Learning to play the banjo

Subject: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 09:20 PM

OK. I took the plunge and bought a 6 string banjo. I do not know how to read music but would realy like to learn to play this thing. First, did I make a mistake in buying a six string as opposed to a 4 or 5 string? Is it possible to learn to play without being able to read music? I have the desire and the commitment but not sure which direction to go. Do I attempt to teach myself or should I take lessons. I   appreciate the input.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Melissa
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 09:39 PM

If a 6string banjo is what you wanted, of course you didn't make a mistake by not buying a 4 or 5!

If it's tuned like a guitar, I would think you'd want to use guitar tutorials/instruction stuff as your foundation. You'll know whether you need lessons or not when you've given yourself a little time to get familiar with your instrument.

Sounds fun!

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Charley Noble
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 10:00 PM

Did you buy this type of banjo because you already knew how to play guitar?

Cheerily,
Charley Noble, who play 5-string banjo

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 10:02 PM

First, did I make a mistake in buying a six string as opposed to a 4 or 5 string?

Probably. At least in not considering this: What type/style of music do you want to play?

Is it possible to learn to play without being able to read music? I have the desire and the commitment but not sure which direction to go. Do I attempt to teach myself or should I take lessons.

Self taught (well I did buy a book) tenor banjo/mandolin who can understand basic music theory but can't sight read here...

Any help you can find, ie. if you can learn to read, can find a good teacher, etc. I think has got to help.

That said, you may get by without and you have the most important qualities, I think in desire and commitment.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 10:03 PM

No, I don't play the guitar. I'm starting from scratch. In your opinion which is easier to learn on 4,5 or 6 string?

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,fretless
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 10:16 PM

4, 5, and 6 string banjos all have differnt playing styles -- none is "easier" in my opinion -- they're just different. Your 6-string can be tuned and played like a guitar. Use a guitar instruction book to get started. The 5-string is the banjo most commonly played today and most commonly associated with folk music, blue grass and old-timey. There are lots of instruction books out there. My favorite, because its the one I started with, is Pete Seger's How to Play the 5-String Banjo. You don't need to read music to learn from it. The 4-string was popular back in the early 20th century for jazz, ragtime, and such. Today, it is used frequently in Irish music. Listen to Mick Maloney -- he's terrific on the 4-string.

And beware -- you buy one and get hooked, you're likely to buy another...and another...and so on.

And remember the old Appalachian saying: "Do you know how to read music?" "Not enought to hurt my playing." ;-)

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 10:17 PM

Easier for what?

Not touched a 6 string banjo but I find flat picking a jig on a GDAE easier much easier than I do on a EADGBE guitar (something I'm trying and struggling to learn to do at the moment) for example but I might prefer a guitar for some chords to a song.

I can't see how Scruggs style bluegrass could be done without that little 5th string, etc.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: john f weldon
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 10:25 PM

A 4-string can be tuned like a mandolin, which makes it best for melody. A six string is really a guitar, which is very versatile, for chords and melody, but the fact that it has a banjo head will make it sound a bit plunky for chords.

The five string will sound like a real banjo, and if you like the sound of a banjo, this is the only choice. It has no logic, only beauty.

Irish players tend to the 4-string for melody. Dixieland player use a 4-string but tune it CGBD, for richer chords. The six-string is very rare; Rev Gary Davis used to get a lot out of it, but it will always sound "hybrid".

The five string is the love which hath no words; it is itself.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Bobert
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 10:29 PM

Take it back and get either a 4 or 5 stringed banjo... Different animal that you have...

Actaully the 4 string is a good place to start and work your way up...

Unless, of course, you allready have Leo Kotkee finger pickin' skills and if that is the case then...

...nevermind... You'll do just fine with the 6 string...

B~

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Melissa
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 10:35 PM

I think you'll be happier in learning if you don't start out worrying whether you 'should' have started with something different.

The first 6string banjo I saw was promoted as a cross between banjo and guitar. Sounds like a banjo and plays like a guitar..so guitar players could pretend to be banjo players without having to learn new stuff.

ANY instrument is a step in the right direction.

Whichever kind you get next will be easier to learn--simply because a lot of the basic foundational stuff you pick up with your first instrument will carry over.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 10:53 PM

(Probably) disagree, Melissa.

My first banjo I had was a 5 string and I wanted to (and still do but that's another story...) play like Barney McKenna. I was pleased to learn he played tenor banjo and that I had the "wrong" instrument.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 11:20 PM

Irish players tend to the 4-string for melody. Dixieland player use a 4-string but tune it CGBD

Just for reference. There are 2 common 4 string banjos.

The plectrum which has the same length neck as the 5 string. CGBD is a common tuning for this instrument.

The tenor banjo has a shorter neck and 17-19 frets. The "standard" tunings for this are in 5ths. "Jazz" CGDA and "Irish" is the same intervals but lower (an octave below fiddle/mandolin) GDAE.

---
I believe the highest 4 strings of the guitar DGBE has also been reasonably popular, I guess mostly on plectrum and by jazz guitar players doubling as banjo.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Melissa
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 11:30 PM

Well Jon, all I can say in response is that I probably disagree with your probable disagreement...except I'm not certain what I'd be disagreeing about.

My first banjo was also a 5string.
Oddly enough, although I had the proper instrument, I never did end up playing like anybody but myself. I think chances are pretty good that if I'd started on tenor, I would have ended up playing like myself on that too.

This Guest we're talking to is just starting to begin.
There is nothing wrong with a 6string as a starter instrument.
Haven't you noticed that most people who really dig in and learn to play generally end up getting other instruments as they learn and find out that maybe they'd like to broaden themselves a bit?

Starting to Begin is good.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 24 Dec 07 - 11:37 PM

I think what I've noticed is that you tend to do better if you are chasing some aims.

In this case, I can't say it can not be done on 5 string - Chris Grotewohl seems to make it possible... but for me, I would have been chasing a wrong combination of aims, instruments and ability - a combination, I believe can just lead to wanting to give up/ deciding it's too difficult.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 25 Dec 07 - 03:08 AM

There's nothing I like better than the sound of a banjo.........................unless it's a chicken caught in a vacuum cleaner.

eric

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Jeri
Date: 25 Dec 07 - 08:10 AM

5-string banjo was easy for me to get started with. It took work, but if I did that work, it was pretty easy to learn. Of course, I learned clawhammer/frailing first. I think 4-string tenor would be the same. Once you get the basics down, it's simple to go on from there.

6-string, I'm not so sure about. I play a little guitar, and I don't think I could have worked a lot of it out on my own, especially starting as an adult. There aren't a whole lot of 6-string banjo teachers, and playing it exactly as you would a guitar wouldn't sound right. If you're one of those people who can hear what others are playing and work out the left hand fretting and right hand picking used to get those sounds, you'll probably be OK with the 6 string.

What it really comes down to is why did you want the banjo and what do you want to play on it?

As to reading music, no it's not necessary to be able to, but it makes learning tunes a lot easier. Learning to read tablature might make more sense for you. If you don't want to to either, you'd better learn your instrument well and have huge ears.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: The Sandman
Date: 25 Dec 07 - 03:10 PM

plectrum techniques for guitar, six string banjo, and four string should be similiar.
fingerpicking techniques for six string banjo and guitar should also be similiar,but different from five string banjo.
as well as concertina and guitar I also play four string banjo.
I would treat the six string banjo,like a four string Banjo or six string guitar as regards flat picking,and a six string guitar as regards finger picking,and when it comes to alternative tunings use the guitar as my guide,thus drop d,DADGBE,Double drop d,DADGBD,DADGAD,CGCGCD,DADDAE,and any other open guitar tunings,but learn EADGBE first.Dick Miles

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 25 Dec 07 - 03:29 PM

Though something has been said about it, it hasn't been stressed enough:

Start with the kind of MUSIC you like and would like to create, and THEN pick an instrument associated with that music!

For instance, if you're enamoured of bluegrass, you definitely want a five-string, probably with a resonator. And you'll want to learn 3-finger up-picking, a la Earl Scruggs.

If you've fallen in love with old-time, mountain music, you want a five-string open back. You'll probably want to learn frailing or clawhammer, or possibly 2-finger up-picking a la Pete Seeger.

If you want to play dixieland, you need a tenor banjo (4-string). You'll play with a plectrum.

Frankly, I don't personally know of a music that's really right for a six-string banjo.

In my opinion, if you start out with an instrument that wants to lead you other than where you want to go, you're more likely to get discouraged and give up, and that's a damn shame.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: john f weldon
Date: 25 Dec 07 - 04:02 PM

Suggestion: Keep the 6-string.
Replace the lowest string with the very high g string from a 12-string guitar.
Retune the high e-string to d.

If you can learn to clawhammer on this it will sound okay, and you'll have an extra bass note!

You will seem very cool, and can say you're the best in the world in the 6-string clawhammer style, due to being the only one.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Stringsinger
Date: 25 Dec 07 - 06:44 PM

There are exponents of the 6 string banjo. Johnny St.Cyr of Louis Armstrong's Hot Five.
Clancy Hayes who accompanies himself on dixieland material. Django Reinhardt started out on the 6 string banjo.

I think it depends on the make of the banjo. Deering is said to make a good 6 string that
has the necessary banjo ring. It can work in dixie bands and trad jazz.

It can also be fingerpicked like Sam McGee with Uncle Dave Macon. Ragtime pieces for
fingerpicking sound good on it.

Many 6 string banjos are cheaply thrown together and don't sound great.

The best I ever played was a Gibson trap-door 6 string circa 1920's.

Frank

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,fretless
Date: 26 Dec 07 - 12:27 PM

"Frankly, I don't personally know of a music that's really right for a six-string banjo."

I remember the Rev. Gary Davis playing a six-string banjo. Boy, that was RIGHT. I don't know is he ever recorded anything on a SSB, though.

Otherwise, I agree: Guest has to figure out what kind of music he/she wants to play and pick the appropriate instrument based on that.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: john f weldon
Date: 26 Dec 07 - 12:44 PM

Yes, he recorded a few on an LP called "The Guitar and Banjo of Rev Gary Davis" I think. It's all instrumental.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: BanjoRay
Date: 26 Dec 07 - 02:30 PM

Tell the guy what you really think chaps! He made a big mistake. He bought a banjo presumably because he likes the sound - what had he heard? There's a 99.9 per cent chance he heard a five or a four string banjo. He didn't know this when he went out and bought a six.
He bought the wrong banjo - now he needs to do something about that.
Ray

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: PoppaGator
Date: 26 Dec 07 - 02:45 PM

I've seen the six-string banjo used in some of the very best traditional-style New Orleans jazz groups, as part of the classic lineup that includes trumpet, clarinet, trombone, string bass or tuba, and drum kit. The sixth instrument is normally either piano or banjo.

In this musical genre, the banjo is typically strummed in a steady rhythm, not fingerpicked, with plenty of "chord changes." (In many cases, the change is from one inversion of a chord to another of the same chord, but many of the changes involve the introduction of relatively exotic "jazz" chords, like augmenteds and diminisheds, that do not appear in basic 3-chord or 4-chord arrangements.) A very busy left hand, in other words, but a simple basic right-hand part.

The more historically accurate intrument for this setting would be a four-string tenor banjo.

I believe that these modern-day revivalists use the six-string banjo simply because so very few players today own and play the old four-string tenor, but there are plenty of skilled guitar players available to fill out the band. When I've seen these intruments in this trad-band context, they have definitely been set up in standard guitar tuning ~ as a guitar player myself, I recognize most of the chord shapes. (Not all of them ~ as mentioned above, the arrangements generally include the absolute maximum number of chord changes, one per quarter-note beat, and many of the chords are known only to God, Mel Bay, and the player ~ not to me.)

I suspect that one or two of the six-stringers that I've seen played in this context have belonged to the bandleaders (usually trumpet or clarinet players), not to the indivudals playing them on a given gig. The banjo "sound" is an integral and necessary part of the ensemble, and the bandleader who has one of these hybrid inststruments at his disposal is free to audition and hire from the pool of available guitarists able to read music, or at least chord symbols. This way, he can hire a skilled musician as the band's "banjoist," even in an era where true trad-jazz banjo players are essentially nonexistant.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: The Sandman
Date: 26 Dec 07 - 03:08 PM

yes, but the six string banjo can be played for folk as well as jazz,if I was using it for folk, I would either treat it like a six string guitar[as did Sam Mcghee]and finger pick it IN STANDARD TUNING,or tune it daddae/dgddae and treat it like a four string irish tenor banjo[and flatpick it], TENOR BANJOS are often tuned gdae,forIrish Music,thus you have the three top strings tuned the same as an Irish tenor banjo.Dick Miles

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Leadfingers
Date: 26 Dec 07 - 03:13 PM

I give (Sorry - SELL) the occasional banjo lesson , and find all to often that someone wants to play Irish Music and has been sold a Fie String , when they really should have a tenor ! Guest DOES need to know WHAT he wants to play before buying anything !

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,Jom
Date: 26 Dec 07 - 03:19 PM

"I would treat the six string banjo,like a four string Banjo or six string guitar as regards flat picking"

I can't in that with my own tenor and mandolin playing, I rest the thumb side of my hand on the instrument body. I can't span the 6 strings of my guitar that way and I am trying to adopt a free right hand.

I also find the right hand on guitar more difficult in another way when trying to flat pick jigs and reels. Whereas in GDAE, most of the stuff I play only involves moving to the next string for the next note, with std tuned guitar I find I might have to miss a string (eg 3rd string to 1st), and playing 3 successive notes on different strings is quite common.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 26 Dec 07 - 03:27 PM

Actually, I think "six-string banjo" is an unfortunate term, because of vagueness.

In this thread I am sure GUEST and the subsequent posters have been talking about what's often called a "guit-jo" or "banjitar", a banjo body with neck and six strings configured a la guitar.

A different animal altogether is what would be a five-string banjo except that it has an additional bass string added between the fourth string and the short thumb string, which would then be the sixth string. This may be played frailing, clawhammer, two-finger pickup, or three-finger bluegrass style. Or I suppose it COULD, if you wanted to, be played plectrum.   This is the instrument that always comes to my own mind when the expression "six-string banjo" is used. I do wish folks would make this distinction plain by their language, and abandon "six-string banjo" to avoid confusion.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: PoppaGator
Date: 26 Dec 07 - 03:32 PM

The five-string banjo is a unique instrument suited for a particular subgenre (or more accurately, perhaps, for a number of related subgenres) of American folk music. The short fifth string is a high-pitched drone (normally, a G note) that cannot be fretted (at least, not easily and not usually). It is positioned, counterintuitively enough, "below" the lowest-pitched of the four full-length strings, even though it is by far the highest pitched string on the banjo.

If you want to play a certain familiar type of "banjo music," only a 5-string will do.

On the other hand, there is plenty of music suited for banjos without the high-G drone, in various folk traditions as well as in older-style pop/standard and jazz settings. The four-string banjo has long been used in these contexts, and the six-string version can also be put to work in much the same way, using any of various tunings.

The moral of this story, of course, is to know what you want to play before you buy an instrument! If the 6-string banjo in question was just so cheap and so available that GUEST simply could not pass it up, I would suggest that he tune it and treat it as a guitar, learn some simple songs, and perhaps ~ if he develops some skills and wants to persue music more seriously ~ eventually buy a guitar and keep his hybrid banjo as an interesting second instrument that can produce that banjo sound when desired.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: The Sandman
Date: 26 Dec 07 - 04:18 PM

In this thread I am sure GUEST and the subsequent posters have been talking about what's often called a "guit-jo" or "banjitar", a banjo body with neck and six strings configured a la guitar.said UncleDaveO.
YES Dave thats is what I am talking about,basically a guitar with a banjo body,and these instruments I have always seen tuned like a guitar.
perhaps the OP,Could describe what they really have.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Bernard
Date: 26 Dec 07 - 05:24 PM

One thing people seem to have overlooked is the six string can, in theory, be strung as any of the others! After all, the ubiquitous Windsor 'Zither' banjo has six tuning machines although it is usually string as a five-string...

Okay, maybe string tension may need working out, but it seems to me to be the most versatile choice.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 26 Dec 07 - 06:35 PM

Perhaps, but

The the scale length is on the long side for the 5th tuning playing.

I'm not sure 5ths works across 6 strings, at least not on a guitar. I've tried but I've always got horrible "extra" sounds from the other strings. I think it is moving the other way (and with the opposite effect) from say moving a guitar towards more open tunings where other/sympathetic strings may add to the "full" sound.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Fliss
Date: 26 Dec 07 - 06:47 PM

Where are you guest. There may be someone in your area who can teach you.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 27 Dec 07 - 02:40 AM

Most zither banjos had six tuners because they used guitar machine heads
not proper banjo pegs, and guitar machines come in threes.

eric

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: MARINER
Date: 27 Dec 07 - 03:14 AM

If my memory is not failing me ,Mick Maloney ,mentioned above, played the six string banjo back in the 60s .

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Stringsinger
Date: 27 Dec 07 - 04:57 PM

I defy any banjo enthusiast to improve upon what Johnny St. Cyr did with the 6-string banjo in his early recordings with Louis Armstrong and the Hot Five and Seven.

Django Reinhardt started with the 6-string banjo and it didn't hurt his playing.

The Six String Banjo is a unique instrument precisely because it doesn't sound like a five-string, tenor, mandolin or tenor banjo. It's its own instrument and can be played well by
anyone who wants to learn it.

Instead of trading it in for a five, learn to play the instrument as is meant to be played.
Finger picking ragtime sounds good on it. Chordal style in a trad jazz band sounds good.
Lead picking like on a guitar also works.

If you want to learn to play a five-string banjo then buy one separately, but if your 6-String sounds decent, learn to play it. Many banjo players do not know how to play it so they diss it out of ignorance. By all means, check out Harvey Reid and find out what he has done with the instrument. You won't be disappointed.

Frank Hamilton

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Dave Hanson
Date: 28 Dec 07 - 03:12 AM

Mick Moloney played and still plays tenor banjo.

eric

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Sandy Mc Lean
Date: 28 Dec 07 - 08:31 AM

Frank said: "Many banjo players do not know how to play it so they diss it out of ignorance. "
I agree 100%!
A six string banjo has a history in jazz that goes back many decades before bluegrass banjo playing was invented by Earl Scruggs (borrowed from mountain music). It should not be expected to conform to a pre-conceived notion that a five string resonator is the only "real banjo".
I have a six string banjo that I play with a thumb pick in a thumb roll style that I use for guitar as well. I play folk and old country stuff mostly, but play my own way, rather than trying to follow any set style. For some songs this works well and imparts a unique sound. For others I find that the guitar works best.
4,5,or 6 strings, resonator or open-back they are all banjos because they are all strung drums. Just different!
                Sandy

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Sandy Mc Lean
Date: 28 Dec 07 - 08:35 AM

I forgot to add a quote that I once heard:
"A banjo is just a long necked bohran!" :-}

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: kendall
Date: 28 Dec 07 - 08:54 AM

"The 4 string banjo was invented by a fella who couldn't play the 5 string banjo." (Granpa Jones)

I have one of Pete Seegers banjo books and it is top quality. If it aint in there, you don't need it.
It is one of my most treasured belongings because it was given to me by the man himself.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: PoppaGator
Date: 28 Dec 07 - 12:44 PM

Granpa Jones was pulling our collective leg, I think, because I find it hard to believe that the 4-string banjo did not predate the quirkier and more specialized 5.

Pete Seeger's banjo is a 5-stringer, and if I'm not mistaken, he "invented" or pioneered a longer-necked version of the earlier mountain-music 5-string banjo. Pete plays a fairly broad range of traditional and original folk-music styles and has never restricted himself to the old-timey and bluegrass traditions; however, the constant presence of that fifth-string drone does restrict how widely a player can vary his style and repertoire. (It certainly restricts how many keys you can play in!)

Thanks to Frank and Sandy for some solid history and insight about the relatively-rare six-string banjo.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Ernest
Date: 28 Dec 07 - 01:07 PM

The banjo`s african predecessors and early american banjos were 5-stringers (or at least used the short string typical for the 5-string b. - see for instance Gura/Bollmann "America`s Instrument") so Granpa Jones wasn`t completely wrong - but admittedly a little polemic.
The 4-string was invented because the short string was in the way when strumming chords in the early jazz bands, this was the plectrum banjo which became the tenor by shortening the neck. Most of the other variants - mandolin-banjo, ukulele-banjo and of course the guitar banjo - came into being because the drum provided more volume.

Generally I think this has no effect on the musical value of an instrument (otherwise the only traditional instrument would be a hollow log banged with a stick or stone). If a player is able to play what he wants to play on it it definitely is a serious instrument IMHO.
Best
Ernest

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Lowden Jameswright
Date: 28 Dec 07 - 01:46 PM

For free banjo tuition, try Youtube

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Re5mADE_tLU&feature=related

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,mariner
Date: 28 Dec 07 - 02:15 PM

Eric ,I know that Mick Maloney played and still plays the tenor banjo ,but in his days with the Emmett Folk i am certain that he played the 6 string .One of the E

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,Mariner
Date: 28 Dec 07 - 02:18 PM

WOW ,WHAT HAPPENED THERE ?? To continue, one of the Emmett Folk ,Donal Lunny joined up with the Byrne brothers of the Spiceland Folk to form the Emmett Spiceland.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST
Date: 28 Dec 07 - 09:52 PM

I want to thank everyone who responded to my question. I learned a lot just from what I read from you folks. I think I have decided to go ahead and buy a five string and start with it. I am going to keep the six string because if nothing else it is a beautful instument. Who knows if I become proficient with the five string I may want to pick up the six string and see what I can do with it. Again thank you all. You have a grest site here and a multitude of knowledge and I appreciate your sharing it with me.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Leadfingers
Date: 29 Dec 07 - 04:46 AM

Good Luck with whatever banjo you play Guest

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: kendall
Date: 29 Dec 07 - 09:43 AM

Granpa Jones was not a great banjo player, but I like what he did.
Pete Seeger can play many different styles. I had one of Granpa's instruction books, but didn't get much from it.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Dec 07 - 09:53 AM

The really fascinating aspect is that you bought a six string banjo by mistake. A few months ago we had a guy on mudcat saying he couldn't find anywhere he could buy a six string banjo, and presumably he was trying to buy one.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 29 Dec 07 - 10:02 AM

I suppose it depends on where you live. Both where I lived in N Wales and now in Norfolk, the banjo I'd be most likely to see in a music shop that just had "a banjo" is a 5 string. Partly as I go to more sessions than anything else, the banjo I'd be more likely to hear anyone playing is a tenor...

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Leadfingers
Date: 29 Dec 07 - 10:05 AM

Well I have an assortment ! Couple of fives , a short scale tenor and a 100 plus yaer old Seven string ! AND a Banjola , which is great fun !

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 29 Dec 07 - 11:07 AM

Incidentally Keith Stacey is a great banjo player - playing all the main styles and he is still looking for pupils. He lives at Clay Cross near Chesterfield. His number is 01246 865739 and he knows all about banjoes.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: danensis
Date: 29 Dec 07 - 11:28 AM

Hmm, I've got a seven string as well, but haven't learnt to cope with five yet. Much prefer the tenor as it has the notes in the same place as my mandolin.

John

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,QuestionMark
Date: 29 Dec 07 - 11:36 AM

The string of posts seem to not acknowledge that there is currently a resurgence of the 6 string banjo going on in country music. Primarily, due to Keith Urban being a known 6 string banjo player and his 6 string banjo appearing in at least one of his videos.

QM

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Stringsinger
Date: 29 Dec 07 - 02:42 PM

I first heard the banjo as a young boy. I was enamored of the four-string instrument not aware at that time whether it was tenor or plectrum-tuned. It was a happy sound and I loved it. I also found that people could sing with it as well.

When I first heard the five-string banjo in 1949 at a Hootenanny in a Hollywood Hills home, I was captivated by its down-home quality. Matty Miller was a good clawhammer player albeit simple but his playing had that wonderful wooden quality as well as the brassy sound and was ideal for accompanying mountain folk tunes.

Later, I heard Pete Seeger and again was enchanted by the bright ringing tones he got with his fingerpicks and how he employed it as a complete musical instrument for song accompaniment. I met him in the early 50's at the home of Will Geer and when he played I thought that I saw sparks shoot out from his hands.

I had heard Pete earlier on a recording of "Hold The Line" written by members of the Weavers to describe the Peekskill riot.

The first and classic recording I heard of Pete was the 10" Folkways "Darlin' Corey" which in my opinon was a high benchmark for folk singer performances on an lP. He did unusual things for a banjo player such as a suspended rolling arpeggio accompaniment under the old ballads such as "John Reilly" and "Come All Ye Fair and Tender Ladies". He was the first five-string banjo player that I heard playing an accompaniment in 6/8 time for "Risselty Rasselty". To my knowledge, no one before that time had used the five-string banjo with such musical versatility. Pete also introduced Earl Scruggs' style of playing to the city folks in New York.

I had heard that Pete started playing tenor banjo at Harvard and knew a lot of the popular songs of the 20's and 30's. This would explain his penchant for using ninth and thirteenth chords
in his accompaniments.

The point of all of this is that the banjo is a highly versatile instrument capable of many different styles of playing and is just now beginning to be explored for its entire musical range. Bach sounds good on it. There are be-bop banjo players both five-string and four-string and discoveries in the so-called "Old Time" community of two-finger and three-finger styles are being resourced.

We have a banjo Renaissance and the 6-String is the next to be explored.

Frank Hamilton

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: john f weldon
Date: 29 Dec 07 - 03:03 PM

I hope someone else hasn't already written this:

About 4 & 5 strings; the late Tommy Thompson used to play a banjo based on the earliest known reference to a banjo. That was a painting, about 1760-ish I believe.

It had 4 strings, but the "missing" string was the bass string. The short string was anchored near the 12th fret!

I started on the 5-string, and find it very natural and intuitive. I particularly enjoy my "bandoline" which has a wooden body and a 5-string neck. Not loud, but very pretty.

The biggest draw-back of the 5-string is playing with folks who like playing in F.

Use a mandolin for notes, a guitar for chords, and a banjo for soul!

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: GUEST,Jon
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 09:18 AM

I'd guess the painting is "The Old Plantation".

---
Frank, Apart from "the only "real banjo is the 5 string" type comments, I don't think many players diss any banjo even if they may not know much about some. The main point as far as I'm concerned is simply there are different banjos for different purposes.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Charley Noble
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 11:50 AM

One of the best instrumental recordings by Pete Seeger has to be NONESUCH AND OTHER FOLK TUNES (Folkways Recording), for demonstrating the versatility of the banjo. And if my memorary has not betrayed me, one Frank Hamilton was also providing accompaniment on that recording. I particularly liked "Singing in the Country." The recording is now available on CD from Smithsonian Folkways.

Cheerily,
Charley Noble

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: fretless
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:06 PM

The banjo in "The Old Plantation," an 18th century painting in the Rockefeller Folk Art Museum at Williamsburg, Virginia, is a fretless gourd banjo with three long strings and a short drone, with the positioned around where the 12th fret would be if the banjo were fretted. There's no way to tell how the banjo would have been tuned, so there's no way to tell if the missing string was the bass string, although it's not unreasonable to assume that it was. There are a number of copies of the picture available on the Web. Here's one that is of a scale sufficient to show detials of the banjo: The Old Plantation.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: Sandy Mc Lean
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:06 PM

"And if my memorary(sic) has not betrayed me, one Frank Hamilton was also providing accompaniment on that recording."
It never ceases to amaze me that on the Mudcat we can enter discussions with such as Frank Hamilton, Kendall, Jim McLean etc.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: john f weldon
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 12:41 PM

Wow, thanks for the link to that picture. The banjo looks eerily similar to another banjo of mine, a fretless that I ordered from a guy who makes them, can't remember his name. It sounds great, but I usually stick to G on that one.

As a visual artist (to use the term loosely), I will confess that my own interest in accuracy in drawing is approximately zero, so I wouldn't be surprised if the banjo he was depicting might have had the drone anchored a little closer to the nut.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: fretless
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 06:11 PM

John,

That's an entirely resonable observation regarding the acuracy of the rendering of the banjo in the Rockefeller watercolor. On the other hand, the scene has been interpreted as accurately rendering elements of the clothing, particularly the supposedly African-derived hear coverings, and the facial features of the people depicted seem sufficiently individualized that the overall picture, which is thought to be a folk rendering of a wedding ceremony (i.e. jumping the stick), has been interpreted as a sort of marriage certificate/documentation within in 18th centery African American community that was often illiterate.

And I guess I need to apologize for thread drift, unless we consider learing "about" banjos to be part of learning how to play them.

Subject: RE: Learning to play the banjo
From: fretless
Date: 30 Dec 07 - 06:18 PM

By the way, Pete Ross in Baltimore makes contemporary versions of The Old Plantation banjo for under $1,000: online details here.