If you fancy joining in...

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Tim Leaning
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 02:53 PM

LOL
Paul I am sure there are books you will be recommended to read in order to further your edjikashun.
The time to worry is when you get to the end and still
no one figured out what key you were in.

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: folkypaul
Date: 28 Oct 08 - 02:22 PM

I don't mind people joining in when I sing but as an unaccompanied singer they tend to ask what key I'm going to sing it in.

How do I know.

Paul

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Tim Leaning
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 06:58 PM

"singing along in a drone a micro second behind is not on"
Guilty as charged!
I am terrible at catching the words to a chorus.
But I love to listen.
The thing is if you go to say for example Flaxton,the singing is so breath catching and you want to join in.
But I do do it very quietly(I think!).
The other thing that is embaraasing is I know the words to a DYlan song until the performer starts to look around desperatley for a prompt.
Doh! Bloomin useless me.

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Lowden Jameswright
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 04:30 PM

There's nothing to compare with an off-the-cuff spot where folks join in and something sparks. I don't care if I experience a dozen occasions that don't quite hit the spot, just as long as the spark is there now and again - it's worth it. Maybe folks should be prepared to take a risk now and again, and not be too precious about their own performance? (beats a hasty retreat)

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Valmai Goodyear
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 09:24 AM

Gurney, I'd agree about not joining in a song with an instrument unless invited. It can be highly disruptive to a singer and is very bad manners. Singing with an accompaniment is a very different skill from singing unaccompanied. Adding a voice and maybe harmonies to choruses is one of the deep joys of traditional music.

Joining in with dance tunes is another matter. Most players are happy with this, but even so it's best to listen to a tune all through before crashing in at full volume as they may be playing a local or personal variant of something well-known. Visiting musicians are frequently caught bending by the Sussex version of The Oyster Girl, which comes from Scan Tester and has a markedly different B music from the standard one.

Also, a musician may be trying to relieve themselves of a party piece with variations or harmonies which will be wrecked by the application of oven-ready chords or someone else's idea of what the speed should be. Some might be able to take refuge in an unfamilar key which will confuse pursuit, but that option isn't open to everyone.

A lot of our music is social, as Will Fly rightly says, but a little listening benefits everyone.

Valma (Lewes)

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Dave (Bridge)
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 03:43 AM

Joining in appropriately is fine. BUT, singing along in a drone a micro second behind is not on. We often have a person in our company who does this all the time. Even to songs which have just been written and sung for the very first time. Amazingly, this person cannot help the singer if they forget the words. Why 'cause they don't know the words.

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Gurney
Date: 27 Oct 08 - 12:20 AM

Depends where you are. I've had people complain because I'm joining in the choruses at a concert. When I explained that was what the chorus' were for and carried on, he got the huff and left, complaining to the management on the way out.
The concert was by The Jews Brothers, well-known here in many scenes, including folk.

I wouldn't join in with an instrument unless invited.

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Melissa
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 07:03 PM

That sounds like it was a nice gathering, Nick..thanks for the link.

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Nick
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 06:34 PM

Sorry wrong link that's a Counting Crows song I was working on - here's Willow Tree

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Nick
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 06:32 PM

Apart from very few things I like people to join in and tend to announce keys and invite people to add something. I'm lucky to play with a bunch of people who don't have enormous egos and have the talent to join in and add things which makes it a more attractive option. I was at a folk thing recently with a mandolin player who couldn't play in time (or sometimes in key come to think about it) but played on everything.

I happened to have my Zoom recorder with me the night that we had a nice spread of players in and we played 'Willow Tree'
together. If I remember the line up for it was something like vocals and singers, three guitars, three fiddles, two concertinas and a squeezebox, electric bass, harmonica, and trumpet. Given that it was completely unrehearsed (you'll catch the instruction at the beginning - "it's in G" and "we need a bit of bass on this" - all highly technical) it comes out pretty well and the time only goes awry here and there.

Nice when things work and the whole is greater than the sum of the parts etc

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Tim Leaning
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 04:26 PM

I used to get terrible margarines but I think I growed out of them.

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 03:55 PM

Yep. I'm for it. Joining-in music. Except for margarine who will NOT listen!

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Amos
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 02:57 PM

Well, each locale has its own conventions, but I am much in favor of all-in participation at least once in a while. It makes for much stronger bonds.


A

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Melissa
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 02:25 PM

I'm in the middle of the US..guess I'll need to holler my assistance loudly!

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Tim Leaning
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 02:23 PM

Ahhh Melissa,thats the best offer I had in ages.
I expect there is half a world between us?
I am in the UK at Grimsby.
Famous for being the Birth place of Fiddlers Green
and smelling a bit.

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Will Fly
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 01:32 PM

Generally speaking, I prefer acoustic sessions (where everyone joins in) to folk clubs (where people perform sequentially). In most cases, people either play very quietly or sit out if they really don't know a tune properly, or are still learning it. It's a great way to get to know the music and, if the session organisers/participants are sensible and welcoming people, a great evening as well. In the sessions I participate in and run, all comers are welcome and the musical range is quite eclectic - something for everyone. And - to be honest - it can be so loud that a comparative learner who makes the odd fluff can do so in the knowledge that his/her fluffs won't be heard!

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 01:30 PM

Until I feel more competent as a singer, I prefer singing along to singing alone. I'll take any opportunity to quietly harmonise. I need a group to sing along with. Lovely blending in, not to mention anonymity.

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Melissa
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 01:18 PM

sit near me then, Tim..I'll help you.

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Tim Leaning
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 01:13 PM

Re joining in
I would l;ove to be able to do that,unfortunatly I play the guitar same as lots of other people,and am applingly slow at catching on to what is happening.
Its bad enough when you fluff your own turn but tis very embarassing indeed to stuff up someone elses go.

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Acorn4
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 01:10 PM

My wife sings and accompanies herself on concertina and often finds keys like A flat and E flat best for her vocal range.

We once had a sarcastic comment from a melodoen player that he wasn't able to join in with his instrument.

I don't think I need comment further!

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 10:23 AM

Lowden,
I'm with you all the way.

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Lowden Jameswright
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 10:13 AM

Whoops - sorry about my typing - that disappoints me also

Subject: RE: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Silas
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 10:05 AM

I have a maxim. Only join in if you have something to add.

Subject: If you fancy joining in.....
From: Lowden Jameswright
Date: 26 Oct 08 - 10:00 AM

.... it's in "F" or if you prefer, D on Capo 3...

Reading the "Folk Club Manners" thread made me think about the wisdom or otherwise of inviting others to play along. It's something I try to do as often as possible because so many people turn up to play at our local folk club that it's likely they only get to do one song. OK, so sometimes it doesn't quite gell as you'd like it, but I'm one for involving other players and singers 'cause I think it helps carry the evening along.

I'm very much in the minority though, and have to admit some dissappointment at being so.

Why don't more folks try it?