Dogs at Festival

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: The Fooles Troupe
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 07:11 PM

Over 400 posts.

Has this thread gone to the dogs?

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Folkiedave
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 07:02 PM

As a dog owner. No dogs no me

I think that is an attitude to be applauded.

Clearly the dog means more to you than the festival and that is your choice.

As far as children and their behaviour is concerned festivals do make special arrangements for them. At Bromyard for example it was Jan and Dr. Sunshine.

And I have never been bitten by a child (at a festival or elsewhere) I have been bitten by a dog, and the thread was started because of a dog biting a child at a festival. Of course children can be annoying - none more than my own two daughters when they went through the teen years. We tried hard to stop them annoying people, and then stopped taking them to festivals as soon as we could.

One became a festival organiser.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: GUEST,not a do owner
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 06:35 PM

sensible suggestion from Wysiwig there I thought.

Scooby - why shouldn't stewards enforce the rules for dog owners same as all other rules, whatever the festival decides they are? at most festivals it would be a stewards job to ask somebody to stop making noise in the middle of the night, for example. If somebody is such a nuisance that they are asked to leave the festival, it often does become an issue for festival directors to step in but warnings etc usually come from the stewards at first.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: fiddler
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 05:06 PM

As a dog owner

No dogs no me

dog allowed - keep them under control

Clear upo after them if they disgrace you.

End of story

No controversy just plain logic and consideration for your folking buddies.

Is there really any other route.

Heavens mine spent a week backstage at the aham and everyone nejoyed h is company. I hope.

Andy

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Blowzabella
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 03:38 PM

Personally I find all drunks and most children much more of a nuisance than some dogs. I can't do html, so can't embolden any of my text but iff I say ALL drunks, MOST children, SOME dogs .... you get the general order of my own annoyances. Why should my annoyances be of any less import than ... say ... Dave's??

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Scooby Doo
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 03:04 PM

Why should stewards do a dog enforcement notice.It should be the festival organiser like Sandra who started this thread.


Scooby.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: wysiwyg
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 02:27 PM

I have not read the whole thread. I did read the first post. It toiok me awhile to condense my thgouhts, and I hope it's not too late to share a possibly-cogent thought.

My first reaction was, why don't campground rules cover this? At US campgrounds, there is no exception to the rule that dogs must be short-leashed whenever they are outside the RV, tent, or cabin. They can't be left unattended (tied out or in the campsite), either. Campground personnel can evict an owner who does not observe this, or any owner whose dog is not under control, or campers whose dogs bark excessively or violate the quiet-after-bedtime rules. I believe proof of rabies vaccination is required at registration.

Can't that just be Festival Policy and enforced by stewards?

~S~

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Banjiman
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 02:22 PM

....but you could ban alcohol (as they do at a lot of Bluegrass festivals in the States I understand) as there is a risk that someone might drink too much and hurt someone!

A greater risk than a dog hurting someone I'd dare say.

Or we could just live and let live?

Paul

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Folkiedave
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 01:45 PM

Massive restrictions on dog owners? There are already massive restrictions on dog owners - some of which dog owners ignore. I didn't go to the ceilidh tent at Bromyard so I can't comment but I certainly never saw a dog in the main marquee.

So dog owners accepted restrictions at Bromyard. They also don't take them into restaurants - except some places of course who don't see this as a problem - which is most restaurants as I am sure you are aware. I have never seen a dog in a cinema, theatre, supermarket or a hospital or classical music concert. Large numbers of hotels don't allow dogs and you have to keep them outside school gates.

So the idea that dog owners have some kind of freedom to act as they wish with their dogs without restriction and that asking them to leave them at home for a folk festival is some kind of big new deal is patent nonsense. As some dog owners on this thread have attested they would never dream of taking a dog to a festival.

I have yet to discover why a dog is a nuisance inside a tent and thus barred and not outside a tent.

And unfortunately Baz and you have my sympathy, it is impossible to bar drunks from folk festivals - much as it is to bar them from anywhere else. But it is possible (easily) to bar dogs.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: GUEST,baz parkes
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 12:28 PM

Dave...your comments on Bromyard reminded me it was actually the second festival I ever went to.

I had my 3 front teeth knocked put by some drunk wielding a wheel brace (not sure if he was tattooed Paul:-)). This didn't put me off festivals, especially Bromyard, or drunks or wheelbraces.

I think I know why I'm posting this,but...

Baz

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: strad
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 12:00 PM

Like some dogs - don't like some dogs - hate all midges..BAN THEM!!

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 11:20 AM

400 - but I'm not coming back to this thread

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Banjiman
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 11:11 AM

"More concerned about wild (not so young) children in increasing numbers nowadays at folk festivals! Perhaps we need a special roped off area for them...!"

Or keep them on leads........or maybe ban them completely? They are so noisy and disruptive!

....and peole with tattoos really bother me as well, I once (actually twice) got hit by someone with a tattoo.... therefore I come to the considered, rational opinion that there must be a signiificant risk of anyone with a tattoo hitting people. That is my experience so it must be right!!!

Paul

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Muffin
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 10:52 AM

Bromyard discussed this last year and implemented an "Assistance Dogs Only" policy in the venues.

This worked very well in the ceilidh tent. The policy being clearly signed also meant that even the owner of a dear broken-legged, recuperating puppy (aaaa!) appreciated why he was asked to remove the dog.

Not aware that ticket sales were affected!

More concerned about wild (not so young) children in increasing numbers nowadays at folk festivals! Perhaps we need a special roped off area for them...!

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: GUEST,not a dog owner
Date: 16 Sep 08 - 10:11 AM

aagh wrong key again, have moved my keyboard and keep hitting enter by mistake... sorry...

"Both of these suggestions will stop the presence of dogs worrying those who do not wish their weekend spoiled by other people's love of dogs. To me they seem eminently reasonable suggestions with an eminently reasonable charge. "

to me they don't seem eminently reasonable because I think the risk of something bad happening is pretty small and you are suggesting placing a massive restriction on dog owners. Some of your objections to dogs seem to be down to annoyance factors rather than actual danger factors, and I don't think its fair to single out one group (dog owners) for annoying things, when you don't seem to want to place similar restrictions on other annoying things.

Your segregated areas suggestion sounds so restricted that actually anybody who took a dog to a festival with that set up may as well not be there - in which case you may as well go for your total ban option.

Fair enough to have some restrictions in place to try and minimise risks of actual injury, but I think I agree with others here who don't want to live in a risk free society. It sounds like you have been particularly unlucky with dog incidents in your past Dave - for which you have my sympathies. But in my own experience and that of my friends I have never come across a single incident at a festival like the ones you have described which does make me think that such things are thankfully pretty rare.

(Btw, dogs with muddy feet jumping up are not, to me, in the same category as being bitten. Mud is an annoyance to be sure. The b****rd who smeared coleslaw on my tent at a festival a few years back was a massive annoyance too. Ban coleslaw at festivals!!)

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Folkiedave
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 12:38 PM

Fred, you are still defending the existence of dogs as pets and giving us a detailed history of their development and eyesight and no doubt you have a detailed knowledge of the development of the bio-degradable dog shit bag. I am really not bothered.

I am bothered about people being having issues with dogs at festivals including them being bitten. You can of course ignore the question and hope it may go away.

I have made two practical suggestions: 1) to ban them completely as happens elsewhere and 2) to have a separate area where they and their owners can camp and do doggy things together. They can look after the dogs and make sure they don't crap where other festival goers go. Small charge for this facility. Say £10.00 per dog.

Both of these suggestions will stop the presence of dogs worrying those who do not wish their weekend spoiled by other people's love of dogs. To me they seem eminently reasonable suggestions with an eminently reasonable charge.

So far your solution has been to keep the dog on a lead. Well one of the dogs that bit me was on a lead, and the dogs at Bromyard referred to by me and Snuffy this weekend at Bromyard were on leads. As someone had pointed out dogs on leads can still bite.

Guest - not a dog owner.

I have been away at Bromyard and had not fully kept up with the thread for three days. Sorry about that. As to your suggestion..........

I assume you are saying practical restrictions (no dogs in bars or in venues, dogs on leads at all times etc etc).

I just want to extend that to camping (if we agree on keeping them out of venues then it is only an extension of that). It would have been hard to provide a doggy area at Bromyard - you would have needed one area for dog owners in caravans and another for dog owners in tents and motor homes etc.....BUT it would have been easy to say no dogs on the main festival site, stay in the fields (camping area).

Where camping is mixed; caravans, camping vans and tents all together - then it would be easy to provide a separate area.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: GUEST,not a dog owner
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 11:29 AM

oops, hit the wrong key there.

was almost going to ask Dave what he thought of the suggestion I made above lost in the mists of posts.. then decided not to bother since
a) he's already clearly made the suggestions he wants to make and doesn't seem that interested in mine and
b) I've almost lost the will to live.

was also thinking about re-iterating my point about the difference between actual risk of physical harm and annoyance, and why I think they are separate issues... but then see b) above...

oh well.

not sure where dog eyesight has to do with anything. also not sure why somebody thought Dave lives in the states, when he doesn't, but a misunderstanding methinks. easy done, no need to nitpick... ah, but it's mudcat!!

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 11:03 AM

Longsighted doesn't mean you can see a long way. It means you can't focus on things close up. It's the wrong description here. Human eyes, given good health or a decent pair of specs, are just as capable of focusing to infinity as a dog's or a pair of binoculars or the Hubble telescope. Like our eyes, and unlike the bins or telescope, they can't magnify. They lack the acuity of vision of human eyes as the macula is absent. Of course, their eyesight in adapted to hunting in tandem with their other senses, but their eyes are not superior to ours in any way, and are inferior in some respects. Poor colour vision, poor acuity...they're just good for the job in hand. That job does not include shitting all over the place and biting kids in festivals, etc.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 10:52 AM

"Apropos of doggie eyesight, just google "dog eyesight" and you'll get abundant links all of which will confirm that dogs's eyesight is very compromised compared to that of humans.   When you read a detailed post and find one serious inaccuracy of this sort you do have to wonder about the reliability of the rest of the post."

Steve. Here's the low down on dog's eyesight. It is true that dogs cannot see very well close up. Also, they see almost in monochrome, or at any rate cannot distinguish colours easily. The point I was getting at is that dog's eyes are very good for long distance hunting, not for close up work. That is because they have a much wider angle of vision than we have and they tend towards lateral vision where ours is binocular. That enables them to see prey over a greater angular range than we can. What's more they are longsighted. That means they can also see prey at a much greater distance than we can.

Think about it. It's logical. When a prey is a long way off, even a highly developed sense of scent would not be much use in locating that prey. But a dog whose eyes have evolved to allow it to see a prey when it's a long way off, can use its sense of smell when it gets close enough to smell it.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: theleveller
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 10:40 AM

That's an extremely Volvoist remark. (Now if you'd said a BMW.....)

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 09:33 AM

"Even female hedgehogs have pricks!"


Q. What's the difference between a hedgehog and a Volvo estate?

A. With a hedgehog the pricks are on the outside...

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Proogle
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 09:25 AM

OK there are waaaaayyy too many posts here for me to follow and if someone has pointed this out i salute you!

Dogs on Leads can still bite!!!

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 09:25 AM

Apropos of doggie eyesight, just google "dog eyesight" and you'll get abundant links all of which will confirm that dogs's eyesight is very compromised compared to that of humans.   When you read a detailed post and find one serious inaccuracy of this sort you do have to wonder about the reliability of the rest of the post.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Folkiedave
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 09:19 AM

Me too. I live in Sheffield.

And when my daughter was bitten in France the law hadn't changed at that time. So she had the anit-rabies jabs.

Of course it is a matter of personal responsibility. The problem is that by the time the dog has acted irresponsibly it is often too late.

As in "ohhhh he's never done that before".

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Folkiedave
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 09:15 AM

I personally would not take my young dog into a venue as he may disturb people.

So if you wouldn't take a dog into a venue since he may disturb people is it OK for the dog to disturb people outside the venue and if so how does the dog know the difference.

And I have seen dogs lying quietly under seats all over the place, not just at festivals. Well they lay quietly until some human trod on them.

Do you go to Cheltenham Festival? Do they allow dogs in their venues?

I suspect not.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 09:14 AM

I'm still trying to work out who it is who lives in the States.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Folkiedave
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 09:11 AM

Guest dog owner.

People do not have dogs that bite children. Do you seriously think that my friends thought they had a dog that would scar a child for life?

Well they don't now.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Folkiedave
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 09:08 AM

I saw that Snuffy. Making my way to the toilets at the time.

I didn't see the dog scraping its paws down you though. Condolences. But it was probably only playing and he's never done that before anyway. Dog lovers will probably tell you it comes from their pre-domestication days. Inheritance. You can't stop it. Dogs do that. And as you say - no harm done. Learn to live with it.

After all they are almost human aren't they? Dogs I mean - not morris dancers.

Dave (Sheffield City Morris).

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: GUEST,dog owner
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 09:00 AM

I must apologise, I read Folkiedave's post as it was from Steve Shaw (maybe a similar tone) but sorry to Steve, I was answering Folkiedave's post.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: GUEST,dog owner
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 08:52 AM

I think perhaps you have a different viewpoint to some other people Steve as you live in the States?
We do not have a problem with rabies in England, where the question for the thread originated from.

I personally would not take my young dog into a venue as he may disturb people.
I have seen many other dogs quietly lying by/under chairs causing no disturbance.

I also would not have a dog that would bite a child. I have dogs, I have children. My dogs can easily be separated in the house from the children, and my children are taught to behave responsibly around dogs.

I think, Steve, it's all a matter of responsibility, which of necessity is a personal issue, which possibly makes debates like this useless.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Snuffy
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 08:50 AM

Trying to make my way through the mudbath of Bromyard on Saturday morning in preparation for a day of morris dancing in town, I was just congratulating myself for reaching the "safety" of the mud-free artificial roadway.

I was following a couple, each with a dog on a longish lead. As we reached the craft centre one of these dogs started squaring up to the previously mentioned cone dog. Giving them as wide a berth as possible without stepping off the roadway into the mud, you can imagine my delight when the non-combative dog took full advantage of the length of lead allowed him, and decided to show me how "friendly" he/she was by rearing up and dragging a pair of muddy paws all the way down each leg of my morris trousers.

Not the end of the world - no bloodshed, injury or disease, just a bit of ridding from fellow morris men. But it was a significant downer for me, and has certainly changed my attitude to dogs at festivals. Control of your dog must be absolute and constant - a second's inattention is all it takes to recuit more dog-haters.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Folkiedave
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 08:07 AM

they carry small plastic bags (often bio-degradeable) designed for the purpose So they either get the dog to shit in the small plastic bag or they were grovelling away in the mud to pick up the dogs' shit. Nice.

Fred this is not about dog knowledge, mine yours or anyone elses. It is about whether dogs should be allowed into festivals to crap on the grass, bark during the night and during performances, have dog fights and bite children. All of those things have been attested to in this thread.

I personally don't need to "know" about dogs to see their behaviour. My own experience of being bitten twice and sitting with my four year old daughter for the best part of a week whilst they had a series of anti-rabies injections (and worrying whether they had rabies or not and if the serum had arrived in time) told me most of what I need to know about dogs.

Two friends had a dog - they don't have it any longer because it bit their two year old child on the face and scarred her for life. Their own child Fred. Scarred for life. Nice, eh?

So when you have sat in a hospital for period of time with a screaming four year old having anti-rabies injections, and had a dog destroyed because it scarred your own two year old for life, come back and tell me you know all about dogs. Or perhaps your own experience doesn't extend that far?

Now back to dogs at festivals.

Be kind enough to say whether you think dogs should be allowed into venues and if not why not?

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: the lemonade lady
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 07:43 AM

Actually I think it's ok to have dogs at festivals so long as they don't bark at night. I try to remember to put a bowl of water under my trailer for the mutt so that it gets a drink as well as it's owner.

Sal

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: theleveller
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 07:38 AM

"There's a hedgehog that keeps stealing my cat's food.
Should he be banned"

Are you sure it's a 'he'? Even female hegehogs have pricks!

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Midchuck
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 07:22 AM

Minor correction:

Dogs can run further and faster than we can can.

Dogs can definitely run faster than we can. Almost any four-legged animal can. Virtually nothing living can run, continuously, further - albeit relatively slowly - than a healthy human in proper shape. We've lost awareness of that fact because almost none of us are in proper shape.

That, as well as tool using, language, and (I would have said until the present Presidential campaign, abstract thought) are what allowed us to dominate the planet to the point where our survival is in danger.

Peter.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 07:17 AM

I don't go around calling people with whom I happen to disagree "lower forms of human life," or suggest they need anger management psychology. Funny people, some of these doggie lovers!   Now I think it best if you and I confine ourselves to talking to people other than each other, Fred old chap. Naturally, I await with pleasure your final volley.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 07:06 AM

Dogs have extremely good long distance sight. and a pack of dogs is very good at bringing down a large quarry.

"And there's absolutely no need to get rude and insulting."

Indeed. Why do you do it?

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 07:06 AM

There's a hedgehog that keeps stealing my cat's food.
Should he be banned, or charged an entrance fee to my kitchen?
Or perhaps to form a band to include every musician that ever set foot in the North East?
Or else provide another songwriting opportunity for Mike Heron?

Answers on small postcards.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 07:00 AM

And there's absolutely no need to get rude and insulting.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 06:57 AM

All very neat, Fred, but I fear the truth is probably far more prosaic. The relationship started when wild carnivores, including doggie relations, started to hang around human dwellings feeding on the discarded remains of animal carcasses. The animals had better teeth than humans for stripping the last remnants of meat from the bone. The humans would have tolerated this as it kept the hungry animals from getting too close and it also cleared away remains which could otherwise have festered and caused disease.   Today, we see scavenging dogs and foxes in an entirely different light, but in those times there were no weekly collections, tin cans or plastic dustbins. The point is that the humans were already useful hunters, making up in guile what they lacked in pace.   The kind of small prey that dogs could catch would not have been of much interest to the humans. Few birds were available for dogs to catch (no guns huh?) and there were no rabbits (and probably no hares) as these were introduced much later.

And dogs have pretty rotten eyesight.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 06:50 AM

Like I said. Lower forms of human life and sarcasm.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 06:45 AM

Wasps are incredibly useful creatures earlier in the season, consuming large numbers of nuisance insects, and their nests are of course things of beauty. It's just those redundant workers later in the summer, once the nest work had been done, that cause the trouble. It's idle hands doing the devil's work. They even get drunk feeding on fermenting fruit - an amusing sight. Most of the time they're just exploiting the damage already started by birds. Cut 'em a bit of slack - they hardly ever sting and they're gorgeous to look at close up.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 06:43 AM

Sorry Dave. When did your name become Steve?

Anyway, while I'm no expert on human evolution, I suspect that Blowzabella has got hold it slightly wrong. My understanding is that serious changes to the world's climate forced our tree dwelling primate ancestors to become plains dwellers, thereby forcing them to compete with animals who were much bigger and faster and more powerful than they.

As a result, primates, who were already considerably smarter than most other animals, became even smarter. In effect they survived by banding together and developing complicated stratagems for hunting, for protection against other animals, and for sharing out the spoils of the hunt.

Thus it was that humanity developed what are far and away the most complex forms of social organisation in the animal world. Complex forms of social organisation call for unusually large brain sizes, and that is precisely what we've got.

Nevertheless, early primate hunting methods must have been pretty crude and pretty ineffective, consisting of sneaking up on a prey and battering it to death with clubs; always assuming the prey doesn't get up and fight back or run off. So early man must have been forced to spend most of the waking day on a never ending quest for easy meat.

As far as I know, none of the primate species developed much of a sense of smell, since most of them are vegetation eaters, and what few carnivores exist among the tree dwelling primates capture their quarry by sheer mass action. Therefore, they did not need a sense of smell when they dwelt in the trees. Nor would the hunting tactics which they adopted when they settled on the plains have called for one.

However, mankind is extremely good at adapting its environment and using things which other animals possess to its advantage. Therefore, while humans were sneaking predators, rather than chasing predators, the advantages of forming alliances with dogs must have been pretty obvious. Dogs can run further and faster than we can can. They can smell their quarry from a considerable distance, and their long distance sight is much better than ours. What's more, they can be trained to bring the quarry back to the rest of the pack.

in other words, humans became much more more effective hunters as a result of dog domestication. That in turn left us with a redundancy of brain capacity. That is because, where our thought processes were previously bound up with hunting, we now had time and space to think about other matters. Hence, our ability to philosophise and to express ourselves through music, language, art etc. And hence the capacity of some of the lower forms of human life to indulge in cheap sarcasm.

So overall, yes. Our symbiotic relationship with dogs probably played an important in human progress. It is in no small measure because of the domestication of the dog that I can enjoy music and read poetry and watch drama and muse on the wonders of nature. Thanks dogs.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 06:31 AM

Should have added that I saw a busker yesterday in Islington with a ginger cat wrapped round his neck. It looked pleased when people threw money but fierce when people asked (frequently) whether he was glued on. Now THAT'S quality control over punters.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 06:27 AM

Hmmm. Wonder if dogs could be trained in quality control to steer you away at festivals from duff acts and people you don't want to see. Useful, possibly.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 06:25 AM

Excellent beasts, Blowza. It's just that at festivals I can find my own food by the smell of the hot-dog caravan, I don't necessarily need protecting from sabre-toothed tigers and I'll probably have left my flock of sheep at home - a convenience thing you understand.

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Blowzabella
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 06:18 AM

"It's great to know that, if we own a dog, we'll have with us at all times an expert on what other dogs' arses smell like. ;-)"

The point was that they knew what deer / hare (or whatever the local food source was) smelt like and thus were an invaluable tool in helping Man find food. They also knew what the more dangerous animals smelt like and could warn of their approach. When Man began to farm, they helped guard the flocks. etc etc

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: GUEST,Ralphie
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 06:10 AM

Wasps...Don't get me started!
Once had a mouthful of wasp with my pint at a festival.
Never had a mouthful of dog though.
(Lets not go there, you smutty lot!)

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: theleveller
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 05:56 AM

Never mind about dogs; what about wasps? Wasps are a real pest at festivals – they should definitely be banned. I mean, what IS the point of wasps? And don't tell me they're Ok as long as they're on leads – have you ever tried putting a lead on a wasp?

Subject: RE: Dogs at Festival
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 15 Sep 08 - 05:26 AM

Hey, Blowzabella, thanks for that insight! It's great to know that, if we own a dog, we'll have with us at all times an expert on what other dogs' arses smell like. ;-)

And calm down a bit, Fred old chap. I do know what the cones are really for, you know. I was just trying to be funny, that's all. You appear to have been blessed with an "American" sense of humour. ;-)