ADD: Widow's Promise / Widow and the Devil (Ryan)

Subject: RE: ADD: Widow's Promise / Widow and the Devil (Ryan)
From: GerryM
Date: 27 Sep 22 - 02:46 AM

The Australian group, Triantan (Judy Pinder, Anthony Woolcott, and Miguel Heatwole) recorded it very nicely as The Widow's Promise on their CD, Turn Again.

Subject: RE: Lyr ADD: The Widow and the Devil (Mick Ryan)
From: GUEST,Nick Dow
Date: 26 Sep 22 - 03:46 PM

Mick Ryan posted on mudcat 2010
'Imagine my surprise when I came across this continuing conversation about The Widow's Promise, a song I wrote in 1982 (it may have been '81). The song came about because the band I was then in (‘Crows’) needed an up tempo, light hearted song to balance our set. I extrapolated the characters from a traditional song, The Devil and the Feathery Wife, I had heard Nick Dow sing, and an original song, The Mother in Laws, written by Gerry Rees. Having said this, the story, the tune and the lyrics are my own.'

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Joe Offer
Date: 26 Sep 22 - 03:13 PM

Joe - do cleanup

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: synbyn
Date: 31 Aug 04 - 04:18 PM

Mick ryan & pete harris are at the tenterden folk weekend oct1/2/3 this year, in concert & in smaller sessions- mick ryan will be leading a songwriters workshop/ discussion on saturday afternoon. Tried to make a clicky, but couldn't, so details are on the website for tenterden folk day via google.Should be a good one!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: GUEST,MMario
Date: 22 Apr 04 - 08:47 AM

Barbara if you would it would be greatly appreciated. Other's have offered tapes (which would let ME learn it!) but to get it into the DT we'd need a transcription.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: GUEST
Date: 22 Apr 04 - 03:42 AM

I love the version that Kate Rusby does of this song with the Poozies!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Barbara
Date: 22 Apr 04 - 01:21 AM

Well, I've got Sylvia Herold's CD with it on it, and I could have a go at transcribing the tune, if you want. I've been meaning to learn it anyway.
Blessings,
Barbara

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: radriano
Date: 21 Apr 04 - 05:58 PM

And Mick Ryan calls the song "The Widow's Promise" not "The Widow and the Devil."

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Sooz
Date: 21 Aug 03 - 10:04 AM

ADA have the CD and its only £4.99 (The widow's promise)

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: MMario
Date: 21 Aug 03 - 09:55 AM

still looking for a tune for this...

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: GUEST
Date: 27 May 03 - 04:12 AM

Mick Ryan. Crackin' bloke. Make a point of going to speak to him when you next see him. He's one of the sort that is happy to spend hours talking about anything!
Not only does he write songs, but fantastic plays as well, such as "The Voyage" about people fleeing Ireland by way of ship, and all the problems they encounter on the way, or "Tanks for the Memory" about when the people of Tynham were kicked out of there homes by the army.
If ever you get the chance to see one of his plays, grab it with both hands 'cause it wont come again for quite a while!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Herga Kitty
Date: 20 May 03 - 06:29 PM

Felicia sang it at Herga last night (by request).
Kitty

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Nemesis
Date: 20 May 03 - 02:01 PM

Lee Collinson performs a cracking version too!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: GUEST,Ralphie at work
Date: 19 May 03 - 02:23 PM

To bring things full circle...
Mick wrote it, (Gawd Bless him!), Crows performed it. (Might even have a tape somewhere?)
Kate R (or Poozies) nicked it, and turned Mick into a multi-millionare..(Bugger!)

Glad He and Pete did well at Weymouth, might even bump into him, (or other posters) somewhere in the summer.

Regards

Ralphie

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: MairSea
Date: 19 May 03 - 09:14 AM

Mick Ryan and Pete Harris have just done some fantastic sets at Weymouth Folk Festival and just this weekend at Winchester Folk Festival including Tolpuddle Man and The widow and the Devil. Brilliant entertainers and nice people too.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Leadfingers
Date: 18 May 03 - 03:17 PM

Put Tolpuddle Man in the Digitrad and the first post from Non Member
is the lyrics of Tolpuddle Man posted by Grahm Moore himself.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: GUEST
Date: 18 May 03 - 01:31 PM

William, if only I'ld known.
Pint and Dale at Herga tomorrow Mon 19th May
Thanks Mick Ryan, great song.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: GUEST,sledge
Date: 18 May 03 - 12:03 PM

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 24 Nov 99 - 02:04 AM

John, mission accomplished, I hope you don't mind the history lesson as well.

LTS

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 24 Nov 99 - 12:40 AM

Oh bugger..... Had all my lyrics stolen a few years ago, but will try and cadge something off the album 'Business as Usual', by Roy Bailey. Or buy it yourself....

Chorus goes something like

You can break down our (spirits??) And tear down our ...... But you can't break the heart of a Tolpuddle man.

Does that sound familiar?

Will get back to you hopefully later (tomorrow for want of a better phrase, it is still dark here) when I should have found the wretched CD. Ah, the return of audio typing..... AAAAAGH Nurse the screeens!!!!!!!

LTS

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: John in Brisbane
Date: 23 Nov 99 - 11:49 PM

Liz, I promised a fellow Woodford festival goer last New Year that I would try to find the lyrics to 'Tolpuddle Martyrs' which sounds like the same song. Are you able to supply these please? Regards, John

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: A. Non
Date: 23 Nov 99 - 08:36 PM

If ballads had to historically accurate, one could download the Digital Tradition database in about 2 seconds.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: MMario
Date: 23 Nov 99 - 08:24 PM

So? We know there was a lot of lying going on during those trials too!

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: A. Non
Date: 23 Nov 99 - 07:39 PM

Reality is a bit lacking here. Testimony in 17th century witchcraft trials established that the devil's penis was very cold, and sexual intercouse with him was a painful ordeal, not a great joy.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Stewie
Date: 23 Nov 99 - 06:31 PM

George, I have an old Leader/Tradition album from 1978 called 'Fair Was the City' where Mick Ryan is teamed up with Jon Burge. Ryan does the singing, with Burge on guitar, fiddle, banjo and dulcimer. Dave Burland guests with harmonies on a couple of tracks. It is all traditional material and is worth looking out for in the secondhand shops.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 23 Nov 99 - 04:35 PM

Sorry to be pedantic George, but the song is'Tolpuddle Man' and was written by Graham Moore, a teacher in Dorset, who was asked to write it for the 'Community Play', which turned into the play 'Tolpuddle Man'. If anyone is interested, the play was about the Tolpuddle martyrs, who weren't martyred, but did come from Tolpuddle. They basically began what developed into the Trade Union movement in Britain, because they were starving to death. They were transported to Australia for taking an oath against the king, the only crime they could make stick. They were all reprieved when it was discovered that the king was a freemason, an organisation that doesn't include the reigning monarch in its oaths.... King can't take an oath against himself, so they were pardoned on the same technicality that got them transported in the first place.

If you are a Ralph Jordan fan, look out for another of his incarnations as one of the Hackney Martians. They do the best ever version of the 'Radetski March'& 'Delilah' I have ever heard.

Dorchester was my home town until 9 years ago, and I miss it dreadfully, terrible homesick feelings, because there was a thread about Portland earlier - it turned out to be Portland Oregon, but still it make me go all gooey....

LTS

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: MMario
Date: 23 Nov 99 - 03:44 PM

Is there a tune out there for this? Hmmmmm????

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: kevin
Date: 15 Sep 99 - 04:05 AM

Marion you mentioned your tendonitis. Here's something I posted yesterday to the mudcat thread "hand pain while playing": hi...two points in addition to those already discussed: 1) quoting from memory Segovias' introduction to his book of guitar studies, "The greatest and most common problem for the beginning guitarist is UNNECESSARY MUSCULAR TENSION". This cannot be emphasized too strongly. Using only the exact amount of force necessary allows us to play more fluidly and with greater agility, preserving our bodies while freeing us to be more musically expressive. If you can look at video of segovia or rory block, do so. With Rory, in spite of the truly crushing power of some of her playing, at every moment (down to the 1/4 second) that her hands and arms aren't actually punishing the strings, they appear to be utterly limp. With Segovia it's truly amazing. His hands appear to be completely motionless as torrents of crisply articulated notes pour forth. Pay attention to your shoulders, your spine, your hips, legs, feet. Get your whole body into a comfortable, well-supported position, breathe naturally, and remind yourself over and over, at every opportunity, to relax and enjoy. 2) with a nod to bert, two things to do or not when your hands begin to hurt. DON"T FLICK THEM! The goal is to increase blood flow without inflicting additional stress. Let your arms hang limp at your sides for 5-15 seconds. Raise your hands to slightly above your breast for 5 seconds. repeat. research suggests that restriction of blood flow and consequent stress of tendons,etc occurs within 20-30 minutes of "tense" playing, and that normal blood flow and muscular relaxation can be recaptured with as little as 30 seconds of the above exercise. so: play for 20 minutes. Exercise relaxation for one minute. Do that acouple more times, and then watch that Rory Block video again. Finally, here's help for emergencies, ie you've hurt yourself but you have to play more. Aspercreme. Topical analgesic. Rub it on the pain and the pain goes away, without having to swallow half a bottle of aspirin and get indigestion and kidney damage. Not only that, but it is genuinely therapeutic, as it doesn't just mask pain but actually improves blood flow. I hope this helps. Whether your music is driven by heart, soul, brain, libido, anger, love, pride, or joy, it needs your body to be smooth, calm, confident, relaxed, comfortable, and well-taken-care-of in order to reach its' true power. good luck... yrs, kc ps marion, this stuff also applies to fiddling. My friend Brian Steger can fiddle almost nonstop for hours...he says people used to make fun of him 'cause he was always dropping his bow...he still drops it once in a while, but he's the one who's laughing now...hope this helps...

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: GeorgeH
Date: 14 Sep 99 - 06:42 AM

Well I'm sure others know more about Mick Ryan than I do, but I'm not sure how many of them visit these parts. He's a wonderful singer and songwriter (and all-round great guy) who seems to have been around UK folk music longer than I have (so that puts it at about 30 years plus) but is showing less sign of wear and tear . . He started off as a singer of largely traditional songs, whereas these days his first interest seems to be in "Folk Theatre".

I first encountered him with "Crows", in company with Ralph Jordan - sound engineer and concertina player extra-ordindinary and later good friend. If you find their vinyl in any discount bins then grab it! A good few years (and two children) later we went to see a performance of Mick's "Tolpuddle Man" - a sort of Folk oratorio - in Dorchester (another good friend was playing in it) and were bowled over by it; I suspect that was only released on tape but again it's well worth looking out for. That was 8 or 9 years ago, and the tape remains one of our daughter's favourites (she's now 18) - strangely enough only last evening she was discussing building up a song repetoire and was saying she wanted to learn some songs from that show. (One song from that show is quite widely sung; e.g. by Roy Bailey; I THINK that's "The Road to Dorchester"). Then most recently Mick was performing at this year's Sidmouth Festival - and did a great set on the main stage. Including songs from his latest 'show' which I've not seen and can't recall the name of.

If you want more info. let me know and I'll see what I can find out.

G.

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Marion
Date: 13 Sep 99 - 03:40 PM

How about that, Andrew... yes, I was at the Heart and Crown last night. When you said something about County Mayo I assumed you were in Ireland; so this was more of a coincidence than I thought!

Do you live in Ottawa? If so, are you part of the "organized" folkie culture at all? I go to the Irish Society's ceilidhs and dance lessons, and also the contra dances at All Saint's church. In the past I have played occasionally at Rasputin's and at the Glebe Centre slow jam, but right now I can't do anything with my instruments because of tendonitis.

Maybe I'll see you around sometime if you go to any of these things.

Slainte,

Marion

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Barbara
Date: 13 Sep 99 - 02:25 PM

I believe Sylvia Herold of the Katz 'n Jammers in the SF Bay area has also recorded it.
Anyone know anyting about Mick Ryan who wrote it?

And I learned it from Chris Roe, too, who sings it in the Seattle area.
Blessings,
BArbara

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Andrew G
Date: 13 Sep 99 - 02:02 PM

Thanks to all who responded! That is indeed the song I was looking for.

Incidentally Marion was that pub in Ottawa the Heart and Crown? Becuase that is where I heard it!!

Cheers A

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: GeorgeH
Date: 13 Sep 99 - 12:41 PM

Kate Rusby performs a rather fine version of this song . . . Well worth listening out for.

G.

Subject: Lyr Add: DEVIL VERSUS THE WIDOW (Mick Ryan)
From: emily rain
Date: 13 Sep 99 - 11:40 AM

i had thought this was in the digitrad, but it didn't turn up with my searches. so here are the lyrics:

DEVIL VERSUS THE WIDOW
by Mick Ryan

Up high upon a lonely moor
a widow lived alone
In an inn she kept and while she slept
the pillows heard her moan
For many's the time a traveler
has spent the night with me
But there's not a man in all creation
gives content to me

For some can manage once or twice
some make three or four
What seems to be a rarity
is the man who can do more
I'd give anything to find him
in heaven or in hell
And while the words were spoken then
she heard the front door bell

Chorus:
And the wind blew cold and lonely
all across that widow's moor
And she never ever turned away
a traveler from her door

Then boldly the widow she went downstairs
and the door she opened wide
And as she did a tall and handsome
stranger stepped inside
She gave him bread and brandy
and after he was fed
He said My dear, well have no fear
it's time to go to bed

For I heard you call way down below
and I've come to see you right
But you must come to hell with me
if I can last the night
She said You randy devil!
to this bargain I'm agreed
For hell on earth or hell in hell
it's all the same to me

Chorus

Then the devil and the widow they jumped in bed
and the devil was working well
And he thought before this night was through
she'd be his in hell
But when they got to number nine
the widow cried Encore!
And when the twelfth time came around
she still called out for more

At twenty-five the devil thought
he had to take a rest
But the widow still said Come raise yer head
and put me to the test
At sixty-nine the widow laughed
again, again she cried
And the devil declared Well I can see
just how your husband died

Chorus

At niney-nine the devil he
began to cry and weep
Oh I will give you anything
just let me go to sleep
Before the morning light was on
the devil hobbled home
And the widow still unsatisfied
once more was left alone

She lay there and she grumbled
and she thought of niney-nine
If only that old devil could
have made it one more time
I'll call him up again tonight
and see what can be done
With a bit of application we
could make it to the ton

Chorus

But when she called him up that night
no devil he did appear
For the first time in eternity
the old devil he shook with fear
Of all the pain and torment
I've witnessed here in hell
I never knew what pain was
'till I rang your front doorbell

Chorus
^^
--- as sung by Chris Roe, Seattle

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: William Pint
Date: 13 Sep 99 - 10:35 AM

The song is actually called "The Widow's Promise" but everyone I know calls it "The Widow and the Devil". It was written by Mick Ryan who live in England. My partner Felicia Dale and I have just recorded a version on the CD Hartwell Horn for Waterbug Records. Our webpage has details. (and lyrics). http://members.aol.com/Pintndale/

Subject: RE: Lyr Req: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Marion
Date: 13 Sep 99 - 10:32 AM

Can't help you, but an interesting coincidence - I also heard that song for the first time last night, in a pub in Ottawa.

Subject: The Widow and the Devil???
From: Andrew G
Date: 13 Sep 99 - 10:05 AM

I was at a session last night and the band that was playing did a song about a widow and the devil. I didn't manage to catch the name of the song and I couldn't get to talk to the band to ask them about it.

It was about the devil and this widow and the devil was trying to get the widow into hell. The widow was lonely and she wanted a bit of fun first so she seduced the devil and they started to have sex. The premise of the song was the widow was insatiable and she wore the devil out through the night. The chorus of the song started out "after nine times" and proceeded to "after 22 times" and "after 99 times the devil knew what killed the husband!"

It was a grand laugh. Is anyone familiar with this song? I look forward to any help I can get!

By the way the band were from County Mayo if that may narrow it down!