Lyrics & Knowledge Personal Pages Record Shop Auction Links Radio & Media Kids Membership Help
The Mudcat Cafemuddy

Post to this Thread - Sort Descending - Printer Friendly - Home


Tech: MIDI port question

GUEST,leeneia 30 Nov 08 - 09:59 PM
Joe Offer 30 Nov 08 - 10:09 PM
M.Ted 30 Nov 08 - 11:17 PM
GUEST,leeneia 01 Dec 08 - 12:00 AM
Joe Offer 01 Dec 08 - 12:30 AM
Darowyn 01 Dec 08 - 03:42 AM
GUEST 01 Dec 08 - 06:10 AM
pavane 01 Dec 08 - 10:17 AM
M.Ted 01 Dec 08 - 12:50 PM
Darowyn 01 Dec 08 - 03:26 PM
Darowyn 01 Dec 08 - 03:29 PM
M.Ted 01 Dec 08 - 09:16 PM
GUEST,.gargoyle 01 Dec 08 - 09:33 PM
GUEST,leeneia 02 Dec 08 - 10:05 AM
M.Ted 02 Dec 08 - 11:22 AM
jeffp 02 Dec 08 - 12:03 PM
GUEST,goodlife 02 Dec 08 - 03:49 PM
IvanB 02 Dec 08 - 10:05 PM
GUEST,leeneia 03 Dec 08 - 11:10 AM
GUEST,Ed 03 Dec 08 - 11:34 AM
GUEST,leeneia 03 Dec 08 - 11:32 PM
IvanB 04 Dec 08 - 12:01 AM
Share Thread
more
Lyrics & Knowledge Search [Advanced]
DT  Forum
Sort (Forum) by:relevance date
DT Lyrics:









Subject: Tech: MIDI port question
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 30 Nov 08 - 09:59 PM

My computer is an old one. Actually, it was custom-made long ago and has been updated from time to time. At any rate, I am not familiar with present-day off the shelf computers.

If I were to buy a computer from one of the mass makers, such as Dell, would it have a MIDI port? Or is a MIDI port something out of the ordinary?

The reason I ask is that I am going to give a demonstration on using MIDI, and I need to know what the average buyer needs to buy in order to have a QWERTY keyboard and a piano keyboard plugged into a computer.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: Joe Offer
Date: 30 Nov 08 - 10:09 PM

Hi, Leeneia-
MIDI ports on computers are long gone, probably since about 2000. They used to accommodate joysticks and other game controllers. I can't recall how many pins they had - they looked like a video or serial port.

Nowadays, MIDI keyboards are connected to computers by USB. Some keyboards have USB outlets, but I think most still have the round connectors that MIDI keyboards have had for years.

If you Google or search Amazon for MIDI to USB, you'll find what you're looking for. Cables run from eight to forty bucks.

Hope that helps.

-Joe-


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: M.Ted
Date: 30 Nov 08 - 11:17 PM

You need one of these: MIDI/USB interface


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 01 Dec 08 - 12:00 AM

So if a beginner with an up-to-date computer goes to the store and buys a MIDI piano keyboard, all she needs is a USB port?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: Joe Offer
Date: 01 Dec 08 - 12:30 AM

Well, leeneia, I checked a few keyboards from Casio, Yamaha, and Roland. All have the round MIDI In/Out ports, but only one expensive Roland keyboard had USB. So, you'll most likely have to buy an adapter. The MIDI ports can be a bit troublesome, although the most common problem is confusing what "In" and "Out" mean - they're just the opposite of what one would think they should be. I don't know how many times I've made myself look like a genius by just switching "in" and "out."
The USB connection is almost dummyproof.
-Joe-


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: Darowyn
Date: 01 Dec 08 - 03:42 AM

I don't agree with Joe on that. I guess that he was looking for Keyboards that were capable of working as a free standing instrument with built in voices- as an electronic organ or a stage piano, for example.
For midi work on a computer, it is more usual these days to use sounds inside the computer rather than in the keyboard.
Accordingly, all you need from your keyboard is the facility to turn key presses into midi messages sent via USB.
Nearly all of these controller keyboards come with USB, and are much cheaper.
Here are some examples on Musicians Friend
Cheers
Dave


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: GUEST
Date: 01 Dec 08 - 06:10 AM

Most recent computers fit a motherboard with on board sound card(not always the greatest), and which has a standard line/mic in and audio out connection.

Basically all you need to do is fit a sound card on your computer with the right connection; common as muck and cheap as anything. Then the expensive bit; you need to buy the lead which has the MIDI IN & OUT converter to D plug. A decent music shop should still sell them, but they're about 20 quid.

USB to MIDI tend to be a bit more expensive. I think Edirol sell the cheapest.

Mike (sorry can log in where I am)


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: pavane
Date: 01 Dec 08 - 10:17 AM

I got a USB MIDI lead for about $10 (haven't tried it yet though)


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: M.Ted
Date: 01 Dec 08 - 12:50 PM

The keyboard has to have a USB port--remember that there are still some inexpensive synthesizers around that don't have any output at all, or only analog audio outputs. There are also some synth units that are used for live performance, such as the palm sized Kaosillator, that only have analog output.

There are also synthesizer workstations, like the Korg Tritons, which have midi sequencers and even recording software built in, so you can use them to create MIDIs, and you can convert the MIDI to soundfiles, and add analog tracks--

It gets even more complex than this, because there are always new devices that get added to the mix--I've been wanting to buy a new keyboard for more than a year, and I can't quite figure out whether I want it to be a workstation, or whether I want to just do that all on my computer. It's a puzzlement.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: Darowyn
Date: 01 Dec 08 - 03:26 PM

Unfortunately, my Guest post has been deleted, which makes nonsense of my apology for not being logged in.
I was pointing out that the machines Joe refers to are all free-standing instruments with internal sound generators as well as Midi capability.
What is more usual these days is to have a keyboard which is only a controller for sounds generated inside the computer, and which all have USB as standard these days.
These are a few examples
M Audio is a reputable brand. I use several of their devices. They are far cheaper, and sometimes better than a workstation/synthesiser keyboard.
Cheers
Dave
    Sorry 'bout that, Dave. One of the volunteers got carried away. I undeleted the missing posts.
    -Joe Offer-


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: Darowyn
Date: 01 Dec 08 - 03:29 PM

THat did not work either:- try this:-
Second attempt


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: M.Ted
Date: 01 Dec 08 - 09:16 PM

You linked to a whole page of synthesizers, which, by definition, generate sounds, in one way or another. Many of them output this digital sound info through both USB and MIDI--most shown there don't have analog output though, so they do need an audio converter. You know that, of course.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: GUEST,.gargoyle
Date: 01 Dec 08 - 09:33 PM

Soooo.....

My inabibility to post to Mudcat ----

Is not personal....(TILC TAK ehT and others who resent The Light) .....................................you folks are mearly in the process of training even more "CONE-HEAD CLONES?"

]

And mistakes happen....

OK .. I can accept that.

Sincerely,
Gargoyle


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 02 Dec 08 - 10:05 AM

My head is spinning.

I'm going to give a talk to the harp society in town. The harpers range in age from 16 to 40. I want to show them how to use a computer to go online and download music in MIDI form.

I also want to show how, using music software, one can arrange music, change key, write new parts, etc.

Meanwhile, my own equipment is very old. My piano keyboard, bless its little heart, has been going for about 15 years. That's gratifying, but not informative for the average 18-year-old. Her computer will be much newer.

To re-phrase the original question, what does she have to do to download and edit MIDI's?


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: M.Ted
Date: 02 Dec 08 - 11:22 AM

Bottom line is that your average 18 year old probably has a program such as Garage Band which allows editing both midi and sound files into a music file that can then be burned to disk or uploaded to the internet, or whatever.

This program has an expandable library of MIDI clips which can be cut and pasted, and new MIDI clips can be recorded, either by way of a piano keyboard, or by using the typewriter keyboard. You can also add existing MIDI files to the library and tinker with them to your heart's content.

If you have an audio converter, as described above, you can also record voice, instruments, or whatever and edit that to your heart's content, as well.

There are also ways to sample audio files(which is how a lot of the hip-hop stuff is done)--so basically you have the same type of sequencer that we've done MIDI with since the old days, and you cut and paste, same as always, but you have a lot more pieces to cut and paste.

Kids can learn to use these things intuitively--my 12 year old daughter sat down at a computer in a children's museum and put together a music track for a short video she'd made without having anyone explain *anything*--With adults, it's a different story. It took me twenty minutes of fiddling with the program before I realized that I already knew how to use it;-)

Anyway, my advice is, before you give your talk, do a little homework and get familiar with Garage Band or Mixcraft, which is a PC program that is very similar. There are actually tutorial videos around, and, after initial panic, you'll find yourself on surprisingly familiar ground--


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: jeffp
Date: 02 Dec 08 - 12:03 PM

To download MIDI's, you just need a computer and Internet connection, but you knew that. To listen, you need either an internal synthesizer, which most computers sold today include, or to connect an external synthesizer.

To check whether you have an internal synth, open your Control Panel. Double-click on Sounds and Audio Devices and select the Audio tab. If there is something shown under MIDI music playback (near the bottom), then you should be able to listen. Click the Volume... button to make sure it's not muted or turned down too low to hear. Then download a MIDI file and double-click. It should play.

To connect an external device, you'll need instruction from somebody else. Sorry, I've got no current experience with that.

Hope this helps.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: GUEST,goodlife
Date: 02 Dec 08 - 03:49 PM

thats the easy part windows media player or quicktime or real player will all play midi,s it's what you want to do with it that is the problem i am still using cakewalk version 3 but if you visit two cows or cnet site and type in midi player i am sure you will come up with some more up to date programs some may even be shareware


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: IvanB
Date: 02 Dec 08 - 10:05 PM

leenia, you've been using NoteWorthy Composer for years, so part of your answer should be fairly obvious to you: download a midi file from the internet, open it in NWC and edit away! Of course, as discussed in a thread about a year ago, if the midi file was produced by someone recording a personal performance into a midi recording program, the resulting file may translate into a score with lots of "hash" on it when opened in NWC.

As for, plugging an instrument into the computer, I've used a keyboard with a midi port with one of the midi/usb cables mentioned above and had success, even though I still prefer doing my editing from the computer keyboard. There is a Behringer UCA202 USB Interface which allows other instruments to be connected through a USB port although you'd need some way of getting at least a preamped signal into the interface device. I have the Behringer interface as well, but I received it just as we were leaving for the winter this fall, and I haven't tried it out yet.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 03 Dec 08 - 11:10 AM

'leenia, you've been using NoteWorthy Composer for years..'

Yes, that's part of the problem. I don't remember whether my computer has an unusual sound card. (It used to.) The company which put out my keyboard is out of business. I do know that I had to make a special request for a MIDI port the last time my computer was upgraded so I could keep using my piano keyboard.

Evidently the young guy at the shop didn't know there is such a thing as a MIDI-to-USB cable. In fact, one reason I am posting here is that the young guys at the shop don't know anything about writign music. To them, music is something you download and play on your ipod.

So thanks for the link, IvanB. Your page contained an ad for a 25-key synthesizer which costs $179 plus shipping. It has a USB cable and works with XP and above. It looks like it would do nicely for music editing.

By 'music editing' I mean things like:

change the key
write a new part
change treble to bass and vice versa
change the time signature
remove poorly-conceived special endings
convert a tenor part to a descant

These are things I do all the time.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: GUEST,Ed
Date: 03 Dec 08 - 11:34 AM

leenia, I think that this article explains the options quite well


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 03 Dec 08 - 11:32 PM

Thanks, Ed. That helps bring me up to date.

I didn't know what my piano keyboard (which makes no sound on its own) is called a MIDI controller until I read that article.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Tech: MIDI port question
From: IvanB
Date: 04 Dec 08 - 12:01 AM

The link I made was actually to the Behringer USB interface which could work for a keyboard that has audio out capabilities, but I was thinking of it more in terms of other instruments, such as harp, guitar, etc. With one of these it could be used with a pickup attached to the instrument then run through a preamp to provide some line level output to the inputs on the Behringer.

For a keyboard, the midi/usb cable linked to by M. Ted in the third post of this thread should do the trick, even for your old keyboard. The keyboard I used with this type of cable is an old MusicStar which was made for Win 3.1, after which the company promptly went out of business and no drivers were ever created for any Win versions above 3.1. It still worked fine for me on computers using both Win XP and Vista (using native Windows drivers).


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate
  Share Thread:
More...

Reply to Thread
Subject:  Help
From:
Preview   Automatic Linebreaks   Make a link ("blue clicky")


Mudcat time: 22 July 1:10 AM EDT

[ Home ]

All original material is copyright © 1998 by the Mudcat Café Music Foundation, Inc. All photos, music, images, etc. are copyright © by their rightful owners. Every effort is taken to attribute appropriate copyright to images, content, music, etc. We are not a copyright resource.