Coffeehouse - Starting One Up

Subject: RE: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 10 Oct 02 - 03:35 PM

I find it interesting that "coffeehouse" here is used in a sense that clearly sees the music venue as being the central thing, with an admission charge, and the coffee thrown in for free maybe.

With us "coffeehouse" would mean a place where you go and buy a cup of coffee, and these days you'd be very lucky to have any live music on the premises, because they'd need a Public Entertainment Licence even for one person to play or sing.

So when you say "coffeehouse" in the States, we should read it as "non-alcoholic folk club". Might make a nice change sometimes.

Any body in England got any experience with running one like that? And how did it work out with the PEL system (where all the assumptions tend to be that it's only in places with liquor licences that this kind of activity can ever take place.)

Subject: RE: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: Naemanson
Date: 10 Oct 02 - 01:09 PM

I haven't given a whole lot of thought to coffeehouses for profit becaue I have never considered there to be any money in folk music. I figure to make money in music you need to go into Rock & Roll or Country-Western. The two coffeehouses I have been affiliated with were both fundraisers, one for a UU church and the other for an arts center.

I would suggest that route, especially if you are a member of a church. You should then be able to get the consisitency you need to be a success.

By the way, that consistency should be limited to the place and date. Don't be afraid to experiment with the format. There is no one-size-fits-all.

Also you should be prepared to enjoy every performer that steps on to your stage. You'll hear some really bad performers but you will also hear some really great ones. I can tell stories about this and many of them are good stories. Be prepared for those "Oh Gosh" moments where everything goes right and the moment becomes magic.

Don't let your own interests dictate the shows. My main interest is in traditional English/Irish/American music yet the bulk of our open mike performers were singer-songwriters. If I had been stodgy about my interests the coffeehouse experience would not have been so enjoyable for me.

Most important, be real with yourself about why you are doing this. I remember with great happiness looking at the audience, seeing their enjoyment of the performance, and thinking, "I did this for them."

(I tried not to do that when the performance was painful. I didn't want to think "I did this TO them." [GRIN])

Subject: RE: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: GUEST,Lighthouse 2002
Date: 09 Oct 02 - 09:12 PM

Once again - thanks to everyone and their ideas. Indeed I AM in the US - (central Massachusetts) - and I'm glad someone mentioned the handicap accessibilty route. Hadn't thought of that one. Also, I've played a bunch of open mikes in the area and I have been in my share of Unitarian churches as well. Thanks for the advice and I'll keep you posted.

Subject: RE: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: fretless
Date: 09 Oct 02 - 05:08 PM

I used to help run The Good Coffee House in the Park Slope section of Brooklyn, NY. It's still in operation about 25 years after its founding, with concerts on Friday nights at the meeting house of the Brooklyn Society for Ethical Culture (http://www.bsec.org/events/coffeehouse/index.html). Back in the late 70s when I was involved, we had a committee of about 6 core members and some less central participants who all worked on the program, helping to set up the room, collect admissions money, clean up afterwards, and so on. All were volunteers. I can't imagine how it would have succeeded without the collaboration of this dedicated team.

The lion's share of the admissions money went to the musicians and another chunk went to the Society for use of the space. The rest of the cash went to advertising, flyers, and the coffee, which we made a point of providing for free. Baked goodies were prepared and sold as a sidebar by one of the volunteers. Attendance for the weekly concerts could range up to 100, although it was rarely that high. Most of the audience were singles in their 20s-30s, although we certainly had older folks and kids, too (we let the kids in free, which tended to make loyal customers out of their parents).

Our musicians were mostly local, although we did eventually get the audience numbers up to the point where the gate share could support some traveling folkies, who added to their take by selling their records (those frisbee-like things we had before CDs). Bands brought their own sound systems if they wanted one (the hall was small enough that it wasn't absolutely necessary), or we have some contacts if they wanted to rent sound locally.

I doubt if we could have attracted the audience or sustained the program if the program hadn't been formalized. A jam session or a more casual, open mike program wouldn't have done the job. I KNOW that the place wouldn't have succeeded without team of volunteers, and I KNOW that the coffee house wouldn't have provided anyone with anything even beginning to approach pin money, let alone a living wage.

For another successful volunteer-run coffeehouse that was founded around the same time as TGCF, look at the Cherry Tree Music Coop in Philadelphia -- http://www.cherrytree.org/.

Good luck!

Subject: RE: Coffee house - Starting One Up
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 09 Oct 02 - 12:26 PM

The open-mic that I used to help run was an adjunct to a non-profit cooperative avant-garde art gallery. The gallery had more space than it needed and they let us use the back room for music every Friday night. The format was open-mic with the occasional invited guest performer. On regular open-mic nights, we charged one dollar admission and the proceeds went to the gallery. On guest performer nights we charged more and the guest got all of it. Four of us rotated the hosting and sound board responsibilities. It would probably still be going on today but for the building deteriorating to the point that the owner was forced to do extensive repairs and remodelling and had to increase the rent to more than the gallery could afford.

If something similar exists in your town it might be worth checking into. Affiliation with any existing organization, even a church, will give you a pre-existing membership list to whom you can send promotional fliers. BTW, if you do go the church basement route, Unitarians are historically the most coffee-house receptive bunch.

Bruce

Subject: RE: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: MMario
Date: 09 Oct 02 - 11:39 AM

If he's in the US - many churches are Handicapped accessible whether "basement" or other areas. (In NY at least you can't get approval for any kind of renovation without adding handicapped accessibility); the lift for our church was about 1/2 the price of our renovation a few years back

Subject: RE: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: Don Firth
Date: 09 Oct 02 - 11:35 AM

Thanks for making that point, McGrath. I've been in a wheelchair myself for the past twelve years, and that really limits where I can go.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: Amos
Date: 09 Oct 02 - 09:44 AM

Well, when you start it, let us know where it is!! I might like to come and play!


A

Subject: RE: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 09 Oct 02 - 05:37 AM

I take it you're not in England, or you'd have to worry about the Public Entertainment Licence stuff. But I gather there can be problems like that elsewhere, so that's another thing to check.

"Basements" sounds like it might be a problem for access for some people. You ought to avoid landing in a place where people in wheelchairs and their friends can't use it.You'd be potentially keeping out some great musicians in my experience, aside from anything else.

Subject: RE: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: GUEST,Lighthouse 2002
Date: 08 Oct 02 - 09:21 PM

Thanks for all your wonderful advice. What I have in mind, although called a "coffehouse", is more just a place for musicians to gather and play for anyone who will show. I have played in church basements as well, and I was not thinking of something that is affiliated with the church but just to rent out the basement. As far as food goes - maybe just a pot of coffee and some bakery items but that's it. Hoping to get local musicians to perform (open mikes and also headlining). The main problem is getting an audience to show and make it worth everyone's time. Big names - out of the question for now obviously, but I personally would have jumped at the chance to be a headliner even if it was for only 5 people. A gig is a gig! Once again, thanks for the advice.

Subject: RE: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: Glen Reid
Date: 08 Oct 02 - 09:03 PM

I started a so called coffeehouse type venue about 8 years ago in a town of about 5000 people.Actually it was a licenced restaurant and on a slow night (wed) once per month, we would start with an open mike, followed by a schedualed performer. Everything was done on a shoe string budget (cheap flyers, word of mouth and a lot of favours called in on musical friends).
We always tried to pay an honourarium to the schedualed performer, but oft times no one showed up and I'd end up giving them gas money out of my own pocket.
Like the earlier post mentioned, volunteers are hard to come by and even harder to keep interested.
The whole purpose of this was to get some buzz happening and to get seed money to start a proper music festival.

The long and the short of it is, last summer was our 5th festival season. It has always been a "not for profit" registered company, with the only paid personal, being the Artistic Director.The rest of us are all volunteers.
Every year leading up to the festival, I bite my knuckles and pull my rapidly graying hair, muttering something like "this is the last f.....g time".But after its over, we are gleefully planning next year
.Everyone thats ever been to it, agrees its a nice little festival and maybe we,ve helped some young up and comings, or provided a chance for a few old folkies to carry on the traditions and just have a good time.
In any case, I'm not sorry I started it and hope we will always have the people and the where-with-all to continue.
All the best,
Glen

Subject: RE: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: Phil Cooper
Date: 08 Oct 02 - 03:25 PM

I agree with Don and Brett's posts, above. Be consistent. Are you looking for a place for musicians to play? Or, are you going to be in the business of selling coffee, with music as an incentive to bring in customers? The Chicago suburbs had a ton of coffeehouses that started in the mid-to-late '90's. Many had musicians playing for tips. All these places are closed now. I used to tag along when my significant other played at some of these places. In one place, the sound system was set up by the front door. I often saw people walk up to the coffeehouse, see there were performers playing, and walk away. Being clear about what you want is very important. If you're running a business, ground rent is bound to be high, so you need to sell a lot of coffee and treats to keep open. If you're in a free location (church basement, community center) you don't have an over head to worry about and you can pursue making a place for musicians to gather. Good luck.

Subject: RE: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: Don Firth
Date: 08 Oct 02 - 03:09 PM

Well, I dunno. I guess it depends on what you mean by "coffeehouse."

I played in a lot of coffeehouses during the late Fifties and on into the Sixties. All the ones I played in were businesses, set up in owned or leased locations, just like a regular restaurant. They all had an espresso machine, and they all served a variety of specialty coffees and teas, along with some fairly elegant pastries. Some of them also served light lunches (freshly made sandwiches, cheese boards, etc.). Actually, a couple of them actually verged on elegant, almost like non-alcoholic night clubs, and late in the evenings they sometimes drew the after-show crowd. As far as getting people to perform there, that was no problem: they hired singers on a regular basis and paid them. This was in Seattle during the late Fifties and early Sixties.

I spent some time barnstorming in the San Francisco Bay Area in 1959, visiting many of the famous places I'd heard about where folk music was sung. I found most of them to be holes compared to where I'd been singing, and most of the time, the singers (even some well-known ones) sang for tips. Seattle may not have been regarded as a center of folk music at the time, but I decided I was better off here, so I came back (just as an aside, when Joan Baez was singing at the Club 47 in Cambridge, Mass. for ten bucks a night, I was singing three nights a week at The Place Next Door in Seattle for fifteen bucks a night—not bad in 1959).

I have sung at a church basement "coffeehouse" or two, but these were usually pretty short-lived and, if sponsored by the church, generally came under the heading of "youth programs." I imagine it would depend on how big an operation you have in mind. Do you want to open a business that features folk music, or are you just looking for a gathering spot for singers? I think you need to be very clear about what your goals are.

Don Firth

Subject: RE: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: Naemanson
Date: 08 Oct 02 - 01:19 PM

I have worked at a highly successful venue and one that would have been successful except that...

I started by hanging around the Side Door Coffeehouse. At the end of the evening I would help put away chairs and clean up. Over the years I became one of two people running the place. Then, owing to influences that are not important here, I quit. I then tried to start up a coffeehouse in the next town over.

There are certain questions you will have to answer for yourself. How often will you be open? What will your format be? Do you need a sound system? How many people say they want to help? How many of them will actually show up when there is work to be done? Are there any free sources of publicity in your area? Can you find them? This is going to be a coffeehouse so will you serve coffee and food?

The Side Door is open on the third Friday of every month. The format is to have an open mike in the first half of the evening with a featured performer in the second half. The featured performers are chosen from the ranks of the open mike performers, with one or two exceptions.

The Mocha Cafe started with the same format making sure we were always on a different night than the Side Door. After a while we shifted to all open mike. Even now, having been closed for almost a year, I still get questions about when we will be open.

The most important thing in running a coffeehouse is consistency. Find a venue you can keep and be open on the same night every week or month. Your audience has to be sure of when and where you will be. It was the killer for my Mocha Cafe. My venue kept shifting me to different nights and some months I couldn't get into the building at all.

You can run a coffeehouse all by yourself. Don't depend on a lot of help in the early stages. Ask for volunteers and don't be surprised when they don't show up. The Side Door offers free admission to those people who provide goodies to be served with the coffee.

Good luck,

Brett

Subject: Coffeehouse - Starting One Up
From: GUEST,Lighthouse 2002
Date: 08 Oct 02 - 12:54 PM

Does anyone know the logistics of starting an acoustic coffeehouse? I know about finding a place to play (church basments etc.) but is there anything else that needs to be done beforehand, and what would be a good way to attract performers to a new venue?

Thanks