BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 03 Jun 08 - 01:54 PM

I thought we were talking about a new planet :)

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: ard mhacha
Date: 03 Jun 08 - 02:18 PM

Arran, go and read your bible and relax, nothing can change the result Steve McQueen a winner in France and Robbie Wilson`s comment on this Thread by far outstrips all.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Den
Date: 03 Jun 08 - 04:04 PM

Who's yer man talking to now. Oh hold on, if it makes you feel better Arran:
I'm sorry (i'm sorry)
so sorry (so sorry)
for treating you the way i did
(i didn't mean to hurt you baby)
i'm sorry (i'm sorry)
so sorry (so sorry)
for leaving you the way i did.

There now feel better?

What a simplistic view of history you have Teribus. Englishman = Hero.
Irishman = prat.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: GUEST,Gulliver in the sun
Date: 03 Jun 08 - 04:22 PM

Oooops, look like I stumbled into the wrong thread--I thought this was about the film Hunger!   Silly me...

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Teribus
Date: 03 Jun 08 - 04:55 PM

"Dresden was a cultural landmark of little or no military significance, the attacks were indiscriminate and not proportional for the commensurate military gains." - An urban myth

Dresden bomber twice before in August 1944 by the USAAF target oil processing plant, again in October 1944 by the USAAF target railway yards.

Briefing Notes for the raids of night of the 13th carried out by RAF Bomber Command and the daylight raid of the 14th Feruary 1945 carried out by the 8th USAAF:

"Administrative staffs and refugees are fleeing from Berlin towards Central Germany which they consider is the only safe area left, and the object of the attack is to so disrupt organisation and transport as to create chaos and so bring about the collapse of the enemy's war machine"

The city of Dresden housed 127 factories all turning out material for the German war effort and it had been designated a strongpoint in the defensive line along the river Elbe to be defended at all costs.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: GUEST,G
Date: 03 Jun 08 - 05:21 PM

Was there any Palestinians or Irish in Dresden Teribus ? Three wipes would have been better than one eh ?

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 03 Jun 08 - 05:52 PM

Den, you asked for my sources for
"You could have pointed out that the strike was opposed by PIRA outside prison."
I have books too. Also this
http://cain.ulst.ac.uk/events/hstrike/chronology.htm
It later became clear that the IRA leadership outside the prison was not in favour of a new hunger strike following the outcome of the 1980 strike. The main impetus came from the prisoners themselves.

Re. the SDLP man deciding to withdraw his nomination, my speculation is as valid as yours, and more than plausible.

Re.
"Further more. I voted for Sinn Fein, does that make me something other than "an ordinary decent Nationalist", and if so, what exactly because I've always thought of myself as one."
The majority of Nationalists did refuse to vote Sinn Fein before the cease fire. Were they not ordinary decent folk too.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Teribus
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 01:42 AM

"What a simplistic view of history you have Teribus. Englishman = Hero.
Irishman = prat." - Den

Not exactly Den, more like this:

Commander of a properly constitiuted and authorised armed force in time of war undertaking an extremely difficult task successfully against one of the most evil organisations the civilised world has ever known = Hero

Mediocre terrorist (according to your own view of his performance Den) ineffective member of a non-representative group, operating without mandate on behalf on no-one other than themselves, engaged in the murder of their own countrymen = Prat.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: GUEST,Em
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 03:44 AM

Thanks for the YouTube link Teribus. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RQRzNuaW0yE

I agree, very moving indeed.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: ard mhacha
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 04:20 AM

And the winner is `HUNGER` and no amount of sour-grapes can change that, reading some of the vitriol on this Thread it has really got under their skin, not forgetting Robbie Wilson`s words of wisdom, the winner on this Thread.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 05:04 AM

I am sure it is well produced and performed to earn such acclaim.
I look forward to seeing it.
Has anyone read any critique of the film that examines its historical authenticity?

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 05:30 AM

surely being 'only a mediocre terrorist' is better than being a really good one. not as good a neighbour as 'not being a terrorist at all', but definitely a step in the right direction.

I'm not sure I'd agree with your assessment though. Our local MP went to plead with Sands when he was killing himself. The kind of resolve he showed scared me - a bit like these suicide bombers, and 9/11. To know that there was someone who hated your country so much and was indifferent to the murders that would come in the wake of what he was doing.

That sort of moral certainty is scary.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 05:37 AM

A couple of reviews here.
I think I might give the film a miss.
Hardly a good night out.
http://film.guardian.co.uk/cannes2008/story/0,,2280448,00.html
http://www.emanuellevy.com/article.php?articleID=9951

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 06:16 AM

I have read a lot of reports about the film and it does appear to have been well researched. My post on 3 June 10.42am mentions this and the following is taken from the link below.

McQueen, who had never written a script before, described the research process of speaking with ex-prisoners, prison officers and priests who had visited the Maze as "probably the heaviest experience of my life emotionally".

research

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: GUEST,Stafford
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 07:02 AM

As far as I know Britain crossed the Irish sea and stripped Ireland of it's assets and sailed off. Then came back and occupied it's lands. I can understand why the Irish were a little pissed about it.

Personally I think we should address our error and get out of Ireland. So many of you seem to think the occupation is justified and because the Irish fought the invaders they should be looked upon as terrorists!

Bob Sands was probably hammered all his life because he was born into the catholic church and rebelled against the lack of human rights in Ireland around that time. Was he wrong to do so ?

What we did in Ireland over the centuries was wrong. Killing people because of their faith was wrong, stealing their lands and properties was wrong. Locking guys up before a court made judgement on them was wrong. Causing untold pain and suffering on men, women and children was wrong.

This film is about one man who suffered injustice at the hands of the British and because of the exposure we frown on anyone prepared to make a film about our shame and embarrassment.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 07:40 AM

As far as I know, there were no assets to strip.
Conquest was what all nations did back in the Dark Ages.
Now, we have votes.
There was no popular movement for home rule before 1916.
There is still not quite a majority in the North.
Try and stick to the subject Stafford. Some contributors get very cross else.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: GUEST,Stafford
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 08:26 AM

Thank you. The British government sanctioned the taking of Land in Ireland. An organised government didn't exist in the "Dark Ages" though. I was keeping to the subject, this film is about one man and his protest against the British.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: GUEST,Keith A
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 08:57 AM

How many centuries ago are we talking then??
His protest was against being refused special status in prison.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Big Mick
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 09:03 AM

No assets to strip? Keith, just when I thought you might be at least reasonable, you throw this out. Ever hear of Irish Oak? Not recently because it was stripped and sent to make English and European furniture. Do you not consider land an asset? It was stripped from the hands of the Irish, and given to transplanted peoples. How about homes? Were these assets? The ones that were taken from families who had lived in them for centuries, and then razed to make way for cattle to graze. How about Arranmore? You may of heard of the place. It is where the people who had lived there for centuries were evicted to make way for the plantation lords to graze cattle. Here is the paragraph from the linked article:

The Irish potato blight had started in 1845 and decimated the country over the next three years. Absentee landlords shipped the few crops grown in the poor soils to the most lucrative markets, and farmers who had worked the same plot for generations, still using their great grandfathers' spade and hoe, were evicted if they could not pay their rent. Without the potato crop, there simply was no money. Plunged into misery, the gaunt people of Arranmore were reduced to eating seaweed. In 1847, after half had been evicted by a landowner they'd never seen because they had no documents to prove they'd ever paid rent, the Society of Friends sent 2 coffin ships to bring many of them to America.

Your attempt to whitewash centuries of repression, discrimination, and usurpation of rights and property does not speak well. Debate on the film is fine. But your denial of factual history, and your attempt to mitigate the guilt of the English government is beyond comprehension.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 09:18 AM

I know.
All those things happened to English, Scottish and Welch folk too.
No reason to murder someone today though.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 09:25 AM

I do not think that furniture making could destroy a forest Mick.
Read here about what really happened.
http://www.irishoakforests.com/munster.htm

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 09:41 AM

"Your attempt to whitewash centuries of repression, discrimination, and usurpation of rights and property does not speak well. Debate on the film is fine. But your denial of factual history, and your attempt to mitigate the guilt of the English government is beyond comprehension. "
Sorry Mick.
I missed this bit at the end of your post.
All nations did things in history that would not be acceptable today.
Britain was no worse than others, and better than most.
Your country, Mick, was stealing land from Mexico in much more recent times.
You have to move on Mick, and ask the people of today what they want.
What you must never do today is force things on a people that those people do not want.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: ard mhacha
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 10:12 AM

Weelittledrummer, Down through the ages the unswerving stupidity of the Charge of the Light Brigade was also `scary` as was the brave spitfire pilots in WW2, those servicemen and countless others were no different to the IRA volunteers, all brave men,but willing to sacrifice their lives for their country.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Teribus
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 10:33 AM

"surely being 'only a mediocre terrorist' is better than being a really good one. not as good a neighbour as 'not being a terrorist at all', but definitely a step in the right direction." - WLD

Excellent point Big Al - very well put.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Den
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 10:42 AM

Re. the SDLP man deciding to withdraw his nomination, my speculation is as valid as yours, and more than plausible.

Its still only speculation and completely in keeping with your bias and as it happens completely untrue. I tend to rely on the facts. You see the difference between you and I Keith is that, as far as I know you have never set foot in N.I. I on the other hand lived through the period in question every hour of every day. Now back to the point you made about the SDLP rep. withdrawing his nomination because he feared for his life and the lives of his family. The particular seat that Bobby Sands took was MP for Fermanagh- South Tyrone. The incumbent was a man by the name of Frank Maguire who past away after a lenghty illness.

There was infighting amongst the SDLP party as to who would replace Mr Maguire. The party's support was split between two candidates, Austin Currie and Frank McGuire's brother Noel. Who by all accounts was a fairly inexperienced politician. Currie had stood in 1979 against Unionist leader Harry West without the endorsement of the party and lost the election. Currie's self serving attitude in 1979 forced the party leadership to temporarily remove him from his executive position, though he was by 1981 reinstated. It was the fear of being ostracised for good, should he repeat that performance that forced Currie to swallow a bitter pill, when the party executive decided to overturn the local selection convention and not to contest the election.

Step up Noel McGuire and Fr Joe McVeigh. I'll leave Father McVeigh to end the "speculation" in his own words.

"Shortly after hearing about the second hunger strike, I opened the New York Times and read about the sudden death of Frank Maguire, MP for Fermanagh- South Tyrone. His death came as a great shock to me. We had been very close friends. I did not realise he had been so ill.

Not too long after his funeral, I heard a report that there was a move to enter Bobby Sands in the by-election against the unionist candidate, Harry West. I thought this was a brilliant idea. There were other nationalist candidates going forward but I knew that for Bobby to have a chance there had to be a straight fight with West. All that was required was for the SDLP to withdraw and for Noel Maguire, a brother of Frank, to withdraw and support the Sands campaign.

When I got confirmation that Bobby Sands was entering the election I phoned Noel Maguire and said that I thought he should consider making way for him. Noel took his own counsel and eventually decided to withdraw from the contest leaving a straight fight between Bobby Sands and Harry West.

There was a solid republican vote in this constituency. There was hope that Bobby Sands would win the election, bringing world attention to his situation and the intolerable conditions in Long Kesh prison and the British government would be forced to come to a deal."

From the Irish Democrat.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Den
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 10:47 AM

Teribus, if you want to talk terrorists why don't you tell us about the MRF? After all the predated Bobby Sands by a few years.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: GUEST,G
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 10:52 AM

British Mudcatters = Cultural and religious intolerance.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Den
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 10:59 AM

Guest G, I think its unfair to tar all British Mudcatters with the same brush. There are certain British Mudcatters who are thankfully open minded enough to reason for themselves.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Teribus
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 11:11 AM

RE: "Cultural and religious intolerance"

Now who exactly was it that came out with this? Somebody or others Cultural Attache?

"YET AGAIN TERIBUS YOU EXPOSE YOURSELF AS THE ULTIMATE ASREHOLE OF MUDCAT."

Although I must admit, it that had been from a Brit I would have expected them to be able to spell.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: goatfell
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 11:15 AM

ard mhacha,

you don't even know me, and I thought that being either protestant/catholic the Bible was a part of your religion and God, ard mhacha, you don't even has the decincy to say your sorry, I have said I'm sorry many times, but then I have grown up and be adult about this unlike you and yer pal Den who are both wee school chidren small mined and have tunnel vision, no only that but yo and yer pal Den are just back stabbing, two faced simple minded tunnel vision people that can't see the whole picture and see that there is trouble on both sides.

so away and play with yer pals the the republican movement in Northern Ireland along with Den.

Oh and before I go I support the Republican movement but I don't support the terrorists, unlike the ones the vote for Sinn Fein IRA because they support terrorists.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: goatfell
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 11:20 AM

I beivieve that the Scots, Welsh, English and the Northern Irish have the right to home rule, but the difference is that the Scots, Welsh and the English don't fight with Westminster.

but as I have said You have your views and I have mine, So I wonder you ard mhacha and Den both go to Church or else you are just like me a hypocrite.

I know that I am one and freely admit it can you?

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: GUEST,G
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 11:23 AM

Teribus I am as English as you, thank you very much and as capable as you of making a typing error(something your good at might I add). You once told me a funny story about "The Heroes of Waterloo". Why have you changed so much ?

I repeat, TERIBUS YOU EXPOSE YOURSELF AS THE ULTIMATE ARSEHOLE OF MUDCAT."

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: ard mhacha
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 11:28 AM

Arran son, there`s a good boy, it`s time for your strait jacket.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Teribus
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 11:34 AM

"Teribus I am as English as you," Guest G

So not very English at all then!

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: goatfell
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 11:44 AM

ard mhacha,

at lest I have said that i'm sorry but you don't have the guts because you are a coward like Bobby Sands and he was a coward because he left his two friends to the RUC and Bobby Sands ran away like the coward that he was.

but there you go you can't even face the truth but then again you do vote for people the believe in muder or if you don't then you are a hypocrite, an Northern Irish Catholic hypocrite like all the Celtic supporters,

ard mhacha and yer Pal Den GET A LIFE BOTH OF YOU, or is this case where you throw insults at people that don't agree with you all mouth and no action.

well you'll be glad to know that I can say if I think I'm sorry then I'll say it but if not I won't

GET A LIFE AND BLOODY GROW UP THE PAIR OF YOU SIMPLE MINDED (DAFT) PEOPLE ard mhacha and Den.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: goatfell
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 11:49 AM

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: goatfell
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 11:52 AM

This me again getting angry becase of a dickhead who can't say that arran you're right/wrong.

I'm sorry about that but I do take thing like this personally because one of my family was killed by the IRA while I lived in Belfast for a wee while and it just makes me angry that's all.

so I'm sorry ok.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: GUEST,+
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 12:03 PM

Arran, did Teribus ever buy you presents at Christmas ? Did your mother ever speak about him? Sorry, just I can see a striking resemblance.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 12:16 PM

Den,
I admit to being surprised that the SDLP would go out of their way to help a convicted IRA man get elected, but I am happy to withdraw.
I only offered it as a speculation anyway.

My one statement of fact that you specifically challenged was that the hunger strike was not supported by IRA leadership outside.
As you have fallen silent on that issue I take it that you now concede, irrespective of where you used to live, that you were completely wrong and I was right.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 12:27 PM

I don't know about anyone else, but I get very uncomfortable with these conversations when they descend to abuse.

Calling each other 'daft' and 'arseholes' and the like.

We obviously hold different shades of opinion, but lets try and keep it civilised.

And this in a way is an answer to your question, Ard.


My father fought with the Irish Guards in the last war driving a tank. When I was a young idiot, I took him to task for wearing the Kings uniform and killing people he didn't even know. He said to me , Of course I killed people that was what we were there for.

I asked him what was morally different about the people who had killed people in the camps over in Germany - some of which he was there for the liberation of. He simply said, it was different, and if you had been commanded to do those things, a civilised person would have let them kill you first.

After the war, he resumed his job as a detective on the Boston police force. In those days, if they caught murderers - they hanged them. In my young idiot role, I asked him - how could you let yourself be part of that?

He said, Yes I tried to stop people who needed stopping, but if they ever ask ME to hang someone, that's the day I tell them to stuff their job.

I believe there is a dicernible difference. I thank God, I've never had to discern it.

Starving yourself to death in the full knowledge that your death will trigger reprisal murders and counter reprisals...... it makes me shudder, and I wish Bobby Sands was at home now enjoying his middle years.

I'm not even anti IRA. I thought the guys who drove a van and did a rocket attack on Downing Street were really brave. I know my relatives were involved in the organisation sometime in the 1930's.

But no, I don't approve of what Bobby Sands did. I'm not sure what the 1970's/80's campaign achieved. I feel pretty bloody sure that all the democratic processes had not been exhausted before unleashing the terror.

Most Irish people would be astonished at the the average English person's ignorance of, and indifference to their politics.

We weren't aware of your grievances, and the democratic structure and free press existed to put things right. Putting bombs in our cities and killing our young soldiers just closed peoples ears.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Den
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 02:50 PM

Hold on Keith where did I specifically challenge that the hunger strike was not supported by IRA leadership outside?

I merely asked for your sources. Any other reading into my request is your interpretation.

I'd stay clear of the speculation Keith, the damage you wished to inflict has somewhat backfired on you.

I'm still waiting to hear about the MRF, any takers.

As I said somewhere up there I would like it if the film focussed on the events that shaped the life of Bobby Sands. Life doesn't happen in a vacumn. I don't think that anyone wakes up in the morning and decides to suddenly take up a path that they know could eventually lead to their untimely death. What made Sands do the things he did? What shaped his beliefs? I think that Bobby Sands and a number of other young men got tired of the oppression and decided to do something about it. There are only so many times you can kick a dog before the dog bites back.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 03:21 PM

the trouble was - he was biting Thatcher, who (rather like some other people) was certain she was right.

moral certainty = scary people

she simply didn't give a rat's rectum about the rights and wrongs. he provided her with another chance to play Winston hurchill - a sort of warm up for the falklands and the Miners strike.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 04:15 PM

Den, you demanded my sources.
When I asked what for specifically you said,
"Yeah this for a start,"You could have pointed out that the strike was opposed by PIRA outside prison." "

Den, no one reading that would doubt that you were challenging the truth of it, and you lose dignity by denying it.

Re the MRF, why would we be discussing that in this thread?
Start a new one if you must.
We must not go off topic must we.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 04:25 PM

WLD, did your dad drive his tank over the canal bridge on the road to Nijmagen?
The Irish Guards crossed it knowing it to be rigged for demolition.
In the film A Bridge Too Far it was supposed to have been cleared by Americans just in time.
But it was not.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 05:14 PM

Den, here is another perspective on the decision by Noel Maguire to withdraw.
It comes from an interview with Pat McGeown (OC of H Block 6 and one of the strike organisers) in 1985.

"(Maguire) asserted his intention to stand right up until the hour before nominations closed. Sinn Fein members were standing by to withdraw Sands' papers if Maguire went ahead.
A visit by Adams and O'Connail (IRA Army Council member) and ....
the Sands family finally persuaded him against it."

I am sure it did.
Most people would be "persuaded"

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 06:43 PM

He was fighting in that area. he arrived two days after D-day somewhere in Caen area. and he fought through France, Holland, and Germany of course. he wasn't actually part of th Arnhem thing, but he said that the fighting was very fierce and units were getting cut off and trapped behind enemy lines like that all the time.

A Bridge Too Far was about the only war film he ever went to see. But he said although it captured some of the recklessness, it missed the relentlessness of people you knew being killed all around you every day. And of course the smell of dead people which was apparently everywhere.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: GUEST,Resolve
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 07:08 PM

Who would have thought that 25 years later the same army would be driving armoured personal carriers through the streets of a UK city and firing gas and plastic bullets at unarmed British citizens resulting in several deaths.

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Jean(eanjay)
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 07:35 PM

interesting link

Apparently as well as being shown in selected cinemas the film will be shown on channel 4 later this year.

Subject: RE:After the War
From: GUEST,warhatchet
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 08:05 PM

Mack do you know where I might find a copy of After the War by Tim Irvine if so please e-mail me at [e-mail] thank you

Subject: RE: BS: Bobby Sands hunger strike film
From: Teribus
Date: 04 Jun 08 - 08:36 PM

Bobby Sands hunger stike Film "Hunger" - All this prat managed to achieve was possibly "weight watcher or of the year 1985" absolutely nothing else.

Now let's face it exactly what did he starve himself to death for?

United Ireland - Not achieved

A Police Force that was predominantly Catholic or Republican - Not achieved.

A commitment from the Government of the UK that Ireland will be a single united country - Not achieved

Can any of you tell me what this man achieved apart from writing songs with lyrics that were entirely spurious, historically incorrect and intended to inflame a bad situation with the sole intent of making it worse.

Now all that is bad enough but these were the people he was supposed to have been protecting.

Protecting, Jesus "H" come dancing Christ Bobby Sands and his colleqagues killed 3500+ Irishmen, Women and Children and injured and maimed about 30,000 more - For What???

Absolutely Nothing - Hey boys that is what this prat died for absolutely nothing. And that is how history will record his so called sacrifice - It was made for nothing.

Oh Yes "I wish I was back Home In Fuckin' Derry" - Hey all you so called Folkies take a bloody good look at those lyrics - lets hear you give them some sort of credance based on history taking into account that they sing of something that was supposed to have happened in 1803 but was written about in the 1970's - Bobby Sands contribution should have been based upon historical accuracy, particularly as it should have based upon 20 X 20 hindsight - But there again, as with all things Irish - Why let the truth get in the way of a good story.