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England's County Anthems

GUEST,Martin Norcsalordie 10 Jan 09 - 07:12 AM
Paul Burke 10 Jan 09 - 07:24 AM
Terry McDonald 10 Jan 09 - 07:31 AM
GUEST,Rafflesbear 10 Jan 09 - 07:35 AM
GUEST,Rafflesbear 10 Jan 09 - 07:45 AM
The Borchester Echo 10 Jan 09 - 07:45 AM
melodeonboy 10 Jan 09 - 07:49 AM
Wolfhound person 10 Jan 09 - 08:37 AM
peregrina 10 Jan 09 - 08:47 AM
The Borchester Echo 10 Jan 09 - 08:49 AM
Dead Horse 10 Jan 09 - 09:11 AM
Big Al Whittle 10 Jan 09 - 09:14 AM
The Borchester Echo 10 Jan 09 - 09:19 AM
The Borchester Echo 10 Jan 09 - 09:21 AM
greg stephens 10 Jan 09 - 09:25 AM
GUEST,Rafflesbear 10 Jan 09 - 09:28 AM
Dead Horse 10 Jan 09 - 09:39 AM
The Borchester Echo 10 Jan 09 - 09:41 AM
The Borchester Echo 10 Jan 09 - 09:46 AM
Malcolm Douglas 10 Jan 09 - 10:03 AM
The Borchester Echo 10 Jan 09 - 10:07 AM
GUEST,Martin Norcsalordie 10 Jan 09 - 10:09 AM
GUEST,Martin Norcsalordie 10 Jan 09 - 10:12 AM
Dave Earl 10 Jan 09 - 10:20 AM
Big Al Whittle 10 Jan 09 - 10:38 AM
Richard Bridge 10 Jan 09 - 10:50 AM
JeffB 10 Jan 09 - 12:21 PM
greg stephens 10 Jan 09 - 12:33 PM
The Borchester Echo 10 Jan 09 - 12:43 PM
The Sandman 10 Jan 09 - 01:04 PM
Tootler 10 Jan 09 - 02:03 PM
Little Robyn 10 Jan 09 - 02:29 PM
The Borchester Echo 10 Jan 09 - 02:30 PM
GUEST 10 Jan 09 - 02:39 PM
sid 10 Jan 09 - 03:21 PM
peregrina 10 Jan 09 - 03:29 PM
The Borchester Echo 10 Jan 09 - 03:47 PM
peregrina 10 Jan 09 - 04:01 PM
The Barden of England 10 Jan 09 - 04:05 PM
GUEST,Rafflesbear 10 Jan 09 - 04:24 PM
Big Al Whittle 10 Jan 09 - 04:53 PM
The Borchester Echo 10 Jan 09 - 05:14 PM
GUEST,Rafflesbear 10 Jan 09 - 05:40 PM
GUEST,Tammy 10 Jan 09 - 06:05 PM
Liz the Squeak 10 Jan 09 - 06:14 PM
GUEST,Rafflesbear 10 Jan 09 - 06:30 PM
Terry McDonald 10 Jan 09 - 06:46 PM
GUEST,TommyTrinder 12 Jan 09 - 12:32 PM
peregrina 12 Jan 09 - 12:33 PM
Dave Sutherland 12 Jan 09 - 12:48 PM
GUEST,Macca (Norcsalordie) 12 Jan 09 - 12:54 PM
Nigel Parsons 12 Jan 09 - 12:56 PM
greg stephens 12 Jan 09 - 12:57 PM
peregrina 12 Jan 09 - 01:02 PM
Mr Red 12 Jan 09 - 01:09 PM
GUEST,Martin Norcsalordie 12 Jan 09 - 01:27 PM
peregrina 12 Jan 09 - 01:33 PM
The Borchester Echo 12 Jan 09 - 01:41 PM
The Borchester Echo 12 Jan 09 - 01:48 PM
Dead Horse 12 Jan 09 - 02:07 PM
Richard Bridge 12 Jan 09 - 02:11 PM
The Borchester Echo 12 Jan 09 - 02:22 PM
bubblyrat 12 Jan 09 - 02:47 PM
Terry McDonald 12 Jan 09 - 02:56 PM
bubblyrat 12 Jan 09 - 03:02 PM
Steve Gardham 12 Jan 09 - 03:20 PM
GUEST,Rafflesbear 12 Jan 09 - 03:37 PM
TenorTwo 12 Jan 09 - 03:46 PM
r.padgett 13 Jan 09 - 01:05 PM
GUEST,Rafflesbear 13 Jan 09 - 01:33 PM
Richard Bridge 13 Jan 09 - 02:10 PM
BB 13 Jan 09 - 02:57 PM
Kampervan 13 Jan 09 - 03:06 PM
Steve Gardham 13 Jan 09 - 03:18 PM
Big Al Whittle 13 Jan 09 - 07:40 PM
GUEST,Macca (Norcsalordie) 20 Jan 09 - 07:23 AM
peregrina 20 Jan 09 - 07:41 AM
peregrina 20 Jan 09 - 08:02 AM
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Subject: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Martin Norcsalordie
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 07:12 AM

Hi Mudcatters,

Whilst playing a gig in Shrewsbury, I had a idea for a band project (as you do...)
As we know that Trelawny is the county anthem of Cornwall and that the Lincolnshire Poacher is the unofficial anthem of Lincolnshire, my question is this:

Barring recent artificial attempts at creating an "official" anthem, what are the respective anthems - official or not - of England's Counties?

Prime example of artificial attempt is A Song for Devon whilst clearly Widdecombe Fair would be the county's first choice.

Other ones I have are:
Yorkshire - On Ilkla Moor Baht 'at
Sussex - Sussex By The Sea

I'd be particularly keen to find out what Kent's is!

Many Thanks
Martin Norcsalordie


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Paul Burke
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 07:24 AM

I suppose Lancashire's would be She's a Lassie From Lancashire, though Rawtenstall Annual Fair would be a contender. Derbyshire's is obvious. Would Nottamun Town do for Nottingham?


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Terry McDonald
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 07:31 AM

I've a nasty feeling that 'Dorset is Beautiful' is ours......


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Rafflesbear
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 07:35 AM

If the Wurzels didn't sing the Somerset one then I'll be a Hartlepool monkey's uncle


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Rafflesbear
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 07:45 AM

Mrs Raffles suggests The White Cliffs of Dover for Kent ?


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 07:45 AM

Kent: Hopping Down in Kent

Some other thoughts:

Lancashire: Lancashire Lads
Tyneside: Bonny Gateshead Lass
Northumberland: Hesleyside Reel (or a song Dance To Your Daddy)
Yorkshire: Holmfirth Anthem

Nah, tired of songs . . .

Somerset: Radstock Jig
Oxfordshire: Old Tom Of Oxford
Lake District: Trip To Cartmel
Staffordshire: Flaxley Green
Hampshire: Kempshott Hunt
London: Maiden Lane


. . . and so on . . .


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: melodeonboy
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 07:49 AM

I'm not aware that Kent has one. If it did, I'd be very diappointed not to have heard of it by now.

If this be the case, am I allowed to nominate "Man of Kent" by Bob Kenward?


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Wolfhound person
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 08:37 AM

Northumberland: Spirit of the Border (Tom Clough)
or Lindisfarne (Matt Seattle)
or Lads of Alnwick
or Morpeth Rant

Tyneside: Dance to Your Daddy, or (I suppose) Blaydon Races

Durham: Durham Rangers


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: peregrina
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 08:47 AM

Lots more choices than Ilkley Moor for Yorkshire--try the Dalesman's Litany or browse here Yorkshire Garland Songs!


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 08:49 AM

North Tyneside: Dance To Your Daddy, yes.
South Tyneside: Here's The Tender Coming
Durham: I've Got To Leave Old Durham Town (Roger Whittaker), no don't think so.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Dead Horse
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 09:11 AM

Hopping Down In Kent - that one gets my vote
Rochester Recruiting Sergeant - written by Pete Coe, a good alternative.
Deserter From Kent - seems a bit too simple for my tastes.
Folkestone Murders - dark deeds. Too dark for an anthem.
Not in digitrad but worth mentioning is Men Of Kent:-

MEN OF KENT

If you're wanting me on Monday, then I won't be there
I'll be bound off to Maidstone afore to see the fair
With me pockets full of money and a heart that's full of joy
There's many a thing in Maidstone to please a country boy

CH> So come all you jolly fellows to Maidstone we will go
Never mind the weather, be it rain or be it snow
We'll sport and we will drink my boys 'till all our money's spent
And we'll prove to the world my boys, we're all Men of Kent

If you're wanting me on Tuesday you know where I'll be found
I'll be down by the alehouse that's on the edge of town
A-drinking of the Kentish ales to drive away the dust
And eating of the finest foods until I'm fit to bust

If you're wanting me on Wednesday I'll tell you where I'll be
I'll be down by the Medway, fair maidens for to see
I'll pick me one that's handsome and likes a bit of fun
And I'll relieve her of her maidenhead before the day is done

On Thursday and Friday I'll be drunk as I can be
With all my friends around me, as far as I can see
With a wench a-sitting on my knee and a tankard at my lips
And the beard that hangs beneath my chin a-soaking up the drips

Now when the fair is over and I have had my fill
I'll make my way back home again, I'm feeling rather ill
And to my home and farm again my weary legs I'll steer
And start saving up my money to come back again next year

So come all you jolly fellows to Maidstone we will go
Never mind the weather, be it rain or be it snow
We'll sport and we will drink my boys 'till all our money's spent
And we'll prove to the world my boys, we're all Men of Kent

Might as well do a "lyric add" huh?


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 09:14 AM

I think I'd prefer Robin hood riding through the glen - after all everybody's heard of Robin and the Sherriff of Nottingham.

nottanum town - the meanings a bit obscure - even to people who sing it.

The football team in Derby is called the rams - so i suppose the derby ram would be popular choice .

i think however most folkies would prefer Hey Up me Duck! which just beautifully encapsulates a speech pattern and the industrial age gone forever. a songwriting achievment of the very highest order. It celebrates the greatness of the county better than any number of statues of industrialists.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 09:19 AM

Derbyshire: Down In Yon Forest / Valley


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 09:21 AM

Nottinghamshire: Thorneymoor Woods


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: greg stephens
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 09:25 AM

I think there's a Devon Glorious Devon well up and running already. Cunberland as was, and it does for the new Cumbria as well, has the very well-established John Peel.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Rafflesbear
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 09:28 AM

Cheap + cheesy link here - apologies before I start

Dead Horse - your Men of Kent don't seem to venture very far from Maidstone which by pure chance is where Norcsalordie (who started the thread) are appearing tomorrow afternoon at 15:00 in The Flowerpot - ME14 2RJ


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Dead Horse
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 09:39 AM

I am sure there MUST be a better song for Sussex than that Sussex By The Sea.
Mebbe something from The Coppers?


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 09:41 AM

Sussex: Sweet Wivelsfield
Cornwall: Way Down To Lamorna


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 09:46 AM

Essex: Through Bushes & Briars
South Coast Naval Towns In General: Rambling Sailor


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 10:03 AM

Martin asked what the anthems, official or unofficial, are. He didn't ask for suggestions for new ones, so it might help if we were to say whether we're providing information, wild guesses, or just nominations. At the moment the discussion seems to have turned into a poll for folk songs that might serve on the grounds that they happen to mention a county or a place in one, or to have been sung there at some point; all good fun, but a complete change of subject.

In many cases the official march of the county regiment is as close as you'll get to a 'county anthem'. On that basis, for Berkshire you have 'The Dashing White Sergeant', and for Wiltshire 'The Vly be on the Turmut'. There are others; perhaps somebody who knows about military music would like to help out.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 10:07 AM

I'll go and play my balalaika instead.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Martin Norcsalordie
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 10:09 AM

Thanks for your suggestions so far!
I've finally taken the plunge and listened to a clip of the "official" Devon anthem. I defy anyone to listen to it and not start frothing at the mouth - really.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Martin Norcsalordie
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 10:12 AM

Yes, as Malcolm said, I'm after the Trelawny-s of the other counties. I've heard that some football chants can form part of the anthem too, such as Blaydon Races.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Dave Earl
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 10:20 AM

How about Shepherd of the Downs for Sussex


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 10:38 AM

When I was a kid about nine or ten, i can remember the now defunct Lincolnshire regiment (called the Poachers) marching in a parade to the strains of the Lincolnshire Poacher through Boston town centre, with their bayonets fixed. It was some sort of custom - they had the right to do it - because the regiment had been awarded the freedom of the town.

it was a wonderful sight. very exciting and inspiring for a little kid.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 10:50 AM

Surely the unofficial Kent anthem is "the Nutting Girl" - closely followed by the (title has eluded me) "Twistng, turning, wandering free, flows Medway Softly to the Sea" and maybe even Don Thompson's Medway song - and isn't there one about the Medway Queen as well? Or what about "Jolly boys of the Arethusa"?

Cornwall - now what's the title and who wrote it? Mike Nicholson and Peter Collins both sing it - is it called "Cornish Lads"?

I've not heard your last three suggestions, Dead Horse. Will you do them for us on Sunday afternoon the 25th Jan at the Nag's Head?


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: JeffB
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 12:21 PM

Malcolm, this is a fun thread. You know (or perhaps you don't) the sort of thread where people use wit and imagination to entertain each other. I don't see how anyone can find out whether an "anthem" is "official" or not in any case. So let's nominate and guess wildly at as many as we feel like. Perhaps eventually our respective County Halls will pick up on somw and there will really be some "official anthems".


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: greg stephens
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 12:33 PM

Diane Easeby: I dont think the Cornish can have "Away Down to Lamorna" as their own anthem. It is only a very slight rewrite of the extremely Mancunian "Away Down to Pomona". In any case, Trelawney has done me fine all my life and I feel no urge to change now!


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 12:43 PM

As Malcolm Douglas has decreed that is has to be some boring regimental militarism, neither apparently will do.
So, for Cornwall: Camborne Hill.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Sandman
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 01:04 PM

spped the plough for suffolk,this used to be the marching tune for the regiment based in Bury St edmunds[where I lived for many years]
west suffolks.
otherwise the suffolk miracle,might do


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Tootler
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 02:03 PM

Holmfirth Anthem won't do for Yorkshire

It is, after all, the Holmfirth anthem.

I appreciate that those (like Mrs T) who are from those parts think it is the whole of Yorkshire, but.....


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Little Robyn
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 02:29 PM

We'm com oop from Zummerzet....
Robyn


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 02:30 PM

Why ever not the Holmfirth Anthem for Yorkshire?
It's a lot more rousing that Scarborough Fair (or 'Ull 'n' 'Alifax 'n' 'Ell . . .).
The French, after all, use the name of one southern port for the national anthem.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 02:39 PM

Didn't Wiltshire claim The Turmot Hoer at one time? I have also heard a version of the Blackbird song being claimed as the Cornish Anthem.

Tradsinger


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: sid
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 03:21 PM

"A Lancashire Mon" by Henry Yates(1841-1906). He was born on Blackstone Edge (near Saddleworth I beleive) in the heart of Lancashire.

Last verse:-

There may be a shire 'at is broader,
But ther's nobbut one Ceawnty - just one,
'At King is a Duke on - that's Lanky,
An' ther's nowt licks a Lancashire Mon!

"She's a Lassie from Lancashire" was written in London by Murphy, Lipton & Neat in 1906! It's nowt t'do wi' us.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: peregrina
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 03:29 PM

If non-Yorkshire residents are going to assign an anthem for God's own Country

(which has so many wonderful possibilities--if you are going to settle on just one place and allow recent songs, Stan Graham's Whitby Harbour, or Roger Davies' Huddersfield Town...or the anonymous Barnsley Anthem)

then I'll propose Robert Saint's Gresford for County Durham.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 03:47 PM

I am Yorkshire born (which is obvious from my name) and my family goes back many centuries. I am thus more qualified than most to speak on behalf of my county.
What the OP wants is anthem-like pieces (such as Trelawney) and the Holmfirth Anthem seems eminently suitable for Yorkshire. Equally so would be Spencer The Rover which Robin Dransfield recorded with a brass band accompaniment.
Either must be better than any Green Howards military march anyway (especially as the Howards nicked our ancestral pastures).


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: peregrina
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 04:01 PM

The origins of the Holmfirth Anthem:
info here is not Yorkshire


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Barden of England
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 04:05 PM

For Kent, my vote goes to almost any song by Bob Kenward. Kent's finest songwriter about the county. I've yet to hear one from Chris Wood, but I presume he has written one or two.
John Barden


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Rafflesbear
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 04:24 PM

I'm inclined to go with Martin who originated the thread and Malcolm's interpretation, given that Martin came back and agreed with him having said originally that it was for a project.

On my pc Malcom says "the official march of the county regiment is as close as you'll get" which is at odds with "has decreed that is has to be some boring regimental militarism"

So - suspending the wit and imagination for this post only - I would suppose that a significant proportion of a county's population would at least recognise the song - not just us folkies, and when they heard the song they would feel that it belonged more to them than to people in other counties

It follows therefore (anyone still awake?) that people from outside the county are not in the best position to say what it should be. So not being best qualified for any of these counties these appear to me (note - Appear To Me) to be the best contenders so far

Cornwall - Trelawney
Tyneside - Blaydon Races
Dorset - Dorset is Beautiful
Somerset - I am a Cider Drinker (based on the number of requests when playing there)
Yorkshire - Ilkley Moor
Derbyshire - The Derby Ram
Lancashire - She's a Lassie from Lancashire (?)
Cumbria - John Peel
Sussex - Sussex by the Sea (based on it being adopted by Brighton and Hove Albion
Lincolnshire - Lincolnshire Poacher
Devon - Widdecombe Fair (by popular selection as per link in the first post)

and entering the realms of suggestion -

Buckinghamshire - The Eton Boating Song


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 04:53 PM

birmingham - We Gotta get out of this Place


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 05:14 PM

Eton is in Berkshire.It was moved wholesale at the same time as Slough was booted out of Buckinghamshire. Thus, I nominate for Berkshire: Eton Rifles by The Jam.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Rafflesbear
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 05:40 PM

As I said - not best qualified - I stand corrected. For me it all started going wrong when Hackney was taken out of Middlesex


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Tammy
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 06:05 PM

Malcolm Douglas: Explain what the The Dashing White Sergeant has to do with Berkshire or any other English County Anthem.

Wikepedia: The Dashing White Sergeant is a Scottish folk dance, performed to a similarly titled piece of music. The dance is in 4/4 time, thus it is a form of reel. The dance is performed by groups of six dancers.

I was sorry to read you were ill recently, did you have an operation to get rid of your sense of humour?


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Liz the Squeak
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 06:14 PM

'Dorset is beautiful' is the unofficial anthem of the county. It's true anthem, and the regimental song of the Dorset Regiment (before they became the Devon and Dorsets), is 'To be a farmers' boy'.

I've seen the Devon and Dorsets march down High West and High East Street, with bayonets fixed, to that tune, for the same reason... in common with most county towns, the county regiment has the right to march at certain times of the year, with bayonets fixed.

I can't remember why they were marching, I was about 3 or 4, but the Queen had visited earlier that day - I remember seeing the back of her head in a long black car. She was wearing a pink hat.

LTS


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Rafflesbear
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 06:30 PM

"I can't remember why they were marching"

and I ask myself the same question :-)


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Terry McDonald
Date: 10 Jan 09 - 06:46 PM

There's been a discussion about To Be a Farmer's Boy as a regimental march before and I think it was pointed out that a number of county regiments used it, including the Hampshires. The Devon and Dorsets no longer exist, having been subsumed into the Rifles.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,TommyTrinder
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 12:32 PM

Most fellow Yorkshiremen (and indeed women) would be more familiar with "Ilkley Moor Baht 'at" than the "Holmfirth Anthem" (which I've never heard outside of the folk circuit).

I wouldn't know what Kent's anthem is, but I'd assume many people would be familiar with "Hopping Down In Kent" from their schooldays.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: peregrina
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 12:33 PM

The tune of the first is not from Yorkshire and the Holmfirth anthem is not a Yorkshire song!--I confess I'm still not clear on the criteria and purpose of the selection.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Dave Sutherland
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 12:48 PM

WLD I thought that the football team was called Derby County Nil??


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Macca (Norcsalordie)
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 12:54 PM

Hiya guys, can I just clarify what we're looking for. We are, as Rafflesbear said, looking for songs (from cities and towns, not just counties) which can be considered the local anthem. The criteria is that people from that locality would consider it their own. For example, I wouldn't consider Threescore and Ten or The Dogger Bank to be the anthem of Grimsby even though both songs mention the town. Similarly Maggie May is generally accepted as the Liverpudlian anthem above many other songs from the city which mention Liverpool such as Leaving of Liverpool or Liverpool Lou.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 12:56 PM

Warwickshire: The Bear & His old Ragged Staff
(And I'm not even from England!)


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: greg stephens
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 12:57 PM

Nothing in yet for the West Midlands, Avon or Humberside. Funny, that.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: peregrina
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 01:02 PM

Macca--so you want familiar regional and local favourites rather than officially designated songs? That's kind of a field work questions, then, rather than a trivia quiz or brain of Britain.

FWIW I've heard 'Three score and ten' far more often in Yorkshire folk clubs than Ilkley Moor....


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Mr Red
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 01:09 PM

West Midlands is not a county. An administrative area yes! But who is sentimental about a smudge on the cartography?

Mr Red (from Staffordshire) an' ar bain't heard of no Flaxley Green.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Martin Norcsalordie
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 01:27 PM

ok, here's an example of what we're after.

If there was an Olympics for english counties and a county won an event, what would be the song everyone heard as the medals are handed out?

If (and sometimes when) England wins a gold we get to hear "God save the queen", like it or not. Even if we'd rather hear "Land of Hope and Glory", we get "God save the queen".

It's a bit hypocritical to then say that Widdecombe Fair is the county anthem, when the council has officially elected it to be the awful D-E-V-O-N song, but(and I'm going out on a limb here) Devonshire people would feel better represented by Widdecombe Fair.

If you look up Yorkshire on Wikipedia (and other sites) it says that Ilkla Moor "is considered the unofficial anthem of the county" so we'll roll with that one.

Clear as mud?


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: peregrina
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 01:33 PM

Please browse the wonderful Yorkshire Garland site here (and read about Ilkley Moor and the Holmfirth Anthem) before you use wikipedia as your guide!--Or at least try folkopedia!


Yorkshire Songs at the Yorkshire Garland site


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 01:41 PM

Map of Flaxley Green

Jolly nice tune.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 01:48 PM

The UK national anthem has a German tune.
Is that ground for changing it? (Actually, I wish it was).

Jerusalem to the Rose Tree tune would be good.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Dead Horse
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 02:07 PM

Our whole royal family is German, aint it?


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 02:11 PM

Well, it depends partly on how much of Queen Victoria's offspring as German, and one's thoughts on Greeks


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: The Borchester Echo
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 02:22 PM

Mr Windsor is Queen Victoria's great-great grandson.
(That's the second time in a few days I've mentioned that).


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: bubblyrat
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 02:47 PM

Speaking as someone who was raised in and at Cowdray House,and attended Midhurst Grammar School,I must insist upon "Sussex By The Sea" for the eponymous county (but only for WEST Sussex, of course----those "other people " must make a different selection----"Oh! I do like to be beside the seaside", possibly ??).As for Dorset??Well, having lived there for yonks,and having got to know Nicky Haan quite well, I would have to go for " Lovely ,Lovely Purbeck Hills "----don't you agree ??


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Terry McDonald
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 02:56 PM

Ah! Purbeck Hills is certainly a better song than Dorset is Beautiful but.........the Purbecks are only a (relatively) small region of the finest county in all England!


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: bubblyrat
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 03:02 PM

Some others that present themselves to me are :
"Ding Dong (merrily on high) "------    Avon

   "Everything is Bootiful"------ Norfolk

    "The Pink Panther " theme -------Durham

      "How Much is that Doggy in the Window ?" -------Berks


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 03:20 PM

Okay I tried to post this 3 days ago but it disappeared up its own ********.
Ilkley Moor Baht 'at may be a good anthem for Ilkley or perhaps even the West Riding at a pinch, but it certainly doesn't represent anything to us North, East and South Riding folk. Yorkshire is a large and diverse county from Saddleworth to Middlesborough and all points south and east. A decent all-encompassing anthem is certainly long overdue. Peregrina and I were discussing something like Woody Guthrie's 'This Land is my Land' in the car yesterday on the way to a meeting.
The nearest thing I know to a Yorkshire anthem was originally adopted by the East Riding. It is a music hall song called originally 'My Pretty Yorkshire Lass'. It dates from the 1870s and was written by George Leybourne. As The Bonny Yorkshire Lass it is now used by various Yorkshire regiments as their march past.
I suppose there's always 'My Girl's a Yorkshire Girl'

If you are just looking for place anthems, I'm sure there has been a thread on this before because lots of Yorkshire towns have their own anthems.


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Rafflesbear
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 03:37 PM

South Riding ?


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: TenorTwo
Date: 12 Jan 09 - 03:46 PM

Suffolk - that's got to be "Speed the Plough" or, I suppose, if you must have words, "The Battle of Sole Bay"

T2


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: r.padgett
Date: 13 Jan 09 - 01:05 PM

Glad I've missed all of this!!

Why not "Bring us Barrel" from Keith Marsden for Yorkshire?

or even "Merry Mountain Child" (this was written by Joe Perkin)

Joe of course re-arranged a song to create t'Holmfith Anthem

Ilkla Moor Bhat 'at, is ok and you hear the brass bands play this at 3 miles and know yer in Yorkshire (or feel you are even if you are not!)


Ray


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Rafflesbear
Date: 13 Jan 09 - 01:33 PM

If you won't accept Ilkley Moor for Yorkshire then it has to be the theme tune to Wallace and Grommet - it means Yorkshire throughout the world


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 13 Jan 09 - 02:10 PM

Yes, Diane, but who were the other contributors to his gene pool?


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: BB
Date: 13 Jan 09 - 02:57 PM

'Trelawney' undoubtedly *was* the Cornish anthem, but certainly Roger Bryant's 'Cornish Lads' is now running it at least a close second in many Cornish pubs these days. I think present day Cornishmen actually identify with it in the here and now, as opposed to the historical 'Trelawney'.

Someone mentioned 'Where be that blackbird to?' as a possible Cornish anthem. It's more likely to be a Devon one (much more likely than any of the parlour songs mentioned above - and no, I'm not talking about 'Widecombe Fair'), as the use of the expression 'Where be to?' and such like is very much Devonshire dialect, rather than Cornish.

Barbara


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Kampervan
Date: 13 Jan 09 - 03:06 PM

I shouldn't think even the combined forces of our entire 'intelligence'services could answer that one Richard.

But then that's probably where they are closest to being like the rest of us!


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 13 Jan 09 - 03:18 PM

Sorry Raffles, should have said 'South Yorkshire'. it's so easy to get confused with all these boundary changes and such a large county.
Having 4 Thriddings as well. We never were very much good at maths.
As an old farmer once said to me looking at a trio of osses pulling a plough, 'By, them three mek a good pair!'


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: Big Al Whittle
Date: 13 Jan 09 - 07:40 PM

there was that song about the Birmingham Jack of All trades


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: GUEST,Macca (Norcsalordie)
Date: 20 Jan 09 - 07:23 AM

Like it or not, Ilka Moor Baht'at is classed as Yorkshire's county anthem by most. Threescore and Ten was written by a Grimsby fisherman (who's name I've forgotten) which makes it more of a Lincolnshire song...


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: peregrina
Date: 20 Jan 09 - 07:41 AM

Now then....
Classed by whom?
I think that some of the same problems arise with seeking 'county anthems' for this kind of list as the old 'national musical instrument' thread-- namely the question of how identities and labels are created. By identities I mean how 'we'--for any given 'we'-- are pushed to define ourselves against, and in distinction to, others; by 'labels' I mean how others construct an image and a label for others, for 'them', when those others do not choose that label.

If you were going to do such an exercise for, say, the U.S., I am sure people from Texas might not want 'Yellow Rose of Texas', nor those from Virginia, 'Carry me back to Ol' Virginny'. Even though those choices might speak to outsiders, locals might see them as pandering to outsiders.

If you are going to go for only regionally produced words and tunes then you wouldn't you have to rule out Ilkley Moor as well anyway?

Yorkshire is the largest of the regions, and very diverse--it can hardly be represented by a single moor.

And it has a fantastic trove of far moor--I mean more--interesting songs here:

Yorkshire Songs at the Yorkshire Garland site

For my part, I've never yet heard 'On Ilkley Moor' sung in a Yorkshire folk club--maybe others like to think we all have flat caps, whippets and stand on moors eating wensleydale cheese all day!!! If so, come visit Yorkshire and see for yourself, or visit the Garland website instead.

Good luck with your project whatever you decide. (For myself, I would be far moor, I mean more, interested in a collection of regional songs that dug up and dusted off little known regional treasures from each county--imaginative choices, fantastically performed, with thoughtful and informative notes.)


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Subject: RE: England's County Anthems
From: peregrina
Date: 20 Jan 09 - 08:02 AM

Come to think of it, which county divisions are you using?!!

The jigsaw puzzle of the UK tells me that this is going to be a very long project. And if you go by the current system you'll need FOUR Yorkshire songs!


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