Outlawry in Folk Music

Subject: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: topical tom
Date: 17 Oct 07 - 01:22 PM

Across the centuries tales of skullduggery and murder have been spun by minstrels, troubadours, songwriters and storytellers. Some were based on fact, others invented.
       Some of the songs that spring to mind are "Jesse James",Woody's "Pretty Boy Floyd", "The Banks of the Ohio", and "Down in the Willow Garden".There is also "Brennan on the Moor", the song of the Irish Highwayman as so well interpreted by the Clancy Brothers and Tommy Makem.
       Why are people so intrigued by these dark deeds? Is it wrong to be so attracted to them?
       Discussion and other songs would be appreciated.

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 17 Oct 07 - 01:24 PM

Same reason that newspaper headlines don't read: "Nobody Did Anything Wrong Today!"

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: Wesley S
Date: 17 Oct 07 - 01:29 PM

Songs about sinners are far more interesting than songs about saints.

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: Mrrzy
Date: 17 Oct 07 - 01:32 PM

People who obey and comply are not likely to do anything worth writing a song about...

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: Susan of DT
Date: 17 Oct 07 - 01:34 PM

A search for outlaw in th eDT will get you a long list of songs

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: topical tom
Date: 17 Oct 07 - 01:50 PM

Thanks, Susan of DT! A superb list indeed!

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: greg stephens
Date: 17 Oct 07 - 04:26 PM

A good songwriting challenge: The Ballad of the Law-Abiding Citizen.

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 17 Oct 07 - 09:02 PM

Well, I didn't jaywalk today, though I was sorely tempted to.
No, I didn't jaywalk today, though I was sorely tempted to.
I threw my litter in the bin, because I'm so in love with you.

You make we walk the straight and narrow, you make me walk the line.
You make we walk the straight and narrow, baby, you make me walk the line.
I'll never get a parking ticket, never have to pay a fine.

It's tough to be an outlaw, when your woman is a cop.
It's tough to be an outlaw, baby, when your woman is a cop.
When you come up to that red light, well, you know you've got to stop.

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: Goose Gander
Date: 17 Oct 07 - 09:55 PM

A related subject: In-Lawry in music . . .

My Mother-in-Law

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: Wilfried Schaum
Date: 18 Oct 07 - 02:18 AM

Greg - when starting my work I first have a glimpse into the forum.
Thank you, you made my day.

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 18 Oct 07 - 06:08 AM

see discussion on Lincolnshire folksong competition.

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: GUEST,Mr Fox
Date: 18 Oct 07 - 10:09 AM

"A good songwriting challenge: The Ballad of the Law-Abiding Citizen."

Well Greg, I didn't write it (W H Auden did) and it's a poem but not a song, but.........
^^
The Unknown Citizen

To JS/07/M/378 This Marble Monument Is Erected by the State)

He was found by the Bureau of Statistics to be
One against whom there was no official complaint,
And all the reports on his conduct agree
That, in the modern sense of an old-fashioned word, he was a saint,
For in everything he did he served the Greater Community.
Except for the War till the day he retired
He worked in a factory and never got fired,
But satisfied his employers, Fudge Motors Inc.
Yet he wasn't a scab or odd in his views,
For his Union reports that he paid his dues,
(Our report on his Union shows it was sound)
And our Social Psychology workers found
That he was popular with his mates and liked a drink.
The Press are convinced that he bought a paper every day
And that his reactions to advertisements were normal in every way.
Policies taken out in his name prove that he was fully insured,
And his Health-card shows he was once in hospital but left it cured.
Both Producers Research and High-Grade Living declare
He was fully sensible to the advantages of the Installment Plan
And had everything necessary to the Modern Man,
A phonograph, a radio, a car and a frigidaire.
Our researchers into Public Opinion are content
That he held the proper opinions for he time of year;
When there was peace, he was for peace; when there was war, he went.
He was married and added five children to the population,
Which our Eugenist says was the right number for a parent of his generation.
And our teachers report that he never interfered with their education.
Was he free? Was he happy? The question is absurd:
Had anything been wrong, we should certainly have heard.

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: Midchuck
Date: 18 Oct 07 - 10:18 AM

'Cause Ladies love Outlaws, like babies love stray dogs.

Ladies touch babies like a banker touches gold;
Outlaws touch ladies deep down in their souls...

Ladies touch babies like a banker touches gold;
Outlaws touch ladies - any damn where's they take a notion to.

Peter

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: theleveller
Date: 18 Oct 07 - 11:29 AM

If you want an interesting take on this, read 'Liberty Against the Law' by Christopher Hill.

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: GUEST,Bob Coltman
Date: 18 Oct 07 - 04:26 PM

All the Robin Hood ballads, from Child's English and Scottish popular ballads.
Bold Turpin
Bandit Cole Younger
Quantrell
Kenny Wagner - at least two songs about him

...and that's just a few. Check Lomax's books for more, especially western outlaws. Bob

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: GUEST,Jim Carroll
Date: 19 Oct 07 - 01:30 PM

2 great Irish traditional songs on the subject.
Farmer Michael Hayes, who flees after killing a land-agent (in one version he kills the livestock on the land he has been evicted from).
Is chased for about 200 miles (on foot) and eventually escapes to America. Tom Lenihan sings it on 'Mount Callan Garland.
Brave Michael Power, Robin Hood type character from South of Ireland. - sung by Clare singer Michael 'Straighty' Flanagan of Inagh.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 19 Oct 07 - 01:48 PM

The suspicion must be that either the social structure of the time (at any given time) or the power of capital enchains a far greater share of the populace than it liberates, so that the dream, usuall y forced to be hidden inthe interests of survival, is of revolution (as in black-face dance and the "king for a day" traditions in many English rurual communities).

The songs, then give a voice to the oppressed, who see or wish to see revolution flourish - but often, as the romantic highwaymen, die, which in turn justifies the "decision" to remain unfree.

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: GUEST,TJ in San Diego
Date: 19 Oct 07 - 02:22 PM

If you have to ask, you probably shouldn't go there. However, when you take away moonshiners, murderers, thieves, plunderers of maidens and pirates, among others, you greatly diminish the available volume of folk song. Not being a psychologist, I am not qualified to answer for the fascination itself. It is probably like going to auto races and watching the accidents. You feel horrified and exhilirated at the same time, and can't take your eyes off the carnage. I don't know what that says about us, but few can deny it.

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: greg stephens
Date: 19 Oct 07 - 02:52 PM

Then, of course, there are the infinite number of English folksongs about fox-hunting. Recently outlawed!

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: GUEST,Jim Carroll
Date: 20 Oct 07 - 03:54 AM

Bert Lloyd once said that 'Goodnight Ballads', 'true confessions' written by hack writers and sold at public hangings; ('Ben Hall', Sheffield Apprentice, Captain Kidd, Newlyn Town - et al) were so-called because of the practice of the 'audience' of shouting "good-night" as the rope tightened around the client's neck. He mentioned Defoe as his source. Does anybody have any information on this; a reference would be appreciated.
Jim Carroll

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: bankley
Date: 22 Oct 07 - 04:11 PM

gangsta folk...

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: Suffet
Date: 31 Jul 09 - 08:32 PM

Try The Tobler Brothers. Real outlaws. Killed two men in Indian Territory (now Oklahoma) in 1885. Tracked down and apprehended by US Marshal Jack Stillwell. Hanged in 1888.

--- Steve

Subject: RE: Outlawry in Folk Music
From: Jack Blandiver
Date: 01 Aug 09 - 04:02 AM

My wife (Rapunzel) has recently set Bonnie Parker's poem Outlaws - Clyde Barrow & Billy the Kid to her own tune on the 5-string banjo. Have a listen at her myspace page:

http://www.myspace.com/rachelmccarron

We've both been long fascinated by the iconic legend of Bonnie & Clyde in terms of myth, folklore and graphic historic reality in which their bullet ridden corpses contrast vividly with their own photography, thus making the prophetic resignation of Bonnie's lyric all the more poignant somehow...