BS: USA: Sports and Social Class

Subject: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: GUEST,Jim
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 06:44 PM

Apologies for yet another non music thread, but you're such a helpful bunch. *grin*

Here in England, football (soccer) has historically been the 'working man's game', whereas cricket has been much more of a 'middle class' pursuit. We also have two different types of rugby. Stereotypically, 'union' is a bit posh, but 'league' is northern and 'working class'

I'm wanting to find out whether such differences exist in the USA. Is there a social 'type' who would be more likely to be drawn to basketball than baseball or gridiron football etc.?

Are there regional differences?

Thanks for any thoughts

Jim

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 07:14 PM

Basketball is black and city

Baseball is middle america

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: catspaw49
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 07:28 PM

No way you can simplify it as Guest does.......Kentucky and Indiana are in the midwest basically and the most popular game played on the streets of this country in "pick-up" form is basketball. And I guess that New York has moved to the midwest according to our Guest.

There are some random distinctions, but to try and simplify it without writing a treatise is next to impossible. The sport that draws the largest attendance here is automobile racing........go figure what that means.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: GUEST,Jim
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 08:16 PM

Thanks, Catspaw49

Here in England, if there are two major sporting events going on at the same time, you can generally guess which bar(pub)will be showing which.

Is that not the case in the US?

Jim

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: NicoleC
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 08:38 PM

No, because in the US all the pubs have 12 TVs with something different, annoying and loud on all of 'em.

Nascar is supposed to be a low-class sport stereotypically, but the fan demographics are way up the education ladder and well into upper-middle-class salaries. Or so NASCAR fans keep telling me.

Golf is kind of a high-brow sport here, perhaps because it's expensive. Tennis and racketball have middle-class would-be-snob appeal, but any sport in the US has it's multi-class afficianados.

If you had to pick a lower-class sport, it's probably pro wrestling or ultimate fighting.

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: GUEST,Jim
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 08:53 PM

Thanks, Nicole.

I'm most interested in the fanbase of basketball (I should have been clearer in my initial post)

Jim

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: catspaw49
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 08:55 PM

Yep...That's a pretty fair answer Nicole.

Take any sport, let's say baseball. Among it's ranks you'll find a pretty broad spectrum of followers....some casual, some voracious....but it's tough to pin down a distinct demographic, especially in terms of "class."

Soccer has a kind of middle class audience and is the team sport most played by kids in the US so you're seeing a rise in it's viewing as well. Golf is as likely to be played by ex-high school jocks as rich folks anymore and any distinction to class is slowly going down the tubes....and Tiger Woods has done wonders in getting African Americans involved. Still an "upper-middle game" but I think in a few years it will not be nearly as much that way. I was in a hot-wings sports bar eating one afternoon and although there were several ball games of various types on the numerous TV, the most watched TV's had a golf match and the crowd watching was more what you'd expect would be watching football.

I could write a long one on who goes to which races, but racing in general draws from the entire spectrum. Sorry my friend....I don't think there's a good answer to your question!!

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: GUEST,Jim
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 09:12 PM

Catspaw49,

The fact that there 'is no good answer' is a good answer.

Thank you

Jim

would be grateful for any more info on basketball though

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: Bill D
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 09:30 PM

It is hard to comprehend (even for those of us who live here) how large & diverse the US is. You could divide it into 6-10 areas the size of the UK and ask the question about each and get different answers. And yes, social class is a factor in some of the sports, just not as strictly divided as you might have in the UK.

Texas and the south have LOTS of racing and football (lower to middle class, 'mostly'), certain smaller areas have more tennis and Polo..*grin*...soccer happens 'most' where there are large populations of kids whose families come from Europe, Latin America...etc..

but the 'big' (read:TV promoted) sports (basketball,baseball,football, and often, hockey) are common in every area, just a bit more so in major metropolitan areas.

Soccer has the serious disadvantage of playing continuously, so sponsors do not like it, even if there were not 3-4 competing sports wanting air time.

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: John Hardly
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 09:45 PM

I come from Indiana where it is little exaggeration to say that Basketball is the State religion.

....I worshiped at the altar. ('til I failed to make the varsity team in college)

Every class, every race, everybody who loves a good game comes out. I now live in a smaller town (12,000) and a good portion of the town shows up for high school hoops games......regular season!!

Oh.........was Oscar Robertson black?! Larry Bird the great white hope......hell no. It just isn't that way in Indiana.

I'd even say that basketball had no small influence on a State that was coping way better than the national average on race issues. Indiana.

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 09:50 PM

I am not a sports fan, so anything I say here is from an outsider. Okay?

I live not too far from a small to mid-sized southern U.S. city which used to have a minor league basketball team. In a town with about 30% black population, about 90% of the audience at a typical basketball game was black. The white majority (where the money is) either didn't care for minor league round-ball or didn't like hangin' with the black folks (Naw! Couldn't be that!). Anyway, the team went belly-up a few years ago due to poor attendance.

Meanwhile, out in Boise, Idaho which has half the population of our fair city and 100% white at that, their minor league team sells out every game.

So, our town now sports a minor league hockey team instead. That's right folks, ice hockey down here in Bubba-Land where a lot of folks have never even seen snow. And the mostly white audience fills the place up every game. These good ole boys just love to watch those Canadians and Minnesotans beat hell out of each other with those little sticks.

Go figure

Bruce

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: Midchuck
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 09:51 PM

The unemployed and prison inmates play basketball.

Working-class people bowl, or play softball.

Up-and-coming professional and executive types play tennis.

Established professional and executive types, those who've made it to the top, play golf.

This proves that as you rise on the socio-economic ladder, your balls get smaller.

Peter.

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: Bobert
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 10:10 PM

Well, I'm not gonna wade in on NASCAR or ice hockey being the Redneck sports of choice, or golf being the high brow sport of choice but will go on record of sayin' that up in the Wes Ginny holler, where men are men and so are a few women, "Bowling for Dollars" and "Roller Derby" are like... real big!!!!

Hey, I just watch 'em for the commercials...

Bobert

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: Benjamin
Date: 13 Aug 02 - 10:40 PM

Sports have been breaking the social class more and more from what I've observed. Basketball is popular in poor areas, but you will also see many rich and/or famous people sitting courtside at games who are also huge fans. I'm seeing more and more people with less money getting into golf now a days. Baseball is seems to be the great American pass time for all classes, though many fans could be lost if there is another strike. With Lance Armstrong, cycle racing is becoming recognized.

John, I've heard that about Indiana a lot.

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: Ebbie
Date: 14 Aug 02 - 01:54 AM

One has to think separately about national sports and college sports. In the American south, college basketball and football are of far greater moment to most people.

(John Hardly, 'twas not ever thus. What about the KKK?)

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: katlaughing
Date: 14 Aug 02 - 02:05 AM

Midchuck...what about pingpong and balls getting not only smaller but more lightweight?**BG**

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Aug 02 - 02:23 AM

Manchester is to your "soccer"

What The Raiders are to U.S. Football

Poor working-class Hooliganism run amok!

Sincerely, Gargoyle

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: John Hardly
Date: 14 Aug 02 - 11:18 AM

"(John Hardly, 'twas not ever thus. What about the KKK?)"

They are/were marginalized, regionalized (I live ten miles from their last great stand) and, believe me, Hoops is bigger.

Someday maybe I'll write about my experience growing up in a city, personally integrated for my family by my father. I'll thank him forever.

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: GUEST,Les B.
Date: 15 Aug 02 - 11:52 AM

Here in the American West snipe hunting seems to be enjoyed by easterners, and sheep jumping by the locals.

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: EBarnacle1
Date: 15 Aug 02 - 12:06 PM

I was just commenting to my son that we, even the poorest of us, live better than the average person of 300 years ago. Even [especially] poor kids get expensive equipment made in sweatshop conditions. Sports are basically a matter of what is available in your neighborhood.

Right now, the Harlem Little League is on its way to the regional version of the Little League World Series. That's cause some adults took an interest in doing things with the neighborhood kids.

My kid was at our canoe club the other evening and someone came down with an Olympic K1 (racing kayak). He allowed him to try it and, even though he flipped it every time, he had fun and in now hooked on doing better. I can arrange instruction through the club and, if he gets good enough, we can arrange a coach through the Olympic committee. The same goes for fencing [a Title 9 sport] and other sports. Most of these sports are not mass entertainment sports, just a way to get involved and away from the electronic baby sitter.

The same can be said of teaching a kid a musical instrument.

If you want a kid to learn, there are two things you can do: Teach him or her or just leave a bunch of kids alone with some basic implements and they will invent or adapt a game for themselves. Kids love to be involved and the interests carry over as they grow older.

Subject: RE: BS: USA: Sports and Social Class
From: EBarnacle1
Date: 16 Aug 02 - 11:23 AM

The above was not meant as a shut out. We also enjoy our local minor league baseball team. On the other hand, too many people spend more time watching than participating in all sorts of activities.

While this is great for the people who believe they own (who says the plantation system is dead) sports teams, it keeps the public from really getting the most out of these sports--participation at any but the most basic level.

Too often, if a person is not a star, they get shut out of participation and become a couch potato/spectator. This is neither healthy for the eliminatee or the culture. I would lay odds that many on this forum are amateurs (in the original sense) who did not take initial elimination from other activities as vox dei. We need more of that in the world.