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The state of the 'cat
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Bee Date: 30 Jul 08 - 03:54 PM Mudcat has been and is a wonderful resource for me. I very hesitantly picked up a guitar two years ago, taught myself to play, and here is one of the main places I learned some basic music theory, lots of tips on playing and singing, help when I was trying to find lyrics and figure out chord structure. I love the song origins discussions and the fine archive of music, and the links to various performers and other sources. Love the place. Long may she swim. |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Barbara Date: 30 Jul 08 - 03:22 PM "There are places I'll remember all my life... some remain." I don't hang out at Mudcat as much as I used to. It's changed and so have I. Mudcat is a river, flows clear sometimes, sometimes muddy, fast or slow, deep, shallow, through a lot of different countries, seasons. I think I loved it best when it was smaller and wittier, but nothing stays the same, ever, and "In my life, I've loved them all." Blessings, Barbara |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Sorcha Date: 29 Jul 08 - 04:25 PM Forget to log in up there at 7:52, Terry? From: GUEST Date: 28 Jul 08 - 07:52 PM |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Mr Red Date: 29 Jul 08 - 03:45 PM I have never had the 'Cat state anything, thought a lot of people put words in the feline's mouth. Speak for it, drag it kicking and screaming but you can't put a lead on a Cat without a huge fight. Some of it's claws are long. And yet when it wants some attention it fair purrrrrrrrs. The 'Cat is a true feline, fiercely independant and it's own boss. The trolls, flamers and commercial interests (you know who they are) can kick it all they want, it just demonstrates their greed, short-comings &/or lack of potty training. You can't help but notice they are around but if nobody engages they tire easily. The 'Cat has changed. But change is the only certainty in life. And for those that point-out death is a might certain, I always say: "yea, and as changes go............." |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Big Mick Date: 29 Jul 08 - 01:53 PM The 'Cat is in a fine state, thank you very much. We have a solid world wide community that is more than willing to be so much more than a voice in the ether. I remember the days that Roger describes, and it was an enchanting, and heady, time. I remember when Rick came, in fact when many of the regular, and iconic, members came. The Mudcat today is different, but it is still magical. Perhaps it has changed from a movement, to an institution, but even if that is so, the evolution, by and large, has been in a positive direction. During this past month I have experienced the love that is generated on a world wide level in an overwhelming way. In making my Paypal account available to assist open mike, I have seen in a very real way how much each of you is willing to help out a "friend never met" with hard dollars. If those two examples, plus Bruce Murdoch's CD, don't cover the spectrum of what constitutes community, I don't know what does. I remember when we did Rick's CD release party live on CIUT-FM and the community banded together, and because of the live stream, we sold CDs that night around the world, over $500.00 worth. Although I did have to follow Ken Whitely onstage, remind me NEVER to do that again........ ***LOL***. Forget the naysayers. Look at them like you look at mosquitoes when you live in a beautiful forest, just a part of the price you pay to live in paradise. We are a community, and we will stay a community. We are diverse, we will occasionally fight or disagree, but we will do it as folks that, when the chips are down, pull together, forget differences, and take care of one another. Take it from one who knows. All the loving best, Mick |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Roger in Baltimore Date: 29 Jul 08 - 01:03 PM I'm not much into navel gazing. The Mudcat has been around for over a decade. It's membership was much smaller, but still quite knowledgable. When I was new to the 'Cat, I was fairly new to computers and definitely new to the Internet. I enjoyed answering questions on various subjects and I enjoyed getting some of my questions answered. I have gotten to meet many catters face to face and found them all to be interesting people who share my interest in folk music (whatever that may be). In the early days, we had many threads asking catters to describe their interests. These days, such threads would probably quickly get too long. There were many discussions of what qualitites this forum had and should have. It really was an on-line community. People reached out to others when they were in need. People supported each other through hard times. It still has the qualities of a community, but a much larger community. The Brits have a large slice of the community, but why not. We certainly brought them in. They also have a different viewpoint and I find it interesting and educational. There are fewer questions that I answer or even know the answer to. Yet there is still much to learn. And I continue to develop the friendships I have made here both on-line and off-line. I don't surf any other forums, so I cannot compare the Mudcat to others. It is not what it used to be. What is! But it is still a community that feels like home (except maybe the Walmart has come to down and several new developments have grown up from the corn fields). If you like it stay. If not, there is a very wide world out there. Roger in Baltimore (who doesn't even live in Maryland anymore (everything changes)) |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Richard Bridge Date: 29 Jul 08 - 10:45 AM Didn't he write folk songs? |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: artbrooks Date: 29 Jul 08 - 08:15 AM The German airforce has a base...or at least has a very large force on a US base...here in New Mexico. I think their presence here was mandated after WW-1, principally because of the Zimmerman letter. |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 29 Jul 08 - 08:11 AM "(This thread really is drifting far from home.) " A typical Cat thread, then - :-) OK Tasks for Toady... 1) think of a MUSIC topic 2) research any existing threads 3) contribute something USEFUL therein 4) or start a new one and contribute something useful... 5) switch off computer... Oops Toady's not here... Ok OK Tasks for Today... 1) ... |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 29 Jul 08 - 07:05 AM Does anyone else have bases in the US? Sort of friendly reciprocity. Otherwise it looks a bit lopsided. During the Cold War I used to favour the idea that the US should shift its seat of government to Moscow and the USSR should transfer its seat of government to Washington. With modern communications it'd have been be easy enough, if a bit inconvenient at times, and it would reduce the likelihood of them bombing hell out of each other. Maybe something like that could be worked out for Israel and Iran... (This thread really is drifting far from home.) |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 29 Jul 08 - 06:32 AM "the US has never needed bases in Australia to be in deep shit." Quite right! The US does not NEED the bases so it can be in deep shit - it can manage that quite well by itself! However the bases have been here for for ages, and are so secret that we Aussies are not even allowed to know what goes on in them! However, by reading US Pentagon & White House press releases, we have learned that the USA would be in deep shit WITHOUT them! :-) They are so secret that all the secret satellite and other cutting edge military stuff wouldn't work without them, the US tells us. :-) |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Andrez Date: 29 Jul 08 - 05:59 AM Just a random observation and quite off thread but here goes: the US has never needed bases in Australia to be in deep shit. Think about it, the only country ever to drop a nucleqr weapon on a human population and ever since then pretending to be the worlds nuclear cop! On the other hand everyone gets something different from the 'cat and thats how it should be. The thread about Mick and the loss in his family and the response from friends and strangers as well as Mick (god bless yer) himself, plus the feelings and tears that the thread evoked in me, shows more clearly than any theorising that there is something very special at the core of this community. Its called a heart.............. which of course Neddy, is the source of all musical expression. Anything else that can be found on the 'cat is just a sheer bloody bonus. Cheers, Andrez |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 28 Jul 08 - 10:22 PM "If having bases is the requisite to be a state, UK has been a State since 1943" Trumped again, ya whinging Pom! They took _US_ over first - something to do with the Japanese bombing the crap out of the US bases in the Pacific.... :-P Australia had MacArthur, ya know.... never sure just whose side HE was on, btw.... :-) |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: quokka Date: 28 Jul 08 - 08:56 PM DO they have bases here in Oz??!! You should see what happens if you tried to go near one of 'em!Ever heard of Pine Gap? As to why...well apparently we're the 'deputy sheriff' in this part of the world, according to the shrub. |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Leadfingers Date: 28 Jul 08 - 08:47 PM If having bases is the requisite to be a state , UK has been a State since 1943 !!! |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: artbrooks Date: 28 Jul 08 - 08:25 PM Does the US have bases in Australia? Why? |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: GUEST Date: 28 Jul 08 - 07:52 PM See LTS pretending to work 0747AM Two people in Chat , someone else came in , didnt post any thing at all for several minutes and would not explain why they did this ! One person left and the lurker left immediately .This is why MudChat does not get used very often , as this happens FAR too often ! |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 28 Jul 08 - 07:28 PM Please! Australia has been the de facto 51st state since WWII!!!! The US would be in deep shit without the US bases here! |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Lizzie Cornish 1 Date: 28 Jul 08 - 04:50 PM The State of The Cat has never been lovelier! Between the threads for Laurel, Mick and Bruce, lies love and support, from a real 'community'. And it's far outweighing all the hatred that has been on here for so long. About time. |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Bobert Date: 28 Jul 08 - 09:33 AM 'er is is it the 51st??? No matter, it will be an honor... Now we need a couple Senators and maybe a Rep 'er two... And a Governor, too... I nominate LH for Governor 'cause he's purdy smart boy far as I can see... I reckon we oughtta have some balance with our Seantors so why not Ron Davies and T-Bird... Amos is a sho in for the House of Reps... They tend to be more open minded and I think he'd do a bang up job... Maybe CarolC as another... How nmany House seats we gonna get, anyway??? Rap and Skivz would do purdy good, too is we get four and if it's five then I'd like DougieR 'cause he needs something to do... I'll volunteer to be the state treasurer so ya'll just fill up an envelope with yer spare cash and mail it to me... Okay??? What else??? B;~) |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Bobert Date: 28 Jul 08 - 09:26 AM Are we gonna get the 52nd star on the flag??? |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: GUEST,DV Date: 28 Jul 08 - 09:21 AM Thanks, that's essentially what I've done. My expectations when I came met with a very different reality, but since I'm here, I'm obviously comfortable enough with it for now. When I saw the link to a site about "American folk and blues" I expected there to be far more ethnic cultures' music traditions to be represented. They aren't, and as some of you graciously point out, the emphasis here is on British and Anglo American folk music traditions and popular music more than say, Cajun or Native American country. And that is fine. It just wasn't what I expected, and I'm sure those sorts of music traditions get discussed too on occasion. |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: artbrooks Date: 28 Jul 08 - 08:56 AM DV, my own opinion is that the discussions "above the line" are a pretty mixed bag. They primarily involve English-language music...which is reasonable since this is an English-language site. My own highly unscientific survey of what is there right now is 19 threads involving American (US) music, 21 involving music from the UK (England and Scotland only, at the moment), 14 from other countries (which includes Canada and Ireland), 26 that are unidentifiable without opening the thread, and 17 that aren't about "national" music, per se. The latter group includes obituaries, inquiries about instruments, and this discussion. One thing about the Brit threads is that they use this forum more than Americans do for "what is happening where" information. As for folk vs. popular? The question of "what is folk" comes up regularly, and there has never been any consensus on it. My recommendation would be to read what interests you, get into whatever discussions float your boat, and ignore the rest...and welcome to the 'Cat. |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Richard Bridge Date: 28 Jul 08 - 08:36 AM I am sure you are welcome, DV. Go for it - and if you want to be specific about what you are discussing you can always be clear whether it is American traditional or American composed folk. One interesting overlap is that qute a range of English folk songs that we have preserved today were preserved in the Appalachians and reintroducd into the UK |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 28 Jul 08 - 08:31 AM "I still wonder how many of the people who post contentious S**t stirring stuff here ever actually SUPPORT any kind of live music , either as a performer or as a listener !" I'm with you LF.... :-) ESPECIALLY as a performer... |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: GUEST,DV Date: 28 Jul 08 - 07:59 AM Being a relative newcomer, I have to say I'm surprised at the narrowness of the music discussed here. Seems mostly to be a British folk site, with occasional conversations about American and British popular music. Not what I expected at all, when I followed links from another site, looking for American folk and blues music. I thought perhaps there was a summer lull. |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: GUEST,LTS pretending to work Date: 28 Jul 08 - 07:47 AM A reason the Chat has been under populated for a while is possibly due to some people who treated it as their own territory and actually warned others off, forbidding them use of it. People didn't want to sit through the diatribes that were being publicly voiced and so got out of the habit of frequenting the Chat. This problem has hopefully been resolved. I check in there often still, there are times when there are people there, but not always when I'm at a computer I can log onto the chat with, so I cannot enter and chat. LTS |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Leadfingers Date: 28 Jul 08 - 07:43 AM The Cat is not doing to badly , despite the Trolls and Nit Pickers ! I still wonder how many of the people who post contentious S**t stirring stuff here ever actually SUPPORT any kind of live music , either as a performer or as a listener ! |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: melodeonboy Date: 28 Jul 08 - 07:36 AM I log on to the Mudcat site more than any other. Why? Because it nearly always informs me, it usually makes me think and it often makes me laugh. Admittedly, I occasionally irritate others and they occasionally irritate me, but we are only human, after all. No decent music discussion forum is going to be completely free of trolls and tub-thumpers; again, the human condition. And the state of it (to answer the question)? Bloody good. Generally vibrant and healthy. Well done, Joe, and thanks. |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Richard Bridge Date: 28 Jul 08 - 04:28 AM My understanding of the country side of things is distant - it is not my chosen music, but I have read (here) that country is now stylistically distinct from country and Western, and that in some country circles the debate "is teh modern music really country, or s it just pop" is heard - but there is no touchstone equivalant to folk's much argued 1954 definition. Blues nowadays worries me. How can pretty well any modern musician relate to the concerns expressed or exemplified in most early blues? On the other hand, Chicago blues fathered (IMHO) the great rock and pop era of the late 60s and early 70s although I am less clear of its conection to what was then called "soul". The absence of discussions related to those communities perhaps indicates that the 'cat has changed (if it was ever like that) much as some would argue that folk has moved on and is no longer the ethnomusicologist's concept that spawned the 1954 definition. Oddly, I went looking the other day for the "folk and blues" mission statement that I was sure I remembered from the days when I first came here, but could no longer find it. Has it gone? Did I dream it? But I and many others still come here several times a day, so it must be doing something right! |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: TheSnail Date: 28 Jul 08 - 04:18 AM GUEST,punkfolkrocker the sad old hairy beardy hippy with violin I resemble that remark! |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker Date: 28 Jul 08 - 01:30 AM taken alka seltzer.. vitamins and anti constipation fibre drink.. middle age is a b@gger.. anyway.. bedtime very soon.. so.. dont know how 'folk' Buddy Holly is but without him, there would most probably be no Beatles as we know them.. and consequently, no folk clubs dominated by rich posh accountants and lawers with top ££$$ deluxe US guitars in spotless white shirts and levis playing non stop Beatles songbook to the exclusion of the sad old hairy beardy hippy with violin who just turned up on the vague chance they'd let him fiddle some old english morris melodies.. errmm... google 'purple chick buddy holly' g'night |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker Date: 28 Jul 08 - 01:15 AM hi Joe.. total respect to you as always.. cant be a tougher voluntary job than yours..!!! whatever name i use on the weekends you can usually determine me by my IP and drunken writing style.. in real life i'm a happy non aggressive drunk.. same for me here. but sorry.. i'm an aging bolshy lefty.. and if i get deleted & denied expresion when i feel i'm making a sort of serious my kinda humour point of view.. specially if it took at least half an hour to string the words together and struggle to get them 2 finger typewritten down then i'm bound to argue for the sake and fun of it.. guess i'm not unusual amongst the thousands of folks who enjoy larking, loiteringing, and louting here.. cheers joe.... ps.. drunk far more than i did last night.. but somehow just feelin mellow.. ps.. theres a cracking 10 CD bootleg Buddy Holly boxset out on torrent just now |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Joe Offer Date: 28 Jul 08 - 12:48 AM You know, the policy for at least a couple years has been that we don't allow threads about Mudcat editing and Mudcat policy. There are two reasons for this:
So, this time I give up, although I hate to do this. I'm leaving this thread open, and I won't allow any editing. Let's see where it goes. Next time, though, use this as a rule of thumb: if it's the kind of thread that always ends up a big fight, Dont Start It!!!! -Joe Offer, Forum Moderator- |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker Date: 28 Jul 08 - 12:27 AM i love our music and truly consider mudcat to be one of the best and most serious international discussion forums for the 'likes of us' i'm also a very happy weekend ciderhead.. so.. I am very well aware of the contrasting UK/US mod delete cultures here.. basicly, UK time weekends midnight to 5 or 6 am.. any thing we daft drunk brits might think is funny will get deleted.. weekdays, most any sh@te we post will probably be tolerated and left for posterity.. ??? ps.. I remember and respected Shambles... !!!?? |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 27 Jul 08 - 09:05 PM Threads get closed and deleted. Shit happens. Re BS threads - actually some of those started by WAV below the line DO have a lot of very good music info in! While I may not agree with his viewpoint, sometimes some of the discussions do cover very serious ground, and everybody is free to ignore any advice therein.... :-) "There never seems to anyone in chat these days! Why?" Well, I can't afford the resources on my PC to just sit in there any more, as browsers etc get more demanding of processor time, RAM, dialup etc. If you REALLY want to chat 1) sit in there when nobody else is in there - then the chat room shows that someone is in there! This encourages others to enter! 2) note that if someone is already IN there, they may be busty... er BUSY (!!!) doing other things and may not notice you turning up for oooo say, 10-15 mins - not everybody will be just staring at a blank screen for hours waiting for words of wisdom from somebody else! :-) |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: pdq Date: 27 Jul 08 - 08:04 PM The man who started the Grand Ole Opry broadcasts on WSM (November, 1925) said he was playing America's folk music. The term "Country" was once "Country & Western", as distinguised from "Classical", "Popular" and "Rhythm & Blues". They come from the need to separate music into different categories for radio station programming purposes. |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Brakn Date: 27 Jul 08 - 07:47 PM "What's wrong with the Mudcat" Was it that bad? |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: McGrath of Harlow Date: 27 Jul 08 - 07:08 PM So does this count as a music thread or not? I think below the line is just as much core Mudcat as above it anyway. Good threads can come out of either - and so can bad threads, of course. Rules of thumb like "music thread good, BS thread bad" are just as much nonsense as "warm fuzzy thread good, argumentative thread bad". I agree that the relationship between country and "folk" is potentially interesting. More especially when it come the varieties of both where stylistically they are more or less identical. |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: TheSnail Date: 27 Jul 08 - 07:03 PM I was a little curious about the "What's wrong with the Mudcat" thread. I've never noticed a thread being completely deleted rather tnan closed before and it didn't seem to be getting particularly out of hand last time I saw it. What happened? |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: Sue the Borderer Date: 27 Jul 08 - 06:53 PM Pardon, Skipy? It didn't look below the line to me. |
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Subject: RE: The state of the 'cat From: skipy Date: 27 Jul 08 - 06:31 PM There never seems to anyone in chat these days! Why? & Why is my thread about White Horse Folk Festival "below the line"? Who decides which festivals can be "above the line"? What secret club am I not a member of? Please let me know so that I don't join it! Skipy |
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Subject: The state of the 'cat From: Richard Bridge Date: 27 Jul 08 - 06:22 PM I am NOT trying for a reprise of the deleted thread about "What's wrong with the Mudcat. Nonetheless, It may be noteworthy that the proportion of BS threads to above the line threads seems very low to me at the moment - which suggests that the 'cat is more focussed at present on its core functions (folk, at least - although blues, an aspect of folk, seem conspicuous by its absence at the moment) than of yore. Either that or the mods are committing genocide on a wholesale basis. We have at least one thoughtful "What is Folk" (the rap one) thread where (apart from the usual quadrupeds) some thought actually seems to be being given about the central question of our presence. We have some threads actually about songs/tunes. Nobody seems to be saying "Here's my address - I'll have the chainsaw running" right now [OK, guilty, I have said it before]. Many people seem to log in several times a day. Where else would I go for threads about which tune for Byker Hill is which and which is more trad than the others? It might be interesting to discuss the core differences between country and folk - in country of course there is no 1954 definition or equvalent so I suggest it is a matter of style rather than origin. Last time I suggested such a thread it died quite fast. Yes, I think the 'cat is doing OK. |
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