save your souls, though.:)
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Barbara Date: 03 Jul 99 - 07:27 PM They may not have ketchup for your chips, Joe, but I sure wish some US farmers would take a leaf (or an ear as the case may be) from the Canadian folk and run "Hot Buttered Corn" wagons out there in the acres and acres of corn. Order it up, and someone runs out the back side of the wagon, picks an ear, shucks it, and drops it in the boiling water. A few minutes later, buttered and salted and impaled on a stick, there's a fresh ear of corn on the cob. MMmmmm. Only way to buy corn, at least before the SuperSweets. Regular sweet corn converts most of its sugar to starch in something under a day, even refrigerated. So bring your own ketchup. Nobody's perfect. Blessings, Barbara |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Tim Jaques tjaques@netcom.ca Date: 03 Jul 99 - 07:27 PM This wouldn't surprise me. We have such petty, small-minded, and bigoted nationalists in Canada too, who think that the way to build up their own fragile egos is to tear down the other guy. They have a great platform in our national broadcasting corporation, from which pulpit they preach their spiteful philosophies and mis-state facts. Yet no doubt they then wander out to watch Americans play baseball for the Toronto Blue Jays or the Montreal Expos, and on the way home slip through the McDonald's drive through in their Fords or Chevys to pick up a Big Mac Combo. Your marching bands would be welcome at our Santa Claus parade here in Windsor, Ontario, for which yours truly does the band bookings. We hire some from inner city Detroit schools and have for years. As close as Windsor is to Detroit -- five minutes through the tunnel if the traffic and customs are right -- many of these kids have never been out of the city of Detroit. They have a great time and we are very lucky for a city of our size to get marching bands of that calibre for that price. Incidentally, Canada Customs has never demanded that they put a customs deposit down for their instruments. My fear is that one year some zealous petty nationalist will be working there and that will be the end of our Detroit bands. Now, Canadian pipe bands raise my ire. May I plead that they be banned from Australia as well? They refuse to march because it is "too cold". Yeah right, about ten degrees C last year and about 7 C the year before. Last year I wore a sweatshirt. This year I am tracking some down in the USA, since American pipers and their instruments seem to be made of hardier stuff. Hopefully I will be able to shame the local ones. Unless they were changed recently Canadian bands (as in the folk/rock/etc category) have a much harder time getting gigs in the US than US bands have getting gigs in Canada. The Immigration laws respecting the work visa are much tougher. Yet American guys play at the bars in Windsor all the time. I'd be happy to hear that this outrageous and discriminitory law had changed. I thought one of the purposes of NAFTA was supposed to be getting rid of these barriers, not just with respect to consumer products but the arts as well. I have no fear of American or any other culture -- most of my friends will agree that I have no culture at all.:) But I don't view myself that way -- like that good American, Popeye the Sailorman, "I Yam What I Yam.":) As for American culture, its all how you view it. When I think of American culture I think of California wine, The Ark in Ann Arbor, old Tiger Stadium and Wrigley Stadium, incredibly big and inexpensive meals, cops who look like cops, and helpful, friendly service in the shops. Probably lots of others if I put my mind to it. I don't think of Friends or Big Mac Combos.
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Rick Fielding Date: 03 Jul 99 - 07:21 PM Now cut that out Chet! Next you'll be after Peter Allen and Rolf Harris. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Chet W. Date: 03 Jul 99 - 06:58 PM Could we retroactively ban Olivia Newton John?
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Helen Date: 03 Jul 99 - 06:07 PM annap, Hoges(Paul Hogan) is crass and brash and so on, which I guess can be restated as politically incorrect. But he is also funny, and he likes poking fun at himself and Aussies generally, so that's why I like him. My favourite scene in the first Crocodile Dundee movie is when the kangaroo starts shooting back - I was crying and laughing at the same time. It appealed to my radical-left leanings - the downtrodden and oppressed fight back. Helen |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: thosp Date: 03 Jul 99 - 05:56 PM i'm new to the mudcat site --- but i am happy to find (kindred souls)the sprite of friendship that exists here--- my heart does go out to the dissapointed kids (if that's still the case)but gil's wide brush scares me-- |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: annamill Date: 03 Jul 99 - 05:53 PM I love vinegar on my french Fries. Gil, I think maybe , possibly, YOU HAVE OVER REACTED to your emotions. I'm sure there are parents out there who are overspilling with emtions right now and I can understand their anger, but your biased, bigoted, racist, bullshit remarks were unnessecary and might be forgiven if you apologize. Maybe not. All Australians did not make this decision. I would like all my friends from down under that these sentiments about your country is not generally expressed or felt in the USA. We have a great deal of respect for a country that, like ours, had to fight to survive in what was virtually wilderness. I love Paul Hogan!! Has he done something politically incorrect that I'm not aware of? Enlighten me. Love,annap |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Helen Date: 03 Jul 99 - 05:50 PM MatthewB, I'm appalled at that terrible action of playing Deutschland Uber Alles rather than the Israeli national anthem at the soccer match. If I can make a national apology, even though I am only one Aussie, please accept my heartfelt distress that this happened. There are bigots everywhere, and insensitive people, and it would be nice to live in a fantasy land believing that it doesn't happen in my own back yard, but I know it does. I think I can state with a great degree of certainty that for every one person who thought that was clever, witty, funny or a neat nasty trick there would have been at least 100 people, more than 100, who were saddened or appalled by it. Thank you for seeing the bigger picture and not rating all Australians as being bigots - although there are more here than I like to contemplate. Helen |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Alice Date: 03 Jul 99 - 05:31 PM by the way, Aussie Jeff, get over to the thread called An Irish Tale. Your talents are needed. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: bseed(charleskratz) Date: 03 Jul 99 - 05:30 PM Golly, is everyone ignoring Jeff Kramer? Is that the cold shoulder routine (I thought it was funny as hell--if he is truly an Aussie. If not, maybe a bit scurrilous, but still funny.) Anyway, we have old Gil to thank for a terrific thread. (Apparently his tirade appeared in Oz before it slithered here--as letter to editors?) --seed |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Alice Date: 03 Jul 99 - 05:28 PM on my fries, give me salt only. Isn't it amazing that thread creep has already led us to a subject like potatoes. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Cap't Bob Date: 03 Jul 99 - 05:15 PM Joe ~~~~I don't know how you can attack the Canadians just because they use gravey on their fries/chips. For years I was a ketchup man, nothing but ketchup on my fries. Then I started sailing up into Canada and in every port that we pulled into they had a bottle of vinegar on the table to use on your chips. Actually, I now prefer the vinegar to the ketchup, however, if possible I use both katchup and vinegar. By the way, the absolute best place in the world to get fish and chips is in Killarney, Ont. at a place called Mr. Perch which is located in the warf that runs through the town. The fishing boat comes in and ties up quay side ~ where they unload the fish ~ fillet them ~ and cook them fresh. Ya just can't beat that (they even have ketchup for the chips). Hat's off to the Canadians. Cap't Bob |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Rick Fielding Date: 03 Jul 99 - 05:04 PM Heather and I visited our VERY FIRST "Chip Wagon" last year. Now mind you, she is still a UK citizen, having been only living off Canada's bounty for 22 years, so it was up to me to let her know that next to the beaver (shut up Catspaw) the chip wagon is our national symbol. The chips or "patats frits" as EVERY Canadian calls them, were fabulous! I also had (being very patriotic) a back bacon on a bun, while Heather - obviously feeling very Scottish - had a hamburger. We both had catsup (oops I mean Ketchup) Joe. In the States you'll fight to the death for the right to bear arms. In Canada "We'll fight til we're tired for the right to arm bears". Rick (a proud Canuck-and that rhymes with duck!) |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Nan Date: 03 Jul 99 - 03:05 PM I spent 6 months in Australia and found them to be GREAT people. As for the "acorn doesn't fall far from the tree" bit.....who do you think many of the Americans were that were sent to the new Colonies? Gil, you won't win many converts to your arguement with an opening like that. The Olympic committee blew-it, I think your anger is mis-directed, or at the very least, very nasty and distasteful. Cheers, Nancy |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Bill D Date: 03 Jul 99 - 02:01 PM wow...you miss one day...and LOOK!...Now why, I wonder, do those committees not think to post their plans HERE before they dig themselves into such holes! This sensible group would have advised them as to a reasonable course of action! ..There is almost no graceful way out now..I'm sure Australia did not need LOTS of American & Japanese bands to have a nice ceremony...(for some reason, the phrase.."76 Digeridoos led the big parade" is echoing in my head)...but someone sure needs to figure out how to appease the kids who raised that money! It is an unfortunate truism that the wonderful people of ANY country, including Australia, the U.S., Japan..etc., are at the mercy of whatever clutch of political types happen to be running things at the moment...and after the hassles we had in Atlanta, I do not envy Oz next year...it will be grand, but also tedious. Sure hope someone finds a reasonably gentle way to resolve it all.... |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Joe Offer Date: 03 Jul 99 - 01:30 PM Gee, you drive for miles and all you see is corn, and you're bored to death and starved to death, and you see a big sign that says "Chip Wagon Ahead." You screech to a halt in the middle of nowhere and you see this seedy-looking guy with a greasy-looking panel truck, selling french fries with gravy. That's all. That's Canada fer ya. Fielding can keep it. I want ketchup on my fries. God bless America. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Big Mick Date: 03 Jul 99 - 01:26 PM Right then, enough of this jingoistic bullpuckey, and it was a great road to travel in those lovely old days............Now, Rick, when are we going to talk about Canada becoming part of the States?????? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA.......LMAO, AND JUST KIDDING |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: catspaw49 Date: 03 Jul 99 - 12:43 PM Alrighty then.......Let's get started on the Canadjuns, now that's a whole other story. catspaw |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Rick Fielding Date: 03 Jul 99 - 12:24 PM I've ALWAYS agreed with YOU Joe! p.s. Funny thing, I know what you mean about that 'ol radical spirit poppin' back every so often. Peace Bro. It was a good road to travel on. rick |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Joe Offer Date: 03 Jul 99 - 12:05 PM Well, Rick, Gil DID give us a nice opportunity for us all to agree with each other.... |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: catspaw49 Date: 03 Jul 99 - 12:04 PM Toodlng his trumpet? I think he was a fly-by flamer Rick. Be nice to see his response to Helen sending him this thread though! catspaw |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Rick Fielding Date: 03 Jul 99 - 11:58 AM Where the Hell is Gil? |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Chet W. Date: 03 Jul 99 - 10:40 AM I wonder if Gil is indignant, with his vast knowledge of history, that the last Olympics were held in Radio Free Georgia, USA, which also began as a penal colony. I suppose maybe the next one could be planned for Devil's Island. Or would the folks who can pay $600 for a ticket be willing to bunk up in Papillon's cell block? Chet W. in South Carolina, who didn't go to a single Lympic event in Atlanta |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Ted from Australia Date: 03 Jul 99 - 10:34 AM What a disaster! On behalf of all fair minded Australians and that includes everyone who has no connection with the olympic games organising committe i extend my apoligies to all the dissapointed marching bands.
Regards Ted
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: bseed(charleskratz) Date: 03 Jul 99 - 09:59 AM Bruce, that bald New York kiddie is from California. --seed |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Bruce from Bathurst Date: 03 Jul 99 - 08:55 AM Oh joy, oh rapture! As Alan of Australia has reported, bands may yet be marching towards Bathurst in 2000. It now appears the fallback position for the relevant New South Wales politicians is to offer the American and Japanese (yes, Gil, Japanese!) marching bands some time on stage at various non-opening ceremony events. The heat has not died down in the New South Wales media - I can't speak for other parts of the country - and we have yet to face tomorrow's Sunday newspapers, which usually manage to build up our collective anger on most issues, but it would be nice if just one news item actually included a detailed report on the *music* on offer. Maybe Alan, Alison, etc, have looked more closely at our local TV news, but it seems to me the music is way behind as a news item. By the way, the original deal for Bathurst was for more than 2000 band members to stay here for two weeks before the Games, supposedly injecting $3,000,000 into the Bathurst economy. But right now I'm now going to watch Pat Rafter and that bald New York kiddie play their Wimbledon semi-final. Aussies versus Yanks in a sporting context? Who cares? Bruce from Bathurst (the $3m town) |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: murray@mpce.mq.edu.au Date: 03 Jul 99 - 08:41 AM I have to second what Helen and Alison said. We in Australia are as much victims of the Bumbling Olympic Board as anyone. It is not the Australian Government that made this decision. The Board seems to be a power of its own. They are planing to modify our public transport system, modify working hours, and change the time we switch to daylight savings time just for the games! As I recall, the invitation to the US marching bands came last September. This is a helluva time to change their minds. There was a reason at the time for choosing the US bands over the native ones. They had some skill that we lacked. I can't remember what it was. I'll go one further, Gil. I don't think ANYONE with taste should visit Olympic games ANYWHERE. Murray |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: The Shambles Date: 03 Jul 99 - 07:06 AM See also here Xenophobia |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: The Shambles Date: 03 Jul 99 - 07:03 AM "I hate the Swiss". That was a joke, I don't hate anybody. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Alan of Australia Date: 03 Jul 99 - 04:13 AM G'day, This saga has been going on for a while, with the initial decision to exclude Aussie bands in favour of overseas bands. The very latest, as of this afternoon our time, is that the OS bands are coming after all, but not for the opening ceremony. It's encouraging to see all the responses from our friends at Mudcat to Gil's post, but Gil, old mate, your post reinforces what a lot of Aussies think, i.e. that Americans are not well informed about events, current or historical, outside their own country. Go back & read your history books. Look at the system of social injustices in England, political in Ireland that led to convicts being sent here in the first place. Sure there were murderers & thieves sent here (prior to the American war of independance they were sent to America), but there were also very many good & decent people sent here by a travesty of justice. Aussies, like anybody else, can be obnoxious on occasion, but have you not heard the expression "ugly American"? I'm sorry and surprised that you think we've forgotten your part in WWII. We haven't. It was worth the wait and has always been acknowledged. On the other hand, how much do you know of the exploits of the ANZACS at Gallipoli or the suffering on the Burma Railway? What about the American strategic presence in our country since the war: does that show a lack of gratitude? I'm not sure I'll be proud of this post when I read it tomorrow, but Gil, your post was not at all helpful. I've made a lot of friends in the world wide Mudcat community which is characterised by friendliness and taking each other on our merits. And an agreement to spell differently. Let's keep it that way. Your point could have been made in an entirely different way without being insulting to an entire nation. You may even have found many average Aussies agreeing with you. Seed, don't worry, there are plenty of Aussies who boycott Paul Hogan movies. We're not all like him. Your hearing of "Whiskey" must be from some other part of Oz :o)
Cheers, |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Joe Offer Date: 03 Jul 99 - 04:03 AM Oh, you're a nasty one, Helen - but we love you, too! Gil's message was a textbook example of American jingoism. As you may have noticed, not one person agreed with him. If anything, I think the Americans here may be guilty of reverse jingoism - we tend to speak of everything foreign as wonderful, but we aren't so favorable in our opinion of our own country. If fact, I've noticed that several U.S. Mudcatters use British spellings (colour, favour, etc.) with those nasty extraneous u's. Anyhow, we like Australians just fine, and many of us even like Hulk Hogan, or whatever his name is.... -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: http://anon.free.anonymizer.com/RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Jeff Date: 03 Jul 99 - 03:56 AM G'day, mates. Aussie Jeff here. I'm your semioffical spokesbloke for the penal colony of Australia.
Look's like my mate Gil stirred up a bit of a fracus over here
It's my job to explain why 500 Orange County high school marching band members were "disinvited" from the 2000 Olympic Games by a country whose cultural calendar include an annual dynamite-throwing contest.
First, though, let me crack open my fifth Foster's Lager of the morning and finish my breakfast dingo.
Beaut! That's good dingo. It always tastes better when you beat it to death with your own hands.
Awwl right, then. Now, for the band controversy:
As was reported, roughly 500 high school band members in O.C. (and 1,300 nationwide) are bloody unhappy after being invited to the Sydney Olympics, then being disinvited because they're Americans.
Nine months of band practice and fund-raising is down the counterclockwise-rotating drain. Whatta bloody disappointment!
I even received an e-mail from a frustrated 14-year-old trumpet player, Robert Wood of El Dorado High School in Placentia, who inquired: "Since you lived through the '70s, I would like to know if you have any advice for me on how to annoy the Olympic Committee."
Well, mate, as someone who knows a thing or two about the '70s and nonsequiturs I can confirm that if the situation were reversed, here in Australia we'd marinate the whole lot in Vegemite and toss 'em on the barbie.
But since the situation isn't reversed, I ask for your patience and understanding.
I also ask you not to fixate on the fact that I have a large beer funnel in my pants.
Speaking on behalf of the Australian nation, I would only add the following:
Only a bushwhacking drongo wouldn't give away his billabong for a hoon spat. Dinky di.
(Translation: Only a fool lacking in social graces would concede his dry riverbed to a delinquent sausage. Really.)
The point, I think, is that Australia isn't evil or necessarily anti-American. It just wants to show the world that Australia, despite being legally drunk and generally on fire, is quite capable of fielding its own marching band — unless NATO intervenes.
I mean, how bad could an Australian marching band be?
Imagine a thousand high-stepping Australians in short pants, not counting kangaroos and emus, blowing on termite-hollowed tree branches known as didjeridoos, to the stirring strains of "Waltzing Matilda" and "Down Under" by Men at Work.
OK, bad.
On that note, let's pause for an Australian Fun Fact: Me own mum just bit off me left ear in a rugby scrum. And the thing is, it don't even hurt. Dinky di!
In further fairness to the jilted American musicians, I do understand why they're so disappointed about not being able to come to Australia. After all, there's so much to see and do. There's the Opera House in Syndey. And the Sydney Opera House. Did I mention the Opera House? It's in Sydney.
Plus there's the chance Rupert Murdoch could walk up to you at any time and buy your soul.
Another must-see is Ayers Rock, which is listen closely, mates, because this gets tricky a rock.
Of course, if you ever make it down this way and I sincerely hope you do I hope you'll take advantage of the truly best Australia has to offer:
New Zealand. G'day.
Jeff Kramer at JeffK@link.freedom.com. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Helen Date: 03 Jul 99 - 03:45 AM You guys (non-sexist, all embracing term) (In the words of a famous Oz Aboriginal boxer) I love youse all. I just saw on the tv news here that the bands are still invited to perform in Sydney but not at the opening ceremony. It's not the best solution but it is a compromise (whatever we may think of compromises). I like everything that you have said here in response to Gil's posting - viewpoints from all sides of the problem. With love, respect, admiration, etc etc Helen PS I might be doing the wrong thing here, but.... I've just copied and pasted this whole thread into an e-mail to send to Gil direct, just in case he doesn't drop back in to read the consequences of his posting. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: bseed(charleskratz) Date: 03 Jul 99 - 02:11 AM Gee, I've been boycotting Paul Hogan films for years. Does that make me anti-Australian? --seed p.s., I've also always had difficulty with the Oz habit of singin' Whiskey in the Jar with one part A of the verse melody followed by three part B's (I hope I'll be forgiven by the apostrophe police for the B's instead of Bs, which looks too much like BS--how many references to other threads did I manage to squeeze into that sentence?). |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Bruce from Bathurst Date: 03 Jul 99 - 02:05 AM I'm sorry I missed the opening of this thread. I've been in the 'Olympic City' waiting for Dick Gaughan's concert last night (brilliant!) Our friend Gil and his media release have both received quite a lot of exposure in Sydney media these last few days and the whole issue has generated a quite inappropriate amount of heat. Mudcatters are better than that, judging by the comments in this thread. Here in Bathurst we were expecting to host several hundreds of these band members during the Games. Bathurst is about three hours west of Sydney and what with the University campus and boarding schools vacant for holidays, etc, we could easily accommodate them all out here. Now, our Mayor is saying he'd like Bathurst to be compensated handsomely for the decision to 'uninvite' the visitors. He's my elected local government representative, but I don't remember being asked anything about this matter. Oh well. So many people see the Olympics as an opportunity to make a financial killing in one way or another that the relevance of the Games has almost been lost, IMHO. I will be taking my 14 year old son to some events in Sydney, at outrageous cost, because whatever else it means, we'll get to see some outstanding athletes competing in a unique event. My wife won't even consider it. Many of my friends are planning to either grab cheap flights out of the country at that time or to rely on TV, and that worries me a little. But I will definitely not be paying the exorbitant amounts being charged for the opening ceremony, with or without marching bands. I'm sorry I won't be meeting hundreds of Orange County and Japanese band members in Bathurst. I like my fellow musicians, and even some bodhran players (grin) and I don't like to see kids disappointed so, all round, I'd prefer this hadn't happened. But since politicians are convinced the media controls public opinion, it has happened. There will probably be more glitches before the opening ceremony for the media to jump on, but Sydneysiders (and Bathurstians) are cynical enough about how decisions are reached without Gil's help. If any Mudcatters want to have a session in Bathurst while the opening ceremony is on, the Bathurst Folk Club will be open to suggestions. . . . and mine's a Guinness. Bruce |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Lonesome EJ Date: 03 Jul 99 - 01:53 AM I hope the Australian Govt rescinds their rather harsh and unfeeling treatment of the American marching band. Until they do so I pledge to boycott any Paul Hogan movies, snub anyone who offers me a vegemite sandwich,cancel my membership in the Men at Work Fan Club, and refuse to watch Rocco's Modern Life on Saturday morning with my daughter. HOWEVER, Gil, I might suggest you attempt to approach your issue with a little more intelligence than you displayed. Your bone-headed remarks did very little to gain sympathy for your cause in this forum which, by the way, is not an American site but a Global one.We are friends here, and if you go kicking dirt at some of us the rest of us tend to think you are an asshole, capiche? LEJ |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: DonMeixner Date: 03 Jul 99 - 01:10 AM I must say that I am intriqued by this line of postings. My daughter was in a filed band for years and I supported her every step of the way. Collected bottles for return money, managed paper drives, sold pizza. Why? I love my daughter, I hate field band music. But we had all we could do to raise money to go to DC or Disney world. I think very few American Bands could have raised the gelt to get to Oz for the Ozlympics. Besides , its Australia's chance to show the world their finest, let them have their days in the light. Let their kids show our what they can do. By the way Fielding I'm still roundly pissed about you Icebacks coming across bridge and steeling my work. Especially after I went to see the band thats doing the thievery! Yelling with drums is the only way to describe it. Unless its yelling with bagpipes. ( Imagine, bagpipes indoors! What kind of hearing can remain after that?) Felicitous regards Don |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Matthew B. Date: 03 Jul 99 - 12:56 AM Reminds me of the time I got a little peeved at the actions of a very small number of Australians, but it certainly didn't make me dislike Aussies in general; they're far too much fun to be with, and way more down to earth than their Limey... um, British cousins. Oops. The event I'm referring to was the opening ceremony (what is it with them and opening ceremonies anyway? Maybe it's a weakness.) of a soccer match between the local team and the visiting team from Israel. When they played the Israeli national anthem ("Hatikvah") on the loudspeaker, they cut it off halfway through and played "Deutscheland Uber Alles" in its place. That was a rather hurtful thing to do, and I felt insulted as a Jew, but it didn't shade my feelings for the Aussies. Neither ignorance, cruelty, bigotry or racism has a national boundary. You can find them anywhere. The Israeli team continued to stand at attention, and never lost their dignity. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: BK Date: 03 Jul 99 - 12:43 AM What a mess.. Joe & others are sure right; the class struggle is still with us in a big way; I'm not sure all of the playboys are so dumb, sad to say. Just look at the marketplace & much of so-called "mannaged care" in the health area. Screwing both the doctors & the patients. "Mannaged" to "make plan," like selling washing machines, for the prospectus & impressing the potential stock investors. The hell w/the service which is supposed to be the reason for it's existence. Got me grumpy.. Not-So-Cheery, BK |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: bseed(charleskratz) Date: 03 Jul 99 - 12:42 AM I'll tip a Foster's to ya, 'Spaw, next time I get to Quinn's (Thursday night). --seed |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Big Mick Date: 03 Jul 99 - 12:25 AM Well done, 'Spaw. Mick |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: catspaw49 Date: 03 Jul 99 - 12:19 AM I can but second the eloquent comments of my friends. Being a long time racing sailor, I've had nothing but respect for the Aussies for over 30 years. (Do any of you remember the 12M, Dame Pattie---gawd it took guts to show up and sail that thing, but they did it with panache.) And to anyone wanting a text and example about the power of belief, motivation, and teamwork, you'll find nothing better than John Bertrand's (Skipper of Aussie II), titled "Born to Win." BTW-I have 2 beautiful pix of A II hanging in the den. I dunno'.........maybe Gil/Gordon has the interests of the kids at heart. Maybe he does see the problem lies with the petty bureaucrats. But I must say that anyone who puts me in the position of trying to explain the "Ugly American" just flat pisses this ol' hick right off. So come back Gil/Gordon and explain...or shall I just put you down as yet another unmitigated asshole? To Helen (who has my number), Alison, Alan, Bob, and all our Australian friends------My apologies for the attitude and as you know, I'm sure, it isn't the feeling of anyone in THIS village. catspaw |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: bseed(charleskratz) Date: 03 Jul 99 - 12:12 AM Just to lighten things up a bit, how about a chorus of
Hit's the syme the whole world over, Just riffing a bit on some of what has been mentioned or expressed above, about the poor being taxed for luxuries for the rich, about class struggle... --seed |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Rick Fielding Date: 02 Jul 99 - 11:21 PM I want to apologize for my flippant comment earlier. I've re-read Gordon's initial post several times now and it has very little to do with a stupid Olympic Commitee, and just smacks of general ugliness. I think we all know from the pay-offs and scandals of the last few months that the I.O.C. definitely sees itself as impervious to criticism, so I doubt any angry phone calls would do much good. Canada's Dick Pound, the heir apparant to Samaranch has behaved very badly in recent times as has the rest of Canada's olympic committee, who still have not forgiven a large number of Torontonians who made visiting Olympic dignitaries aware that, Yes Indeed, we DO have poverty in Toronto and quite a lot of residents would like to see THAT addressed before bidding for an olympic games. When we lost out to Atlanta not EVERYONE was disappointed. But back to Gordon's posting. On first reading I thought he was being tongue-in-cheek (although vicious) about Australians, but after a second look, it just seems flat out racist, in the most black and white way. That's the first time I've seen real xenophobia on Mudcat, and I'll bet if Gordon calms down a bit and looks at what he wrote, he might be a bit embarrassed. As a Canadian I've gotten tons of ribbing, some of it razor-sharp. No problem, cause it's all humour driven and I enjoy that kind of wit and word-play. Even Don M's thread about Canadians "stealing" American (Irish Band) jobs in the Syracuse area was hardly offensive to me as some of his information was over 20 years old, and having chatted with him on the phone and through Mudcat I consider him a friend. Nope, haven't seen anything but respect for each other's countries in the better part of a year that I've been on mudcat, so I strongly hope that Gordon re-appears (in this thread) and does some follow up.
I would also like to apologize to our "Ozzie" friends, but I think they know how we all feel. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Big Mick Date: 02 Jul 99 - 10:52 PM Gil, I will only say this to you. If I use the Aussies I have met here on the 'Cat as my gauge, you are about as far off the mark as you can be. Helen, Fair Young Maid, Bob Bolton, Alan of Australia, and of course the Fair Alison are some of our most valuable contributors. It is safe to say that the Mudcat Cafe would not be the wonderful town that it is without them. I am offended that with one broad swoop, you have mischaracterized some wonderful people. I hope you will cool down and make this right. And by the way, many of those who you characterize as thieves, lawbreakers, pickpockets and the flotsam of civilized society were Irish people ripped from their homes for offending the Crown by their presence. So it seems to me you have offended the memory of brave people simply trying to survive under difficult circumstances. And they were an integral part of establishing a remarkable society down under. I can understand the anger at what appears to be a very poorly handled situation. One can hardly condemn the Australians for wanting their Olympics to be a reflection of their society. One of the major problems today is the lack of understanding on the part of us Yanks that the rest of the world does not necessarily want to be completely like us. Believe it or not, and I know this is hard, the civilized world does not end on the California coast. Having said all that, whoever handled this situation, did so in a very poor manner. How about it friend Gil, can you find it within yourself to clarify your statement apologize to our Australian citizens? All the best, Mick |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: katlaughing Date: 02 Jul 99 - 10:41 PM Just did a quick forum search to see if Gil has been on here much. Using that name in the search box brought up several postings with the letters G-i-l in various names. Ironically, the earliest was someone in Australia. There was only one posting with just "Gil", so, I would suspect we've been flamed by someone looking for music sites to vent his obvious prejudices. My favourite quote from the Wizard of Oz seems good advice for all of our dear Mudcateers in OZ: "Pay no attention to that man behind the curtain!" i.e. curtain of intolerance, anger, and prejudice! Most of us on here would NEVER judge a country by so few! Besides, our own preparations for the Olympics in Salt Lake City, which are spilling over into Wyoming, haven't been free of controversy, etc. To Gil: it may sound trite, but remember, when one points a finger, three fingers point back at them! Katlaughing & loving the Aussies!!! |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: alison Date: 02 Jul 99 - 10:36 PM I am not an Aussie by birth... but I do live here... and if you have offended me, (which you have), just think how the real Aussies feel. As was pointed out by Helen? we first heard of this a few days ago... and WE didn't have anything to do with it.. it was the olympic organising committee. So go yell at them not the innocents you find here!!! And many of us are not convicts.. we came of our own free will. I for one, don't want the olympics here.. it's costing us a fortune which could be better spent on something useful like hospitals, and education. I intend to be back home in Ireland to avoid the mess it's going to create here. But here is the thinking behind it as far as we have been told..... why should they spend more money bringing in overseas bands etc.. when there are plenty of musicians and bands already here. why not use the aussie performers? did the Americans bring in international performers for Atlanta? I don't know. Yes I feel sorry for all the kids who have been let down, but the aussie kids were let down too.. the message they are getting is that they're obviously not good enough for the job.. so we'll bring in some overseas talent....... how's that for building self esteem? from what I have heard the overseas kids were going to have to pay $3500 for the priviledge of playing here. which leads me to the question.. were they really being asked for their talent. or just to bring more money in to this event. I know which one I believe. I don't often get riled here at mudcat but you got my Irish blood up. Please don't tar us all with the one brush... and please see this for what it was.. a committee decision. And if you meet an Aussie in America... please make them welcome, the majority of us would make you welcome in our country too. slainte alison
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Mike Billo Date: 02 Jul 99 - 10:15 PM I'm an American father of three. As an adult, I have learned to accept disappointment and unfairness as a part of life, however, when someone inflicts injustice on my children, I lose all reason, and swear vendettas. I suspect that is the case here. I'm hope that when Gil cools down a bit, he will feel sorry for some of the things he's said about our fellow Mudcatters from Australia. In case he doesn't, I aplogize for the angry words of my countryman. Last year, as a part of an exchange program, my family hosted a young woman from Australia who was the most charming house guest anyone could ever hope to meet. No nation of people should ever be held to blame for the actions of their petty civil servants. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Helen Date: 02 Jul 99 - 09:57 PM Joe, My concerns about the Olympic Games being held over here, in my state, are that huge budget cuts have been made for hospitals and public education and social services, to come up with the money for these games, for the new buildings, the changes to the transport systems, etc etc with the carrot being held up that huge amounts of tourism dollars will flow back into the economy. I welcome an international event like the Games because it promotes fellow feeling, a sense of community throughout the world, but I don't see any justification for penalising the poor, the sick and the needy so that some big bits of architecture and lots of promotional hype can be paid for, and so a few Olympic committee members and a few politicians can get their names in lights. I tend to agree with you about the playboy elite. Helen |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Helen Date: 02 Jul 99 - 09:50 PM Hi FairYoungMaid, I didn't realise you were in Sydney. I'm in Newcastle, just north of you. I think the whole thing has been a disaster. Whether the original decision to hire bands from overseas for the Olympic opening event is right or wrong, or somewhere in between, or nothing to do with "right" or "wrong" is only part of the problem. The other part is that a decision was made based on a number of assumptions, without informing the Australian people, and which has now blown up into a huge international fiasco. I don't think it can be easily fixed - it just seems to get worse and worse, and the marching band people from overseas - not just America - are justifiably upset, but so are the Australian people, the community as a whole, by the whole situation. Having Gil vent his spleen in such a nasty way on a forum which is unrelated to the Olympic Games, and where a diverse range of thoughts, feelings, beliefs and values tend to be expressed (which is the pride of the Mudcat site) has just ruined my day, I'm sad to say. But, I know that there are plenty of other 'Catters who will see the situation from more than one side and who will jump in to smooth some ruffled feathers, mine included. I am doing my best to maintain a neutral tone, and I have no intention whatsoever of getting into a nasty slanging match with Gil, whose opinions I welcome, but whose nastiness was completely uncalled for. Helen |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Alice Date: 02 Jul 99 - 09:49 PM Gil, I hope when your emotions calm down about this you realize that you just made a generalized condemnation about an entire group of people, based on what a 'committee' did. You owe Australians an apology for your statement. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Joe Offer Date: 02 Jul 99 - 09:42 PM I don't think this has anything to do with normal Australians and normal Americans. The Olympics has become a plaything of the wealthy elite, and these people don't know and don't care about the concerns of ordinary people. Same things goes in business nowadays. Those in charge seem to think they have a divine right to use the world for their own profit, with no concern whatsoever for the rest of humanity. Maybe I'm becoming a radical again in my old age - I see a new class struggle coming, a struggle between an educated middle class and a not-so-bright elite playboy class. -Joe Offer- |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Rita64 Date: 02 Jul 99 - 08:35 PM Helen, I completely understand how you feel and I am distressed that Gil might represent a number of people. I must firstly correct Gil. His statements about Australia's heritage are a vast exaggeration - especially due to the fact that a considerable portion of the population are first, second or third generation Aussies from Asian and European countries - and have nothing to do with the colonial days. It is true that this whole marching band disaster has just been made public and, being an occupant of Sydney myself, I was just as distressed as this Gil fellow when I heard that these poor people from all over the world were told they couldn't participate anymore. The Australian Olympic Committee has made a huge mistake, I agree. But if you could see the frenzy of construction in Sydney at the moment and feel the anticipation and excitement generated by the 2000 Olympics you would realise that Sydneysiders have the best intentions for the Games. ~FYM~ |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Helen Date: 02 Jul 99 - 07:15 PM Thanks seed, I am upset by Gil's remarks and unable to respond in a neutral way at this stage, but you have a good interpretation so far: only one or maybe a small handful of people made the decision. It was only made public this week to the Australian people. The Sydney Olympic plannning body has been making some incredible blunders (whether this is a blunder or not I'm not prepared to comment at this stage - not when I am feeling so sad about being attacked with no request to hear our side of the story, and a lot of Aussies are getting tired of the whole Olympic thing) and most of the decisions of the planning body have only been made public long after the decisions have been made. I will comment further when I stop feeling so upset. Helen |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Rick Fielding Date: 02 Jul 99 - 07:15 PM Marching bands eh? Yes complain to the roof-tops, but please don't send them to Canada! Well, maybe Quebec. just kidding! |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: Chet W. Date: 02 Jul 99 - 07:14 PM Gil, I'd be angry too, but we all have our lists of historical flotsam, and obviously, as everywhere, this decision had to have been made by an inept bureaucracy. God knows we got 'em too. Chet W. |
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Subject: RE: Aussies ban American Bands From: bseed(charleskratz) Date: 02 Jul 99 - 07:06 PM I don't know how many Australians (other than the national team) participated in opening or closing ceremonies in Atlanta. I suppose it's irrelevant. I also don't know what percentage of the Australian population participated in making the decision described above, but I suspect it was tiny, therefore unfair to ascribe to the whole nation. I doubt, Gil, that you had very much affection for Aussies before this event, having catalogued all their supposed faults as you did. I retain my affection for them and doubt both the possible effectiveness of your approach and the virtue of your desire to demonize them. --seed |
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Subject: Aussies ban American Bands From: Gil Date: 02 Jul 99 - 05:28 PM I used to like Australians. Oh sure, I knew Australians weren't perfect. For one thing, many of them are descended from pickpockets and cutpurses and other English convicts who were transported to Australia in the 18th century and as we all know, the acorn doesn't fall far from the tree. And true, Australians also have a tendency to be loud and obnoxious when they're beered up which in my experience seems to be much of the time. And yes, like Frenchmen, Australians too often tend to forget who helped them out when they needed it.
For example, Australians don't seem to remember that if it hadn't been for us in World War II, they'd all be speaking Japanese.
Still, despite the many, many drawbacks Australians bring to the table, I had always more or less liked them.
But no longer. Because the Australians have turned out to be a bunch of low-down back-stabbing rats. They made a deal with hundreds of Orange County high school kids, then they cravenly weasled out of it.
And in the process they broke those kids' trusting little American hearts.
What I'm referring to here is the news that 1,300 young American marching band members, including about 500 from Orange County, have been disinvited to participate in the 2000 Olympic Games opening ceremonies in Sydney, Australia, next year. The reason they were disinvited is because some Aussies were complaining that the planned opening ceremonies had too many American marching band members and not enough Australian ones.
"American marching bands at our games?" said one of many letters to the Sydney Morning Herald on the subject. "How could anyone even contemplate such a crass idea?"
The organizers of the opening ceremonies quickly folded in the face of the outcry, and unceremoniously gave all the American kids the boot. Americans out, Australians in.
Never mind that the American kids had been formally invited way back in September. Never mind that they'd spent months raising money for the trip and dreaming of a once-in-a-lifetime experience.
Never mind all that. They all got the bum's rush.
Now, as you can imagine, the bounced band members and their parents are pretty upset. And frankly, I assumed everyone else in Orange County would also be outraged at this mean-spirited affront.
But when I called the Australian Consulate in Los Angeles and spoke to Deputy Consul John Price, he said the consulate hasn't heard so much as a peep of protest.
"As far as I know, the consulate hasn't received any calls whatsoever," he said.
Well, let's change that, shall we?
The number for the Australian Consulate is (310) 229-4800; when the recording comes on, hit 9 and you'll get a live person. Or try the Australian Embassy in Washington, D.C., at (202) 797-3000.
You don't have to shout or be angry. And there's probably no need to remind them that Australia was founded as a penal colony; they already know that.
But you could suggest that if this is the way Australians feel about Americans, maybe Americans shouldn't visit Australia — for the Olympic Games or anything else.
After all, we Americans want to be polite.
And we certainly wouldn't want to go where our band members aren't wanted.
Gordon Dillow gldillow@aol.com. |
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