BS: Passchendael victim identified.

Subject: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 08:10 AM

Many unknown dead are found every year.
It is rarer for him to be identified.
He was buried with family present.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6273292.stm

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: skipy
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 08:21 AM

RIP
Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: GUEST,Victor
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 08:45 AM

Watched it on the news. Seemed a bit silly giving someone who died 90 years ago such a send off.

British pomp at it's finest. Pity the British government put a ban on media coverage of funerals of those killed in Iraq, they said it's bad for moral ! Sorry George Bush told them it's bad for moral.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 09:46 AM

"Seemed a bit silly giving someone who died 90 years ago such a send off."
That is a point of view.

"Pity the British government put a ban on media coverage of funerals of those killed in Iraq, they said it's bad for moral"
I think that you are mistaken about that.Where did you get it from?

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Gulliver
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 10:20 AM

My grandfather was at Paschendael, among other theatres of war. He said no country was worth dying for.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: The Walrus
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 12:01 PM

May I be pedantic and point out that Pvt. Lancaster was not one of the dead of Passchendaele, but died in the First Battle of Ypres, trying to arrest the German advace across Belgium, in 1914. The Battle of Passchendaele was part of the Third Battle of Ypres in 1917.

Private Lancaster was a 'regular reservist', and having served time in the regular forces was recalled to the Army in August 1914, during the 'reserve' period of his 12 year enlistment*.

Walrus.

"...At the Going down of the Sun, and in the morning
We WILL remember them..."


* A Soldier generally enlisted for 12 years service, that is a fixed period** in the regular forces and the balance to be served as a reservist, subject to a number of training weekends per year (2 or 3 IIRC) and liable for immediate recall 'to the colours' as required.

** Subject to arm of service, theatre of service and some other factors.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Captain Ginger
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 12:52 PM

Pity the British government put a ban on media coverage of funerals of those killed in Iraq, they said it's bad for moral !
Absolute bollocks. I do wonder what planet some posters live on!

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: GUEST,Capt, Ginger watchdog
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 01:15 PM

Passchendael victim ? has another body been found ? I thought the guy in question was killed at Ypres.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 02:55 PM

Yes, the BBC report seems to be in error about he battle.
Other sources all give PlugStreet, Ypres1.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: gnu
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 03:15 PM

RIP. Lest we forget.

Keith :"Seemed a bit silly giving someone who died 90 years ago such a send off." That is a point of view.

Rather polite of you, Keith. I'da told Victor to fuck off. Pretty low, Vic... pretty low.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Megan L
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 03:41 PM

Victor i can see that some people may find it difficult to understand. I however am the grand daughter of one of the unfound ones all my grandmother recieved was a telegram "Missing presumed dead" from the September 1914 till her own death may 1960) she kept a light in the window every night in the forlorn hope that he had been injured and lost his memory and that some day he would remember and find his way home.

Even after all these years i would love for him to be found, to be able to honour him and to vindicate her trust and love for all those lonely years.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: gnu
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 03:44 PM

Bless you and yours, Megan. Brings tears to my eye. Some do just not understand.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Rog Peek
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 06:42 PM

Good for you Megan, agree with you entirely.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: GUEST,Victor
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 07:27 PM

I understand Megan, it was the uncertainty that your grandmother lived with. (Lord be kind to her).

In the case of remains being found after 90 years, I feel a service at a family plot would have been adequate.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Peace
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 07:51 PM

"
Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Megan L - PM
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 03:41 PM

Victor i can see that some people may find it difficult to understand. I however am the grand daughter of one of the unfound ones all my grandmother recieved was a telegram "Missing presumed dead" from the September 1914 till her own death may 1960) she kept a light in the window every night in the forlorn hope that he had been injured and lost his memory and that some day he would remember and find his way home.

Even after all these years i would love for him to be found, to be able to honour him and to vindicate her trust and love for all those lonely years."

This is one of the most beautiful posts I have ever read on Mudcat. I need some Kleenex.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: artbrooks
Date: 05 Jul 07 - 09:25 PM

He gave his life for his country. Does it really matter how long ago?

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 06 Jul 07 - 04:49 AM

If we keep remembering the horrors of war, hopefully, one day, we'll learn to live without them, in peace.

My great great uncle is somewhere under the soil of Arras. He has nothing but a name in the Vis en Artois Cemetery. He's one of over 9,000 men who fell in the period from 8 August 1918 to the date of the Armistice in the "Advance to Victory" in Picardy and Artois, between the Somme and Loos, and who have no known grave. There are probably another 2,500 graves in that one cemetery alone. 11,500 men killed in a 10km area, in 3 months.

I'd be more than honoured to attend his funeral service, should they ever find identifiable remains. He fared better than 3 other relatives. What's left of them is under the sea, in the twisted and shattered remains of the 3 ships they were sunk on during the Battle of Jutland, 1916.

90 years or 90 days ago, these men who gave their lives should be honoured. You cannot honour a man who died in a war last month and not honour his predecessor who died last century doing the same job.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Captain Ginger
Date: 06 Jul 07 - 06:02 PM

Victor, from the reports I read, his grand-daughters were chuffed to bits by the service that was held. Or maybe you have a closer call on Pte Lancaster's wishes than most.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: skipy
Date: 06 Jul 07 - 06:26 PM

LTS 90 years or 90 nanoseconds, they should be honoured.
I thank them for "my today"
Skipy

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Peace
Date: 06 Jul 07 - 06:31 PM

Good one, skipy. I feel the same way.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 07 Jul 07 - 01:48 AM

Actually, what I should have said was 90 years or 90 days, these men AND WOMEN should be honoured.

LTS

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: open mike
Date: 07 Jul 07 - 03:22 PM

"his grand-daughters were chuffed to bits by the service that was held"
translate please? does that mean they were happy or sad or mad??
what is chuffed? (common language......)

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Zany Mouse
Date: 07 Jul 07 - 03:31 PM

To anyone who doesn't understand the need for the 'pomp': just stand at the Menim Gate at 8pm EVERY night (including Christmas Day) and remain unmoved.

Rhiannon

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Zany Mouse
Date: 07 Jul 07 - 03:32 PM

Chuffed is exceptionally pleased. Sometimes it is said as 'chuffed to little mint balls'!

Rhiannon

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: The Walrus
Date: 07 Jul 07 - 11:57 PM

Zany Mouse posted on 07 Jul 07 - 03:31 PM
"...To anyone who doesn't understand the need for the 'pomp': just stand at the Menim Gate at 8pm EVERY night (including Christmas Day) and remain unmoved..."

For those who have never been to Iepers/Ypres or don't know of the tradition...

Every evening at 8 p.m. local time a section of buglers from the local fire brigade parade at the Menin Gate and sound the "Last Post"*
This tradition has been carried out every evening at this time since the gate was built in the 1920s, with the exception of the period of the German occupation, however, it is said that the last German soldiers weren't out of the town before a bugler was sounding "Last Post" again.
The Menin Gate is the memorial to the men lost in the Ypres salient who have no known grave.

Tom (Walrus)


* The American equivalent is "Taps"

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 08 Jul 07 - 02:57 AM

A greater demonstration of respect and gratitude you will never see. God bless them, and God bless Pte. Lancaster.
RIP

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 08 Jul 07 - 03:40 PM

Pomp from the pompiers!
There are usually numbers of school parties there.
Mostly teenagers.
Silence.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: GUEST,PMB
Date: 09 Jul 07 - 05:34 AM

We must always remember the tragedy of that war, which was made far worse by the fact that it was a futile and unnecessary conflict, conducted in a brutal and wasteful manner. Of many of the dead, you can scarcely say that they gave their lives- they were forcibly robbed of life by conscription and wasteful generalship that had no regard to humanity. And only twenty years later, the final "victory" brought another war.

We must remember so that we can learn- that you can not fight injustice with injustice.

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: GUEST,Guest: one who knows
Date: 09 Jul 07 - 08:15 AM

But sometimes you must fight, because not to fight means enslavement and the destruction of all you hold dear. That! is the lesson learned...

Subject: RE: BS: Passchendael victim identified.
From: Keith A of Hertford
Date: 09 Jul 07 - 08:25 AM

"futile and unnecessary "
The Kaiser should have been allowed to take all of Belgium and any other country he wanted?