An informal unscientific question-widespread songs

Subject: Folklore: An informal unscientific question
From: irishenglish
Date: 15 Apr 08 - 05:22 PM

Hi all,
For some time now I have been compiling lists of traditional songs for something that someday I hope to turn into a book. I'm a LONG way off from that possibility by the way! Basically when I get a new CD, or hear a new version, or a new traditional song to my ears, I write it down with all the info I know about it, cross reference it to established academic sources-Child, Sharp, Lomax, etc, as well as whatever the artist themselves says about the song. My question is this, what do you think are the most widespread, most performed, most transcribed songs. I'm looking for purely informal answers here, and feel free to include a song whether it comes from Ireland, England, Scotland, Newfoundland, America, whatever. I'm not trying to get bogged down in specifics of where it comes from, I just want what people feel are the most popular traditional songs. I will give you an example, because while doing this I realized I had no less than 20 versions of Farewell, Lovely Nancy, or Farewell and Adieu Lovely Nancy, or Lovely Nancy, or....well you get it. Another one was Fair Maid On The Shore, I was shocked when I found out how many versions I had of it! So add 'em up, much appreciated, irishenglish (Robert)

Subject: RE: Folklore: An informal unscientific question
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 15 Apr 08 - 05:23 PM

I could be wrong, but isn't this more or less what the Roud Index has already done?

Subject: RE: Folklore: An informal unscientific question
From: GUEST,Steve Gardham
Date: 15 Apr 08 - 05:36 PM

No contest.
Barbara Allen is the all-time most recorded, published, collected etc traditional song in the English-speaking world.

Subject: RE: Folklore: An informal unscientific question
From: irishenglish
Date: 15 Apr 08 - 05:57 PM

Ruth, you are not wrong per se, I look at the Roud Index quite a bit,
for help and information too. I think for right now, I was looking for what songs people have in their own collections that are more frequent than others. For every obscure song there is, like Steve suggested, a Barbara Allen alongside it.

Subject: RE: Folklore: An informal unscientific question
From: Bill D
Date: 15 Apr 08 - 05:59 PM

However, the most recorded Child ballad is "Gypsy Davey" (by whatever name you wish to call it.....closely followed by "Barbry Allen" and "The Two Sisters". It may be that Gypsy Davey has become a bit better known.

Subject: RE: Folklore: An informal unscientific question
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 15 Apr 08 - 06:07 PM

Does "most popular" here mean most often sung or existing in the greatest number of variants?

Subject: RE: An informal unscientific question-widespread songs
From: irishenglish
Date: 15 Apr 08 - 06:12 PM

Thanks for the distinction McGrath, and sorry for the confusion, or lack of a solid focus. In terms of what I am personally looking for as the originator of the thread is most often sung/recorded.

Subject: RE: An informal unscientific question-widespread songs
From: GUEST,The Mole Catcher's unplugged Apprentice
Date: 15 Apr 08 - 06:16 PM

'I was looking for what songs people have in their own collections that are more frequent than others. For every obscure song there is, like Steve suggested, a Barbara Allen alongside it.'

This is a wonderful idea, no matter what some say...The mention of The Roud Index was of course an off handed plug for the goood works of the EFDSS and the VHML, on whose site The Index resides ;-)

Charlotte R

PS. I have used the said index myself quite alot, a useful tool

Subject: RE: An informal unscientific question-widespread songs
From: Ruth Archer
Date: 15 Apr 08 - 06:20 PM

No, it was a question about whether the project irishenglish plans hasn't already been successfully undertaken. There was no intention to plug EFDSS - please don't presume to speak for me.

Subject: RE: An informal unscientific question-widespread s
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 15 Apr 08 - 08:02 PM

I liked Bill D's short list, above. One thing about The Two Sisters is that there are versions that have evolved so far from each other that they have barely a line in common, yet you can still tell instantly that, in some important way, they are the same song. Also, it's easy to miss a recording of that song if you're not aware of all the different titles under which it is recorded.

Another one that has been recorded under many different names is The Golden Vanity.

My own record collection leans heavily towards the American and may feature more recordings of John Henry than any other single song.

Subject: RE: An informal unscientific question-widespread songs
From: Bill D
Date: 15 Apr 08 - 09:44 PM

Here is a longer list I have which has a slightly different count for the 'most recorded' Child Ballads. Obviously, it is only one indication of 'popularity'. It is compiled from a fairly close count of some folks who are trying to list all known recordings.

I do NOT have a similar list of songs not in the Child ballads. I presume "John Henry" and "Sweet Betsy from Pike" would be ranked high.

Ballad..............# of listings

200 - Gypsie Laddie-444
084 - Barbry Allen-229
243 - The House Carpenter-159
279 - The Jolly Beggar-159
286 - The Sweet Trinity (Golden Vanity)-149
002 - Scarborough Fair-122
289 - The Mermaid-121-
026 - The Twa Corbies-116
010 - Two Sisters-115
095 - The Maid Freed From the Gallows-114
076 - Lord Gregory (Annie of Roch Royal)-103
078 - The Unquiet Grave-07
209 - Geordie-97
012 - Lord Randal-96
248 - The Grey Cock-95
278 - The Farmers Curst Wife-93
092 - Bonnie Bee Horn (Lowlands of Holland)-91
079 - The Wife of Usher's Well-82
081 - Little Musgrave and Lady Barnard-80
274 - Our Goodman (5 Nights Drunk)-79
299 - The Trooper & the Maid-77
214 - The Braes of Yarrow-76
113 - The Great Silkie of Sule Skerry-75

Subject: RE: An informal unscientific question-widespread songs
From: irishenglish
Date: 15 Apr 08 - 10:12 PM

Bill, are the numbers from the Roud index, or another source? In any case, thanks for all that typing! Much obliged

Subject: RE: An informal unscientific question-widespread songs
From: Bill D
Date: 15 Apr 08 - 11:13 PM

The numbers? The first # is just the ballad number in Child...the number after the song is just the totals I copied from a compilation. I did not look at Roud for it.

(and *grin*, I copied & pasted, then edited. I'm not that good or dedicated a typist...note that I stopped at 23 or so)

Subject: RE: An informal unscientific question-widespread songs
From: quokka
Date: 16 Apr 08 - 02:48 AM

There is a film about old folk songs in America, it is called Songcatcher, starring Aidan Quinn and Janet McTeer. Check out Aidan Quinn singing 'When the Mountains Cry'. The film also has Iris DeMent. The singing in the film is excellent. Barbra Allen, the Two Sisters and many other old songs...well worth watching.

Subject: RE: An informal unscientific question-widespread songs
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 16 Apr 08 - 09:52 AM

The question was 'what do you think are the most widespread, most performed, most transcribed songs.?'

Given that, I think the songs must be much more ordinary than ballads from Sharp, Childs, etc.

I have a friend who teaches piano. She had a Kenyan student who knew Jingle Bells from home. 'Everybody knows Jingle Bells,' he told her.

I believe the literal answer to the question will be the names of songs such as Jingle Bells, songs so ordinary that we don't even remember we know them.

Subject: RE: An informal unscientific question-widespread songs
From: GUEST,Lighter
Date: 16 Apr 08 - 10:56 AM

"Happy Birthday" and the first stanza of "Auld Lang Syne" have got to be the two most often sung songs in the United States, followed by "Jingle Bells" and other popular Christmas carols. Brahm's Lullaby is also sung on appropriate occasions, though "Rock-a-Bye Baby" has lost ground.

On terms of raw numbers of singers, various Protestant hymns, kids' rhymes, and old sing-along favorites presumably follow.

Relatively few people actually sing the kinds of songs we're mainly interested in here on Mudcat.

Subject: RE: An informal unscientific question-widespread songs
From: Willie-O
Date: 16 Apr 08 - 11:36 AM

So, folk songs, recent or old, known to non-folkies?
Canadian sample:

Farewell to Nova Scotia
Barrett's Privateers
I'se the Bye
The Blackfly Song
Wreck of the Edmund Fitzgerald

W-O