Origins: Do You Love an Apple?

Subject: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From:
Date: 09 Jul 98 - 11:33 PM

I am looking for the music for the song "Do you Love an Apple?" performed by the Both Band, among others. If anyone could tip me off, please do so -- we are looking to use it at our Aug. 16th wedding.

Please mail me at [e-mail]

Thanks much!! Tom

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From: Barry Finn
Date: 09 Jul 98 - 11:36 PM

Go to the upper right hand corner of the screen, enter Do You Love An Apple & then hit the search button, 2 songs will come up, one is what you want. Barry

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 10 Jul 98 - 03:28 AM

You'd think that one would be easy to find. You can click here and find the lyrics here in the Digital Tradition, but there's no tune. I looked through a stack of likely songbooks, but couldn't find the tune. Can anybody help?
-Joe Offer-

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DO YOU LOVE AN APPLE?

Do you love an apple, do you love a pear?
Do you love a laddie with curly brown hair?
Yes, I love him, can't deny him
I will be with him where ever he goes

Before I got married I wore a black shawl
But now that I'm married I wear bugger-all
Still, I love him, can't deny him
I will be with him where ever he goes

He stands at the corner, a fag in his mouth
Two hands in his pockets, he whistles me out
Still, I love him, can't deny him
I will be with him where ever he goes

Before I got married I'd sport and I'd play
But now, how the cradle stands in my way
Still, I love him, can't deny him
I will be with him where ever he goes

Do you love an apple, do you love a pear?
Do you love a laddie with curly brown hair?
Yes, I love him, can't deny him
I will be with him where ever he goes

- as sung by Ellen van der Hoeven
(a version of "Still I Love Him" AJS)
@bitching @marriage
filename[ LOVAPPLE
AJS
apr97

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From: BBJ
Date: 10 Jul 98 - 11:33 AM

Maura O'Connell does a really beautiful version of this song on her "Wandering Home" CD. She calls it "Irish Blues". It's one of my favorites on a really great album. Also "Sally Gardens" "Coast of Claire".

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From: Kathleen
Date: 10 Jul 98 - 04:49 PM

Altan does a nice job with this song, but I forget the album title. When I remember, I'll send it in. Kathleen

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From: Ian HP
Date: 10 Jul 98 - 07:28 PM

Wonderful version of this by the Bothy Band - original album no longer available (I think) but available on 'The Best of'.

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From: Benjamin Bodhra/nai/
Date: 10 Jul 98 - 10:31 PM

The Bothy Band Album is stil available thru' Green Linnet, and the song with a variety of different verses is also found in one of those sets of books like the Soodlum set, the name of which escapes me, and it goes by the title "Still I love Him" as the first verse that BB sing is not included.

I'll try to find the name and bounce it in as that has the tune in staff.

B

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From: LToynbee
Date: 11 Jul 98 - 09:53 AM

Kate Russell and Christine Kydd also do a lovely version of this song on what seems to me to be a nameless tape I've got!! (Green Trax Lable)

Subject: ADD Chords: Do you Love an Apple?
From: harpgirl
Date: 11 Jul 98 - 12:26 PM

Hiya Joe, whattayaknow?
I play "Do You Love an Apple" with the following chords:
..

  D              G   
Do you love an apple?  
D             G  
Do you love a pear?    
D             G   
Do you love a laddie   
(  )               A  
With curly brown hair  
D         D7  
Oh yes I love him  
G          (  )  
Can"t deny him  
D                  A           D  
I'll stay with him wherever he goes   

sorry, my guitar playing is a tad on the PRIMITIVE side...harpetta

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 11 Jul 98 - 08:48 PM

Thanks, Harpgirl - I have a little trouble getting the tune just right in parts of this song, so I'd like to see the actual notes. Anybody able to post this song in ABC or MIDITXT format?
-Joe Offer-

Subject: Tune Add: DO YOU LOVE AN APPLE?
From: Alan of Australia
Date: 11 Jul 98 - 10:49 PM

G'day,
Here we go, I played this from memory but it sounds about right. It doesn't appear in my Soodlum collection but "Folksongs & Ballads Popular In Ireland" volume 2 has "Still I Love Him" to a different tune.

---

Click to play

To play or display ABC tunes, try concertina.net

ABC format:

X:1
T:Do You Love An Apple
M:3/4
Q:1/4=100
K:C
G6|c2c2c2|A2G2G2|c2c2c2|A4G2|c2c2c2|A3GE2|
E2D2C2|D4ED|C4D2|E2G4|A4G2|A2c4|c3Bc2|A2G2E2|
D3ED2|C6||

Cheers,
Alan

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 11 Jul 98 - 10:56 PM

Thanks, Alan. Makes a lot more sense to me now.
-Joe-

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From:
Date: 12 Jul 98 - 12:35 PM

IIRC, Trapezoid did an interesting version of this in their own unique way. . .

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From:
Date: 22 Jul 98 - 01:16 PM

Thanks for all the discussion on the song melody. I can get MIDItext to run, but I cannot SEE the music for it... I can't figure it out.

Any chance that someone could mail me a GIF, BMP or JPG file of it to look at? I would appreciate it. Cheers, Tom

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From: Jon W.
Date: 22 Jul 98 - 02:48 PM

I made a .bmp using abc2win and Paint. Anyone else want one, I'll email it. [e-mail].

Jon W.

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 22 Jul 98 - 07:53 PM

Noteworthy Composer will display and print music to MIDI files. MusicEase will do the same for SongWright files. There are many programs that will display and print ABC files. ALL are available as shareware.

Subject: Tune 'Do you love an apple'
From: GG
Date: 02 Mar 99 - 01:05 PM

Hi, I"ve seached everywhere for the tune to- Do You Love an Apple [ Irish tune]. Anyone out there have it? Music notation fine.Thank -you.

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In Mudcat MIDIs:

Do You Love an Apple

He Comes Down Our Alley (from Folksongs of Britain & Ireland, Peter Kennedy)

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Subject: RE: Tune 'Do you love an apple'
From: harpgirl
Date: 02 Mar 99 - 01:55 PM

Hi GG It's in the DT sweety...type the title into the box in the upper right hand corner. I begin in C and play with CFG and the appropriate 7ths where you hear the changes...harpgirl

Subject: Do You Love an Apple?
From: fae13
Date: 20 Oct 99 - 11:13 AM

Hello Fellow Songweavers...

I am looking for the name of the composer to the tune "Do You Love an Apple?" Now I believe that is the title but I have also heard this song referred to as "Still I Love Him". I am also unsure of the origin of the lyrics as well.. are they Traditional? are they contemp? HELP =)

Any leads would be greatly appreciate.

Light, fae

Subject: RE: Do You Love an Apple?
From: Bert
Date: 20 Oct 99 - 11:25 AM

The tune of 'Still I Love Him' is a close derivative of 'Villikins and His Dinah'

Subject: RE: Do You Love an Apple?
From: MMario
Date: 20 Oct 99 - 11:28 AM

found it in a couple places - in all they were attributed as "traditional irish" - - which doesn't mean either the tune or the lyrics ARE, but....

Subject: RE: Do You Love an Apple?
From: Alice
Date: 20 Oct 99 - 11:52 AM

Another version is called "When I Was Single" (recorded by Clancy/Makem), similar lyrics, but a different tune.

Subject: RE: Do You Love an Apple?
From: Cara
Date: 20 Oct 99 - 01:01 PM

I really like this song. If there are different versions, could you guys please post the lyrics? Thanks.

Subject: RE: Do You Love an Apple?
From: harpgirl
Date: 20 Oct 99 - 01:39 PM

...cara...it's in the DT

Subject: RE: Do You Love an Apple?
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 20 Oct 99 - 01:41 PM

There's an English version ("Still I Love Him") on the database. The Bothy Band did a particularly nice version on their first album; the tunes are obviously related.

Malcolm

Subject: RE: Do You Love an Apple?
From: Cara
Date: 20 Oct 99 - 03:29 PM

Should have clarified...Different versions than those in the DT...

Thanks harpgirl

Subject: RE: Do You Love an Apple?
From:
Date: 20 Oct 99 - 03:32 PM

I heard that song performed by Trapazoid many years ago. Does anyone know what has become of the violin player and singer from that group, Freyda Epstein? She has such a wonderful and powerfull voice, is she performing with another group? Thanks Bill L

Subject: RE: Do You Love an Apple?
From: lamarca
Date: 20 Oct 99 - 03:41 PM

Cara, the Irish version in the DT leaves out a verse Triona Ni Dhomnaill sang with The Bothy Band:

He works in the fact'ry for nine bob a week
Come Saturday night he comes roaring home drunk
Ah, but still I love him, I can't deny him
I'll go with him wherever he goes...

It's a beautiful tune that I love singing, but always with a little internal grimace at the doormat personality of the woman. The English version seems worse, since he actually beats her in that one...

Subject: RE: Do You Love an Apple?
From: Susan A-R
Date: 20 Oct 99 - 10:08 PM

It's a beautiful, but difficult song, isn't it? I've always thought that it would make fabulous soundtrack material for a doccumentary on abuse. It's classic. And why are all of the best melodies set to songs that are not politically correct??

Susan A-R

Subject: RE: Do You Love an Apple?
From: Jon W.
Date: 21 Oct 99 - 10:52 AM

I could never understand why my wife likes this song so much. Sure my hair is brown and a little curly but the guy in the song is a total jerk, not like me...-)

BTW if anyone has chords to the Bothy Band version (the only one I've heard) I'd like them, please.

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From: GUEST,coldjam
Date: 30 Mar 03 - 11:05 PM

Does anyone know the original writer of this tune? We do a parody and would like to give credit.

Subject: RE: Request: Do you Love an Apple?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 31 Mar 03 - 01:55 AM

I think it's traditional, but let's see what we can dig up on it. I'll post the entry from the Traditional Ballad Index, to give us a start.
-Joe Offer-

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Do You Love an Apple?

DESCRIPTION: The girl loves an uncaring man. She details her abuses ("When I was single, I wore a black shawl; now I'm married, it's overalls," etc.), always ending, "Still I love him, I'll forgive him (or "cannot deny him"), I'll go with him wherever he goes."
AUTHOR: unknown
EARLIEST DATE: 1952 (recording, Phil Hammond)
KEYWORDS: love abuse poverty hardtimes
FOUND IN: Britain(England(Lond,North),Scotland(Aber)) Ireland
REFERENCES (6 citations):
Kennedy-FolksongsOfBritainAndIreland 203, "He Comes Down our Alley" (1 text, 1 tune)
OShaughnessy-YellowbellyBalladsPart2 50, "Still I Love Him" (1 text, 1 tune)
MacColl/Seeger-TravellersSongsFromEnglandAndScotland 30, "Still I Love Him" (1 text, 1 tune)
Gardham-EastRidingSongster 29, p. 37, "Still I Love Him" (1 text, 1 tune)
Silber/Silber-FolksingersWordbook, p. 186, "When I Was Single" (1 text)
DT, STILILOV* LOVAPPLE
Roud #654
RECORDINGS:
Steve Gardham, "Still I Love Him" (Piotr-Archive #308, recorded 10/11/2022; slightly modified by the singer)
Dan Gardella, "Do You Love an Apple?" (Fragment: Piotr-Archive #522, recorded 03/09/2023)
Betty Redshaw, "He Comes Down Our Alley" (on FSBFTX19)
CROSS-REFERENCES:
cf. "When I Was Young (II)" (theme, floating lyrics)
cf. "For Seven Long Years I've Been Married" (theme)
SAME TUNE:
Margaret Barry & Michael Gorman, "Still I Love Him" (on Barry-Gorman1)
NOTES [153 words]: The version sung by Charlotte Higgins (in MacColl/Seeger-TravellersSongsFromEnglandAndScotland) has, rather than overalls, "Now since I'm married I've sweet bugger-all," a rather more vivid description.
The Barry-Gorman recording is an autobiographical rewrite of the traditional song, telling of Barry's life as a singer of traditional songs, but it incorporates a few of the older verses. - PJS
Also collected and sung by David Hammond, "When I Was Single" (on David Hammond, "I Am the Wee Falorie Man: Folk Songs of Ireland," Tradition TCD1052 CD (1997) reissue of Tradition LP TLP 1028 (1959)).
Sean O Boyle, notes to David Hammond, "I Am the Wee Falorie Man: Folk Songs of Ireland": "A Northumbrian song probably imported into Ulster in the 19th century during the American Civil War when the English cotton industry found itself with no raw material and its textile workers came to Ulster to work at the linen." - BS
Last updated in version 6.7
File: K203

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Subject: ADD: He Comes Down Our Alley^^
From: Joe Offer
Date: 31 Mar 03 - 02:27 AM

HE COMES DOWN OUR ALLEY

1 He comes down our alley and whistles me out
His hands in his pockets, his shirt 'angin' out
But yus I luvs 'im
I can't denies it
I goes wiv 'im
Wher'ever 'e goes

2 He bought me an 'ankerchief, red white and blue
Outside the pawnshop 'e tore it in two

3 O I like an apple and I like a pear
And I like a feller with nice curly hair

4 'E took me to the public and ordered me stout
Before I could drink it, 'e'd ordered me out

5 Before we was married, we 'ad lots o' quids
But now that we's married, we got lots o' kids^^

Source: Folksongs of Britain and Ireland, Peter Kennedy, 1975

from the singing of Betty Redshaw of London, recorded by Peter Kennedy in 1954.
Kennedy's notes say that the song now seems to be widespread in England, Scotland, and Ireland; but it was not known to the public until it was recorded by Phil Hamond in Norfolk and broadcast in 1952. Its airing on the radio brought a letter from a listener in London who had heard it sung by children in the poorer districts of Liverpool and Birkenhead during the Second World War.
Betty Redshaw learned her version from her grandfather, whose family lived alongside the River Thames at Gravesend in Kent. He kept a notebook of all the old songs and shanties he heard from the sailors who came into the London docks.

---

Click to play

Kennedy cites verses from a number of other versions.
Lucy Stewart of Aberdeenshire Scotland (1954)

When I was single I wore a black shawl
And now since I've married I've got none at all
Still I love him, can't deny it
I'll go with him wherever he goes

Children's version:

O I like an apple and I like a pear
And I like a sailor with nice curly hair
O gee I love 'im, I can't deny it
I'll be with him wherever he goes

He stands on the corner and whistles me out
He shouts Oo-ey, oo-ey, are you coming out?

He takes me to the pictures, he saves me a seat
And when I get there he says, stand on your feet

There's meat in the oven and cakes on the shelf
And if you don't like them I'll eat them me-self

Durham & Northumberland miners' wives:

He gets up in the morning, he chops me some sticks
Lights me the fire up and gang oot at six
But still I love him, cannie laddie
I'll gang wiv him wherever he gangs

He works in the pityard for twelve bob a week
Comes home on the Saturdays as full as a leech.

Fishwives at Yarmouth in Norfolk:

My back is a-breaking, my fingers are sore
Guttin' the herrin' he brings to the shore

If he's gone to heaven, he'll come to no harm
If he's gone down below then he'll keep himself warm

The storm is a-ragin', his boat isn't in
T'others won't tell me what's happened to him^^

Subject: RE: Tune Req: Do you Love an Apple?
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 31 Mar 03 - 11:08 PM

You've fallen in love with the tune, perhaps. But why do you want to have this depressing, self-destructive lyric sung at your wedding?

Subject: RE: Tune Req: Do you Love an Apple?
From: GUEST,BunnyCymru
Date: 18 Feb 04 - 02:52 PM

This song isn't depressing at all.. it's about real love.. sticking by someone even when it gets hard.

I sang it at my wedding just before the Ceiledh band broke up for the buffet break in the evening.

Subject: RE: Tune Req: Do you Love an Apple?
From: michaelr
Date: 18 Feb 04 - 07:01 PM

I'd say it's got Music Hall written all over it.

Cheers,
Michael

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: AmyLove
Date: 18 Jan 17 - 08:35 PM

Lyrics to Margaret Barry and Michael Gorman's version (found here )

A promoter named Raymond, he did sign us on
To go over to London to sing an Irish song.
Still, I love him, I'll forgive him.
I'll go with him wherever he goes.

We then went to Dublin to see the Lord Mayor,
Who gave us a letter to take over there.
Still, I love him, I'll forgive him.
I'll go with him wherever he goes.

We then went to London, that city of renown,
And when I got there they put on my crown.
Still, I love him, I'll forgive him.
I'll go with him wherever he goes.

I went into the Mayfair, the Duke I declare,
The way he did look when he did see us there!
Still, I love him, I'll forgive him.
I'll go with him wherever he goes.

Now the great royal show band were with us one night,
In the Royal Albert Hall I sang with delight.
Still, I love him, I'll forgive him.
I'll go with him wherever he goes.

I went to the window to whistle him out;
The music was going and I was left out!
Still, I love him, I'll forgive him.
I'll go with him wherever he goes.

Out of me bounty he bought me a shawl,
And the first day I wore it I tattered it all.
Still, I love him, I'll forgive him.
I'll go with him wherever he goes.

I went into the Bedford, he bought me a stout.
Before I could drink it, he ordered me out!
Still, I love him, I'll forgive him.
I'll go with him wherever he goes.

I come to the end now, my verses are out.
If you want any more, I'll have Guinness's Stout.
Still, I love him, I'll forgive him.
I'll go with him wherever he goes.

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple? (Retrospective)
From: GUEST,Pateta
Date: 25 Mar 25 - 09:40 AM

While searching for this song, I found this absolutely prehistoric internet forum. The first message dates back to July 9, 1998. I find this fascinating. The modern internet consists of many toxic people, and seeing this nice little conversation between you all is heartwarming. It brings me much joy to see that this part of the web remains uncorrupted.
Back then, the internet was a place where you could search for help and opinions. Now, it is a place where you're more likely to end up defending your opinion. I wonder how many places like this are still out there — simple, warm, kind, and respectful.
Now, we have AI that helps us with work, day-to-day tasks, and (sadly) even communication. Back then, all of this was just a dream.
I was born in 2002, and this forum with it's age itself fills me with admiration. Many of you have lived full lives since the first post—hopefully great lives. Married, had kids, even grandchildren, who knows.
I just thought I’d leave a little fingerprint in this museum of the prehistoric internet. God bless all of you — those who were here, those who are here, and those who will be here.
I don’t know if anyone will see this, but whoever you are, keep going. I, myself, am searching for purpose in life, and it’s hard. But life is an interesting thing — you never know what will happen tomorrow.
Don’t be too harsh on yourself — we’re all living this life for the first time.
P.S. Thank you for the information, eternal helpers.
Best wishes. Pateta.

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: meself
Date: 25 Mar 25 - 11:19 AM

Now, that's a nice note!

--------------

The best verse so far is the last one:

I come to the end now, my verses are out.
If you want any more, I'll have Guinness's Stout.

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 25 Mar 25 - 11:35 AM

Oddest bit of spam I've seen in a very long time! Written by AI? The link goes to an Instagram page.

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: Helen
Date: 25 Mar 25 - 11:45 AM

I think it is genuinely human. (I could be wrong.)

Thank you for your kind thoughts, Pateta. I have been coming to Mudcat for almost 30 years and the people here are usually very knowledgeable, helpful and welcoming, That's why I am still here.

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: GUEST,Rossey
Date: 26 Mar 25 - 07:31 AM

Every now and again ancient threads get revived by autobots, or those who want to hijack a thread to draw attention to their own web presence on a video, web page or social media following thingy. The mischief makers will also often create a mythical "do you know what this tune/song is?" excuse to drive people to view a youtube video. It's all a game.   Back to 'Do You Love An Apple?'   I once heard this decades a go at a little 'session', and the melody just lodged in my head. It is truly beautiful.   I couldn't remember the odd title, and it faded into the distance of time. So when the Internet came along and youtube, I was so grateful when the dormant memory and tune popped into my head. I was able to track down the Bothy Band's spine tingling version, and many others. The words may not be 'politically correct', due to the theme of staying in a hinted abusive relationship with undying devotion. But historically that's the way it was, and should be judged in the context of the time it is set.

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: GUEST,Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Mar 25 - 03:23 PM

I love this song. To me it seems to be about a rather feckless and frustrated young couple who haven't avoided the privations that can be brought on by bairns and low pay ("nine bob a week") but who still love each other. Where's the abuse? Certainly not there in the Bothies' lyrics. Triona's singing of it is perfect.

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: GUEST,Peter Laban
Date: 26 Mar 25 - 05:36 PM

She got it from her aunt Neili ni Dhomnaill. I heard a recording of Neili singing it but am not sure that is easily available anywhere.

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: GUEST,Rossey
Date: 26 Mar 25 - 05:37 PM

He comes home rolling drunk, and the whistled me out..the woman whose job is to have babies. Just that she loves him, no matter what, The modern concept is of misogyny. The negative is always outweighed by the devotion aspect "still I love him.". There is an implication of a rough relationship, but not spelt out. But you have to remember this is an old style working class relationship dating back to when women were stuck with drunken husbands, that today would likely spell divorce. In this case she is happy loving him despite the niggles.

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: GeoffLawes
Date: 26 Mar 25 - 06:29 PM

Still I Love Him -all recordings on YouTube    https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Still+I+Love+Him++all+recordings

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: GeoffLawes
Date: 26 Mar 25 - 06:48 PM

Do You Love an Apple? -many recordings on YouTube    https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Do+you+Love+an+Apple+song+all+recordings

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: GUEST,Steve Shaw
Date: 26 Mar 25 - 07:25 PM

I think you may be missing some context, Rossey. My ould Irish grandad frequently rolled home drunk of a Saturday night (especially after a Man U home game), but he and my gran were nobbut a lifelong love story.

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: GUEST,Rossey
Date: 26 Mar 25 - 07:34 PM

I said hinted at, it's all in the interpretation, you can make your own backstory out of it. She sounds as though she gives as good as she gets. It's old fashioned working class love and devotion, but with a hint of misogyny, and it is a lovely period song.

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: GUEST,Steve Shaw
Date: 27 Mar 25 - 05:49 AM

I've known and loved the Bothy version for decades. Had I detected any misogyny in it, I'd have dumped it after the first listen. Like lots of relationship songs and stories, it seems to me to be about imperfect human beings, no more or less than that. When it comes to "whistling out," yes it can amount to misogyny if it's designed to harass or cause embarrassment or distress. Equally, back in the day it could just have been just casual, peer group-led laddishness that amounted to very little. Who's to know? I think it's a lovely song, performed beautifully.

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: meself
Date: 27 Mar 25 - 12:05 PM

The young man in question could be just a little rough around the edges or he could be a brute, depending on your preferences or, of course, on the version under consideration.

Subject: RE: Origins: Do You Love an Apple?
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 27 Mar 25 - 03:48 PM

My mother sang both this song and its male companion 'I wish I was single again'. Both were intended as a bit of fun, an exaggeration if you like. Like most ditties of this type it was sung with gusto by both sexes with little thought to modern PC sensibilities. I published her versions in 1982 and they are still being sung with the same spirit at singarounds locally today.