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Lyr Req/Add: Collier Lad (Johnny Handle)

Arnie 12 Jun 07 - 04:01 PM
Peace 12 Jun 07 - 04:19 PM
Joe Offer 12 Jun 07 - 04:49 PM
Peace 12 Jun 07 - 05:04 PM
Peace 12 Jun 07 - 05:16 PM
Peace 12 Jun 07 - 05:27 PM
nutty 12 Jun 07 - 05:28 PM
Peace 12 Jun 07 - 05:32 PM
nutty 12 Jun 07 - 05:43 PM
nutty 12 Jun 07 - 05:53 PM
Peace 12 Jun 07 - 05:58 PM
Mick Pearce (MCP) 12 Jun 07 - 06:01 PM
Peace 12 Jun 07 - 06:11 PM
Dave Sutherland 12 Jun 07 - 06:14 PM
Peace 12 Jun 07 - 06:16 PM
Mick Pearce (MCP) 12 Jun 07 - 06:29 PM
Joe Offer 12 Jun 07 - 06:44 PM
Mick Pearce (MCP) 12 Jun 07 - 07:19 PM
Dave Sutherland 13 Jun 07 - 03:31 AM
Mick Pearce (MCP) 13 Jun 07 - 04:14 AM
nutty 13 Jun 07 - 05:27 AM
Joe Offer 13 Jun 07 - 05:35 AM
GUEST,edthefolkie 13 Jun 07 - 06:44 AM
Arnie 13 Jun 07 - 05:10 PM
GUEST 31 Dec 15 - 02:59 AM
Dave Sutherland 31 Dec 15 - 03:39 AM
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Subject: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Arnie
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 04:01 PM

A friend of mine wants the words of a Geordie song that I used to sing in a band years ago. Unfortunately I've forgotten most of the lyrics and I can't find the song in any database. I recall the chorus, which went;

"Oh the collier lad is a bonny lad
And he's allus of good cheer
For he knaws how to work
And he knaws how to shirk
And he knaws how to drink good beer"

Can anyone help with the verses??


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Peace
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 04:19 PM

The collier lad, he's a canny lad,
And he's always of good chear
And he knaas how to work,
And he knaas how to shork
An' he knaas how to sup good beer.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Joe Offer
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 04:49 PM

I found the same fragment Peace posted, at http://www.muthergrumble.co.uk/issue03/mg0305.htm. Singers were Jack Elliott of Birtley and Johnny (Johnnie) Handle.

A search for collier lad in the Roud Index comes up with lots of songs, but as far as I can tell, not this one.
-Joe-


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Peace
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:04 PM

Sorry. That's the same site I found the stanza on. I can't locate anything else either.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Peace
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:16 PM

A google of

chear, work, shork

provides ONLY that one site. We gotta go at this from another angle.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Peace
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:27 PM

I have sent a message to Malcolm D. I hope he visits this thread because of that.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: nutty
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:28 PM

This has been recorded by Johnny Handle, Still trying to find the words.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Peace
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:32 PM

Is it called "The Collier Laddie"?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: nutty
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:43 PM

No -- thats a different song. It is possible that Johnny Handle may have written The Collier Lad.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: nutty
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:53 PM

Sound sample can be found -

HERE

You can also download the full track (for a fee)....... scroll down to track 206


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Peace
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 05:58 PM

Digging around and found this which is a gold mine of coal mining songs.
Here.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 06:01 PM

I'll put the words up in a little while.

Mick


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Peace
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 06:11 PM

YAAAAAAAAY, Mike.


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Subject: ADD: Collier Lad
From: Dave Sutherland
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 06:14 PM

Without apologies to the man who does not like songs written in dialect.

Collier Lad
(Johnny Handle)

It's doon the shaft on a Monday morn an the kavils is the best,
In the Busty seam with Thompson's team in a flat caaled the fowerteenth west,
The fyece is a hundred and five yards lang when measured from neuk te neuk,
An while crawlin ower the scuflins lads keep doon or yer boond te get stuck.
    For the collier lad he's a canny lad an he's always of gud cheor,
    An he knaas how te work, an he knaas how te shork,
    An he knaas how te sup gud beor.

Noo the shots gaan off and the shovels flee and the belt gets loaded full,
And in half an hour a stane gans on an the motors winna pull,
Brokken belt is the cry and we all creep oot te the mothergate it te mend,
Geordie Hall he's deputy on oor flat says we'll drive him rood the bend.

Noo we pull and we strain te fix it again and when its been put straight,
Tim Jones he's secretary of wor lodge says its time that ye had your bait,
So we tek oorselves te a quite spot wi a plank an a chock fer a seat,
An the crack at last flees thick and fast aboot the deeins at the club last neet.

Noo its very hard when yer paid by the yard to tyek lang ower yer bait,
So we crawl back on, get some timberin done for the belt we can hardly wait,
For its twenty six inches high me lads and the work is really grand,
And the fillers pay, fower quid a day, is the best in aall the land.

Written by Johnny Handle in the late fifties.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Peace
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 06:16 PM

DaveS's post should be a LYRIC ADD


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 06:29 PM

Ok - so I won't put the words up in a little while! I have three transcriptions of the song - one in one of my early song folders (maybe from The Collier's Rant LP), one in the insert from the LP Along The Coaly Tyne and one in Lloyd's book Come All Ye Bold Miners. They three differ in orthography, but are all essentially the same as the version given by DaveS above (I chose the version from the insert - it was the easiest to type from, but there's no worth in posting it, orthography aside, it differs only in a few Weys at the start of some lines (and a glossary!) from the version above).

According to the insert it was the first song Johhny Handle wrote about mining.

Mick


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Joe Offer
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 06:44 PM

Gee, Mick, if you've got it typed, please post it. The differences may help us Americans understand Dave's dialect.
There is also a transcription of the lyrics available at Smithsonian Global Sound. I believe they have free, downloadable liner notes for all Folkways albums.
-Joe-


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Subject: Lyr Add: THE COLLIER LAD (Johnny Handle)
From: Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 12 Jun 07 - 07:19 PM

I don't think that's going to happen Joe! All of them are attempts at transcribing the dialect of the North-East of England, especially the mining dialect. I'll post the transcription I typed in, which I think you'll find pretty much the same as above, but I've included the glossary that was with the song, which might help a bit. (The word bait, usually meant the packed lunch that you took to work with you, rather than lunch in general. It was used where I was born and raised - Middlesbrough, about 40 miles South of the Newcastle area. There are different dialect words for this in various parts of Britain).

Mick



THE COLLIER LAD
Johnny Handle

Chorus:
Oh the collier lad he's a canny lad,
Ans he's aalways of good cheor,
And he knaas how te work, and he knaas how te shork,
And he knaas how te sup good beer.


Wey, it's doon the shaft on a Monday morn and the cavil is the best,
In the Busty Seam we' Thompson's team in a flat caaled the fowerteenth west.
Noo the fyece is a hundred and five yards lang when measured from nyeuk te nyeuk,
And when craalin' ower the scufflin's lads, keep doon or your boon' te get stuck.

Wey the shots gan off and the shovels de fly till the belt gets loaded full,
Till in half an hoor a stone gans on and the motor will not pull;
"Brokken belt", is the cry and we aal creep oor te the mothergate it te mend,
Geordie Haal, he's the deppity in wor flat, says, "Ye'll drive iss roond the bend".

So we pull and we strain for te fix it again, and when it's been put straight,
Tim Jones, that's the secretary of wor lodge, says, "It's time that ye had your bait".
So we tyek worsels te a quiet spot, wiv a plank and a chock for a seat,
And the crack, at last, flies thick and fast of the dein's at the club last neet.

But it's varry hard when you're paid by the yard for te tyek lang ower yor bait,
So we craal back on, get some timberin' done, for the belts we can hardly wait.
For it's twenty-six inches high, me lads, and the work is really grand,
And the filler's pay, fower quid a day, it's the best in aal the land.

Source: insert LP: Along The Coaly Tyne

Glossary:
cavil: stint, place of work (usually written as kevil)
Thompson's team: fillers work together in a team to remove coal from the face
flat: district, area underground
nyeuk: end part of the face, a corner (=nook)
scufflin's: small coals left on the floor by the coal cutting machines
shots: explosives to fire down the coals
belt: conveyor belt
mothergate: main feeding tunnel
deppity: official in charge (=deputy)
bait: lunch
plank: halved prop
chock: square block of wood
crack: talk
timbering: setting up props and planks to support the roof after the coal is taken out
shork: =shirk
dein's =doings
fyece: = face
fower: = four


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Dave Sutherland
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 03:31 AM

Sorry about that Mick; got in late last night and didn't see the words
posted so I went for it - then I realised what you had said. As for Lyr Add - don't know what happened there??


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 04:14 AM

Not a problem Dave - like so many queries it had me looking at things I hadn't seen for a long time (Along The Coaly Tyne used to be one of my favourite records), so it wasn't a waste for me.

Mick


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: nutty
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 05:27 AM

Same here Mick ...... I saw the High Level Ranters at the weekend at the Blaydon Races Festival. Apart from looking older, nothing has changed.
It was a great blast from the past.

Nice to see Ray Fisher there as well.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Joe Offer
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 05:35 AM

I put in the ADD notation and spiff up the lyrics, so they're ready for Digital Tradition harvesting.
-Joe-


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: GUEST,edthefolkie
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 06:44 AM

Note that Johnny Handle uses the word "crack" which is used in the North East of England and lowland Scotland (and elsewhere eg Nottingham, probably because of all the Geordie and Scottish miners who moved south in the 1950s.) It means chat, talk, news as in "What's the crack?".

Not flippin' "craic" which always gets on my wick - this appears to have been appropriated by the sort of people who changed loads of Rose and Crown pubs to Molly O'Grady's and installed near freezing nitrokeg porter. Also some marketing man no doubt thought the correct spelling would imply hoodies smoking lethal substances in trashed houses. Why aye the bonnie lads - not!!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req: Collier Lad
From: Arnie
Date: 13 Jun 07 - 05:10 PM

DaveS & Mick and all the other 'Catters who have helped in this great bit of detective work - many thanks! I'll post this to my mate who wishes to start singing it in the West Country - he's originally from Buckie in the north of Scotland so may even know what some of the dialect means!


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Subject: RE: Lyr Req/Add: Collier Lad (Johnny Handle)
From: GUEST
Date: 31 Dec 15 - 02:59 AM

Does anyone know what the lyrics to the stonemans lament, johnny handle are. The starting goes like this: well the colliers off, & the fellas have left the flat, & the deppity comes & asks us what we're at


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Subject: Lyr Add: THE STONEMAN'S SONG (Johnny Handle)
From: Dave Sutherland
Date: 31 Dec 15 - 03:39 AM

The Stoneman's Song.


So the coal is off and the fillers have left the flat,
And the deppity comes and he asks us what we're at.
So we tell 'im and he stems the holes we've drilled,
And the shots gan off and the packs we build,
Doon the Brockwell seam in the north of Number Five West.

Noo we build packs from the stone's that's in the gate,
And we get them neat and tidy weel afore bait,
For there's girders te hump and girders te set,
And side te take off that Aa dare bet,
Doon the Brockwell seam in the north of Number Five West.

Noo the belt it's rolled and set down in a new track,
And we draw oot the chocks while lyin' on wor backs,
And we set them again in their new place, te stop the whitin' on the face,
Doon the Brockwell seam in the north of Number Five West.

And it's Aa'm alreet th' morn for a sup Aa knaa,
For mi marrer's reckoned up that he's won the snaaball draw.
With a housey card and a pint in mi hand,
Aa'll forget all aboot that no-man's land,
Doon the Brockwell seam in the north of Number Five West.



Index.


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