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BS: Festivals-what's missing?
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Subject: Festivals-what's missing? From: Mooh Date: 25 May 00 - 02:00 PM My usual thanks... As an aside to my thread regarding wet or dry festivals: What's missing from festivals nowadays? What should return? How should they respond to modern tastes? Besides alcohol, I'm thinking in terms of workshops, acts, food, art, interactive things, etc. And I suppose, what should festivals loose? Fire at will. Mooh. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: Megan L Date: 25 May 00 - 02:02 PM What harm did Will ever do you? It OK I'm going to lie down in a darkened room! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: JenEllen Date: 25 May 00 - 02:53 PM We have a late-summer festival in the lower east corner of the state, Tumbleweed Festival. They do a wonderful job there, and I am continually amazed. Everything from writing challenges(topic given, you write the song) and workshops to the glorious 'band scramble' where they place your name in a hat, put you together with a group, and give you an hour to come up with something resembling a 15 minute set. The entire festival is set in a riverside park, with various stages set amongst the trees. This caused a bit of discomfort last year, as they had a Canadian Folk/rock band down that 'plugged in'. This put everyone else playing at the same time in the park at an obvious disadvantage. (Aside: kudos to Dave Carter and Tracy Grammer for a lovely set despite the distraction) When folks complained, the rock-stars feigned indifference. A true shame. What was missing was respect. ~Elle |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: keltcgrasshoppper Date: 25 May 00 - 05:53 PM I still think that the very best festival I ahve ever attedded is the Rollo Bay Fiddle Festival in Prince Edward Island Canada.. Its a mix of fiddle, vocal, dance, etc.. There is a room set up where you can go and sit with anyone from Natalie to a 10 year old who is just starting.. Share songs learn steps.. all very casual not at all exclusive..everyone is comfortable and welcome.. IT IS DRY however which seems to be a problem for some of you... Oh well I'll just spend the weekend with Natalie, Richand wood, J.P. Cormier all of the Chaissons... and on and on booze or not.. The view is great too..The site lookes out on to Cape Breton Island... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: GUEST,liz the squeak Date: 25 May 00 - 05:53 PM What's missing? A whole segment of our future audiences are being drummed out - the under 3's can usually sit quite happily in a cot or pushchair and play with parent/sibling/dirty old rag. The 4-12's get daytime stuff, and are expected to be asleep and supervised by 7.30pm; the 12-16's, if they don't look old enough to get into the pub are stuck out in the garden with a bottle of pop. That's what's missing - activities after 6.pm for those whose ages are the same as their shoe size...... (I realise that comment doesn't work in countries that have size 42 shoes, where we in the UK would have 6-7......) And what about tolerance for younger kids at concerts? (OK, my high horse, I'm getting off it now)... LTS |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: keltcgrasshoppper Date: 25 May 00 - 05:54 PM I can't believe the typos in that post sorry...KGH I think you get my point... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: Willie-O Date: 25 May 00 - 06:07 PM Damn, sign me up Grasshopper! What's the Rollo Bay dates???? And Jen I apologize for the rude behaviour of my fellow Canadians at yer festival...are you sure they're still Canadian? (I'm working setting up a store this month which you can tell is staffed by Canadians, because every time you run into one of them with a pallet-load of merchandise they say "I'm sorry!") What's missing? Me! I haven't made it to hardly any real festivals this past couple years...lets see now... Willie-O |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: DebC Date: 25 May 00 - 06:14 PM Mark Moss had a wonderful commentary regarding festivals in the Fall 99 issue of Singout (has Ani DiFranco and Utah Phillips on the cover. Well worth a read and I say HOORAY, MARK!! Debra |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: Mbo Date: 25 May 00 - 06:20 PM I think Willie referencing "Canadian Bacon" again... --Mbo |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: JenEllen Date: 25 May 00 - 06:20 PM Oh no, Willie....I think it was more of a 'We won a Juneau, what have YOU done' kind of thing. It wasn't a Canadian slam at all...just a general lack of respect for others sharing the park. You had to hear them (they weren't bad) whether you wanted to or not. Lack of planning as far as sound went, and an unwillingness to bend to accomodate other musicians, that's all.. ~Elle |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: keltcgrasshoppper Date: 25 May 00 - 07:09 PM Rollo Bay is always the third weekend in July,...This year it falls on the 14,15 and 16th.. There is camping at the site.. and Jenellen...Children are always welcome.. The hill behind the stage is great for rolling down... And there are actually performers as young as 5 who steal the show every time.. Wonderful place to inspire youngsters. All proceeds go toward free fiddle lessons... SOOOOOO lets all move to PEI...Call Peter Chaisson at 1-902-687-2584 for details and directions |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: JenEllen Date: 25 May 00 - 07:16 PM JenEllen...children are always welcome?????? Okay KGH, who's been squealing about my rolling down hills again, I'll moider the bums??!!?? LOL Actually, a young one who stole the show for me at Tumbleweed was Janis Carper's son. He got up after mom's set and did a self-penned tune about their dog...."Lucky, the Rat-Killing Dog" Beautiful... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: keltcgrasshoppper Date: 25 May 00 - 07:37 PM I love it .. I find such joy in watching and listening to children.. Can't wait till I'm a Grandama.. I'll spoil them rotten and of course roll down every hill We see and run through the tall grass too ,of course thats after we put the fiddles in their cases... Which my brother used to slide down the hill on... now thats another story...KGH |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 25 May 00 - 07:45 PM Festivals vary. And they change over time. The difficulty is finding out which are the ones that fit your needs (and these vary over time too).
Some festivals do very well for children, though probably not that many. Of the ones I've been to, Sidmouth is the one that addresses the needs of children most satisfactorily, so far as I can see. They seem to have a whale of a time, crafts, games, and music and dance. The childrens programme often looks more interesting than that for the adults, with great performers involved. My y impressioin is that it turns out a lot of children who are folk-oriented for life.
Of course that's not much help to Mudcatters in America looking for where to go - but it's pretty clear that you've got some great child-friendly evwents over there too.
The problem with festivals is that, if they are successful they tend to grow bigger, and that can drive away the very qualities that make them enjoyable in then first place. I tend to prefer smaller festivals - but then they fold, because of lack of money, or the key people who do all the work move away or fold under the work-load.
The festivals I know which have managed to grow to a viable size without losing the qualities of intimacy and informality are headed by Fylde and Whitby. Sidmouth is too big, but has managed to run as a bunch of smaller festivals packaged together, so you can still get some of the small scale feeling.
Perhaps what people looking for the right festival should post a list of what that would mean for them (locality, type of activities wanted - eg workshops, dances, sessions - cost, children's festival etc) and then see if other 'Catters could advise from experience.
This could even be a standing facility, either a permathread, or a satellite operation like bbc's pages or the Mudcat Songbook. And I am not volunteering to run it. (Because that's what people always say when you suggest something - "that sounds interesting - why don't you do it"; it's what I always say too.) |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: JenEllen Date: 26 May 00 - 01:12 AM I'd be willing to sort out and organize the information, but honestly don't have the time to hunt it up. I'd prefer to catalog submissions. A global calendar of events and a small listing of those they cater too...wonderful. Anyone with ideas can PM me. ~Elle |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: Sorcha Date: 26 May 00 - 01:56 AM OK, JenEllen, here ya go: Walnut Valley Festival, Winfield Kansas, USA Big festival, 20,000 people, but feels small 3rd weekend in September, Thurs-Sun 4 official stages, 4 more un official Big name entertainers on all 4 main stages; such as Tom Paxton, Cherish the Ladies, DeDannan, New Grass Revival, Bryan Bowers, Dan Crary,Aileen and Elkin Thomas, something for every taste from folk, bluegrass, newgrass, Irish, etc. Jam sessions galore, 24 hrs a day.
Local and relatively unknown performers,Dixie Chicks started here when NO body knew them......
Vendors like Taylor, Ome, Larrivee,Oscar Schmidt, Cripple Creek Dulcimers, Happy Traum in person, Lynn McSpadden in the flesh, etc. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: JenEllen Date: 26 May 00 - 03:50 AM LOL....one down, a zillion to go! Thanks Sorcha, that's perfect!! Woman on a mission...JenEllen |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: Gary T Date: 26 May 00 - 09:42 AM A relative newcomer is the Santa Fe Trails Bluegrass Festival, which just had its third annual showing last weekend (May 19-21). Held in Bonner Springs, Kansas, just west of Kansas City, at the grounds of the Agricultural Hall of Fame. The main force behind it is Leo Eilts, of the band Spontaneous Combustion. Winfield regulars will remember them (reference Sorcha's post, two above as I write this). It is similar in style to the Walnut Valley Festival, but with a higher proportion of bluegrass and more regional talent. The festival has been combined with the annual Blue Devil Barbecue Contest (some contestants offer sampler plates after their competition, but it's not a barbecue feast for the festival attendees) and the Prairie Winds Kite Festival--some darned impressive kites and kite-flying demonstrations. There was also a fair number of kids' activities, with various games and activities, little giveaway items (balloon hats, flower seeds the kids plant in soil in a bag and take home to nurture, etc.), and a stage with kid-oriented music and other performances such as yo-yo demonstrations. Four regular stages plus a campground stage plus the Songwriters Circle Showcase stage (local songwriters performing their own stuff). Bigger names this year were John McCutheon, Connie Dover & Roger Landres, Rhonda Vincent, and the Del McCoury Band. Good quality arts & crafts vendors, reasonable selection of food vendors, various campground jams, youth fiddle contest. The Ag Hall of Fame Museum, a Farmer's Museum, several relocated old buildings typical of rural/small town life earlier in the century, mini train ride around the lake, nature trail through mostly wooded area. Alcohol prohibited in stage areas, beer vendor among food concessions. Pretty nice campground, though shade is rather scarce. RV hookups (at least electric) available, enough port-a-pots, rather long trek for water. Many attendees are Winfield regulars, probably appreciate the noticeably smaller crowd (a few thousand?). |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: Mooh Date: 26 May 00 - 09:58 AM Etc dept How about baby accommodations? Dog (seeing eye kind) admission and comfort? Mainstage audience space? Parking availability? Etc Man. Mooh. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: Ebbie Date: 26 May 00 - 10:47 AM Alaska Folk Festival, Juneau, Alaska: April each year, 7 days. All free. An auditorium that holds approx. 1200. One main stage. One paid guest artist group that will do two 45-minute sets (Thursday and Sunday nights) and workshops on each one's specialty on Saturday and Sunday daytimes. 15-minute sets from about 155 people, out of about 200 applications. (The rest go on stand-by.) No auditions but the board tries to fit in each applicant for freshness and appeal. All acoustic. Four nights of dance, different bands, one hour each. Children's concerts on the weekend, children's entertainment nightly out of auditorium. No alcohol on premises but jamming all over town in restaurants and bars and people's homes; all-nighters... A magic time! |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: Mooh Date: 26 May 00 - 10:58 AM Ebbie. Is there a website? Sounds really good! Mooh. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: Gary T Date: 26 May 00 - 11:18 AM Mooh, I believe the following applies to both Winfield and Santa Fe. This is, however, partly my impression and not necessarily exact. Baby accomodations--bring your own. Dogs--pets prohibited, but surely seeing-eye dogs would be allowed. Comfort--not quite sure what you're after, but I would say owner's responsibility. Main Stage audience space--so far fine at Santa Fe, at Winfield gets jammed on Fri & Sat nights. Parking--available, but probably not all of it terribly convenient. The total Winfield experience incorporates camping there, I think that day-trippers largely miss out on half the fun. The campgrounds open a week before the festival proper. By festival time it's hard to find a campsite that's not a spot in an open field somewhat remote from the stage/concession areas. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: Mooh Date: 26 May 00 - 12:40 PM Gary T, et al, For babies I meant like a nursing/change room/house etc... For dog comfort I meant poop bag provided/dumping place convenient etc... For parking, distance is often a factor, shuttles, direction signs, etc... I really like the idea of camping nearby if it's possible, particularly if it's within walking distance. Some festivals are better situated than others, geographically and financially, and that's an unavoidable fact of existance. However, all other things being equal, some festivals get great transferable ideas about how to solve the common difficulties, and it's the patrons who know what works best. One festival I know has a first come first serve mainstage seating policy which precludes anyone coming much later than when the gates open in the morning. Nonetheless, a later arrival pays the same coin at the gate and may not necessarily get a view of mainstage at all. I'm not sure how to make it better other than to move to/create a larger venue. Thanks for your ideas. Peace. Mooh. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: JenEllen Date: 26 May 00 - 02:01 PM Thanks for all of the 'ETC' Mooh! Forgetting the simple things....database started, however. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: Gary T Date: 26 May 00 - 02:16 PM Mooh, at the two festivals I mentioned I haven't seen changing stations in the men's rooms, I suspect they don't have them in the ladies' rooms, but I never asked. I've never seen a guide dog there, so I assume it's bring your own supplies and dispose of waste in a toilet or port-a-pot (unless a closed plastic bag makes it OK to put it in a trash can). Day parkers park on the grounds, Winfield has a shuttle wagon to cut down on the walk to the music area. Camping is on the grounds, and part of the campground is adjacent to the music area. Some folks choose this part of the campground for the geographical convenience, others choose a farther-out spot for the relative isolation, latecomers take what they can get. All stages have open seating, which means first come first served and move into a better spot if it opens up. Some stages have installed seats, some are bring your own chair. Some people leave their empty chairs for a while, and usually folks respect that space, but there's no rule about it. Most people do a fair amount of stage-hopping, going to different stages at different times to catch the particular acts they want to see. Tickets are for a 24-hour day, midnight to midnight. A multi-day ticket is necessary to drive into the campground (weekend ticket only to get into Winfield before the festival proper starts). If you have a Fri-Sat ticket and arrive Thu evening, you wait by the entry station until midnight, officially Fri. If you want to get in Fri, you buy a Fri ticket, whether it's 9:00 AM or 11:30 PM (this makes it somewhat unattractive as say, a one-evening venture). |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 26 May 00 - 05:33 PM Some things that are useful to know about a festival:
Where is it, when is it, how long has it been going, and is it particularly geared to some particular type of music?
Is there a season ticket etc?
How spread out are the venues? (ie, can you walk betwween them)
Is it in a town/village, or in a field on its own?
Are there informal tune sessions?
Are there informal singarounds?
Are there storytelling sessions?
Any competitions?
Is busking allowed/encouraged/discouraged?
What are the arrangemnetas for ensuring children of different age groups enjoy themselves?
What's it like for people who can't walk, and so forth? Noy t just access to venues - steep hills are also worth knowing aboutr. For example Whitby.
Camping? And how far is this from events? And is there a festival bus service if it's a long way?
That'll do for a start.
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: DebC Date: 26 May 00 - 07:34 PM For a great festival this summer, check out The Greater New Bedford Summerfest. The line-up is really spectacular, all the stages are within walking distance from each other, and the best part is it costs only $5. Oh yeah: I'll be there too, in the "Songs of the Sea", "Songs of History", and other workshops and showcases. Deb |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: GUEST,Lollipop Date: 26 May 00 - 07:46 PM In the case of folk music, good music is missing |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: WyoWoman Date: 26 May 00 - 08:27 PM I'm going to try a blue clickie thing to the thread I started some time ago about a festival being held in Douglas, Wyoming, over Labor Day weekend. If the blue clickie magic fails, just check the thread. The organizer, Steve Weih, really knows his traditional bluegrass, so this ought to be a nice festival. WyoWoman |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: WyoWoman Date: 26 May 00 - 08:32 PM OMIGAWD!!! It worked. I'm so utterly thrilled. Except it's a sage-green clickie thing. But who's to quibble? Ya-whooo! Oh, and re. what's missing in festivals? I haven't been to enough of them to critique a great deal, but I do know that I love the workshops, especially those that are set up to suit several different levels of skills. Being a singer, I'd always like to see more workshops on harmony singing and other topics of interest for The Voice. And, even though my young 'uns aren't so young anymore, I do love to see -- and hear -- the kids enjoying music. I also would love to see more that would involve and welcome adolescents, even though I know traditional music is a pretty hard sell with many of 'em. ww |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: GUEST,mary g Date: 26 May 00 - 09:00 PM bathrooms cleaned regularly and supplied... |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: Mooh Date: 26 May 00 - 09:18 PM Oh Mary, yes yes yes! And enough washrooms to go around! With a place to change a baby in one or two, maybe a mirror for those who are along way from creature comforts, and soap, and no coin operated stalls. Mooh. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: bflat Date: 26 May 00 - 09:20 PM In the Northeast there are wonderful festivals with very very good attendance. NJ Folk Festival starts things off in late April; June brings on the Great Hudson River/Clearwater Festival; followed by several others. Each has great acts; workshops; themes; crafts; food and fun for all ages. But it seems to me there is no one political/social impetus to these gatherings. I'm a child of the sixties and anti-war and racial equality were strong galvanizing themes. Is there anything that coalesces our voices? I propose it should be gun control. There are wonderful songs today to raise our collective consciousness if we could only be united. MY 2 cents. |
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Subject: RE: BS: Festivals-what's missing? From: Gary T Date: 27 May 00 - 01:54 AM One of McGrath's questions was "Any competitions?" I can imagine Sorcha slapping her forehead in unison with me as we recall that one of the key aspects of the Walnut Valley Festival (Winfield) is the National Flat-Picking Championship. (No, it's not a contest about choosing apartments, it's using a flat pick rather than finger picks on a guitar.) People come from all around the U.S. and sometimes from overseas to compete. There are also contests for finger-picking, fiddle, banjo, mandolin, autoharp, and others that elude me right now. But the Flat-Picking Championship, as I understand it, is a fairly huge deal among bluegrass-style guitarists. |