BS: VP Debate Entertainment

Subject: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: dwditty
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 12:28 PM

Play Palin Bingo Tonight

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: dwditty
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 12:30 PM

This one works:

Play Palin Bingo Tonight

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Charley Noble
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 02:47 PM

What's wrong with just drinking?

I suppose I could try multi-tasking.

Charley Noble

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: katlaughing
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 03:05 PM

LOL...that would maybe make it a tad tolerable. Thanks!

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Donuel
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 03:10 PM

drink one teaspoon of vodka/or beverage of your choice,

each time Sarah says 'like'.

One tablespoon everytime she says 'ya know'.

One pint everytime she says 'Constitutional'.

One gallon evertime she says 'civil rights'.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Donuel
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 08:24 PM

Mrs. Palin, what are the most civil rights that need to be restored after the last 8 years of the Bush Cheney Administration?

Her answer to this question is described as "the front fell off"

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Leadfingers
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 10:02 PM

Can ANYONE define 'NUCULAR' ?

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 10:20 PM

I have heard her say that enough times that clearly she can't say it either.

"Say it ain't so, Joe!" she pulled off. She's trying to come from Main Street of Lake Woebegone with most of her gosh and golly's.

There isn't a lot of substance. She got the hockey mom in the first paragraph out of her mouth.

She's clearly aiming at the lowest common denominator. Clever strategy on the McCain team's part.

SRS

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Joe Offer
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 10:27 PM

Well, I gotta admit it - I dozed off....

I thought Biden did well. I thought Palin's "folksiness" was a put-on. By gosh, and God bless her. In Palin's defense, I have to say that my liberal Democrat friend from Wasilla, sounds just like Sarah Palin. So, maybe it isn't a put-on.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Ebbie
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 10:49 PM

*grin* Joe, a friend of mine once put down Palin with the comment: Oh, she's so Wasilla.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:13 PM

"Oh my golly, you Washington folks and yer high-falutin double-talk!" She did alright, I think, considering the fact that I may be far more qualified for the job.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Stilly River Sage
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:17 PM

Any of us is more qualified for the job. Except Chongo, but don't tell LH.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Riginslinger
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:18 PM

It's over. McCain just won!

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:24 PM

When you wish upon a star, makes no difference who you are....

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: olddude
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:24 PM

Like golly gee wizz, pardon me if I puke now

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: catspaw49
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:26 PM

Which is of course the real problem! If some dumbass briarhopper like Leej is more qualified then we're in a shitload of trouble.........and we are in a shitload of trouble if that pair is elected.

Sadly there are many here in the great unwashed midwest who will happily vote for McCain/Palin. Around here the signage is running about 5 to 1 for them. I know Obama is better in the cities but there is a lot of rural even the most populous and industrial midwestern states like Ohio. Local reports after the debate tonight were not encouraging in this part of the couuntry.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: TIA
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:29 PM

People are so afraid of an "elitist", they actually *want* a nincompoop as national leader.

Bet they don't feel the same way about the pilot of the plane they might be flying in.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: quokka
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:32 PM

I don't understand why she wasn't pulled up for not answering the question. She was asked about something completely unrelated to energy, and she answered by repeating what she had already said in an earlier answer, all about energy. Later on when asked what her Achilles' heel was, she stated what she believed are her good points!
At least Biden answered the question. Maybe she doesn't know what Achilles' heel means.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,heric
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:35 PM

Didn't she, at the very end of that list of positives, say something to the effect that "so, no, I don't ever change."

I think she is more phoney than she is stupid.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: TRUBRIT
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:39 PM

I hate to say it -- I truly hate to say it -- but I think she did far better than I could ever have expected.......; I suspect McCain's camp are celebratin'.........!

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Barry Finn
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:39 PM

Well she just pushed the East Coast states into the sea. She does have away with the US or them, she'll be more of a Bush than George ever was & a better drinking buddy too. Altough she'll talk all night she won't end up saying much.

Barry

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: dick greenhaus
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:42 PM

A Republican pundit described the debate as a "nothingburger". I concur. If you started off liking Palin, she probably won; if you didn't, she lost. Don't suspect it changed anybody's mind.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Big Mick
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:43 PM

She made no splash. That is it for McCain. Today he abandoned Michigan as a lost cause. He is in trouble in Ohio and Florida. His VP candidate came off as a lightweight, with high marks for folksiness, but low marks for substance. In the end result, she squandered whatever substance she had and became an appendage.

I stick by my prediction. Big splash, anchor around his neck by the end.

Mick

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Joe Offer
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:47 PM

Now I'm watching the "instant" replay. I got a kick out of Pailin saying "Now there you go, Joe..." about Biden and Obama claiming that McCain and Bush are in the same party.

I have to say the Republicans own that "now there you go" phrase, ever since Reagan used it in a debate. And Palin took delight in using that phrase. Good for her.

But somebody ought to tell Palin that she and McCain are the heirs of the shameful Bush-Cheney legacy, whether they like it or not. If McCain wanted it otherwise, he needed to say it during his convention speech.

-Joe-

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Donuel
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:49 PM

She did make a big announcemnt regarding the constitutional expansion of the powers of the Vice Presidency.

I don't know what she means but she said it, so she will be asked about what these powers are and where in the Constituion or secret ammendments we all somehow missed, that this is written!

Does the Vice President now belong to all three branchs of goverment?
Cheney clames he belongs to two branchs of government already.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 02 Oct 08 - 11:51 PM

I might point out to my esteemed colleague from Ohio that one of our greatest presidents was also a "dumbass briarhopper". And I am not talkin about Zachary Taylor neither. So support me and I will make sure that possum becomes the nation's Thanksgiving fare and Uncle Pen its National Anthem. And Ale Eight One the National Beverage.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: catspaw49
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 12:41 AM

What are you talkin' about? So you had that Lincoln guy.......big deal. Ohio is known as the Mother of Presidents.

I mean we supplied Rutherford B. Hayes and his accomplishments were..........uh......er,well.........they were...........well, some. Yeah, that's it....He had some. Well, one or two anyway..........But what about Grant. Great general and as the Prez he.................uh............hmmmmm......wound up penniless? But what of it? Say, we had TWO Harrisons! Betcha nobody else had two Harrisons. But we had Garfield......only for 199 days cause he got shot but it was a great 199 days. Well at least it was okay....no legislation or anything but he didn't redo the White House and cost everyone a wasted amount of money. But and its a big butt, we had Taft.   Helluva' man.......lot of man......matter of fact a huge man! So the fat fuck got stuck in a bathtub.........so what? And let's not forget Warren G. Harding.........................................wait....Let's DO forget Warren G. Harding.....................So maybe they all weren't Millard Fillmore but we sent 8 of them to DC which got them ta' hell out of the state for awhile......................


Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Lonesome EJ
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 12:53 AM

You think its something in the water? Does Palin have any Ohio ancestors? That could explain some things.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: robomatic
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 01:01 AM

Palin did VERY well, making a full recovery from her Katie Couric sit down(s)

BUT- Biden performed very well and stayed on message, didn't get stuck on the tar baby, and didn't overrun his mouth.

A good debate, a presentation of alternatives, and I think no big shift in population, just a lack of more shift away from McCain.

BUT BUT BUT

Don't for a moment think that Alaskans talk the way Sarah Palin does. She's got some kind of Minnesota thing going there, I think she must listen to Prairie Home Companion.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: DougR
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 01:26 AM

Gov. Palin ate Joe Biden's lunch. You folks have a queasy feeling in your stomach? Same feeling you had in 2000? 2004? I'm not surprised.

Your problem? There are more Conservative Americans than there are Liberal ones. From what I have read recently, our friendly Liberal folks in the British Isles may have the same problem as you do.

DougR

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,heric
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 01:38 AM

If there are so many Conservative Americans they should form a political party and run some candidates.

Unless you are referring to the ignorant hayseeds who like getting "taken," shall we say, by the spendthrift, nation-building Republican party with all of its thieves.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: John O'L
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 04:29 AM

It seems to be generally agreed in the press that she narrowly won the debate because she didn't make any horrific gaffes. Since when does that win you a debate? At least Biden answered the questions. Perhaps that was his gaffe.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: irishenglish
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 07:17 AM

While Palin did better than I expected (If looking down at ones notes constantly while Biden was talking counts), she had no knockout. Neither did Biden which leaves us with a debate where very few people will have had THIS debate change their minds. I know they will try, but I don't see how the Republicans can say that Joe Biden lost somehow. They can complain about the policies, etc, but Biden did not lose, and in fact, finished very strong. His emotional moment was not calculated for sympathy, it was very clearly honest emotion, even 30 years after such a tragedy. Palin on the other hand, constantly changed the subject, most often bringing it back around to energy, even if the topic had nothing to do with it. Biden I think missed one possible moment. Palin kept harping on, you Washington insiders, thats not how I would do it, I'm not an insider, etc, etc. What Palin fails to understand is, if she did become VP, she becomes Washington, just like the rest of them. You may jump from Alaska to Washington, but in so doing, you join the crowd. McCain is no maverick in that sense either-he knows the Washington game. I thought Biden could have adapted that more cleverly than I just did as an attack on her.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 07:21 AM

{{{{DRUDGE POLL}}}} WHO WON THE VICE PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE?...

BIDEN 30% 79,805
PALIN 69% 183,546
NEITHER 2% 4,484

Total Votes: 267,835



Only about 50 times the number of people involved than most pools...

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: robomatic
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 07:21 AM

My second take:

Sarah did very well, especially after her recent televised interviews. Her folksiness to my mind was not a total put-on, but a bit more stressed than her normal manner in Alaska, and it brought me to the edge of cringe, but only briefly.

Biden was more cogent and did not make the mistake of condescending or disdaining his opponent.

I wish there had an opportunity to bring science issues to the fore, i.e. does Palin believe in Darwin or not, but I think the references to climate change brought some of this to the fore.

Bottom line, Sarah did her candidate no more harm, and herself a lot of good, and avoided the yokel image I was a bit afraid might get stamped over the Alaska brand.

Biden did himself and Obama a lot of good by successfully avoiding some of his own known weaknesses.

I think it made AMERICA look good by the high level of discourse on real issues.

It was mostly draw, but I'd give a slight edge to the Dems because Biden stayed on message regarding the economic mess the Reps have so contributed to.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: TIA
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 07:52 AM

"You folks have a queasy feeling in your stomach? Same feeling you had in 2000? 2004?"

If 2000 and 2004 don't make you queasy in 2008, you are an official brainwashed cult member. Look around...like what you see?

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 08:01 AM

The results of two years of Democratic control of both houses of Congress?


The results of the actions of the last Democratic President, pushing sub-prime loans as a solution to home ownership? (1999 bill that Biden voted for)

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Bobert
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 08:26 AM

Yes, very entertaining... It was apparent that the McCain team stuffed about 15 songs in her that she could sing forward or backward and then she tried to sing the most correct song she could think of to answer the questions... The songs were done well but she rarely sang the correct song for the question that was asked...

Biden was Biden at his best... No foot to mouth... No lack of discipline...

All in all, I don't see the debate as a deal changer for anyone... The true undecideds will wait for the the real debates between McCain and Obama...

Oh, from a personal viewpoint and as an Obama supporter, I have allready grown tired of Ms, Sarah's Roller Derbyish, cartoonish persona... It does not inspire any confidence in me that she has the right makings to be either a VP or a P...

B~

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: catspaw49
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 08:31 AM

Hey.....Beardedbrucie......So which way is it? The result of just two years of Dem controlled Congress or going waaay back to Clinton? Dumbya could never have had a thing to to do with it or the 6 previous years of Repub controlled Congress?????

You're so packed full of shit I expect to hear quite soon that you have exploded into a shitstorm the size of Hurricane Gustav. Take a reality enema and note the stupid ass war in Iraq among other miserable Bush decisions. Or if you must go the wayback route, have Mr. Peabody load you into the Wayback Machine and go visit the Reagan era where we first encountered the joys of deregulation and trickle-down economics. Those are the same ones Dumbya's Daddy among others referred to as "VooDoo Economics."

Clinton and the Dems my ass....................

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 08:54 AM

Spaw,

You seem to be the expert on shit.


I have always, throughout these threads, stated that the going into Iraq was the correct move, given what was known at the time, and that the execution was flawed. I have also stated that the main cause of the war was the vocal support given to Saddam by those who were insisting on "Peace at any price".


Both of my statements previously are valid- none of yours appear to be.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 08:55 AM

Excuse me- the last should have been addressed to "Spawsie"

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: catspaw49
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 09:08 AM

Gee the Sarah Approach......Your response had nothing to do with the questions. For the record though, I thought Iraq was an stupid move.....period.

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 09:15 AM

That seems to be your opinion.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: robomatic
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 09:18 AM

My Third Take:

I think Biden made a neat little move when he brought out that Palin did not oppose same sex benefits as opposite sex benefits (which indeed is her practise in Alaska). That might have cost her a few points with the homophobes without gaining her any votes which are already going to Obama.

That was a neat bit of work that zipped right by. The more I think of it, the better Biden was.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Ed T
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 09:37 AM

"I started out with nothing and still have most of it left". source unknown

"The importance of waking up is difficult to appreciate while asleep", source unknown

"It's too bad I'm not as wonderful a person I say I am, because the world could use a few more people like that". source unknown


"If at first you don't succeed, well, so much for skydiving". Victor
O'Reilly, Games of the Hangman

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 09:39 AM

Update- in case you did not like the other set of numbers. In the last few minutes, the following results:


CNNQ Quick Vote   Who fared better in the vice presidential debate?
Sen. Joe Biden 67% 235946
Gov. Sarah Palin 28% 96974
Neither 5% 16826
Total Votes: 349746



{{{{DRUDGE POLL}}}} WHO WON THE VICE PRESIDENTIAL DEBATE?...
BIDEN 28% 95,915
PALIN 70% 236,493
NEITHER 2% 5,771
Total Votes: 338,179

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: robomatic
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 09:54 AM

Last night local station KTUU (Anchorage) had a debate score set up running 52% FOR Palin, 48% Biden. Considering this is ALASKA, I was very surprised it was not higher.

Meanwhile, Another reaction to the debate:

Apparently there are a lot of folks who have ben suspicious or ignorant of Biden. I suspect his self control and ready intelligence strengthened his personal image and confidence in his ticket probably as much as Palin did for hers.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Bobert
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 09:56 AM

Just goes to show ya' that one of these two polls is extremely inaccurate... Porbably both...

As for Iraq??? Poll after poll has beardedbruce in a small minority...

B

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 10:04 AM

"Poll after poll has beardedbruce in a small minority"


OK, that puts me in fine company-

A small minority of the US thought Truman was right about Blacks in the military.

A small minority of the Founding fathers thought slavery was morally wrong and should be stopped. It was not, and the Civil War resulted.

A small minority often is right, and the majority comes around to thinking that eventually.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Riginslinger
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 10:09 AM

Almost always, actually!

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 10:10 AM

I'm puzzled. Twice (or maybe three times), in speaking of her occupational qualifications, she said she had mayoral experience, governor experience, and "oil and gas regulator experience".

Did I miss something somewhere along the line. I don't remember hearing of her having been an oil and gas regulator.

Or have I just been asleep?

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 10:31 AM

why are those polls so widely different?

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,beardedbruce
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 10:38 AM

"For every poll there is an equal and opposite poll."

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 11:05 AM

Why are the polls so widely different? Several reasons:

1. The answers to poll questions depend heavily in which questions are asked, and how they are phrased.
2. The results depend on the size of the sample, and how the sample is arrived at. For instance, buttonholing passersby on the street, interviewing residents of nursing homes, questioning bar habitues, or even members of political clubs, all will get you differently skewed results. And just when the poll is taken can do the same thing.
3. The skill (or lack thereof) or bias of the interviewers can affect the answers. Designedly or by incompetence, the interviewer may stray from the set of questions provided him (even if they are neutral as written), or may smile or frown at a given point, or may emphasize certain words, all of which may influence the answer. And on and on.

Then too, some polls are indeed intended to find out what "the public" (whatever that means) are thinking, but let's face it, many polls are intended to arrive at a given picture, for publicity purposes.

That, my friend, is why not all polls are created equal.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Arkie
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 11:06 AM

Another meaningless voice here, but If you use the criteria of whether Palin stuck her foot in her mouth so far she could not get it out, she came through. She smiled, blinked, and exuded her folksy charm. If you were looking for substance, you got little from Palin but Biden was loaded. He made a good point about McCain's claim to being a maverick. He uses the word a lot but his actual voting record in recent years has been with the administration. He talks about change but proposes nothing new. Biden was strong in other areas too. His response to one of Palin's and McCain's misleading claims that O'Bama voted for big cuts for the Petroleum industry was seen by one commentator as being on the defensive but it correctly pointed out the bill supported by O'Bama and not by McCain contained incentives for alternative energy. He did not go far enough though. The bill contained incentives for the petroleum industry but also was balanced with taxes and the end result was more money for the government. I wonder if McCain actually read the legislation. How far a candidate can go in talking of the origins of the Iraqi war may be limited, but I would think a good case could be made for the present administration disregarding information and advice concerning the invasion and misleading congress and the American people to get into a war for the Iraqi oil fields.

At any rate Palin had some charm and seemed likable enough but did not provide any real substantial encouragement that a McCain/Palin administration would do anything different that what is now being done. The alternatives in Iraq are not losing and victory. In fact the country is losing by staying in the war. On the other had a responsible withdrawal should be considered. The Bush administration has put this country in a situation that will require a long term remedy once there is a decision to actually fix things. My last comment is that the Democrats do not control congress. An even vote in the Senate and a small majority in the House does not constitute control. It simply makes it difficult for the administration to shove legislation through Congress.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Pseudolus
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 11:45 AM

I totally agree with Bobert with his songs analogy. She knew what she rehearsed and used whatever was closest to the question and when there was nothing she just said that she wasn't gonna answer but instead talk about what she wanted to talk about.

I'll say it again. Palin was brought on to appeal to disgruntled Hillary supporters, she is there to take the focus off the similarity between a McCain administration and the current administration and she is there NOT because she would make a good VP, but instead because she makes a good running mate.

Luckily, I believe people are starting to see through it. Palin ate Biden's lunch??? Please...even if it was there for the taking, which it was not, she would refuse it and say, "By gosh let's talk a little bit about energy, huh Joe?"

Frank

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Donuel
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 12:23 PM

You betcha

I had the distinct impression 5 minutes into the debate that Gov. Sarah Palin could in fact perform as President of the United States.
Of course I draw a line between a successful performance and BEING a President. GWB failed cross either line.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 02:09 PM

>>> Around here the signage is running about 5 to 1 for them (McCain/Palin)

I've noticed that in rural North and South Carolina too. On the other hand I don't think its purely a matter of support. I ordered an Obama/Biden support kit with a yard sign Aug 31. I still haven't got it.

>>>VP candidate came off as a lightweight, with high marks for folksiness, but low marks for substance.

Some pundits said even the folksiness looked somewhat forced. I tend to think that she overdid it. Folks would have to be pretty thick to buy it.

>>But somebody ought to tell Palin that she and McCain are the heirs of the shameful Bush-Cheney legacy, whether they like it or not. If McCain wanted it otherwise, he needed to say it during his convention speech.

Good point! I think that Biden hit a nerve with "Name one substantive policy issue where McCain differs with Bush. We are going to hear that question until November 4, because I don't think that McCain can differ with any major position of Bush's without losing part of Bush's base.

>>>Your problem? There are more Conservative Americans than there are Liberal ones.

Doug, When are you going to learn that voting Republican is the opposite of conservatism?

>>>DRUDGE POLL<<<
Biden got 30% of Drudge's fanatical, partisan, Republican, rumor mongering, fan base??
LOL!!! Things are darker for Palin than I thought!

>>>I wish there had an opportunity to bring science issues to the fore, i.e. does Palin believe in Darwin or not, but I think the references to climate change brought some of this to the fore.

Her answer there was kind of crazy. Is she saying that humans didn't cause it but that we can fix it by getting China to cut emissions?

>>>The results of two years of Democratic control of both houses of Congress?

The results were two years of fillibustering and veto threats and a few actual vetos. The damage was done when The Republicans held both branches. The healing will begin when the Democrats do the same.

>>>I think Biden made a neat little move when he brought out that Palin did not oppose same sex benefits as opposite sex benefits (which indeed is her practise in Alaska). That might have cost her a few points with the homophobes without gaining her any votes which are already going to Obama.

That was a neat bit of work that zipped right by. The more I think of it, the better Biden was.<<

I thought it was pretty neat the way that he got Ifil to explicitly ask Palin where she stood on same sex marriage and she weaseled her way out of an explicit answer.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,Jack the Sailor
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 02:16 PM

Sorry, I'm the guest with all the quotes.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Genie
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 02:20 PM

Golly, gee, Donuel. I had just the opposite impression.   I guess if you really buy into the premises of a few pop movies and TV shows (e.g., "Commander In Chief") -- that any good-hearted, honest, well-intended "average Joe or Jane" -- could do just okey-dokey as our Chief Executive -- well, Sarah P is about as average as you can get.   

But if you think that the demands of this job, especially in the light of the challenges the world faces today, really call for exceptional knowledge, intelligence, and skill -- what some would call "elite" qualifications --, then I just can't see this perky, down-home-talkin' (don't ya know?), wise-cracking, substance-free "hockey mom" being taken seriously by world leaders as our President.   Of course, I don't think a lot of them have much respect for Dubya either.   President Palin would be just another term with Dubya in a dress.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: PoppaGator
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 02:48 PM

"Why are the polls so widely different?"?

Uncle Dave-O's answers were correct enough, and always apply in regard to polls in general, but I think there's another more important factor in most of these instant morning-after pools ~ they are conducted through websites, so the population that responds is pretty much self-selected.

It should be no surprise that the response most likely to be expected from angry right-wing males would be the overwhelming choice on the Drudge Report poll. The Wall Street Journal poll would natually represent another largely conservative faction concerned primarily with economic questions. CNN and Fox News obviously appeal to different audiences. Etc. etc. etc.

My guess is that the AOL and broadcast-TV-network sites probably draw the most diverse and representative samples of respondants.

*******************************

My reaction? Palin far exceeded my very low expectations, but I don't think that equals a "win." She couldn't possibly have won over very many folks who started out skeptical of her. The best to be said for her is that she avoided a real, disasterous, blundering loss, which many people half-expected and really would have liked to see.

It should be no surprise that she evaded all the tough questions. To an extent, they both did that, just as both Obama and McCain tiptoed around all the potentially explosive issues in their debate. That's what politicians do. The fact that Palin demonstrated some ability to do so semi-plausibly, without lapsing into moose-in-the-headlights mode, is a major forward step on her part and a tribute to her handlers.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 04:19 PM

Yes but the results are diametrically opposite, and the size of sample seems about the same. variation - fair enough! but either the polls mean something or nothing. It looks like one side, or possibly both have been fiddling the figures to me.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Acorn4
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 05:41 PM

In the UK we've got an interviewer called Jeremy Paxman who, I'm sure would just love to interview Ms Palin.

The Best of Jeremy Paxman

People in the UK will be familiar with the famous Michael Howard interview, but if you've not seen it have a look and just imagine him interviewing the "Vice President in waiting".

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Ebbie
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 09:25 PM

One of my favo(u)rite lines was when she said, "When I chatted with Henry Kissinger"... lol It struck me as so funny. "As I was saying to Henry..."

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: John O'L
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 09:44 PM

Uncle DaveO

... "oil and gas regulator experience" ...
Remember the Americans call petrol stations gas staions. When you pull into the gas station you take the gas regulator and use it to fill the tank.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Riginslinger
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 09:55 PM

"Why are the polls so widely different?"?


                      The Democratic polls are wrong!

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Ebbie
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 11:11 PM

Uncle DaveO, after her failed attempt to win the lieutenant governor she was named by then Governor Frank Murkowski to the Oil and Gas board. She eventually resigned from the board.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: katlaughing
Date: 03 Oct 08 - 11:33 PM

Acorn4, thanks for that! I'd love to see Paxman take after her!

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: akenaton
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 03:55 AM

Paxman has an interest only in promoting his own career.

He has developed an abrasive TV personality which may be entertaining..we all like to see politicians "punished", but as a commentator he is irrelevant.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 04:28 AM

I loved him in Bridget Jones Diary.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 10:14 AM

Thanks, Ebbie, for the Oil and Gas Board information. I hadn't known that.

I was beginning to think there must be some factual basis (however important or trivial) just because the commentators hadn't jumped all over her for it.

Dave Oesterreich

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Ebbie
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 11:23 AM

Palin was appointed Chair of the Commission, Uncle DaveO, but resigned in protest in less than a year.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 02:33 PM

Paxman isn't a commentator, he's a master of a particular style of challenge-interview. His motives aren't too relevant in this context. In fact his lack of any particular political loyalties help make him more effective.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Ebbie
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 06:09 PM

Today a conservative friend told me that he had watched part of the debate. He said, in disbelief, She didn't answer a single important question! What must political leaders around the world think of us! They must think the US is NEVER going to grow up.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 08:22 PM

But the point wasn't to impress political leaders around the world. Or to answer questions.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Little Hawk
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 08:37 PM

That's right. The point was to create a superficial impression of whatever will get your constituency to vote for you. That's almost always the point.

It appears to have worked perfectly on Rig and DougR, for example.

I bet Shane would vote for Sarah...

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,heric
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 10:01 PM

By the way, dwditty, on the thing that started this whole thread: Three people from work actually did use those bingo cards with their families and LOVED them. (Except for the ones stuck with "Bridge to Nowhere") Even the littlest kids were playing it gleefully.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Riginslinger
Date: 04 Oct 08 - 10:07 PM

"It appears to have worked perfectly on Rig and DougR, for example."


                      Actually what made up my mind was the things Obama was saying and doing. It had little to do with McCain or his camp. It's the same old choice--the lesser of two evils, and for me, McCain wins.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 05 Oct 08 - 04:26 PM

New angle - my wife pointed out that the TV camera swung around behind Palin. Perhaps to show us her ass? They didn't do that for Biden. And, they never did it for Hillary.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: heric
Date: 05 Oct 08 - 05:45 PM

I noticed that. I thought they were showing us there was / was not a "bulge" in the back of her jacket.

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: Riginslinger
Date: 05 Oct 08 - 07:36 PM

Probably just the camerman losing control!

Subject: RE: BS: VP Debate Entertainment
From: GUEST,TIA
Date: 05 Oct 08 - 10:22 PM

You betcha, doggone it!