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Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids

InOBU 21 Oct 08 - 08:43 AM
McGrath of Harlow 21 Oct 08 - 09:31 AM
John MacKenzie 21 Oct 08 - 09:43 AM
Azizi 21 Oct 08 - 09:57 AM
InOBU 21 Oct 08 - 05:44 PM
McGrath of Harlow 21 Oct 08 - 07:32 PM
Joe_F 21 Oct 08 - 08:18 PM
Leadfingers 21 Oct 08 - 08:23 PM
InOBU 22 Oct 08 - 10:43 AM
InOBU 22 Oct 08 - 10:46 AM
GUEST,Bob L 23 Oct 08 - 07:48 AM
artbrooks 23 Oct 08 - 08:29 AM
InOBU 23 Oct 08 - 09:29 AM
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Subject: Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids
From: InOBU
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 08:43 AM

My 88 year old mother, whose Mom was Jewish, sang me this, out of the blue, the other day. She told me that the Irish and Jewish kids would play together, in Boston in the 1920s -- all great friends, but they would sing pretty awful songs running each other down. My Grandmother caught my mother and sister singing this one and gave them hell. I expect this dates from some time between 1925 and 28. Mom says, the Irish kids would contract So to whom as S' t' hum

Well... here is some of the worst of Folk...


S'"t' whom yer speaking to hum
S't' whom yer speaking to hum
The noive of you to speak to me
is a thing like I've never have hoid
Abe Lincoln they filled him with lead
Your living you aught to be dead
so go take a hike, you low down dirty kike
S't' whom yer speaking to s't' hum


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 09:31 AM

But the fact that it is "to whom" rather than "to who" in street talk is something that grammarians might find quite impressive.

I'd imagine the Jewish kids would have had a more or less equivalent response. The important thing is being able to play together.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 09:43 AM

Same thing in and around Glasgow 60+ years ago, that I know of. Between Catholic and Protestant kids. Kids are cruel, as are people who never grow up. It's an immaturity thing.

JM


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids
From: Azizi
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 09:57 AM

That's an interesting verse-from sociological and folkloric perspectives.

Thanks for posting it.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids
From: InOBU
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 05:44 PM

In these days of Mum's failing memory, her childhood comes back with remarkable clarity. It is like having a window into the 1920s. She was very clear on the tune, as well as the dialect, she really had the Boston Irish accent down to a T.
Kev, although it is true they played together, and in a number of instances, even married each other, as we saw in the Boston busing struggles, the real feelings behind the songs were not very deep below the surface.
All the best to all,
Lor


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 07:32 PM

With kids it's often not so much that there are real feelings behind songs like that, but that they prepare the way for those feelings to be transmitted by adults who do have them.

Often enough young kids have no understanding of the words they use as weapons. It's the responsibility of parents to pull them up sharp, and signal that they won't put up with the transmission of those feelings from other adults.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids
From: Joe_F
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 08:18 PM

When my father was little (New York City, ca. 1900), naughty Jewish kids had a chant:

Jesus Christ
Went to scheiss
Behind an apple tree.
A snake came past
And bit him on the ass
And blamed it all on me.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids
From: Leadfingers
Date: 21 Oct 08 - 08:23 PM

The Children simply transmit the ideas they get from their elders !


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids
From: InOBU
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 10:43 AM

Mom remembered a missing line... and corrected my transcription... the missing line is - Shar-rup or I'll knock you dead

S'"t' hum yer speaking to hum
S't' hum yer speaking to hum
Sharrup or I'll knock you dead
The noive of you to speak to me
is a thing like I've never have hoid
Abe Lincoln they filled him with lead
Your living you aught to be dead
so go take a hike, you low down kike
S't' hum yer speaking to s't' hum

Mom appreciated but did not know the New York example posted above. Thanks.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids
From: InOBU
Date: 22 Oct 08 - 10:46 AM

Mom makes another correction... Sah hoim ... sounds more like it. When mom says it, it sounds more to me as sah hoym... ah well...


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids
From: GUEST,Bob L
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 07:48 AM

We are not responsible for the attitudes and actions of our ancestors.
We are responsible for the attitudes and actions of our descendants.


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids
From: artbrooks
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 08:29 AM

So then maybe it's "so (to) who am"?


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Subject: RE: Lyr Add: Defamatory song Irish & Jewish kids
From: InOBU
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 09:29 AM

You might be on to something Art!


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