Dances for a school 'medieval fete'

Subject: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Mo the caller
Date: 25 Jan 08 - 10:07 AM

I have been contacted by a school who think I am a medieval dance expert because I taught them some Playford dances (1651) to perform at a Sealed Knot event.
Antone got any easy to teach, good to watch ideas, preferably with recorded music available in the UK, and maybe internet instructions.

I've got as few ideas myself if they're not too fussy.

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: IanC
Date: 25 Jan 08 - 10:41 AM

Horses Bransle (actually Branle de Montarde from Arbeau to the Horses Brawl tune) is a good one (or see some of the other dances in the site).

Looks like a Breughel painting.

:-)
Ian

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: GUEST,Long Lankin
Date: 25 Jan 08 - 10:41 AM

From my limited expereince of recreations and early dance I would suggest teachiong them a Bransle (pronounced Brawl. Google "Bransle" if link below does not work.

Bransle

The carol "Ding Dong merrily on High" is sung to a Bransle tune (the Bransle L'Official - The Kitchen Bransle).

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: GUEST,Ned at work
Date: 25 Jan 08 - 10:47 AM

How about a circle dance like the Bear dance? a sort of medieval hokey cokey!

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Mo the caller
Date: 25 Jan 08 - 11:34 AM

Thanks for the links.
I was thinking branles and farandoles, good to have that site. I call a simplified Horses Brawl at weddings sometimes.
Any more?

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 25 Jan 08 - 11:42 AM

An American Ballroom Companion: Dance Instruction Manuals ca. 1490-1920

Includes Les basses danses de Marguerite d'Autriche (c.1490), Arbeau's Orchesographie (1589) and the 1698 edition of Playford.

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Jack Campin
Date: 25 Jan 08 - 01:26 PM

I don't believe there are ANY mediaeval dances surviving. None of the stuff suggested here so far is mediaeval.

If you don't TELL them you're doing Renaissance or early modern dances you are perpetuating bullshit.

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Mo the caller
Date: 26 Jan 08 - 07:04 AM

So when is medieval?

Yes I agree,especially as it is a school.

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Sorcha
Date: 26 Jan 08 - 08:18 AM

Mo, you might be able to find some here, SCA Dance cheat sheet

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 26 Jan 08 - 09:59 AM

Generally speaking "mediaeval" means pre-Tudor (though you could argue that the reign of Henry VII would still count). And there's precious litle secular music or dance reliaby from back then, in the British Isles anyway.

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Sorcha
Date: 26 Jan 08 - 10:07 AM

No, and the SCA is hardly a reliable source, but it's about all that is out there.

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Long Lankin
Date: 26 Jan 08 - 02:33 PM

If we are going to get pedantic about what is "medieval" as oppossed to "Renaissance" then the late medieval run into early renaissance period - there is no hard an fast rule about when one ended and the other started. Also plenty of medieval practices continued into the renaissance period. It is likely that a dance written down in 1490 already existed at that date rather than being composed then.

However I agree that you should tell them that you are using a dated source - I am not sure it will make much difference to them whether the dance was written down in 1490 or 1410. Last time i was involved in a "medieval fair" I was being paid to Morris dance!

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Gorgeous Gary
Date: 26 Jan 08 - 10:14 PM

The dance group I'm in, Thrir Venstri Foetr, typically does teaching dances as part of our sets. Among the standard ones are Horses Bransle, Tangle Bransle, Maltese Bransle, Scottish Bransle, Gathering Peascods, and Sellinger's Round. We have steps on line at .

-- Gary

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Sorcha
Date: 26 Jan 08 - 11:04 PM

Pavane to Earl of Salisbury
Or pretty much any Pavane.
Road to the Isles to Road to Lisdoonvarna
Any jig or reel. You'll have a blast trying to teach them the jig step.


So, they aren't 'exactly' Medieval....who cares? The kids will have fun anyway. Yes, I DO agree, cite your sources, and explain that these dances are not exclusively, seriously documented, but I doubt anyone will care very much.


Shall we now begin debating the end of the Dark Ages, the beginning of the Middle Ages, the end of the Early Medieval Period, the end of the High Middle Ages....ad nauseum.

Just get on with the teaching of dances, having fun, and doing the best you can.

Sorry, Mo, the 'argument' is hardly about you or what you've been asked to do.

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Mo the caller
Date: 27 Jan 08 - 07:37 AM

Thanks for all the links.
My view is that all I know about historic dances is that they danced for fun. (but I know there are historians who go into a lot more detail). It's interesting to get a more historical light on things occassionally, but I go back to teaching 'for fun' dances.

I did one for the Sealed Knot (English Civil War enactors) last night which would have had the purists tutting.

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Jack Campin
Date: 27 Jan 08 - 07:57 AM

I guess the people who think "it's all just for fun and doesn't matter" would be quite happy to teach kids that Hendrix's version of The Star Spangled Banner was played during the US War of Independence? The degree of anachronism you're talking about is greater than that.

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 27 Jan 08 - 08:08 AM

Hahahahaha!

As an ex-SCA person, I am pleased to tell you all that you have warmed the cockles of my heart.

I have a warm feeling of "Deja-Moo" - I'm sure I've heard all this bulldust before...

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Mo the caller
Date: 27 Jan 08 - 02:22 PM

I wasn't quite saying "all for fun and doesn't matter". I think I was trying to say "they danced for fun, we may not know exactly what they did, but we'll enjoy our approximation". I will of course quote sources and admit to 'reconstructions'.
Wiki divides history into 3 - ancient, modern, and middle, with the Tudors at the start of 'modern' (or says that some do). Which puts rennaisance dance into the pot.
That bransle link above is very clear.

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Long Lankin
Date: 27 Jan 08 - 02:53 PM

Ignore them Mo,

All recreations are just that: a "re-creation" of what we can best approximate happened at the time endevouring to achieve a degree of accuracy to please those involved and/or those watching. Unless they are paid professionals everyone is also doing it for "fun". This is true whether it is a primary school running a "medieval fete", an early dance group or battle staged by the Sealed Knot (or any one of many other recreation groups covering the ancient Romans through to WW2).

No matter how far people go in ensuring the historical accuracy of clothing, equipment, music, etc we are still approching it with 21 Century minds and imposing our own understanding of what it was like. The biggest give away in any recreation event is the teeth! Nobody has sought to go without modern dentistry in the interests of historical accuracy.

While there are degrees of accuracy it is pointless getting hung up on them. As long as you are open about your degree of historical accuracy (or inaccuracy if others prefer the term) and the school is happy then go with it!

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: Bert
Date: 27 Jan 08 - 02:57 PM

When I was at a Fest Noz in Brittany a while ago they had a regional dance which if you called it, it would go something like this.

Circle left
grapevine left
step into the center and back (Just one step that was)

They did the same steps to every tune all evening.

It certainly gave the impression of being a very old dance.

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 27 Jan 08 - 03:07 PM

Nobody has sought to go without modern dentistry in the interests of historical accuracy.

Maybe not - but I've known a few people take their false teeth out to sing.

Subject: RE: Dances for a school 'medieval fete'
From: IanC
Date: 28 Jan 08 - 03:41 AM

Hey folks ... nobody asked for "medieval dances" just dances for "a school medieval fete".

Have you never been to one of those?

Get real.

;-)