Origins: Wearin' o' the Green

Subject: Weain' o' the Green
From: Teru
Date: 24 Jun 99 - 12:29 AM

This is a well-known Irish song, and was in this DB. I want to know a little about the background of this song.

1) When was this song written?

2) What is a name of "a cruel law" in a following sentence?--- For there's a cruel law agin the Wearin' o' the Green."

There were a lot of laws to oppress Ireland, Irish and Catholic. I want to specify the law in this song.

Although Napper Tandy founded the Society of United Irishmen in associantion with Wolfe Tone in 1791, the law may be drawn up in late 19th or early 20th century, because it was against St.Patrick's Day which, I suppose, did not exist in 18th century.

Thank you.

Teru

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From: Teru
Date: 24 Jun 99 - 12:36 AM

Sorry, I made important mistakes.

1) Thread's name should be "Wearin' o' the Green.

2) The first sentence of my message should be "..., and is in this DB.", not "..., and was in this DB."

It's my shame!!

Teru

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From: gargoyle
Date: 24 Jun 99 - 12:52 AM

An interesting collection of commentary on Street Ballads may be found, with a specific reference to this song at: Wearing of the Green

Daniel O'Connell, the Irish leader commemorated in the last stanza, died in 1847. H. P. Such was "the last of the ballad publishers"; he began business in 1849, and his family continued it "until as late as 1917" (Leslie Shepard, John Pitts [London: Private Libraries Association], 1969), 84). Presumably the number "599" refers to Such's inventory of items for sale.

This ballad updates (and names, in the next-to-last stanza) a famous ballad of the same title, in circulation since the turn of the century and later revised by the Irish-American playwright Dion Boucicault (1820?-1890). It began, "Oh! Paddy dear and did you hear the news that's going round,/ The Shamrock is forbidden by law to grow on Irish ground./ No more St. Patrick's Day we'll keep, his colors can't be seen,/ For there's a cruel law against the wearing of the Green.// I met with Napper Tandy, and he took me by the hand,/ And he said 'How's poor old Ireland and how does she stand?'/ She's the most distressful country that ever yet was seen,/ For they're hangin' men an' women for the wearing of the Green." (James Napper Tandy, the Irish revolutionary hero, died in 1803.)

Subject: ADD: Wearing of the Green (not in DT)
From: Brakn
Date: 24 Jun 99 - 04:45 AM

This is another song called "The Wearin' Of The Green" that is not in the DT.

Regards Mick Bracken

THE WEARING OF THE GREEN

One blessing on my native Isle!
One curse upon her foes
While yet her skies above me smile
Her breeze around me blows
Now, nevermore my cheek be wet
Nor sigh, nor altered mien
Till the dark tyrant I regret
The Wearing Of The Green

Sweet land! my parents loved you well
They sleep within your breast
With theirs, for love no words can tell
My bones must never rest
And lonely must my true love stray
That was our village queen
When I am banished far away
For The Wearing Of The Green

But, Mary, dry that bitter tear
'Twould break my heart to see
And sweetly sleep my parents dear
That cannot weep for me
I'll think not of my distant tomb
Nor seas rolled wide between
But watch the hour, that yet will come
For The Wearing Of The Green

O, I care not for the thistle
And I care not for the rose
For when the cold winds whistle
Neither down nor crimson shows
But like hope to him that's friendless
Where no gaudy flower is seen
By our graves, with love that's endless
Waves our own true-hearted green

O, sure God's world was wild enough
And plentiful for all!
And ruined cabins were so stuff
To build a lordly hall
They might have let the poor man live
Yet all as lordly been
But heaven it's owngood time will give
For The Wearing Of The Green

Subject: Lyr Add: THE WEARING OF THE GREEN
From: gargoyle
Date: 24 Jun 99 - 10:28 AM

The above noted link gives a decidedly different version. One which is more like an honor roll of Irish revolutionary heros.

THE WEARING OF THE GREEN London :—H. Such, Printer & Publisher, 177, Union-street, Borough,—S. E.   Farewell! for I must leave thee, my own, my native shore, And doomed in foreign lands to dwell, may never see thee more: For laws, our tyrant laws, have said that seas must roll between Old Erin and her faithful sons, that loved to wear the green. Oh! we love to wear the green, Oh! how we love the green, On native land we cannot stand for wearing of the green, Yet wheresoe'er the exile lives, tho' oceans roll between, Thy faithful sons will fondly sing "The wearing of the green." My father loved his country, and sleeps within her breast, While I that would have died for her, may never be so blest; Those tears my mother shed for me, how bitter they'd have been If I had proved a traitor to "The wearing of the green." There were some that wore the green, who did betray the green, On native land we cannot stand thro' traitor to the green, Yet whatsoe'er our fate may be, when oceans roll between, Her faithful sons will ever sing "The wearing of the green." Remember Father Murphy and Emmett that was brave, Not forgetting Dan O'Connell, that now lies in his grave, If those heroes were alive, boys, their country they'd redeem, And shortly have the union back once more in College Green.

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From: Fadac
Date: 24 Jun 99 - 11:44 AM

Someplace I have a tape done by the Irish Guards. The first half is bag pipes, then second they bring in the brass. The sound was just increadable.

Brass and pipes go together so well.

-Fadac

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From:
Date: 25 Jun 99 - 12:04 AM

The Henry Such broadside text above appeared earlier with the familiar tune (J. Oswald's "The Tulip", 1747) in 'The Citizen, or Dublin Monthly Magazine', 1841, and is apparently the earliest song of that title. The 'old' first verse quoted at that blue clicky thing above and also quoted by gargoyle above is just the opening verse of 3 of the song by Dion Boucicault for his play of 1865, 'Arrah na Pogue'.

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From: gargoyle
Date: 30 Jun 99 - 01:02 AM

The site noted at the bottom is a fascinating location for Irish History and links. They graciously provided the following explanations:

Subject: Re: Comments form Date: Tue, 29 Jun 1999 20:41:55, -0500 From: [e-mail] (MR JOSEPH E GANNON) To: gargoyle

-- [ From: Joe Gannon * EMC.Ver #2.5.3 ] --

> > > In a folksong discussion group, http://www.mudcate.org we had a brief > discussion come up about the song "Wearin' Of the Green." Our information > dates the original published version to around 1814 with many variations after > that. > > We are in the U.S.A. and the songs references are unfamilar to us. > > QUESTION: Who are "Old Erin" and "Father Murphy" and "Emmett" and "Dan > O'Connel" and "Colby Green" and "Naper Tandy?" > > The univeristy library does not have the Irish Biographies you note in your > bibliography - I shall request that the book be ordered. > > Thanks again for a GREAT Web-Site! > > > >

-------- REPLY, End of original message --------

Let me give you a quick rundown on these. "Old Erin" is simply a personification of Ireland, Ireland is known variously as Erie, Erin, Erse. "Father Murphy" is father John Murphy who was one of the leaders of the 1798 Rising in County Wexford. He was captured and executed by the British following the failure of that Rising. "Emmet" (One 't') is Robert Emmet who led a small rising in 1803 which was not very significant in itself in terms of having any chance at success, but his speech in the dock during his trial was very famous and has served as an inspiration for all the generations of republicans since then. "Daniel O'Connell" (two"ls") was the first Catholic elected to Parliament from Ireland in 1828. (So this reference would not be in any 1814 variation of the song). He was actually elected before Catholic emancipation allowed it, his election was one of the catalysts for the passing of Catholic emancipation in the parliament. The British feared that if they didn't allow O'Connell to take his seat there might be a rising in Ireland. O'Connell continued to fight for more rights for the Irish his whole live. He is known in Irish history as "The Liberator." "Colby Green" I'm not sure of, it is probably just a location reference. James "Napper (two Ps) Tandy?" was one of the founders of the revolutionary group known as the "United Irishmen." They were the first republican revolutionaries in Irish history. It was their movement that led to the 1798 Rising and also Robert Emmet's rising in 1803. Tandy had fled Ireland to avoid arrest in 1793 and traveled to France. He returned to Ireland in 1798 at the head of a small force of French soldiers but the rising had run its course by then. He was later captured by the British and barely escaped execution through the influence of Napoleon, who managed to get him released in 1802. He died a year later. Hope this helps you out.

-- Slainte,
Joe Gannon
Managing Editor
The Wild Geese Today
http://www.thewildgeese.com

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From:
Date: 30 Jun 99 - 01:24 AM

Where may one find the version said to be published in 1814?

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From: bseed(charleskratz)
Date: 30 Jun 99 - 02:50 AM

Thanks for that, Gargoyle. Very interesting history lesson.

The question remains unanswered, though: When was the law passed and what was its name that forbade "wearin' o' the green"? How long was it in effect? Did it forbid any garment in any shade of green, or was it specifically aimed at scarves or such worn as a statement of support for Irish freedom?

One other thing I noticed about the two songs posted: both could be sung to the tune of the more widely known version. Are they ever sung to that tune?

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From: Joe Offer
Date: 30 Jun 99 - 04:32 AM

Seed, Click here for another interesting lesson in Irish History, and click here for information about the Penal Laws. I did a fair amount of research, and can't find any mention of a law forbidding the wearing of the color green. I would guess that the "law" is actually various anti-republican provisions of the Penal Laws enacted in the 18th century, and the Act of Union of 1801, and that "wearing the green" is a metaphor for republican activity (or possibly just being Catholic).
One source I have says that some writers have claimed the song was published in 1798, but the earliest provable reference to the song was 1838. The first known printing of the melody of the song was 1845. During the Fenian period in the middle of the nineteenth century, it was said that it was a crime in Great Britain to sing or whistle The Wearin' o' the Green - but no such penal law has been found.

source: The Book of World-Famous Music - James J. Fuld, 1966.

-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From: Teru
Date: 30 Jun 99 - 10:04 AM

Thank you very much for a lot of information.

It's great fun to learn the hisotry behind the song.

Regards

Teru

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From: John OSh
Date: 30 Jun 99 - 02:26 PM

I am not sure about the laws, but I do remember my grandfather telling me about be beaten by British soldiers in the west of Ireland if they spoke in Gaelic (or "my tongue" as he called it), wore any outward symbol of of Irish "Pride" or symbol of nationhood (ie green, any pins from organizations deemed anti-british) etc. Eventually, he and most of his siblings fled to America to be free of the oppression in and around 1916-17.

So it may not be actual laws, but enforced "laws" by the ruling power.

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From:
Date: 30 Jun 99 - 02:33 PM

The tune of "The Wearing of the Green" from 1841, along with Oswald's "The Tulip" are given as ABC's T040A,B in file T1.HTM at www.erols.com/olsonw

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From: Martin _Ryan
Date: 01 Jul 99 - 04:28 AM

"College Green", (in Dublin) mentioned earlier in the thread was the location of the Irish Parliament in the 18th C.

Regards

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From: Branwen
Date: 01 Jul 99 - 11:46 PM

Queen Victoria forbid the Wearing'o'the Green, by soliders in the British Army. The simple act of wearing green on St. Patric's Day took on the meaning of support for either Home Rule or for a free Ireland. It was a punishable offense, I believe that it was considered treason within the British army. However,in the general populace, wearing green publically showed your support for actions aganist the British Government, which if nothing else, could direct unwanted attention to one's Republican activities.

There is also a very interesting piece of film footage of Harry Truman in the Pacific at the end of WWII, participating in a ceremonial presentation of the wearin'o'the green to himself, thus showing the US support for the Newly established Irish Republic.

Subject: Tune Add: THE TULIP / THE WEARING OF THE GREEN
From:
Date: 02 Jul 99 - 12:55 AM

Sorry, I forgot to replace the ` with br's

It turns out there are two songs called "The Wearing of the Green" in The Citizen, or Dublin Monthly Magazine, III, 1841. The first is for the song above on the H. Such broadside, and the second for a song commencing: "Farewell my native land". That's all I have of the 2nd song. Can anyone supply it?

X:1
T:The Tulip (The Wearing of the Green)
S:from James Oswald's 'Airs for the Seasons'
N:'copyright 13 Oct 1747'
L:1/8
Q:112
M:C|
K:G
d>c|{c/2}B2B>B B>d~c>B|{B/2}A2A>A A2 B>c|\
B2(3dcB ~A>GA>B|G2G>GG2::g>f|\
~e2d4(3 GBd|{d/2} c2 B>B B2g>f|\
~e2d4c>B|~A>GA>B D2d>c|{c/2}B2B2B>gd>B|\
{B/2}A2A2A>Bc>d|e>gd>B A>cB>A|\
G2G>GG2:|]

X:2
T:Wearing of the Green
S:Dublin Monthly Magazine, III, 2, 1841
Q:180
L:1/8
M:2/4
K:F
F3/2G/|A3/2A/ A3/2A/|Ac cd|A3/2G/ G3/2G/|G2 A3/2c/|dc df|\
d3/2c/ AF|G3/2A/ FF|F2F3/2G/|A3/2A/ A3/2A/|Ac cd|\
B3/2A/ G3/2F/|G2A3/2c/|dc fe|d3/2c/ AF|A3/2G/ FF|F2||\
A3/2c/|d3/2d/ d3/2d/|d2 f3/2d/|d3/2c/ c3/2d/|c2A3/2c/|\
B3/2A/ B3/2c/|dc A3/2F/|G3/2^F/ G3/2A/|G2 F3/2G/|\
A3/2A/ A3/2A/|Ac cd|A3/2G/ G3/2A/|G2 A3/2c/|d3/2c/ fe|\
dc AF|A3/2G/ FF|F2||]

X:3
T:The Wearing of the Green
S:Dublin Monthly Magazine, III, 14, 1841
Q:180
L:1/8
M:2/4
K:C
G|F3/2E/ CD|E3/2F/ GA|F3/2E/ CC|C3C|E3/2F/ GG|c3/2d/ ec|\
B3/2G/ G3/2E/|F3C|E3/2F/ GG|c3/2c/ cc|B3/2G/ E3/2F/|F3G|\
E3/2D/ CD|E3/2F/ GA|F3/2E/ C3/2C/|C3|]

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From: Martin _Ryan
Date: 02 Jul 99 - 02:52 AM

There's quite a lot about the idea of "wearing of the green" and the songs associated with it in Zimmerman's monumental "Songs of Irish Rebellion". I haven't time to transcribe/precis it at the moment but will return if nobody else does it!

Regards

Subject: Wearing of the Green
From: GUEST,IB
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 04:26 PM

Can you tell me something about this song - about its origin, background and history ?

Thanks IB

Subject: RE: Help: Wearing of the Green
From: MMario
Date: 08 Nov 01 - 04:33 PM

check here

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From: Percustard
Date: 23 Jun 02 - 08:04 PM

Go Martin!

Subject: RE: Weain' o' the Green
From: Percustard
Date: 23 Jun 02 - 08:09 PM

HI all,

Does anyone know of any related tunes to "Wearin' o the Green" that have Gaelic lyrics?

Subject: RE: Wearin' o' the Green
From: Teribus
Date: 24 Jun 02 - 02:02 AM

"Queen Victoria forbid the Wearing'o'the Green, by soliders in the British Army."

"It was a punishable offense, I believe that it was considered treason within the British army."

The two sentences quoted above are from an earlier posting by Branwen.

Both statements are incorrect. The 95th Rifles, an experimental light infantry regiment raised in 1802 wore green and continued to do so throughout Queen Victoria's reign, they became known latterly when regimental numbers gave way to county designation as "The Green Jackets". Likewise the Cameronian Rifles wore green jackets. The Light companies of every infantry regiment in the British Army were distinquished from line companies by wearing green hackles (Grenadier companies wore red). The facings on the red coats of some regiments was green. There is a regiment in the British Army called "The Green Howards" - I will find out when they were raised and when they adopted that name.

But wearing green proscribed in the British Army - NO.

Wearing green a punishable offence - NO.

Subject: RE: Wearin' o' the Green
From: Hrothgar
Date: 25 Jun 02 - 07:07 AM

My father's ENGLISH cavalry regiment used to trot (I think it was trot) to the music of "The Wearing of the Green."

Cantering was to "The Irish Washerwoman."

Subject: RE: Wearin' o' the Green
From: Nigel Parsons
Date: 25 Jun 02 - 07:57 AM

Interesting article Here which states that it was the Irish Regiments which were forbidden to wear 'the green'.

Subject: RE: Wearin' o' the Green
From: Teribus
Date: 25 Jun 02 - 12:15 PM

From the above posting from Nigel:

"...in the late 18th century, the shamrock was adopted as an emblem by the Volunteers of 1777. But it didn't really become widely popular until the 19th century, when the emerging Nationalist movements took the shamrock, along with the harp, as one of their emblems. Viewed as an act of rebellion in Victorian England, Irish regiments were forbidden to display it."

What I deduce from the article is that Irish Regiments were forbidden to display a shamrock - they were not forbidden to wear green. As some one has previously stated there was never any legislation passed regarding wearing of green by anyone.

Come to think about it I will check, but I believe the uniform facings for the Connaught Rangers was green.

Subject: RE: Wearin' o' the Green
From: PeteBoom
Date: 25 Jun 02 - 03:31 PM

If I remember right "the green" in reference was not the colour, but the shamrock - which was being used as a nationalist/anti-union symbol, similar to the uncrowned harp (as opposed to the crowned harp or crowned shamrock).

The Volunteers who adopted the shamrock as their emblem were a legal yoemanry force who adopted the customs of other units that used stylized flowers/plants/whatever as symbols - roses, leeks, etc., After the Act of Union, these symbols had a crown slapped on them and POOF! Symbols of loyal Irish.

"The green" in reference was not the colour, but the uncrowned shamrock - which was being used as a nationalist/anti-union symbol, similar to the uncrowned harp (as opposed to the crowned harp or crowned shamrock). I can, in addition, find no firm reference to any particular law or statute that would limit the "wearing of the green," per se, except as an act of sedition.

I suspect this is part of the myth that grew up, similar to bagpipes being "banned" in Scotland after Culloden.

As far as the army, etc., Royal Ulster Rifles wore a crowned harp as their cap badge, Connaught Rangers' cap badge was a crowned shamrock (WWI vintage). Their successor regiment, the Royal Irish Rangers also wore the crowned harp as a cap badge - No Idea what THEIR successor regiment (Royal Irish Regiment) wears - quit collecting badges before they were formed.

On a side note, the pipers of the Royal Irish Rangers had an immensely ugly uniform - Forest Green tunics with saffron kilts. Ethnicaly pleasing - but hard on the eyes.

Teribus' information on the "Green Jackets" is correct.

Pete

Subject: RE: Wearin' o' the Green
From: GUEST,Martin Ryan
Date: 25 Jun 02 - 06:57 PM

I'll get back about Zimmerman in a day or two!

Regards

Subject: RE: Wearin' o' the Green
From: Kaleea
Date: 26 Jun 02 - 02:38 AM

Sure, and 'twas the Dion Boucicault version that me Grandad was after singin' when I was but a wee lass in Oklahoma. I always really liked the part that says: "Must we ask a mother's welcome from a strange but happy land?" I think I liked it because my grandparents told of how they left Arkansas to go to the Indian Territory, and their people had gotten to Arkansas from Tennessee. And their ancestors came over in the early days, "a couple o' hunnerd years b'fore the prattie famine," said Grandad in what he would call "the old brogue," (the other reason I loved hearing him sing the song!) which he used when telling of all things Irish, then went back to his usual old timey talkin'. Granny called it a "Lilt," which was used by some of her relatives who came "over the ocean."

Subject: RE: Wearin' o' the Green
From: GUEST
Date: 15 Oct 05 - 02:13 AM

when the larken stops the blades of grass agrown as they grow ...
the larken was Queen Victoria....i also was shocked :{

Subject: Lyr Add: THE WEARING OF THE GREEN
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 26 Oct 05 - 11:57 PM

Here's a version from an American broadside, date unknown, from The Library of Congress American Memory Collection :

THE WEARING OF THE GREEN
Sung by T. H. Glenny, at Niblo's Theatre, in the Great Sensation-Play of "Arrah-na-Pogue."

O Paddy dear, and did you hear the news that's going round?
The Shamrock is forbid, by laws, to grow on Irish ground!
No more St. Patrick's day we'll keep his color last be seen;
For, there's a bloody law agin the Wearing of the Green!

Oh! I met with Nabertancly, and he took me by the hand,
And he says: How is Poor Ould Ireland, and does she stand?
She's the most distressed Country that ever I have seen:
For, they are hanging men and women for the Wearing of the Green!

And since the color we must wear, is England's cruel red,
Ould Ireland's sons will ne'er forget the blood that they have shed..
Then take the Shamrock from your hat, and cast it on the sod:
It will take root, and flourish still, tho' under foot 'tis trod.

When the law can stop the blades of grass from growing as they grow..
And when the leaves, in Summer time, their verdure does not show..
Then, I will change the color I wear in my cabbeen:
But, till that day, plaze God! I'll stick to the Wearing of the Green!

But if, at last, her colors should be torn from Ireland's heart
Her sons, with shame and sorrow, from the dear old soil will part;
I've heard whispers of a Country that lies far beyond sea,
Where rich and poor stand equal, in the light of Freedom's day!

O Erin! must we leave you driven by the tyrant's hand!
Must we ask a Mother's blessing, in a strange but happy land,
Where the cruel Cross of England's thralldom never to be seen:
But where, thank God! we'll live and die, still Wearing of the Green!

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: Snuffy
Date: 27 Oct 05 - 08:21 AM

Nabertancly = Napper Tandy

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: Kaleea
Date: 27 Oct 05 - 05:39 PM

Somewhere, I have a very old "Community Songbook" which has lyrics almost identical to the above, but with Napper Tandy. I've rarely seen them anywhere else.   I don't know the publication date as the cover & first couple of pages were missing.

Subject: ADD: Green on the Cape
From: Joe Offer
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 01:41 AM

I stumbled across this, and thought it might be interesting to somebody.

Green on the Cape

I'm a lad that's forc'd to travel from my native land,
By a note that's sworn against me, my country I can't stand;
It's from all danger I made my escape,
With my national colors I wore green on my cape.

Chorus--I wore green on my cape, I wore green on my cape.
With my national colors I wore green on my cape.

I went down to Belfast that seaport so gay,
For to let my friends know that I could no longer stay:
And like a bold ensign I pass'd the baron gate,
With my national colors I wore green on my cape.

There I met a sea captain, who bargain'd with me cheap,
And he told me his company wore green on the cape;
They wore green on the cape, they wore green on the cape,
And he told me his company wore green on the cape.

With a prosperous gale, we sail'd away to France,
And so happy was I to meet with such a chance;
To meet with such a chance to make my escape,
With my national colors, I wore green on my cape.

And when I got to Paris, there I walk'd up and down,
I met with dukes and lords, and men of high renown;
They took me by the hand, saying, how made you your escape?
For they knew I was united by the green on the cape.

There I met Bonaparte, and he took me by the hand,
Saying, how is old Ireland, and how does it stand?
"Tis a poor distress'd country, as ever was seen,
For they hang both men and women for wearing the gree

Cheer up my lively lad, you have friends in this town,
We will send a fleet over, to pull the orange down;
To pull the orange down, and plainly shall be seen,
There is nothing like the Irish lads, for wearing the gre'
For wearing the green, for wearing the green,
There is nothing like the Irish lads, for wearing the gre'

Sold wholesale and retail, by J G. & H. HUNT, at N. E. Corner of Faneuil Hall Market, Boston.

Source: American Memory Collection, Library of Congress
From an undated song sheet, published in Boston.

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: Big Tim
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 05:35 AM

Zimmerman couldn't find the origins of "Wearing o' the Green" (I met with Napper Tandy version), though he gives some useful info.

He wrote; "The tune derives from the march 'The Tulip', written c.1747 by the Scottish composer James Oswald. [the song was printed] in 'The Irish Citizen', January 1841".

According to the "Oxford Companion to Irish Literature", the entry for Henry Grattan Curran (1800-76) says "his poetry includes 'The Wearing of the Green". (HGC was the 'illegit.' son of John Philpot Curran, Robert Emmet's lawyer, and father of Sarah Curran, Emmet's fiancee).

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: GUEST,Atkins
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 07:43 AM

Teribus

The Green Howards were a famous regiment from North Yorkshire, so named I believe after the Howard Family (of Castle Howard - of Brideshead Revisited fame) from whose lands - the Howardian Hills - they originally recruited.

I think they've been amalgamated with the Dukes and the KOYLIs to from a new Yorkshire regiment.

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: paddymac
Date: 04 Jun 06 - 04:56 PM

Here are a few citations attributed to Zimmerman's work. As noted by Martin above, it is an incredible resource, now available in paperback. I highly recommend it to anyone who is a serious student of Irish folk music. The citation below for 24 May 1798 is evidence of the rise of the ban on wearing green anything. The green cockade was most commonly simply a sprig of shamrocks in the cap, but the same treatment sometimnes resulted from the wearing of anything green.

21 Mar 1831        The Dublin Evening Mail reported during The Tithe War that one Michael Grogan of Limerick was sentenced to three months in gaol "for printing and publishing a most scandalous libel, in the form of a ballad song with an intent to create sedition against the government, and disunion between His Majesty's Protestant and Roman Catholic subjects." The most learned magistrate opined that "nothing can be more injurious than inflaming the minds of the lower orders by disseminating ballads and publications of that nature amongst them." (Zimmerman, G.D., 2002 @ 50).

19 Apr 1866        The Belfast Newsletter reported the arrest in Hillsborough, County Down. of a street singer for singing seditious songs, "Erin's King [O'Connell] Is No More" and "Father Murphy." (Zimmerman, G.D.; 2002 @ 46, fn. 57)

24 May 1798        A British officer at Naas, wrote to General Lake that he had summarily hanged three men in the street for wearing green cockades. (Zimmerman, G. D., 2002 @ 43).

21 Aug 1881        The United Ireland paper reported an incident in Mitchelstown, where "the rent was refused and the bailiff tore down the front of the house and commenced to throw the furniture out. Whilst the work of removing the furniture proceeded the people sang "God Save Ireland," "Patrick Sheehan," and other popular songs." (Zimmerman, G.D., 2002 @ 59-60).

11 Nov 1865        The Nation reported a case in Limerick in which a ballad singer sued an election agent for failure to pay him his agreed fee of 60 shillings for 12 days of singing, original songs composed by the balladeer for the occasion, and five pounds if the client's candidate won the election, which he did. The magistrate hearing the case opined that some of the songs were of such a violent nature that they tended to set the people wild. The singer replied that "Unless I set them wild I would not be paid... The more excitement I could raise, the more joy to the party I was employed by. " He added with pride that he could "sing two mobs to smash each other's skulls." (Zimmerman, G.D., 2002 @ 49) The cited source did not report the verdict in the case.

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: katlaughing
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 05:25 PM

Nothing really scholarly...today I was watching Disney's "Lady and the Tramp" with my grandson, for his first time. There is a scene where Tramp distracts an Irish cop at the zoo. Imagine my surprise when I realised the cop was humming this song!

kat

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: RTim
Date: 08 Sep 06 - 09:05 PM

Many, many years ago I was in a band that used to play at a pub in Southampton, England.
One night we were playing and a very large party of Irish people from a wedding came in to our session. They were very enthusiastic (and slighty tight).
One of the party later in the evening approached one of my guitarist friends and said:
"Do you know I'm Going to Dublin in the Green, in the Green?"

To which my friend replied:
"Well I hope you have a great time!"

Tim Radford

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: GUEST,guest
Date: 09 Sep 06 - 06:05 PM

Hey, what about that, I was one of that drunken Irish party that night, but drunk as we were we still had to admire the stunning wit that your friend displayed.
BTW was he the one trying to make music on a Tea Chest ?

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: GUEST,Bob Coltman
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 08:34 AM

To my mind this song is one of the bigger mysteries. Its history, for such a well-known song, is remarkably vague. Few dates or original sources are given, and there's virtually no information as to how it grew and developed.

I wonder if the very commonness of the song has made folklorists steer away from it? Seems to me there's a history there, waiting for someone to uncover it.

Irish singer-author Patrick Galvin rather scants the standard version described above as the "American broadside." In his Irish Songs of Resistance he says literally nothing of the song's history, but gives, in a supplement at the back without comment, the "Old Version, 1798" quoted below. Dating it to 1798 puts the song's origins squarely back in the days of the Great Rebellion. which is helpful. He gives no source.

Note too that the same tune is used by the Clancys for another '98 classic, "The Rising of the Moon." In this they take their cue from Galvin, who gives the text with the note "Air: The Wearing of the Green." (I have heard a different, minor-key tune used to "Rising of the Moon" by Richard Dyer-Bennett, but I don't know if that has any earlier validity.) And, as noted above, the tune (slightly varied) is also used for "Green Upon the Cape," which Galvin includes. Wonder what other lyrics may have been used with this grand old tune?

THE WEARING OF THE GREEN
(Old version, 1798)

I met with Napper Tandy, and he took me by the hand,
Saying how is old Ireland? And how does she stand?
She's the most distressful country that ever yet was seen,
They are hanging men and women there for wearing of the green!

Cho
Oh wearing of the green, oh wearing of the green,
My native land, I cannot stand for wearing of the green.

My father loved you tenderly, he lies within your breast,
While I, that would have died for you must never be so blest,
For laws, their cruel laws, have said that seas shall roll between
Old Ireland and her faithful sons who love to wear the green. CHO

I care not for the Thistle, and I care not for the Rose,
When bleak winds round us whistle neither down nor crimson shows,
But like hope to him that's friendless when no joy around is seen,
O'er our graves with love that's endless blooms our own immortal green. CHO

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: GUEST,Bob Coltman
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 09:10 AM

As for Dion Boucicault, the best that can be said is that he rewrote and gave shape to something that began as a song before he was born in 1820. The Oxford Companion to Irish Literature's claim for Henry Grattan Curran as author doesn't materially help, since Curran was born in 1800 and if Galvin is correct, the song was alive two years before that.

So the song seems to have begun as a folksong, or, at least, as the composition of an unknown author who was old enough to write songs in 1798. Whether there was a yet earlier version that dealt with events before the Great Rebellion is a question worth asking; just how far back can this song be traced?

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: GUEST,TJ in San Diego
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 12:18 PM

This inquiry is from the "colonies," so please forgive my ignorance with respect to the following: I heard The Clancy Brothers and Tommy Makem, back in the early 1960's or so, perform "The Rising of the Moon." The melody seems to be nearly the same as for "The Wearin' O' The Green." Which actually came first? When was the former song written? I always found it to be a powerful statement and well received whenever I sang it.

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: MartinRyan
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 12:31 PM

"The Rising of the Moon" was written by J K Casey for Thomas Davis' newspaper The Nation - mid 1840's.

Regards

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: Lighter
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 02:49 PM

An alternative melody for "The Rising of the Moon" appears on p. 134 of Colm O Lochlainn's "More Irish Street Ballads." Don't know about Dyer-Bennett, but I believe it's the tune used by Judy Collins.

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: GUEST,big tim
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 05:01 PM

It would certainly be very interesting to know the source of Galvin's 'old version 1798'. However, as much as I respect the achievements of Patrick Galvin (born 1930?), especially with 'Raggy Boy', he was a quite young and inexperienced man when he wrote 'Irish Songs of Resistance' (and recorded those 'rebel' LPs, which I have, on tape only). His book is full of great songs but also of quite iffy scholarship, IMO.

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: trevek
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 05:20 PM

In answr to Pete's earlier post, almost all the Irish Regiments had the harp in their badge, including the Ulster Defence Regiment and regts like Tyneside Irish. The RUC also had a harp.

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: Lighter
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 07:46 PM

Galvin's "1798" version given above by Bob Coltmanis is described as "The old street ballad of 1798" in "The Career of Dion Boucicault," by Townsend Walsh (1915), p. 193. Walsh also prints Boucicault's rewrite.

But Walsh doesn't explain his confidence in the 1798 date.

Redfern Mason, "The Song Lore of Ireland" (1911), p. 309, also attributes the song's origin to 1798 and quotes a stanza about Bonaparte, but he is likewise mum on the source of his dating.

My suspicion is that "1798" is just an educated guess based upon the presumed topicality of the words.

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: MartinRyan
Date: 31 Oct 08 - 08:44 PM

For "of 1798" read "about 1798". Hiberno-English.

Regards

Subject: RE: Origins: Wearin' o' the Green
From: GUEST,big tim
Date: 01 Nov 08 - 11:03 AM

It's interesting to note that Zimmerman's A Text (first) is titled 'Green on my Cape'. He dates it 'c.1800', which means that he didn't know the actual date. This song does not bear (very) much resemblance to 'Wearing of the Green' - but the 6th verse is,

In Brest [France!] I met Emmet who took me by the hand,
And asked me for Ireland and how did it now stand,
Such a poor distressed nation you hever have seen,
They hang men and women for wearing of the green.

Could it be assumed that, since Emmet was in France (Paris) from about November 1800 to October 1802, the song could not have been written prior to late 1800? I have a very good modern study of Emmet (Prof Marianne Elliott's) but she doesn't say which port Emmet sailed out of France from, only that he landed in England and then travelled on to Ireland. If it were Brest, could the song pre-date November 1802? (He entered France from Germany).

Zimmerman also refers to 'Another Wearing of the Green by Henry Grattan Curran in Barry's Songs of Ireland, p.144'. Can anyone access that?

So there are at least three versions. A biograper of Boucicault, Richard Fawkes (1979) states that Boucicault learned the original from the singing of his mother Anna Maria Darley (born 1794 or 95) and rewrote the version that we all now know for his play 'Arrah-na-Pogue (Arrah of the Kiss), or, The Wicklow Wedding'. This was first produced in Dublin on 7 November 1864.

However, when the play was produced in the US about 3 years later, both the play and the song were jointly credited to Boucicault and and an American journalist called Edward Howard House. Mr House is definitely thought to have had a hand in the rewrites but nobody can say with certainty who actually wrote what.

So as far as I can see, we have, at least, the original song (1800 or later), Curran's effort, and the one by Boucicault (and to a lesser extent Edward Howard House). I suspect that if Boucicault had never lived, none of us today would know 'The Wearing of the Green'.