What is Zydeco?

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Azizi
Date: 24 Mar 07 - 08:29 PM

What Scoville said.

**

Here's some info from http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Music_of_Louisiana

..."Acadiana music
Acadiana has five main musical genres - Cajun music, Creole music, swamp blues, swamp pop, and zydeco. These historically-rooted genres, with unique rhythms and personalities, have been transformed with modern sounds and instruments.

Swamp pop

Main article: Swamp pop
Swamp pop came about in the mid 1950s. With the Cajun dance and musical conventions in mind, nationally popular rock, pop, country, and R&B songs were re-recorded, sometimes in French. Swamp Pop is more of a combination of many influences, and the bridge between Zydeco, New Orleans second line, and rock and roll. The song structure is pure rock and roll, the rhythms are distinctly New Orleans based, the chord changes, vocals and inflections are R&B influenced, and the lyrics are sometimes French.

Swamp blues

Main article: Swamp blues
A sparse but funky sub-genre of blues that flourished in the 1960s, swamp blues was centered in Crowley, Louisiana — home of Jay Miller's Excello Records, which recorded Louisiana-based swamp blues acts including Slim Harpo, Lazy Lester, Lightinin' Slim, and Katie Webster"...

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Azizi
Date: 24 Mar 07 - 09:03 PM

For the benefit of those on dial-up {or those who don't like to click on hyperlinks}, I think this short blurp that's the 2nd hyperlink tht Scoville provided should be posted here:

"Swamp blues, a minor but interesting genre, originated in the Baton Rouge area where musicians like Slim Harpo, Lightnin' Slim, Lonesome Sundown, and Lazy Lester developed a unique, rocking, Cajun-influenced blues style, captured after 1948 on Excello records. It appealed particularly to British rockers of the 1960s (the Rolling Stones covered Harpo's "I'm a King Bee," for instance, and the Kinks recorded Lazy Lester's "I'm a Lover Not a Fighter") and eventually contributed to the development of zydeco. Among the few surviving exemplars is "swamp boogie queen" Katie Webster. Our selection comes from Lazy Lester's Harp & Soul album, titled "Alligator Shuffle" and available on King Snake Records."

http://www.unc.edu/depts/csas/socult/music/swamp.htm

**

-snip-

Btw, and definitely off-topic, I find the title King Snake Records an interesting one for a blues record company. Here's more on King Snake Records which advertising itself as "Capturing the Groove! Music from the Florida swamps"

The reason why I find the title interesting & fitting is that Blues is so heavily associated with Southern African Americans and so is voodoo. What does voodoo have to do with any of this?

Well, imo, the name "KingSnake" is a reference to the importance of snakes in voodoo beliefs & ceremonies. Snakes were {are} important in the traditional West African religion of the Yoruba {Nigeria, Benin} religion of Vodu {also known as Ifa and Orisha/vodu} and some other traditional African religions not to mention other traditional non-African religions [think "serpents" and "dragons"]. In the United States, in the Caribbean, and in Latin America, the religion of Orisha/Vodu took the forms of Candomble, Santeria, Lucumi, and "voodoo/hoodoo".

See this post about the Snake deity Damballah in the Mudcat thread "Subject: RE: The Color Black & Snakes in Folk Culture thread.cfm?threadid=100016#2000409

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Rasener
Date: 25 Mar 07 - 02:19 AM

Thanks for that everybody.

From what I have read, I like both styles of Swamp music. I just love I'm a king bee by the Rolling Stones.

Scoville
Funny enough, the band i am interested in is R Cajun who are mentioned on the site you put a link for Swamp Music Website.

I have listened and watched vidoes of them and just love what they do.

Ah well lets hope it works out and R Cajun come to my neck of the woods :-)

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: GUEST,sally the lemonade lady cookieless and lazy
Date: 25 Mar 07 - 02:52 PM

http://joeletaxi.co.uk/newrelease.htm try this

sal

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Rasener
Date: 25 Mar 07 - 03:15 PM

Here is their Myspace website
http://www.myspace.com/joeletaxiandthezydecoband

And this is yours Sally
http://joeletaxi.co.uk/newrelease.htm

Thanks for posting Sally

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: melodeonboy
Date: 25 Mar 07 - 07:39 PM

Villan: have a shufti at this site:

www.cajunuk.co.uk

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Rasener
Date: 26 Mar 07 - 01:56 AM

melodeonboy - when you do a link, you need to make sure the http:// is at the front of the link, otherwise it won't work on Mudcat.

Anyway I have updated the link and thanks for taking the trouble to alert me to the link.

http://www.cajunuk.co.uk/

I will have a look later in the day.

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: PoppaGator
Date: 26 Mar 07 - 05:47 PM

"Swamp pop" comes from Louisiana, but it's really quite different from the more tradition-based "roots" genres mentioned in this thread (Zydeco, Cajun, even "swamp blues.)

The term is generally applied to 50s-era rock/pop performed and recorded by south-Louisiana artists and entrepreneurs who were trying to sound "mainstream" and tap into the nationwide teenage market ~ emphatically not embracing their Cajun/Creole roots. I think that an innate musicality and "good-timey" feeling comes through that betrays their heritage despite every effort to produce "All-American" radio hits. The genre, such as it is, can also be characterized by simple production values and (often) some fairly strong harmony singing.

Pretty much without exception, the artists' real family names were French names unfamiliar to Americans outside south Louisiana, but they routinely adopted Anglo-sounding stage names (always simple and hopefully memorable, usually alliterative).

The only way I know of to convey the shared characteristics of "swamp pop" songs is simply to give examples; listing some titles and srtists will help, but only for those old enough to remember hearing the songs. For others, you'd have to be able to listen to several recordings, and then draw your own conclusions.

I'll try to look up some examples laster tonight at home and post them, hopefully including audio links if possible. Right now, at work, the only two I can think of off the top of my head are "Sea of Love" and "I'm Leaving It All Up to You," and I can't even remember the artists' names.

Frankie Ford's "Sea Cruise" was a huge hit that almost fits the definition of "swamp pop." It's a good example of the general sound and feeling. However, Frankie was (and still is) a New Orleanian, not from out in Cajun-land, and I'm pretty sure that his real last name is Italian rather than French.

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Rasener
Date: 26 Mar 07 - 11:57 PM

That would be great Poppagator.

Sea Of Love (which happens to be a very great favourite of mine, but by Marty Wilde in the UK) was written by Phil Phillips (born John Phillip Baptiste). Is that who you meant.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Phil_Phillips

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: GUEST,DonMeixner
Date: 27 Mar 07 - 12:17 AM

All these years I thot it was a fishing reel.

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Rasener
Date: 27 Mar 07 - 12:20 AM

And was it Dale & Grace I'm Leaving It All Up to You

This looks like a good radio link if you can get it

http://www.cajunradio.org/top40swamp.html

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: melodeonboy
Date: 27 Mar 07 - 05:43 PM

It's also worth trying this one, which has cajun, zydeco, swamp pop and more:

http://www.kbon.com

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: PoppaGator
Date: 28 Mar 07 - 12:01 PM

Sorry, I didn't get back to this thread last night. I still have no further examples.

The Villan was correct on both counts: the song "Sea of Love" I mentioned as an example of swamp pop was indeed Phil Phillips's recording, and the same for Dale & Grace's "Leaving It All Up to You."

J.P. Baptiste's nom du disque is, of course, a perfect example of the typical swamp-pop stage name, too.

Most of the great swamp-pop recordings were produced by one Huey Meaux and came out of a single small studio down in southwest Louisiana: "Gold [something] Records" Sorry, my memory isn't working well, and I'm not taking the time to do research. I don't think it's Gold Star, or Gold Bond, but something like that. (Maybe it *is* "Gold Star" -- ??) I'm also unsure whether it was located in Lake Charles, Morgan City, or where...

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: PoppaGator
Date: 28 Mar 07 - 12:42 PM

Just went back and read more of this thread than I did yesterday, when I just perused the 2007 messages about "swamp pop."

1) To Reggie Miles, if you're still around to read this: I knew those guys in the jug band fairly well (although I can't remember "Washboard Jackson"'s real first name ~ I can picture him, though!) In fact, they played at least one private party in my backyard on Whitney Avenue in Algiers, as "opening act" for my kid brother's rock band, Satisfaction (which made several such appearances). One of our biggest parties there was my son Cassidy's 2d birthday, August 28, 1981 ~ if you were there, it would be an amazing coincidence.

2) My understanding of the definition of "jockamo" as "jester," etc., is that it comes from the Italian "Giacomo" (same pronunciation), a common jester-figure in commedia del arte and in Italian Carnivale traditions, notably those of Venice. The Italian immigrants who came to New Orleans were almost exclusively from Sicily ~ pretty far away from Venice, both geographically and culturally ~ and so may or may not have incorporated "Giacomo" into the melting pot of New Orleans' Mardi Gras culture, where African Americans could possibly have picked it up. I think it is at least equally likely that the Mardi Gras Indians' "jockamo [fee nah nay]" has nothing to do with Giacomo the jester, and that the common pronunciation is just a coincidence. Homonyms, in other words.

3) It's a long time since the last slave ship crossed the Atlantic, which is why I have my doubts about any Yoruba vocabulary having survived in the US to the present day. I do recognize that a number of West African syntactical constructs and grammatical forms still persist around here, just like such French transliterations as "making groceries" (from "faire marche).

However, I don't believe specific vocabulary words survive as long as speech patterns, which are actually verbalizations of thought patterns. When a family's first language changes, the youngsters adopt the new language but they learn it from parents who are still thinking primarily in the old language, and transliterating word-for-word to create new constructs and idioms unfamilar to native speakers of the new language.

Many of the characteristic patterns of African-American English ("Ebonics") come straight out of West Africa. One obvious example is possessive-by-proximity; that is, omission of the "apostrophe-s" in informal speech.

You can see the same thing in Ireland. The vast majority of the people who have long since adopted English as their first language still persist ~ several generations later ~ in using Irish/Gaelic syntax with their English vocabularies. Examples: The common use of the phrase "in it"; use of the reflexive "himself" where Brits, Aussies, Yanks and other English speakers would simply say "him"; and the avoidance of uttering a simple "yes" or "no," preferring instead to respond in brief declarative sentances like "I did," "He did not," etc. (The old language, apparently, did not have words for "yes" and "no.")

For the above reasons, I think it's more likely for a word to have traveled back to modern Nigeria from Louisiana than for that word to have had its origins in Yoruba and survived for centuries here in the states. Just my opinion.

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: rock chick
Date: 28 Mar 07 - 12:55 PM

Zydeco - is a type of Afro-American dance music. Its a wonderful lively music, recently saw a band /group and loved every single minute of it.

rc

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Rasener
Date: 28 Mar 07 - 01:51 PM

Very interesting PoppaGator. That what makes Mudcat great.

I am going to see hopefully Marty Wilde at Grimsby soon and hopefully he will sing Sea Of Love

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Azizi
Date: 28 Mar 07 - 05:31 PM

Some African words have survived in the US for centuries. But African words did not have to have survived among people of African descent in the Americas {including the Caribbean} from the 17th century to date since Africans-both enslaved and free-came to the United States and the Caribbean from 1619 or earlier. And after slavery was abolished in the United States, and the Caribbean, Africans have continued to come to these nations. So It is therefore possible for traditional African words to have entered the English language at various times from the 17th century to date.

Here's some "English language" words that are attributed from a traditional African language:

"Among the many other African words adopted by white southerners and later assimilated into American culture are the following: bowdacious, bozo (stupid), cooter (turtle), goober (peanut), hullabaloo, hully-gully, juke(box), moola (money), pamper, Polly Wolly-Doodle, wow, uh-huh, unh-unh, daddy, buddy, tote, banjo, kola (as in Coca-Cola), elephant, gorilla, gumbo, okra, tater, and turnip.

...

The following is a selected glossary of words used by Americans that are derived from African terms or usage.

adobe Rooted in Twi (Akan) culture, where the same word means palm tree leaves or grass used for roof covering.

bad The use of a negative word to mean its opposite or to mean very good, used especially in the emphatic form baad, as in Michael Jackson's song "I'm baad!" Similar words are "mean," used to imply satisfying, fine, or attractive; "wicked", which means to be excellent or capable. This use of negative words to mean something extremely positive is rooted in similar Africanism, for example the Mandingo (Bambara) words a ka nyi ko-jugu, used to mean "it's very good!" (literally translated as "it is good badly!"), as well as the Mandingo (Gambia) words a nyinata jaw-ke, used to say "she is very beautiful!" Also, the West African English (Sierra Leone) words gud baad, which means "it's very good!"

bad-eye Threatening, hateful glance. A common African-American colloquialism. Rooted in the Mandingo word nyejugu to mean a hateful glance (literally giving one the "bad eye").

bad-mouth In Gullah, the word is used to mean slander, abuse, gossip. The Mandingo words da-jugu and the Hausa words mugum-baki have the same meanings, that is to slander or abuse.

bambi Derived from the Bantu word mubambi, meaning one who lies down in order to hide; specifically, it refers to the concealed position of an antelope fawn (as in Walt Disney's film Bambi).

bamboula African drum used in New Orleans during the 19th century. Also, a vigorous style of New Orleans dancing in the early 20th century. A "drum" in early jazz use. Derived from the African word bambula, which means to beat, hit or strike a surface, a drum.
banana Wolof word for fruit, was first recorded in 1563, and entered British English in the 17th century via Spanish and Portuguese.
banjo Kimbundu mbanza, which means a stringed musical instrument; also similar to the Jamaican English word banja and Brazilian Portuguese banza.

bogus Means deceit or fraud. Similar to West African and Caribbean English bo, ba, the Hausa words boko, boko-boko, which also mean deceit and fraud; the West African English word (Sierra Leone) bogo-bogo, and the Louisiana-French word bogue, which also means fake, fraudulent, and phony. The ending of the word "bogus" is part of the words hocus pocus.

booboo Derived from Bantu mbuku, meaning stupid, blundering act; error, blunder. Common nickname found in Black English "

Source:
http://slaveryinamerica.org/history/hs_es_languages.htm

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Azizi
Date: 28 Mar 07 - 09:35 PM

Here's that hyperlink:

http://slaveryinamerica.org/history/hs_es_languages.htm

The Impact of African Languages on American English
Joseph E. Holloway, Ph.D.

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Rasener
Date: 29 Mar 07 - 09:43 AM

Got me ticket to see Marty Wilde and when he sings Sea Of Love, I will be thinking Swamp Pop and Poppagator :-)

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: PoppaGator
Date: 29 Mar 07 - 04:11 PM

Azizi, I stand corrected. I knew about the African origins of many of those words, including (of course) gumbo and goobers.

Ever since I read and understood that insight about how syntax and grammar can exist deeper in the mind, and therefore survive longer, than vocabulary ~ since digesting that idea, I can't pass up every opportunity to try explaining it to anyone and everyone.

I think this phenomemon is most evident in cultures where the downtrodden/defeated population is slowest to adopt the oppressor's language, and you see several consecutive generations speaking their own "dying" language within their own community while learning the boss-man's tongue only very gradually, just enough to follow orders. People continue to think, and to formulate their sentences, in the patterns of the old language, even as they slowly change over to the new language's vocabulary and gradually forget the words from their parents' and grandparents' language. (Most of the words, anyway.)

This quite obviously happened among the earliest African-Americans bound in slavery, to the Irish oppressed in their own country, and (albeit to a lesser extent) to the Cajun people in Louisiana.

What eventually develops is a special, unique brand of the "new" language (in all three of these cases, English) that is very clearly characteristic of the ethnic/cultural/national group in question, and which "sounds" either incorrect, or highly poetic, or both, to outsiders.

Oh yeah ~ back to Zydeco.

Many of Clifton Chenier's most successful songs were direct translation of Fats Domono hits into the French language. Once upon a time I could rattle off a list of titles, but can't think of any at the moment. Whether these particular songs qwualify as true "Zydeco" or not depends upon how strictly one defines the term, but they're not all that much different from even the "purest" examples of Zydeco.

(Incidentally, FWIW, Antoine "Fats" Domino comes from a French-speaking Creole family that moved to New Orleans from rural south-central Louisiana only a few years before he was born.)

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: GUEST,Don Wise
Date: 01 Nov 11 - 11:30 AM

Didn't Zydeco start with Amade Ardoin(1896-1941) and Dennis McGee who blended Cajun songs with blues and jazz?

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Dead Horse
Date: 02 Nov 11 - 08:56 AM

No.

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Mrrzy
Date: 02 Nov 11 - 10:55 AM

Hmmm, the explanation about les haricots that I heard in some documentary about Preservation Hall was that the expression "couper les haricots" (cut beans), referring to taking the string off the string beans (haricots verts) and roughly pronounced in Africanized French as coopay lay zahdeeco [because of the liaison], meant to dance up a storm, and that's where the word pronounced zahdeeco if you have a French accent and spelled Zydeco backformed for the music to which you dance that storm up.

I love American syntax.

Subject: RE: What is Zydeco?
From: Neil D
Date: 06 Nov 11 - 08:10 PM

From: GUEST,Don Wise - PM
Date: 01 Nov 11 - 11:30 AM

Didn't Zydeco start with Amade Ardoin(1896-1941) and Dennis McGee who blended Cajun songs with blues and jazz?

Actually Zydeco is a blending of the earlier Creole dance music often called "La La" with elements of Rhythm and Blues. According to Wikipedia:
Amédé Ardoin made the first recordings of Creole music in 1928. This Creole music served as a foundation for what later became known as zydeco.
These were the recordings on which Dennis McGee played backing fiddle to Amade's vocals and accordion. I'm sure someone here may know better but as far as I've been able to discern these may be the first integrated musical recordings. Nevertheless Amade Ardoin was a major influence on both Creole and Cajun musical genres and should be much better known than he is today.
He was also a tragic victim of brutal racism.
Here is a heart wrenching account by Alan Lomax and others of the Death of Amede Ardoin.