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Memory Songs?

In Mudcat MIDIs:
Thais [lyrics, Newman Levy; tune anonymous]


Mr Happy 23 Oct 08 - 07:34 AM
GUEST,Volgadon 23 Oct 08 - 07:40 AM
Mr Happy 23 Oct 08 - 07:45 AM
SINSULL 23 Oct 08 - 07:47 AM
Mr Happy 23 Oct 08 - 07:57 AM
GUEST,Suffolk Miracle 23 Oct 08 - 08:36 AM
Mr Happy 23 Oct 08 - 08:45 AM
GUEST,Suffolk Miracle 23 Oct 08 - 08:55 AM
GUEST,Volgadon 23 Oct 08 - 09:01 AM
GUEST,Volgadon 23 Oct 08 - 09:57 AM
Piers Plowman 23 Oct 08 - 10:11 AM
SINSULL 23 Oct 08 - 10:13 AM
sian, west wales 23 Oct 08 - 10:20 AM
Mr Happy 23 Oct 08 - 10:26 AM
GUEST,Volgadon 23 Oct 08 - 10:50 AM
Mr Happy 23 Oct 08 - 10:53 AM
topical tom 23 Oct 08 - 10:54 AM
Mr Happy 23 Oct 08 - 11:01 AM
GUEST,Gerry 23 Oct 08 - 08:45 PM
GUEST,TJ in San Diego 24 Oct 08 - 05:07 PM
Willa 24 Oct 08 - 05:43 PM
Stringsinger 24 Oct 08 - 05:48 PM
SPB-Cooperator 24 Oct 08 - 06:41 PM
Seamus Kennedy 25 Oct 08 - 12:48 AM
Joe Offer 25 Oct 08 - 02:39 AM
Piers Plowman 25 Oct 08 - 06:03 AM
kendall 25 Oct 08 - 07:10 AM
GUEST 25 Oct 08 - 10:15 AM
Bill D 25 Oct 08 - 11:57 AM
Howard Kaplan 25 Oct 08 - 10:58 PM
Piers Plowman 28 Oct 08 - 05:47 AM
Mr Happy 28 Oct 08 - 05:53 AM
open mike 28 Oct 08 - 11:33 AM
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Subject: Memory Songs?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 07:34 AM

Memory Songs?

In my repertoire, I쳌fve a number of songs, which fit this category, such as:

Rattling bog
Green grow the rushes oh
When I first came to this land
The green grass grew all around
King Caractacus
Old McDonald

These songs all have the element of needing to memorise all the preceding verses & then sing them back in sequential order.

They always go down well for all kinds쳌fve audiences, & therefore I쳌fm looking to expand my range of these.

I쳌fm also interested in gaining more audience participation 쳌eaction쳌f songs, such as 쳌eUnderneath the spreading chestnut tree쳌f,


Anyone have more?


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: GUEST,Volgadon
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 07:40 AM

Chad Gadia, the children's Passover song. Father buys a kid (goat, not human) for two coins, the cat ate the kid, the dog ate the cat, the stick beat the dog, the fire burned the stick, the water quenched the fire, the ox drank up the water, the butcher slaughtered the ox, the angel of death killed the butcher and God killed the angel of death.


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 07:45 AM

Thanks, sounds similar theme to 'I know an old lady who swallowed a fly'


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: SINSULL
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 07:47 AM

The 12 Days Of Christmas



which often sends me running screaming intot he streets.


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 07:57 AM

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chad_Gadya

Where can I find the tune for 'Chad Gadya' ?


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: GUEST,Suffolk Miracle
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 08:36 AM

The Barley Mow.

Or, if your Welsh is up to it, try counting coloured goats:

Oes gafr eto?
Oes heb ei godro,
Ar y creigiau geirwon
mae'r hen afr yn crwydro.

Gafr wen, wen, wen,
Ie finwen, finwen, finwen,
Foel gynffonwen, foel gynffonwen
Ystlys wen a chynffon,
Wen, wen, wen.

Oes gafr eto?
Oes heb ei godro,
Ar y creigiau geirwon
mae'r hen afr yn crwydro.

Gafr ddu, ddu, ddu
Ie finddu, finddu, finddu,
Foel gynffonddu, foel gynffonddu
Ystlys ddu a chynffon,
Ddu, ddu, ddu.

Gafr wen, wen, wen,
Ie finwen, finwen, finwen,
Foel gynffonwen, foel gynffonwen
Ystlys wen a chynffon,
Wen, wen, wen.

Oes gafr eto?
Oes heb ei godro,
Ar y creigiau geirwon
mae'r hen afr yn crwydro.

Gafr goch, goch, goch
Ie fingoch, fingoch, fingoch,
Foel gynffongoch, foel gynffongoch
Ystlys goch a chynffon,
Goch, goch, goch.

Gafr ddu, ddu, ddu
Ie finddu, finddu, finddu,
Foel gynffonddu, foel gynffonddu
Ystlys ddu a chynffon,
Ddu, ddu, ddu.

Gafr wen, wen, wen,
Ie finwen, finwen, finwen,
Foel gynffonwen, foel gynffonwen
Ystlys wen a chynffon,
Wen, wen, wen.

Oes gafr eto?
Oes heb ei godro,
Ar y creigiau geirwon
mae'r hen afr yn crwydro.

Gafr las, las, las
Ie finlas, finlas, finlas,
Foel gynffonlas, foel gynffonlas
Ystlys las a chynffon,
Las, las, las.


Gafr goch, goch, goch
Ie fingoch, fingoch, fingoch,
Foel gynffongoch, foel gynffongoch
Ystlys goch a chynffon,
Goch, goch, goch.

Gafr ddu, ddu, ddu
Ie finddu, finddu, finddu,
Foel gynffonddu, foel gynffonddu
Ystlys ddu a chynffon,
Ddu, ddu, ddu.

Gafr wen, wen, wen,
Ie finwen, finwen, finwen,
Foel gynffonwen, foel gynffonwen
Ystlys wen a chynffon,
Wen, wen, wen.


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 08:45 AM

GUEST,Suffolk Miracle,

Thanks, is there an English version of 'Gafr wen, wen, wen'?


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: GUEST,Suffolk Miracle
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 08:55 AM

VERY roughly (I'm sure a proper Welsh speaker will send in a thousand corrections):

Are there any more goats to milk?
There's an old one mooching around on the craggs and rocks.
Its a white, white, white one
With a white mouth, white mouth, white mouth
And a white tail, white tail
A white arse and back
White white white.

Then ddu is black, goch is red and las is blue.


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: GUEST,Volgadon
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 09:01 AM

There are many different melodies to Chad Gadya.
The MIDI (2nd from bottom) on this page is similar to what I used to sing. yeladudim.media4u.co.il/PESAH/pesah.htm


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: GUEST,Volgadon
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 09:57 AM

Don't be afraid to adapt the melodies, or come up with your own. These are by no means rigid. Different traditions emphasize different parts of the words.

Here is Chad Gadya from different Jewish communities, not all sung in Aramaic. In order to listen, click on the ear on each page.
This site is amazing, most of the audio is field recordings.
www.piyut.org.il/cgi-bin/search.pl?Expression=chad+gadya&lang=en


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Piers Plowman
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 10:11 AM

"I Have a Song to Sing-O" from "The Yeoman of the Guard" by Gilbert and Sullivan.


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: SINSULL
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 10:13 AM

Dem Bones


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: sian, west wales
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 10:20 AM

Suffolk Miracle's translation is fine,   

Is there another goat?
Yes, not yet milked,
On the sharp rocks
The old goat roams.

A white, white, white goat,
Yes, white mouthed,
bald whitetailed, bald whitetailed,
White shoulder and tail,
White, white,white.

Then black, red, and blue (grey). The one generally known is probably my least favourite Welsh traditional song, largely because it was the only one people ever used to sing socially. There are around 17 Welsh goat-counting songs and some of them are crackin' good.

sian


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 10:26 AM

GUEST,Volgadon,

Thanks for your input so far, unfortunately I'm unable to get your links to work


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: GUEST,Volgadon
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 10:50 AM

www.piyut.org.il/english
Type Chad Gadya in the search.


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 10:53 AM

No, keep getting this:

The webpage cannot be found
HTTP 404
   Most likely causes:
There might be a typing error in the address.
If you clicked on a link, it may be out of date.

   What you can try:
    Retype the address.

    Go back to the previous page.

    Go to and look for the information you want.

    More information

This error (HTTP 404 Not Found) means that Internet Explorer was able to connect to the website, but the page you wanted was not found. It's possible that the webpage is temporarily unavailable. Alternatively, the website might have changed or removed the webpage.

For more information about HTTP errors, see Help.


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: topical tom
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 10:54 AM

"Remember Song" by Tom Rush.


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 11:01 AM

http://www.piyut.org.il/english/


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: GUEST,Gerry
Date: 23 Oct 08 - 08:45 PM

There's a John Warner song, Devlin's General Store, recorded by him and Margaret Walters on the album, Pithead in the Fern. Lyrics available at http://www.folkjohnwarner.com/lyrics.htm


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: GUEST,TJ in San Diego
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 05:07 PM

I can't believe I still remember nearly all the verses of this one after fifty-odd (very odd) years.

Thais:^^^

With a sort of Persian market feeling -

One time in Alexandria, In wicked Alexandria,
Where nights were wild with revelry and life was but a game,
There lived, so the report is, an adventuress and courtesan,
The pride of Alexandria, and Thais was her name.

Nearby in peace and piety, avoiding all society,
There dwelt a band of holy men who'd built a refuge there;
And in the desert's solitude, they spurned all earthly folly
To devote their lives to holy works, to fasting and to prayer.

Now one monk, whom I solely mention, of this band of holy men;
His name was Athanael, he was famous near and far.
At fasting bouts or prayer with him, no other could compare with him.
At grand and lofty praying, he could do the course in par.

One night, while sleeping heavily, from wrestling with the devil
He had gone to bed exhausted while the sun was shining still.
He had a vision freudian and, though he was annoyed,
He analyzed in the well-known style of doctors Jung and Brill.

He dreamed of Alexandria, of wicked Alexandria;
A crowd of men were cheering in a manner rather rude,
As Thais, who was dancing there, and Athanael glancing there,
Observed her do the shimmy in what artists call the nude.

Says he, "This dream fantastical disturbs my thoughts monastical,
Some unsuppressed desire, I fear, has found my monkish cell.
I blushed up to the hat of me, to view that girl's anatomy -
I'll go to Alexandria and save her soul from hell."

So, pausing not to wonder where he'd left his summer underwear,
He quickly packed his evening clothes, a tootbrush and a vest.
To guard against exposure, he threw on some woolen hosiery,
And, bidding all the boys goodbye, he started on his quest.

The Monk, though warned and fortified, was deeply shocked and mortified,
To find, on his arrival, wild debauchery in sway.
While some were in a stupor sent by booze of over two percent,
The others were behaving in a most immoral way.

He says to Thais, "Pardon me, although this quest goes hard on me;
I've got to put you wise to what I've come down here to tell.
Cut out this pie-eyed retinue, what's all this sousin' gettin' you?
Let's hit the trail together, kid, and save your soul from hell."

Although this bold admonishment caused Thais some astonishment,
She quickly answered, "Say, you said a heaping mouthful, beau.
This burg's a drag, I'm tellin' you; the brand of hooch they're sellin' you
Ain't like the stuff we used to get, so let's pack up and go!"

So forth from Alexandria, from wicked Alexandria,
Across the desert sands they go, beneath the blazing sun;
Till Thais, parched and sweltering, finds refuge in the sheltering
Seclusion of a convent - in the habit of a nun!

And now the Monk is terrified to find his fears are verified.
His holy vows of chastity have cracked beneath the strain.
Like one who has a jag on, he cries out in grief and agony,
"I'd sell my soul to see her do the shimmy once again!"^^^

This could, of course, be accompanied by a bouzouki or oud, if so inclined - perhaps even a mandolin. I opt for the guitar myself.

Click to play


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Willa
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 05:43 PM

Volgadon; intriguing - Chad gadya resemles a verse my mother used to recite about an old woman who couldn't get her pig to jump over the stile. She went through a long list of requests including 'stick beat dog, fire burn the stick, water quench the fire, ox drink up the water, butcher kill the ox.
All ended happily and she did 'get home to get the old man's supper'!


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Stringsinger
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 05:48 PM

These songs are sometimes called "laundry list" songs. Oscar Brand's "When I First Came To This Land", the early Germanic/Dutch "There's a Hole In My Bucket", "I Had a Rooster" sung by Pete Seeger and Sam Hinton's "I Had A Bird And the Bird Please Me" (with animal noises), "Ich Bin Der Musikant" (with the various instrument sounds), The "Schitzelbank Song" (on the same order)....some ideas.

Frank Hamilton


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 24 Oct 08 - 06:41 PM

I went to market
Herrings Heads


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 25 Oct 08 - 12:48 AM

JT in SD:
That Thais is brilliant with its internal rhymes.
Do you have a tune for it?

It's the kind of thing Mark Graham does so well nowadays.

Seamus


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 25 Oct 08 - 02:39 AM

Hi, Seamus - Mudcatter Stewart posted lyrics and a MIDI here (click) on his Website. I copied his tune, verified it with Song Fest (1955) and added it to the Digital Tradition entry.


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Piers Plowman
Date: 25 Oct 08 - 06:03 AM

It occurred to me that this sort of song is called "cumulative" and I found this short article, with the titles of a few songs, on Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cumulative_song


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: kendall
Date: 25 Oct 08 - 07:10 AM

There's a hole in the bottom of the sea


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: GUEST
Date: 25 Oct 08 - 10:15 AM

How about "The Barley Mow"
or, for a younger audience "There was an Old Woman (who swallowed a fly)?

W


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Bill D
Date: 25 Oct 08 - 11:57 AM

Here is one I stole from a Jean Ritchie/Oscar Brand LP 40+ years ago, and added & tweaked it a bit with a verse I found in a book.
There is a shorter, slightly different version in the Database, but this is burned into my brain cells this way.....

I encourage the audience to sing with me on the chorus...some even mangage thru 3 verses....

Oh...yes, I DO insist they sing "IS gone"... *grin*

(and, about 15 years ago, the audience at the FSGW Getaway got into the spirit and ran up during the song and brought me close approximations of ALL the items in the song!)

GOOD PEANUTS

The man who owns them good peanuts
And giveth his neighbor none
He shall have none of my good peanuts
When his good peanuts is gone

chorus:
   Won't it be joyful, joyful, joyful
   Won't it be joyful, son?
   Won't it be joyful, joyful, joyful
   When his good peanuts is gone?

The man who owns those soft sweet soda crackers
And giveth his neighbor none
He shall have none of my sweet soft soda crackers
When his sweet soft soda crackers is gone

Chorus: re: crackers

The man who owns them rich, red, ripe, strawberry shortcakes
And giveth his neighbor none
He shall have none of my rich, red, ripe, straberry shortcakes
When his rich, red, ripe, strawberry shortcakes is gone.

Chorus: re:shortcakes

The man who owns them 3 dollar,Plymouth rock, all wool and a yard wide,
guaranteed not to rip and to tear workpants
And giveth his neighbor none
He shall have none of my 3 dollar,Plymouth rock, all wool and a yard wide,
guaranteed not to rip and to tear workpants
When his 3 dollar Plymouth rock, all wool and a yard wide, guaranteed
not to rip and to tear workpants is gone.

Chorus: re:workpants

The man who owns them John Wanamaker's enduable, reversable, sit-on-'em-and-mash 'em, patent restorable, operatic plug-hats,
And giveth his neighbor none,
He shall have none of my John Wanamaker's enduable, reversable, sit-on-'em-and-mash 'em, patent restorable, operatic plug-hats,
When his John Wanamaker's enduable, reversable, sit-on-'em-and-mash 'em, patent restorable, operatic plug-hats is gone.

Chorus: re:plug hats

The man who owns that de-moralized, de-monitized, degenerate, saponacious, silver money...and giveth his neighbor none.
He shall have none of my de-moralized, de-monitized, degenerate, saponacious, silver money,
When his de-moralized, de-monitized, degenerate, saponacious, silver money is gone.

Chorus:......and here, *I*, when I get to the last line of the chorus, reverse the order and sing ALL the lines down from "silver money" down to "good peanuts"...in one breath, if I can.


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Howard Kaplan
Date: 25 Oct 08 - 10:58 PM

Let me suggest Martin Graebe's "Harry the Hawker" [is dead]. However, you need the Sibelius Scorch plug-in to see, hear, or print it on that web page.

Alternatively, there's a posting of the lyrics and of the ABC-notated melody here, on Mudcat. I was quite surprised to see who had posted the ABC notation there, as I had no recollection of having done so before I saw my own name attached to it!


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Piers Plowman
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 05:47 AM

I seem to recall seeing several cumulative songs in Peter Kennedy's _Folk Songs of Britain and Northern Ireland_.


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: Mr Happy
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 05:53 AM

.........& 'One man went to mow'


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Subject: RE: Memory Songs?
From: open mike
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 11:33 AM

there aare some others, which when repeated you leave
out a word each time
and in some you replace with clapping or sign language..

such as:

My hat it has 3 corners,
3 corners has my hat
and had it not 3 corners
it would not be my hat

my (point to head) it has 3 corners...

my (point to head) it has (hold up 3 fingers) corners

my (point to head) it has (hold up 3 fingers) (point to elbow)...etc


or: B I N G O ----- (X) = clap

there was a farmer had a dog
B I N G O was his name-o
B I N G O, B I N G O, B I N G O*
And B I N G O was his name-o....

*
X I N G O
X X N G O
X X X G O
X X X X O
X X X X X


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