Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions

Subject: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: jaze
Date: 12 May 07 - 11:56 AM

I was given this cd yesterday and think it's great from start to finish. Couldn't find a thread on it. Anyone else like it?

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Phillip
Date: 12 May 07 - 02:31 PM

I'm a big fan of Bruce Springsteen, with far too many boots, but this phase of his career leaves me cold. He is great at blue-eyed soul, great at rock, very good at acoustic songs (the acoustic Seeds is excellent, as are the first performances of This Hard land, for example) but he isn't a folksinger, and the people playing with him are not great either. Suzie Tyrell? I'd rather have Swarb.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Stringsinger
Date: 12 May 07 - 03:21 PM

To do a Seeger session and not have any songs that are topical (with the exception of "We Shall Overcome" doesn't represent Pete very well.

I like Springsteen but my opinion (for what it's worth) is that it sounds like a barful of musicians cranking out alcoholic renditions of folk songs. I like Springsteen better as a rock singer.

Frank

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: John Hardly
Date: 12 May 07 - 06:25 PM

It's fabulous. I'm not a fan of Springsteen. I like bits and pieces of his music, but I wouldn't even buy a CD of his. Except this one. This one has s great spirit of joy and sponteneity to it. Springsteen's rough, strained vocal delivery suddenly sounds good to my ear with some of these folk songs that were, until this recording, so trite they were embarrassing to perform.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: BanjoRay
Date: 12 May 07 - 06:40 PM

This music has all the sponteneity of the Berlin Philarmonic. It's a bunch of session musicians doing what they're paid to do - professional, technically superb and totally lacking in any real value whatsoever.
Just my opinion.
Ray

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 12 May 07 - 06:45 PM

I really enjoyed this CD and I am looking forward to the live CD and DVD about to be released (although curiously the group is billed on the new release simply as "The Sessions Band". Curious.)

I think it was a conscious decicion, and a wise decision, not to do any of Pete's topical (or original) songs.   What Springsteen "got" was the fact that Pete Seeger has spent his career teaching others that the idea of "folk" music is to make it yourself. These songs are not museum pieces and should be relevant to the singer.

To say he "isn't a folksinger" misses the point. If you use that definition, Pete Seeger isn't a folksinger either.   Take a look at the songs Pete sang with the Weavers, and Frank - please correct me if I am off base. The interpretations of folk songs such as their version of Mrs. McGrath was certainly different from the way it was sung in Ireland. The Weavers made that song relevant for their audience, and Bruce Springsteen made it relevant for his.

There is no right way or wrong way, and we are all entitled to opinions. I respect that this CD isn't for everyone.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 12 May 07 - 08:33 PM

It was certainly better than "Rogue's Gallery".

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Phillip
Date: 13 May 07 - 02:51 AM

What I meant by Bruce Springsteen "isn't a folksinger" was not that he is not part of some oral tradition and so is not credible, or something "authenticist" like that. I have no problem with that all.

What I meant was that this is something he does really poorly compared to the rest of his repertory. He can do lots of things well, but he can't do all the things he attempts - the awful falsetto on "Lift Me Up" for example, or the quasi-street demonstration of the live version of "57 Channels." And for me this is his worst album since, oh, Devils and Dust.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Sooz
Date: 13 May 07 - 03:53 AM

I'm with John Hardly on this one.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Phillip
Date: 13 May 07 - 04:44 AM

It's interesting, this. People seem to think one thing or the other, with no one really saying "Well, it's okay, I don't mind it."

It's exactly the same on Springsteen boards such as the StonePony London. And it doesn't split there on lines such as long-term Springsteen fans (such as me) hating it, and more recent fans liking it. Nor does it follow that you like this album if you like folksong generally, or vice versa.

So he must be doing something right!

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Stringsinger
Date: 13 May 07 - 11:06 AM

I'm glad that Springsteen made this recording even if I don't enjoy it that much.

Ron, the semantics get sort of ridiculous when some academics say that Pete Seeger or Bruce Springsteen are not "folk singers". Are they "authentic" "folk singers"? Here we go again.

Compared to the absolute sludge that AM commercial music radio spews, the Springsteen output is welcome.

Still, I think it sounds like a group of barroom musicians stewed and sloppy. If you like that kind of thing, more power to you.

Frank

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 13 May 07 - 12:12 PM

"...with no one really saying "Well, it's okay, I don't mind it."

Now, that's a lame recommendation if I ever heard one.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: GUEST,Dani
Date: 13 May 07 - 12:22 PM

Who says Bruce isn't a 'folk' singer?! My formative music years were spent in Jersey, with his songs as a topical musical backdrop to what was going on in my life, the state, the country. Bruce is absolutely an American folk singer, with lyrics of moving, if sometimes dark, poetry.

Born In The USA?

Glory Days?

anything at all from The Rising album?

I'm glad that he finally got to work on some Pete stuff. I heard great interviews at the time it came out on how people from the band felt about doing this music. Nothing 'pat' about it.

Dani

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 13 May 07 - 03:20 PM

"Are they "authentic" "folk singers"? Here we go again."

Exactly my point! We get wrapped up in trying to define the music and the musician that the power of song is.

I agree, it sounds like barroom singers. But for me, some of the finest music I've head comes out of barooms and pubs.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: GUEST,Tunesmith
Date: 13 May 07 - 04:32 PM

One problem with barroom sessions is that may sound great at the time - aided with drink and good company, but may not sound so good the following day coming out of your cd player!

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 13 May 07 - 05:15 PM

Good point!!! But for that moment, the music is alive and performing a function. Participation makes the music a living tradition.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 13 May 07 - 05:20 PM

Ron-
Are you implying that some booze should be sold with the CD? Or maybe before you buy it? Or that its distribution should be limited to those performing on it?

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 13 May 07 - 07:28 PM

I don't think I implied that. Nor would I imply that you need to be drunk to listen to field recordings to understand them.   

If you look at a collection of drinking songs, I think seeing them in the context that they were used gives one a better understanding. Same as sea chanties or any other type of work song.   Everything in context.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: GUEST,Art Thieme
Date: 13 May 07 - 09:46 PM

Again, we have a difference of opinion!

So be it.

Mine, for what it's worth, is that folk music, mainly, is not what many of you think it is.


Art

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: jaze
Date: 13 May 07 - 09:50 PM

I think it sounds good each time I hear it. Like someone said above, he couched the folk songs in new clothing that may help keep them alive for a new generation. Isn't that what folk music does? Keeps it going for new listeners. Some of the songs I thought were trite before, but now appreciate them because of these versions. I love his Shenandoah, Eyes on the Prize is one of my favorites, and Jacobs Ladder has me clapping every time. Say what you will, but I love it.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Derby Ram
Date: 14 May 07 - 10:03 AM

Arh, me anorl....

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: GUEST,Wayne
Date: 14 May 07 - 10:21 AM

Too safe and too many obvious choices. Nicely done but a missed opportunity.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: PoppaGator
Date: 14 May 07 - 11:30 AM

I haven't bought or even heard the CD, but I did hear Bruce and this band perform the entire album live at last year's (2006) New Orleans Jazz & Heritage Festival. It was probably the most deeply affecting and absolutely stirring musical performance I've ever witnessed, and most of the thousands of others there that day apparently felt the same way; I've never seen such a huge crowd moved, almost unanimously, to tears. ("How Can a Poor Man Face Such Times and Live" was the climactic set-closer, with updated lyrics to reflect our recent experience. I assume this is on the album?)

The songs and their delivery were certainly "political," in the tradition of Pete Seeger, insofar as they explored the fate of human indidivuals in the face of public stupidity, greed, and injustice.

This performance occurred only shortly after the recording had been released, and there was a Mudcat thread at the time* (almost exactly one year ago) where responses were generally much more positive than these here. Maybe people who were more acutely aware of the project, of Bruce, and of the Katrina fiasco ~ those ready to discuss it in the spring of 2006 rather than a year after the fact ~ may have been more predisposed to enjoy and understand the music than folks who just happened to stumble across it at this late date.

(*Jaze, I'm surprised you didn't find it. Maybe the forum-search function still isn't working as well as it did before the Great Crash.)

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: ClaireBear
Date: 14 May 07 - 12:38 PM

Here's a link to the original thread.

Count me among the lovers of this CD -- and my musical partner, whose taste is almost always the same as mine, as one of the haters. I don't know why, but it does seem to be a polarizing opus.

Cheers,
Claire

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Greg B
Date: 14 May 07 - 03:13 PM

I like it more every time I hear it--- the differences in
presentation were at first a bit grating. But then I started
to appreciate it for what it was---

---Oh, it isn't 'Bruce Springsteen apes Pete Seeger' but rather
Bruce Springsteen puts together an off-beat collection of musicians
who collectively make some of Seeger's (et. al.) music their own.

I like the Pogues, too. Took me a lot longer to like them than it
did the Seeger Session band, but then again they're more removed
from the way I was used to hearing the material. Same for Flogging
Molly.

And after I'd heard them, 'Morris On' was easy to swallow, then
again I'd heard Steeleye first.

The band reminds me--- only a little--- of Arlo's touring band from
the 80's. Perhaps that's where the inspiration came from.

The album proves once more that Bruce defies categorization--- his is
'good music' regardless of whether it's tapping rock, folk,
blues, or jazz roots, or all mixed up.

I wonder what people would have said if he'd just re-done a bunch
of the same material with the 'E Street Band?' Would they have
liked it better because it was more of a departure, or less because
it was too much.

Anyway, the album is just fun listening; I'm glad he did it.

My septuagenarian folkie parents like it too.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: PoppaGator
Date: 14 May 07 - 04:01 PM

ClaireBear, thanks for the link.

I went back to last years's thread and learned, among other things, that "How Can a Poor Man...", which was such a highlight of the live show in New Orleans, seems not to be on the album at all. (Didn't see it on a listing provided in that thread.)

I'm a New Orleanian by choice, and have lived here for about two-thirds of my 59-year lifespan, but I'm a New Jerseyan by birth and upbringing, and spent two weeks of almost every summer of my childhood and teen years "Down The Shore" in Bruce's home turf of Monmouth and Ocean Counties. So, I feel a special attachment to The Boss.

Maybe it's time I bought my own copies of the Seeger Sessions audio and video disks; the memories of last year's live event are not going to last forever. At the very least, I'll rent the DVD from Netflix.

I recently rented two "Born to Run" DVDs ~ one of the Hammersmith Odeon concert from the tour promoting that great album way back when, and the other a behind-the-scenes docmentary on "making-of" the album, with interesting stuff about changing personnel at the time, etc. I'd recommend both to fans of Bruce.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Gulliver
Date: 14 May 07 - 04:09 PM

I liked this music a lot, and it rekindled my interest in Pete Seeger and similar artists and their work--as it did to a lot of others, according to what I heard on the radio.

The forum search thing is not working very well--two weeks ago I had a lot of trouble finding threads that I knew were there, but the search function didn't find them.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: jaze
Date: 14 May 07 - 09:47 PM

Thanks for that link ,ClaireBear

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Big Mick
Date: 14 May 07 - 11:21 PM

Nice idea, glad he did it, but he could have done it better. I think I am close to Frank on this one. I am not unhappy that I bought the CD, but it isn't in the player very often. There are better renditions. Having said that, I admire Bruce for using his star power to call attention to the music we love and to one of the great folk/topical singers of all time.

Mick

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Phillip
Date: 15 May 07 - 11:54 AM

There are some excellent performances from the tour on youtube. Search for Light of Mine, for example - and then after watching Bruce follow the link to the strange gospel performance by King Louis Narcisse.

(I know I said I didn't like it - but that's the album. And I don't like it! Bruce Springsteen live is a different kettle of fish.)

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 15 May 07 - 12:25 PM

"There are better renditions"

The thing to say is that there are different renditions that might be more appealing to the individual. Taste is subjective. I find the renditions to be very strong on the Springsteen CD.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Songster Bob
Date: 15 May 07 - 01:21 PM

I'm another in Big Mick's house on this one -- a missed opportunity, but kind of fun at the same time. It's fun to listen to, but won't be in "rotation" (other than when the IPOD randomly hits it).

In particular, I noted the tendency that I see in most of the Boss' rock albums. EVERY CUT IS AN ANTHEM! Think about it. Every song is a power song, be it a ballad or a hard-charging call to action. There's little change of pace, little subtlety.

For an album with those qualities, I much prefer Dave Alvin's album of a few years ago, "Public Domain." That one has some real programming to it, and has a few gems that aren't overdone, too. I recommend it to those who want to see what a rocker can do with roots music.

Bob

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 15 May 07 - 02:39 PM

Ron Olesko-

"The thing to say is that there are different renditions that might be more appealing to the individual. Taste is subjective. "

Well, there goes the whole concept of criticism.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 15 May 07 - 02:44 PM

Not at all Dick. That actually defines criticism.

It is just that criticism is subjective and should be understood as such. None of us speak for everyone, or even a majority.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 15 May 07 - 02:51 PM

Sorry, but I can't believe that excellence (or awfulness or mediocrity) are wholly subjective.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 15 May 07 - 02:58 PM

That in itself is subjective.

I don't wish to get into semantics, but for two people to have opposite opinions on something does not make either person right or wrong.   If there were a "correct" way of determining excellence, why would we have crap?

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Greg B
Date: 15 May 07 - 03:20 PM

Bob, you're right--- nearly every cut is turned up to '11' (mixed
metaphor, that).

In terms of better renditions:

I don't think that there is any 'better rendition' of John Henry
anywhere, by anyone.

Some renditions of 'Oh Mary Don't You Weep' are probably equal
(I'm thinking maybe Preservation Hall Jazz Band, or Trini Lopez)
but none are better.

That's pretty good for a single album/CD.

Greg

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: John Hardly
Date: 15 May 07 - 06:38 PM

If you mean what I think you mean by "better renditions", then I would have to say -- not possible by Springsteen. His voice is wholey unsuitable to that kind of "better". His voice is as raw as this recording, and this recording is a jubilant celebration of what many see as Springsteen's strength, but many see as his weakness.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Big Mick
Date: 15 May 07 - 11:23 PM

Ron, last time I checked, that was my opinion. I am entitled to such. You are welcome to a different opinion, but if I need advice on what the best thing to say is, I will surely ask for it.

Thanks,

Mick

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: glauber
Date: 16 May 07 - 12:41 AM

Hey, i liked this CD!

Sure, it has nothing to do with Seeger -- it all sounds "New Orleans" to me -- but hey, the songs are good, and Bruce sings his little heart out.

It could be worse! :)

Good CD to play in the car loud, and sing along.

My opinion, of course. I also like Pete Seeger a lot. Totally different styles, but plenty of heart in either case.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 16 May 07 - 01:10 PM

Sorry Mick, but when you make definitive statements such as "there are better renditions" it does not come across as an opinion.

Secondly, I was stating my opinion and not correcting yours.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Little Hawk
Date: 16 May 07 - 01:25 PM

Yeah? Well, what if you're both wrong? ;-)

'If there were a "correct" way of determining excellence, why would we have crap?'   

So that people would have something to bitch about...

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: WFDU - Ron Olesko
Date: 16 May 07 - 04:51 PM

I'd like to apologize to Big Mick and to Dick Greenhaus if either of you felt that my earlier comments were attacking you for having an opinion. I highly respect both of you. I do get upset when I see people making "definitive" statements instead of stating opinions, but in re-reading the posts I don't think either of you meant to do that.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Pete_Standing
Date: 16 May 07 - 05:43 PM

I like it. I get the impression that he sings with conviction and that the musicians are responding in kind. I've seen the DVD of the session. OK, we have a bunch of session musicians, but they seem to be having a wail of a time rather than going through the motions and then picking up the fee.

I hope it is just the beginning of his exploration into thingy type of music.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Big Mick
Date: 16 May 07 - 10:34 PM

No sweat, Ron. As I said, I am glad I bought it. I just was mildly disappointed in the end result. I was so hoping for more.

All the best,

Mick

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: Stringsinger
Date: 17 May 07 - 05:31 PM

I liked it better when the Boss was born in the USA.

Subject: RE: Review: Bruce Springsteen-The Seeger Sessions
From: John Hardly
Date: 17 May 07 - 05:41 PM

Mick,

You are no longer entitled to an opinion. This notice has come down from the top. I am sorry.

John