Folklore: By Thirty and By Three (Significance?)

Subject: Folklore: By Thirty and By Three (Significance?)
From: GUEST,Ash Ludd
Date: 22 Oct 19 - 08:59 AM

Hey,
Was wondering what the significance of the number 33 is in folk music? Often comes up as "by thirty and by three",
Such as in Willy O' Winsbury:
"and the king has gathered his merry men all,
By thirty and by three"

and in The False Hearted Knight:
"So she brought him out her fathers gold,
And her mother's jewels brought she,
The two best horses that stood in the stalls,
Where there stand thirty and three"

Any help would be appreciated to satiate my curiosity.
Also feel free to point out any other examples where this occurs.

Subject: RE: Folklore: By Thirty and By Three (Significance?)
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 22 Oct 19 - 11:32 AM

It scans nicely and actually simply means 'there were about 30 of them' which doesn't scan as well.

Try the following--all Child ballads:
193B st30
211 st48
281A st 4, B st 4, C st 3.

Merry men
100A st8
81A st 13, B st 4, C st 20, H st 10
110 B st 18, C st 15
156 A st 2, F st 2
182, B st 14
164 (Vol 5 p245) st 10
165 st 17

Steeds
192 A st 11
211 st 8