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From Max: Mudcat Update
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Max Date: 12 Nov 08 - 06:59 PM US: http://amazon.mudcat.org UK: http://amazonUK.mudcat.org FR: http://amazonFR.mudcat.org CA: http://amazonCA.mudcat.org Any German shoppers? |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Leadfingers Date: 12 Nov 08 - 07:25 PM Mister Bliss ! I wish you WERE a member , then I could PM this instead of cluttering the threads ! I know where you are coming from with regard to the negativity re MudCat in the UK Folk world , but there is a LOT of Positivity too. The Clowns who cause the trouble in here dont seem to be very active within Folk at all , either as players or Audience , but still DO put a lot of New People off ! If people didnt respond to the inflammatory posts , this would be a much happier place . The Catters I have met in Real Life have ALL been OK people , wether in UK , in the States or from elswhere in the world . LONG LIVE MUDCAT == And Max For President !! |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: katlaughing Date: 12 Nov 08 - 07:56 PM Having ploughed through some of the very long and contentious UK music threads, I can understand a little bit of what TB is talking about, too. There are some cultural differences, even among UKers, which can be a bit difficult to sort out, at times, and there seems to be more of "taking the piss" and I don't mean that in a US way.:-) I think with the land mass being more compact, too, the UKers seem to know one another and each others' music better than the rest of us. I confess, the whole UK scene seems pretty *incestuous* to me, sometimes!**bg** kat |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Joe Offer Date: 12 Nov 08 - 08:18 PM We have a number of Mudcatters in Germany, Max - and word has it that they are Big Spenders.... |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Bonnie Shaljean Date: 12 Nov 08 - 08:29 PM And we all know that Money Makes The World Go 'Round... http://www.amazon.de/ |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: semi-submersible Date: 12 Nov 08 - 08:35 PM Since I first arrived, I've observed certain Mudcatters having a moderating effect by the power of their words. They speak briefly and kindly, with patience and purpose. Humanity touches humanity, and the response I feel inside me makes up for all the pettiness. Handsome is as handsome does. Visible "Moderator" badges would actually take away from that sense of human contact, and inhibit bystanders like me from trying to volunteer. Whose "job" is it to pour oil on troubled waters? Not mine: I'm not authorised. Not that I've done much; but I feel like it's up to us, not somebody with a uniform, to make this community a good place. It works, Max. Yes, to Mudcat MP3s! Buy 12, get one free? |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Joe_F Date: 12 Nov 08 - 08:40 PM It would be convenient if one could attach a post to the particular previous post to which it is a reply, rather than just tacking it on to the end of the thread. That would also provide a perspicuous way of correcting one's own errors, short of being able to edit previous posts. (O.K., you know where I get these outlandish ideas. For quite a while I thought of the Mudcat as the monster that ate rec.music.folk.) |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Azizi Date: 12 Nov 08 - 09:31 PM Rather than talk about who has been "kept out" of Mudcat-or who chooses not to post on Mudcat after lurkin here, I'd love to talk about how we could get certain populations of folks to visit Mudcat and post on threads. Specifically, I'd love to see more people of color posting on Mudcat. I suppose there may be other people of color besides me who regularly or periodically post on this forum, but when a thread on race invariably is started, those persons don't speak out. Consequently, those discussions lack the myrid perspectives from people of color. I've not been successful in the individual recruitment that I've done, but I know there must be other people of color who are interested in the wide ranging serious, research oriented, and/or lighthearted witty play on word discussion that we have here on music, culture, and so much more. In the brick and mortar world, when integration was beginning, some civic,religious, education, or social etc groups decided not to wait for people of color to come to them, but recognized the need to be proactive about reaching out to these populations, partly because those groups recognized the value that they would receive in being more integrated. I'm wondering, Max, if you would consider doing targeted publicity about Mudcat to online websites whose posters or members are predominately African Americans, Black Britons, Latinos, Native Americans, Asians, and/or other people of color? An aspect of this targeted recruitment might be highlighting threads on subjects that might be more recognizable to persons from those populations such as threads on Caribbean music, or African music, or threads on specific artists from those cultures and other cultures {many of which are part of the larger cultures of the countries from which most Mudcatters come-the USA, UK, Canada, and Australia}. If you are interested in this idea, Max, I'm interested in being part of the brainstorming as to how such targeted recruitment of Mudcat members-or simply information sharing about the existence of Mudcat-could effectively occur. Thanks, in advance, for your consideration of this idea. And thank you for making this wonderful resource and community possible. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: semi-submersible Date: 12 Nov 08 - 09:53 PM Hey, good idea too, Azizi. Do you have a short list of all-time "memorable cultural threads"? Can we have it in the FAQs? Of course other ethnicities' best threads ought to be on the list, too, but if you make sure it contains some of the best examples you've seen, it would offer a rewarding place for people to start without getting discouraged by their first few threads. Popular "favourite threads lists" make a good starting point for any neophyte, and could be featured prominently in any publicity. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Charley Noble Date: 12 Nov 08 - 10:35 PM Max- Thanks for the update. It's good to be reminded that there is a man and a family behind the working virtual community called the Mudcat Forum. I'll be sending in a holiday bonus soon. Cheerily, Charley Noble |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: GUEST,.gargoyle Date: 13 Nov 08 - 12:18 AM Love Offering -In some tight-knit communities it is common at Thanksgiving to offer up a "love offering" to someone that is in need - or to someone that has ministered to a need.
Read the thread and contribute - as you are able.
Sincerely,
You want sell CD's - of stuff already in public domain???? I would gladly pay a US buck EACH for the two hundred of my worst rants ... to be expunged forever... from the hidden (PTL) archives of the Mudcat ... Lord knows that the bank would be bankrupt if I were to try and cover them all. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: GUEST,.gargoyle Date: 13 Nov 08 - 12:21 AM AZIZIZZZn -
Re: I'd love to see more people of color posting on Mudcat.
Chit gurl yo gotta git uz a dye berry card furst.
Sincerely, |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Colin Randall Date: 13 Nov 08 - 12:24 AM While some people may be deterred from posting by the fear that they could be insulted, I've a feeling that most of us are sufficiently thick-skinned not to worry too much. Robust argument is fine. In various parts of my life, I have been known to criticise, and I am perfectly prepared to receive criticism. If it descends into abuse, I persuade myself that I have probably won a point. Maybe meeker souls should take comfort from the fact that abusers stick out so much that they simply bring contempt on themselves. Look at the fourth message on this thread (guest.e and signed G). No comment on the individual or his/her words is remotely necessary. As others have said or implied, Mudcat is a special place. I enjoy the debates, long and short, and am especially grateful for the opportunity to draw attention to items at my own very modest site. I know that some of those items appeal to Mudcatters, because they have said so. But I am also realistic enough to admit that they would go largely unseen, and lead me to close the site down, if I had no means of alerting others interested in the music. Colin Salut! Live ps I agree with the suggestion above that there should be an edit function. I write and edit for a living, but often seen howlers of my own only after e-mailing or posting in haste. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Seamus Kennedy Date: 13 Nov 08 - 01:01 AM Thanks, Max! The one thing I've learned from my years here on the 'Cat: 1. You'll never stop trolls from trolling. 1. You'll never stop flamers from flaming. 1. You'll never stop idiots from feeding the trolls and feeding the flames. Keep up the good work Max, Mudelves, Clones and Joe. Seamus |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Gervase Date: 13 Nov 08 - 03:55 AM I confess, the whole UK scene seems pretty *incestuous* to me, sometimes!**bg** Too right, kat. I gave up trying to count the number of fingers at the last session, while the twang of the banjos almost drove me mad! ;-) |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Liz the Squeak Date: 13 Nov 08 - 04:17 AM Seamus - you should also have learned that nothing stops the music, whatever happens! I think the balance between UK and US subjects is pretty good - the US contingent may have to put up with lots of UK based performance threads, but the UK have had to put up with myriad US political threads too... so it evens out. I do however object to Guest.e's use of the phrase "UK poofters"... both racist and homophobist in two words. I'd object whatever nation was indicated, not just because I'm British. And yes, KatLaughing; with such a small but highly populated island, we do meet up far more often than perhaps those in the US might. I wouldn't quite say 'incestuous' but there is often a faint sound of duelling banjos in the distance at some gatherings! :D It is perhaps that closeness that brings personal feelings, preferences and arguments to the fore in UK orientated threads. What spills out into the threads and on the forum is really only the tip of the iceberg and is often generated by actual behaviour of an individual at a festival or in their private life. Often you only get to hear one side or a warped version of the story, an opinion is formed and nothing anyone can say will change it. When you get individuals, whether named or Guests, fighting it out and washing dirty linen on a public forum, then the best thing you can do is just keep out of the argument and stop feeding the trolls. We're all guilty of having done just the opposite, I'm sure.... I suspect most people forget that this site started as a private venture, not a huge big multi-corporational mega-sponsored moneymaker - I know I do. Thank you, Max. Sometimes I wonder if you have any idea at all of the impact you have made on our lives. LTS |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Spleen Cringe Date: 13 Nov 08 - 04:38 AM Quote: "An idea for generating income right on this site is to sell members' mp3s with Mudcat getting a cut. See eFolkmusic.org for an example. So many mudcatters are musicians and have music available for sale. Not all of it is available at Amazon, but could be available on mudcat to each other as well as to the public. This would be good for members and good for the 'cat." In some ways, Mudcat is in a far better position to do this than, say, the late and lamented Woven Wheat Whispers, in that it already has an international profile and a huge pool of talented singers and musicians on tap. There is also, I reckon, knowledge out there amongst the membership about how to make such a venture work, too... Meanwhile, cheers to Max et al for this place. Personally, I like the principle of running it on semi-anarchistic lines. Max's faith in our alibilty and desire to reveal our better selves is an object lesson in hope for humanity... |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: John MacKenzie Date: 13 Nov 08 - 05:49 AM Colin; Guest e, I assume to be the inscrutable, and sometimes unbearable Gargoyle, who also made the post immediately after. Apart from that...............What Liz said, and may I add to it by asking people to check their facts, before they post. It's like editing your own post, but more personal. JM |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Andrez Date: 13 Nov 08 - 05:57 AM Coming in very late on this thread and have yet to finish it all, but is Joe the Cloner related in anyway to Joe the Plumber? :-) Cheers, Andrez |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: GUEST,Elfcall Date: 13 Nov 08 - 06:11 AM First item purchased from Amazon Uk with the Mudcat link. Elf |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: The Fooles Troupe Date: 13 Nov 08 - 07:45 AM QUOTE "An idea for generating income right on this site is to sell members' mp3s with Mudcat getting a cut. See Folkmusic.org for an example. So many mudcatters are musicians and have music available for sale. Not all of it is available at Amazon, but could be available on mudcat to each other as well as to the public. This would be good for members and good for the 'cat." UNQUOTE I thought that was what the "Blue Plate Specials" were... ... ... ... Sorry, the TV was just showing that footage of "The World's Hottest Buns" ..... again... :-P |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Barbara Shaw Date: 13 Nov 08 - 08:50 AM The "Blue Plate Specials" are for the full mudcat cds. The website http://efolkmusic.org sells cds but also individual mp3s uploaded by its roster of performers. Mudcat has a built-in community of musicians and listeners and selling mp3s here would involve no handling of inventory. In fact, people could record, upload and potentially sell individual tracks as they make them. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Azizi Date: 13 Nov 08 - 09:31 AM semi-submersible, thanks for your response to my idea. I like the idea of a listing of "memorable cultural threads" being a way to interest people in Mudcat once they become aware of this site. The point I was making is how to help specific populations become aware of this site. But focusing on your question/comment, I think the threads listed should be more descriptive than the term "cultural". For instance, is there a thread on the most memorable Blues threads, or the most memorable Caribbean music threads" or the most memorable African music threads or memorable African American music threads [which of course who overlap with the Blues thread but would include such threads as the one on the song Iko Iko, thread.cfm?threadid=23200. Also, I didn't know about this archived thread that was started in 1998 until it was refreshed today with a new post: blues lyrics meanings thread.cfm?threadid=4581&messages=29 . Imo, that's an example of a thread which "deserves to be added to a listing of memorable Blues thread. I think that a good way of alerting people of color* and other folks to Mudcat is starting and maintaining a Mudcat Discussion forum Wikipedia page. Hyperlinks to categories of memorable threads could be posted on that page. Although I've never contributed to a Wikipedia page before, I'm interested in working on a Mudcat Wikipedia page along with other Mudcatters, if Max wants such a page. With regard to hyperlinks to those threads being in Mudcat's Frequently asked questions "thread", in my opinion, Mudcat's FQA is already very difficult to follow. However, if Max and/or the moderators want to add hyperlinks to these types of memorable threads to the FQA section, so be it. *To answer a question I was asked in a pm, "people of color" is an all enclusive, generic phrase that has been used since at least the 1990s by African Americans and others to refer to Black people, Latinos, Native Americans, Asians, and other people who have been considered to be "minorities". "People of color" doesn't mean the same thing as "Colored people", which is a largely outdated referent for Black Americans. As I used it, that term also does not have tghe same meaning as the South African referent for mixed race people-Coloureds-or other such referents around the world. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Roger the Skiffler Date: 13 Nov 08 - 09:34 AM I asked about Mudcat & AmazonUK years ago and got no response, so I was glad to have the new link which I've replaced on my Favourites. As I encourage loved ones to buy me things (OK, yes, I mean CDs!)off my Amazon wishlist,rather than buying me things I don't want , that should help the 'Cat out this Xmas (and I've been known to buy the odd one myself!). RtS |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Barbara Shaw Date: 13 Nov 08 - 10:33 AM OK, how about this: can mudcat get a cut of any sales referred to eFolkmusic from this site via a special link, like it does with Amazon? |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: GUEST,Rudy Date: 13 Nov 08 - 10:43 AM Hi Joe Offer, In that Silver Burdett music textbook series, is there a song about fishing. . . Fishermen are sitting by the lake...by the lake Waiting for the fish to take their bait...take their bait Not a ripple, not a sound Quietness is all around Fishermen are sitting by the lake...by the lake. Thanks!
-Joe Offer- |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: katlaughing Date: 13 Nov 08 - 10:53 AM Azizi, they need to be updated and may not be as specifically categorised as you are talking about, but we do have some memorable threads listed with links in the Permathread Index which is accessed through the drop down menu at the head of the thread titles. LtS, thanks for explaining it better than I could; you've put your finger right on it, imo. Gervase...{BG}...thought that was banjoes I heard!**bg** |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Cool Beans Date: 13 Nov 08 - 11:45 AM The issue of folks' nasty postings arose on another site I frequent, Talkin' Broadway, which prompted a regular to remark: Are you tough enough for a theater chat board? So how about a Mudcat T-shirt with the slogan: Are You Tough Enough for a Folk Music Chat Board? |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: GUEST,Dani Date: 13 Nov 08 - 12:45 PM One thing I've learned by going to a lot of auctions is that you have to go up close and look. If you didn't check it out in the preview, don't buy it from far away, 'cause you just don't know 'til you get it home! Joe IS all those things y'all are ready to bid on (I'll attest to the eyes), but he's also married... AND, more alarming, as far as I can tell he's in love! Dani |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: John MacKenzie Date: 13 Nov 08 - 12:55 PM Well Mudcat already has Tee shirts available, but one that said 'I survived CH and MG', might be apposite' JM |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Sorcha Date: 13 Nov 08 - 10:31 PM You never miss an opportunity for a snotty, snarky, nasty comment do you MacKenzie? I particularly liked one of the recent ones: "The ability to edit ones own posts is a double edged sword. As some people may use it to their own ends. Re writing history is pretty popular in some circles. You can always ask a clone to edit"---Mow I wonder just WHO likes to re write history? Rest assured, you ARE being watched by Other Clones. Sleep well. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: GutBucketeer Date: 13 Nov 08 - 11:55 PM Yeah on everything. Glad Supersearch is up again. Glad that you are innovating. I will use the amazon link for everything I purchase. But most of all, we have missed YOU. Don't forget to play more MUSIC too! Are you playing out again? You know I think you are great. Others do too. Would you be interested in a house concert in the DC area? I'm sure it could raise some money (for either yourself and/or Mudcat). One thing that might be possible is to work on aggregating and editing some of the thread topics and publishing some of them. The advice found here is amazing on topics from musicology, to instrument care and building, to playing techniques, to songs and lyrics. And then there are the stories. Gutbucketeer |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: katlaughing Date: 14 Nov 08 - 12:18 AM I've got ISBN numbers going to waste. Right now, I have plans for two more, that will leave seven needing to be used. Once I get Prairie Child published early next year and see about doing the same with the novel I am working, I've plans to take a look at a couple of the story threads which we've talked about publishing, after careful editing. I have no problem using some of my ISBNs and assigning them and all proceeds to Mudcat with whatever we might come up with. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Jeri Date: 14 Nov 08 - 08:02 AM Sorcha: personal opinion: you either fix something or forget it. I don't want to hear about personal molehills from maybe over a year ago that have been filling a mountain-sized vacuum and keep expanding, and are dragged out whenever an excuse is needed to smack somebody. If you want to have a personal grudge against somebody, the rest of Mudcat and the part of the world that reads Mudcat probably does NOT want to hear about it. Fix it or forget it, because refusing to do one of those things looks like you enjoy the grudge. Maybe you do and maybe a few others at Mudcat like having a reliable target, a scapegoat, but I don't. I think the BS side of Mudcat has come to be about who are our enemies and who are our friends, and that's mostly what drives some of our opinions. I don't like that, but I'm just one voice. Everybody (admins) is watching everybody (although we only speculate about who's doing what) and Max is watching us all. I couldn't be happier that he's re-surfaced. As an admin, I feel we admins need supervision. It's not good for folks to not know there's an appeal authority and it's not good for us (admins) to not have an appeal authority or someone to go to with questions or complaints. I don't usually have many questions, but just knowing there is a Max reassures me. I was talking to someone yesterday and the phrase 'power vacuum' came up. That's exactly what's happened at Mudcat. Some saw a need for authority and no authority, so they jumped in. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: semi-submersible Date: 14 Nov 08 - 08:11 AM Thanks, katlaughing, for pointing out the Permathreads Index I'd overlooked all this time. I like the explanatory sentence or two beside each link (Mudcat Classic Threads section) to augment the thread titles. I prefer to have a sense of where I'm going before I click. Azizi, if you can bring in participants by "starting and maintaining a Mudcat Discussion forum Wikipedia page [with] categories of memorable threads," great. (We now have a Wikipedia Mudcat article thanks chiefly to Gulliver.) Would you be able to post your links here on Mudcat's own forum too? The Permathreads Index looks like the right place. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: artbrooks Date: 14 Nov 08 - 08:15 AM Well said, Jeri. Max, a point of clarification. You said earlier, "I want all contributions stopped". Many of us see Mudcat as providing many things in addition to the social networking facility that many people use it for. As such, we feel that this service should be paid for - at least on a voluntary basis. Many of us contributed to the last hardware buy (the terabit drive). Personally, it makes me feel good to think that I am helping to make this all happen. This is not charity - it is payment for services rendered. May we continue doing so? Art Brooks |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: John MacKenzie Date: 14 Nov 08 - 08:55 AM Art, if Max manages to make the whole thing self financing, which it would appear is his aim. We could still raise money for good cause, like we have for members who have special needs, like losing their house and contents in a fire, as has happened. It could give grants to help talented kids buy instruments, or pay their fare to musical events, like summer schools. There is unlimited scope for doing good, in a Folk Music orientated way. I like the sound of a Mudcat Cafe Foundation. JM |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Beer Date: 14 Nov 08 - 09:04 AM I agree with you on this John. There are some great things we could do. Adrien |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Liz the Squeak Date: 14 Nov 08 - 09:16 AM That's one of your best ideas this year John! A Mudcat Foundation to provide tuition or instruments and equipment or even just get a copy of 'Singing Together' into every home in the world! (alright, maybe not that last one...) but certainly something that will give back to the community at large from the community here, most of whom have benefitted from this site - whether it be virtually, really, financially or personally. It bears thinking about... LTS |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Max Date: 14 Nov 08 - 09:19 AM I don't have a problem with contibutions, though I would very much like to survive without them. The big picture is to generate money to be able to spend the time on the mudcat. I would like to think that the more time I spend on the mudcat, the better it will be. I also intend to seek grants and maybe even interns, getting the 501(c)3 non-profit status, the whole ball of wax. I see the foundation too John, a dream of mine, to be sure. I want the mudcat to be important and relevant not only on the internet, but everywhere. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Stilly River Sage Date: 14 Nov 08 - 10:06 AM This is good. Mudcat is a resource for so many of us, it would be nice to make it more of a brand and a force for good musical support, wherever. For example, I posted a link to this Bill Moyers interview a few weeks ago and speculated that it would be marvelous if Mudcat could raise a few hundred (or even thousands) dollars and build one of these schools in Africa. A note on the link, it is a segment of the program that has some commentary (four minutes) before it gets to discussing the documentary Playing for Change: Music for Peace. The film stems from a multi-year project taht combines the music of street musicians from around the world in familiar songs. It is an incredible job of mixing these performances. The response was disappointing--polite interest in the subject coupled with enthusiasm for the film, but no sense of "we could do this!" that I had hoped for. With a foundation, this IS the kind of work Mudcat could do. I'm going to buy this DVD through the Mudcat like to Amazon, if it is available. SRS |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Stilly River Sage Date: 14 Nov 08 - 10:22 AM Well, darn. For now it is unavailable, but I have added it to my queue at Netflix. It says "Very Long Wait." SRS |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Azizi Date: 14 Nov 08 - 12:31 PM semi-submersible, I wasn't aware that there already was a Mudcat Wikipedia. I looked for the page under Mudcat Discussion Forum rather than Mudcat Cafe. I'm glad to know that such a page exist. Thanks, Gulliver! At this time, I'm not interested in starting a Permathread as a means of recruiting new members or for any other reason. However, if such threads were started, depending on their subject matter, I may very well contribute comments about that subject and/or hyperlinks to current or archived Mudcat threads. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: nutty Date: 14 Nov 08 - 12:41 PM This may be far too ambitious but I would love Mudchat to have webcam facilities so that I can the person I'm talking to - only if they want it, of course. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Mo the caller Date: 14 Nov 08 - 02:15 PM Thinking about the request for editing, and those spelling mistakes that you see in the second between pressing the button and your post going. Could it be made so that Preview is ticked unless we click it off, instead of needing to remember to click it as now? Or is there some way I could do that myself? |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: katlaughing Date: 14 Nov 08 - 05:07 PM Well put, Jeri, I feel the same way. Thanks. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: gnu Date: 14 Nov 08 - 05:11 PM Me too, Jeri. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: skarpi Date: 14 Nov 08 - 05:14 PM well said Jeri ., |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: Mrs.Duck Date: 14 Nov 08 - 05:45 PM I don't know about webcams , Nutty I'd just like some folk to chat to! Never find anyone in there. Used to be quite buzzing in there but folk seem to have wandered off into private spaces. |
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Subject: RE: From Max: Mudcat Update From: gnu Date: 14 Nov 08 - 05:54 PM Ummmm. Back to the topic? I know I posted off topic... sorry Max. |
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