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Tech: Substitutions for Nero?

EBarnacle 28 Jan 09 - 11:12 AM
Gurney 28 Jan 09 - 03:15 PM
Dan Schatz 28 Jan 09 - 03:18 PM
GUEST,Ravenheart 28 Jan 09 - 03:53 PM
Bill D 28 Jan 09 - 04:12 PM
Bill D 28 Jan 09 - 04:18 PM
Bill D 28 Jan 09 - 04:25 PM
Bill D 28 Jan 09 - 04:28 PM
Nickhere 28 Jan 09 - 04:36 PM
Acorn4 28 Jan 09 - 05:10 PM
GUEST,MikeK 28 Jan 09 - 06:47 PM
Bill D 28 Jan 09 - 08:02 PM
nickp 29 Jan 09 - 06:24 AM
terrier 29 Jan 09 - 06:47 AM
Acme 29 Jan 09 - 12:39 PM
Howard Jones 29 Jan 09 - 02:13 PM
Bill D 29 Jan 09 - 07:51 PM
kendall 29 Jan 09 - 08:44 PM
Bill D 29 Jan 09 - 10:25 PM
GUEST,punkfolkrocker 30 Jan 09 - 12:53 AM
Spleen Cringe 30 Jan 09 - 02:57 AM
Howard Jones 30 Jan 09 - 03:39 AM
kendall 30 Jan 09 - 07:47 AM
Bonzo3legs 30 Jan 09 - 08:08 AM
ard mhacha 30 Jan 09 - 08:38 AM
EBarnacle 30 Jan 09 - 10:22 AM
Simon G 30 Jan 09 - 10:43 AM
Acme 30 Jan 09 - 11:37 AM
Bill D 30 Jan 09 - 12:22 PM
Acme 30 Jan 09 - 01:54 PM
ard mhacha 30 Jan 09 - 02:57 PM
Steve Gardham 30 Jan 09 - 03:32 PM
Acme 30 Jan 09 - 04:12 PM
treewind 30 Jan 09 - 06:48 PM
patriot1314 30 Jan 09 - 07:03 PM
GUEST 30 Jan 09 - 07:06 PM
GUEST 30 Jan 09 - 07:58 PM
Acme 31 Jan 09 - 12:35 AM
Gurney 01 Feb 09 - 12:40 AM
Acme 01 Feb 09 - 11:03 AM
Mick Pearce (MCP) 01 Feb 09 - 11:46 AM
Bill D 01 Feb 09 - 01:39 PM
ard mhacha 01 Feb 09 - 03:21 PM
Gurney 01 Feb 09 - 04:46 PM
Bill D 01 Feb 09 - 05:07 PM
Acme 01 Feb 09 - 08:55 PM
Uncle_DaveO 01 Feb 09 - 09:26 PM
Bill D 01 Feb 09 - 10:22 PM
Bill D 01 Feb 09 - 10:47 PM
Acme 02 Feb 09 - 01:18 AM
eddie1 02 Feb 09 - 01:32 AM
JohnInKansas 02 Feb 09 - 04:44 AM
GUEST,Gus 02 Feb 09 - 08:28 AM
Bill D 02 Feb 09 - 12:25 PM
Acme 02 Feb 09 - 12:29 PM
Bill D 02 Feb 09 - 12:55 PM
JohnInKansas 02 Feb 09 - 02:10 PM
Acme 02 Feb 09 - 02:14 PM
Bill D 02 Feb 09 - 02:44 PM
JohnInKansas 02 Feb 09 - 05:40 PM
Bill D 02 Feb 09 - 06:00 PM
JohnInKansas 02 Feb 09 - 06:55 PM
Bill D 02 Feb 09 - 07:10 PM
Acme 02 Feb 09 - 07:10 PM
JohnInKansas 02 Feb 09 - 09:48 PM
JohnInKansas 02 Feb 09 - 10:05 PM
Acme 07 Apr 09 - 11:31 PM
Girl Friday 08 Apr 09 - 06:32 PM
Acme 09 Apr 09 - 03:43 PM
Bill D 09 Apr 09 - 07:44 PM
Paul Burke 20 Sep 11 - 01:55 AM
Acme 20 Sep 11 - 11:24 AM
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Subject: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: EBarnacle
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 11:12 AM

I have recently been advised by my computer that Nero will no longer record CD's for me as my trial is over.

Are there any good substitutes available out there? I would prefer freeware. Linux is also good.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Gurney
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 03:15 PM

My Nero came bundled with a CD/DVD player, and isn't limited. I use it a lot, as I like it a lot.
However, it does seem to hijack .WAV files that are loaded into the computer, making them WAVE files (I'm digitising my LPs) and I'd like to stop that happening.
So, EBarnacle isn't alone in looking for a substitute, but the thread is sinking without a lifebelt.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Dan Schatz
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 03:18 PM

I just swallowed hard and paid the $60. I haven't found that it hijacks worse than anything else, and it has very powerful CD recognition and ripping software. (This has been very important as a producer - there's a lot of legitimate ripping songs and sending .mp3s back and forth that takes place and the lesser programs get awfully difficult about that sort of thing.)

My gripe with it is that it's HUGE and very slow to load - sloppy programming at work?

Dan


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: GUEST,Ravenheart
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 03:53 PM

It's hard to find any single substitute for all Nero does.

The Easy CD-DA extractor by Poikosoft is shareware that works well for me to rip or record CDs. The Kingdia CD extractor is also good.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 04:12 PM

Here is one free one.

http://www.imgburn.com/


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 04:18 PM

Here is one other.

http://www.softpedia.com/get/CD-DVD-Tools/Data-CD-DVD-Burning/ImgBurn.shtml


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 04:25 PM

and even one more

http://www.softpedia.com/get/CD-DVD-Tools/Data-CD-DVD-Burning/Ashampoo-Burning-Studio-Free.shtml

(note...I cannot vouch for these in ease of use. etc...)


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 04:28 PM

the 1st one I listed, Imgburn, seems to be the most recommended in the alt.comp.freeware group.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Nickhere
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 04:36 PM

Tried iTunes? Mac is way more user-friendly and 'intuitive'


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acorn4
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 05:10 PM

I always find Windows Media Player does quite a good job of CD burning, which is only a part of what Nero does, but it does this bit particularly well.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: GUEST,MikeK
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 06:47 PM

I used to use Nero until I discovered Gizmo's Tech Support Alert and the whole host of tested and FREE software listed there. Click on "Multimedia" for the list of burners, rippers audio editors, video editors, conversion software and more and all with links to the download sources.

And when you've explored "Multimedia" there are 13 other categories of software to explore - and all of them free and tested! Enjoy!


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 28 Jan 09 - 08:02 PM

I see that Gizmo says Imgburn, that I noted above, is their favorite.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: nickp
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 06:24 AM

I use Imgburn for video and think its great. Not considered if it is usable for audio because I use Nero as well.

I tend to use Nero to produce a video image and then burn that image to dvd with Imgburn because Nero is not consistent (on my set up) in burning its own images...


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: terrier
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 06:47 AM

I've used Media Player a few times with no problems at all.Also, Linux (I've just started using Ubuntu)comes with its own burner bundled with it but not had a chance to try it yet to see what it does and how to use it.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 12:39 PM

The trouble with NERO, after Nero 6, is that they added in Nero Scout and all sorts of security things to make Windows VISTA happy. Nero Scout, even if you custom install and tell it NOT to install, still installs anyway. It is an indexing program, something to do with all of the home theater applications that so many computers are coming up with. Nero seems to feel this is necessary to be an active player in the multi-media world of computers, downloading, and devices integrated into home theater use, but it slows down many other applications and is more annoying that useful.

I finally uninstalled my Nero 8 and went back to an old copy of Nero 6, where it either isn't present or doesn't present the slowdown problems that the others do. And Nero Scout is pernicious, it buries itself in lots of little places so it can be triggered from numerous applications. If you uninstall it, you also need to do a search and dig it out of all sorts of other places.

Shield your eyes if you don't approve of burning a backup copy of your DVDs: Newer versions of Nero (7 and above) won't play nicely with DVD Shrink. Anything you burn using Shrink will only play on your computer, it won't play on any other DVD devices, like the stand-alone player in your living room. If you are inclined to send a copy of your favorite DVD with your daughter to college so she can show this great movie to her friends, and if it is lost in the mess of her bedroom it isn't a total loss, then you need to use Nero 6 or earlier.

SRS


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Howard Jones
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 02:13 PM

I use the packaged version which came with my PC at home, but I needed a DVD burner at work and my IT department installed Nero 8. More than 800Mb and full of stuff I don't want or need, so I can watch TV and play videos and music. All I want to do is burn a few disks! I won't be touching it with a bargepole for my own use.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 07:51 PM

I stumbled onto one more program...

this one is touted as 'portable', meaning can be used on a flash drive, or just as something that does not write to the registry.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: kendall
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 08:44 PM

My computer guru just installed Nero and it works great. According to him it is a high quality product. It cost me $70.00 including labor.The one that came with my computer was junk.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 10:25 PM

Nero is great,,,it is the Gold Standard.... but like some other gold standards, it gets a bit big for its britches sometimes. I admit that MSWord is the 'standard' word processor, too... but there are fine programs for free that do as much as most folks need.

(I have some moderate from of Nero that came with my computer, but never need its more advanced tricks)


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 12:53 AM

I used the final version of Nero 5 [v5.10..something like that ??]
for years.. rock solid reliable software..
Burned 100's of DVD's & CD's with it.
Then I set up a new PC about 4 or 4 months ago
and discovered as expected that nero 5 would not support
the new DVD burner.
So i've tried out Imgburn
and found it so far to be completely adequate for my needs.
I also purchased a 'new old stock' retail boxed Nero 6
but just haven't needed to replace imgburn with it.

..and i've heard too many negative opinions on how overbloated Nero has become since version 7..


So, I've been totally satisfied setting up this new PC
with only good quality freeware essential utilities;
and as a result have a better faster more stable machine
than ever before !!!


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Spleen Cringe
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 02:57 AM

I swear by Exact Audio Copy. And it's free...


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Howard Jones
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 03:39 AM

I've no doubt Nero is a high quality product, I've always found its worked very well for me. But what I want is something to burn disks. What I now get with Nero is something that burns disks, plays music and video, edits photos, even lets me watch TV. I'm being asked to pay for functionality, and to use up my hard drive, for stuff I don't want.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: kendall
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 07:47 AM

I have Nero 9. It does everything but wash windows.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bonzo3legs
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 08:08 AM

Which of these programmes will burn FLAC files? I use Brrrn for FLAC files.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: ard mhacha
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 08:38 AM

A great Thread thanks to all and MikeK`S bundle will keep me going for a long time.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: EBarnacle
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 10:22 AM

Thanks, BillD. I just installed IMGBurn on this computer. If it works as well as the installation run, I expect to be happy with it for quite a while and may even buy the advanced version. This seems to be a more flexible program.

The Nero that came on this ancient laptop worked well, once I got used to it. We expect to keep it where it is still working.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Simon G
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 10:43 AM

Am I the only person in the world using cdrider which is compact and seems efficient.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 11:37 AM

I have been poking around to learn what all I can put on my new little mp3 player. I enjoy recorded books and music, but I've never had one of these that was also a video player. I wonder if one can turn a full-sized film on a DVD into some sort of thumb-nail sized file with audio and video that can be put on a player, or is the video aspect of it meant for little things that are downloaded off of the internet? I haven't found anything that converts the DVD files to something that the player recognizes. I don't think this is the best way to use the space or watch a movie, I'm just curious to see if I can do it. Maybe Nero has some converter.

SRS


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 12:22 PM

well, SRS... there IS this thing called SUPER. It claims to do almost anything.

I tried a version a couple years ago, and found the interface tedious, but I have since seen testimonials from folks who swear by it.

You are competent with programs, so maybe you would find it works fine.

(I am tempted, just because I like playing with stuff...but it's not something I really need. I can play any format I find, so I seldom convert from one to another.)


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 01:54 PM

Like you said, I sometimes like playing with stuff just to see what it will do. I have a lot of sites bookmarked that I haven't tried out yet, so if I weren't employed and spending this time being gainfully employed I might have tried out a lot more.

I have several word processing programs in this new and improved rebuilt machine. I made the switch to MS Office 2007, but not before I installed the OpenOffice software and played with it a bit. I'm glad you kept mentioning this one. I took Office 2003 from this machine and put it on my son's, so I didn't want to put it back just to find the usual symbols for editing and formatting. I find that OpenOffice is a good way to step back and do things in a file if it takes too long to find the new homes of old features in Word2007.

SRS


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: ard mhacha
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 02:57 PM

I downloaded Reg Cure and it tells me that my PC has 1185 faults, this is not the first time that Reg "Cure" has told me to get cracking and send in the $29 to get the real mccoy, my PC is running as smooth as silk, any of you experts ever had the same tripe from this company.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 03:32 PM

Try Starbucks


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 04:12 PM

Something similar happens when people go looking to download Spybot Search&Destroy. If you google it, a knockoff similar name program appears at the top in the sponsored links. People who have downloaded that by accident are immediately told of imminent disaster and mayhem and the must use various things to cure the problems. The problem is the program they accidentally downloaded. I've posted links to cures for that one in another thread here, though I don't remember which one right now.

I'd suggest you uninstall that program, and remember the adage "if it ain't broke, don't fix it."

SRS


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: treewind
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 06:48 PM

"Linux is Good"
On Linux, I use cdrecord, or actually the Debian branch of it which is called wodim (acronyn: Write Optical DIsk Media)
I wrapped it up in a couple of scripts which apply all the necessary switches for recording either audio or data.

FLAC files can easily be converted to WAV for burning with, er, flac!

Anahata


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: patriot1314
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 07:03 PM

For music, a good programme is "jet audio" (www.cowon.com)
Free and does just about everything music wise


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 07:06 PM

InfraRecorder is a free program with an easy interface. It'll do most burning tasks, including making a CD out of a bunch of mp3 files.

I used Nero from the time it first came out, and loved it; but the Nero Express that came with my last burner was a disaster. It wouldn't install. It kept telling me it had to remove the old version of Nero and then re-boot. But it just kept doing that, re-booting over and over. And when I finally gave up and uninstalled it, I found it had left an incredible mess in my registry. It took an hour to get rid of it. I uninstalled InfraRecorder just to compare, and found it had left only a single key in the registry.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: GUEST
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 07:58 PM

Oh, and since there was some talk about word processors, I should mention Atlantis. I do a lot of search and replace, often including text strings together with formatting characters, and Open Office can't do that. I tried about a dozen other word processors and found Atlantis can do everything I want and it has a nice personality. There's a free version that's adequate for me, but I like it so much and use it so much that I decided to go for the pay version, which I think was only $30.


    Please note that anonymous posting is no longer allowed at Mudcat. Use a consistent name [in the 'from' box] when you post, or your messages risk being deleted.
    Thanks.
    -Joe Offer-


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 31 Jan 09 - 12:35 AM

Yes, good stuff, so please either fix your cookie if you're a member, or choose a name.

I'm going to try out a couple of these programs this weekend and see how they work. Will report back.

SRS


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Gurney
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 12:40 AM

I just downloaded and installed Jet Audio. My computer slowed down to a crawl, JA wanted to take over all my music files, and I couldn't get onto the web. It was very slow to uninstall with Windows uninstall. I'll give it another chance, but it didn't look hopeful that time!


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 11:03 AM

They say insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different outcomes. . .

There were several programs listed. Maybe you want to try a different one next time? Good luck!

SRS


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Mick Pearce (MCP)
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 11:46 AM

Gurney - I don't know why you're having problems like that. I've used Jet as my standard player for years now (currently version 7.1.8.4006Basic) and I've had no troubles at all. That being said, I tend to use only the player and not the Media Centre (a relatively recent introduction), which I suppressed in the options. Have you told the media centre to index all your music files? (I don't know offhand if that's an option, but from the behaviour you describe it sounds like it could be that).

Mick


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 01:39 PM

"Indexing your files"...that reminds me of another option for burning

A VERY amazing program called MediaMonkey will index & play your music files and allow you to view them in many ways...by folder, artist, title, genre...etc.....THEN will be happy to burn them either as a CD or as 'data'...that is, MP3 files...etc.

Since I do have Nero, I seldom try MM, which has fewer options, but it is fine for simple tasks.

MM will do many other things also.....overkill for some, but it sure organizes music like *I* want.

Most functions are in the free version, but there's some other stuff in the pay version.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: ard mhacha
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 03:21 PM

Silly River Sage, Sound advice, if it aint broke dont fix it, I give it the works, flushed it down the pan.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Gurney
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 04:46 PM

Sage, when I try something again, I start from download. When I remove something, I end with the original download. I do agree with you generally, but I'm distrustful of downloads. For want of a dab of tar.....or a keystroke of code....

Bill, MonkeyMedia worked well for me, for a while. I particularly liked being able to level the replay volume. However, another free download of a music program wrecked both Monkey and Windows Media, so that they would only play one song each. I couldn't fix it, and removed both. Never bothered to reinstall Monkey. Perhaps I should.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 05:07 PM

hmmm, Gurney.... some programs are naughty that way...setting defaults to THEIR liking. It is often possible to override such settings, but takes some digging. (I never saw exactly that trick before, however.)

If you reinstall it, be sure and go to the options and tell it what you'd like it to do.

(I have one program I leave as the default for when I just click on some file online, to see if I like it, and I only open Monkey when I want to see and/or play my 'collection'.)


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 08:55 PM

There are some programs, primarily QuickTime these days, that try to insert themselves into your quick start menu any time you get near them. Real used to be very pushy that way. I use WinPatrol (thanks, Bill D.!) and Spybot, both of which ask me if I want this program to put itself there. I tell them no, and keep working. There is also a tiny little program you can download from Mike Lin called Startup Control Panel that is literally loaded into the Control Panel. Open it in your Control Panel then go take a look at what is set up in your quick start area and you remove the bits that you don't want to be there. I don't use many of them often enough to make it worthwhile to spend the time waiting for them to pre-load when I turn on the computer. I'll click their desktop icon if I want to use them. I love that little program, and send a couple of bucks via PayPal each time I download it.

SRS


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Uncle_DaveO
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 09:26 PM

Please excuse me for what may be my ignorance.

I want a CD burner/reader that will deal separately with individual folders or files. My main use is for backup, and I may not want to recall and reinstall the whole schmear of stuff that I recorded at one time. I gather (if I'm correct in this) that an image backup is handled as one big lump, and you can't pick and choose parts of it to restore.

Number 1, am I correct in the last sentence or so? Nero, in the version I have, insists on doing an image backup.
Number 2, What program can I use (preferable for free, but at least for a rather low cost) that will allow the piece-by-piece operation that I want?

I don't need to fit VISTA (I use XP PRO), and I don't need to do DVDs.

Dave Oesterreich


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 10:22 PM

Dave... any burning program should be able to burn any combination of files you wish. Burning an 'image' is not relevant in what you wish. I just drag & drop the relevant files or choose them from a list.

I can't imagine why Nero would want to do only an 'image'...(does it say ISO?)

If there is some mini-version of Nero I don't know about, then just try that ImgBurn noted above.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 01 Feb 09 - 10:47 PM

When you open Nero, what does it say...that is, what does it call itself? Does it look anything like this?

If so, you would want 'make a data CD' and not that item in the list called 'Nero Backitup'


IF you have a full version of Nero, it has a lot of options buried in the menus....it's easy to get lost in them.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 01:18 AM

Programs like Ghost used to make you put the whole thing back, but for a long time now I think you can pick and choose what to restore.

I burn CDs a couple of ways. Sometimes I simply put a blank CD in the player and the Windows box pops up and asks if I want to burn a CD and opens a window I can drag things into. This works well for big batches like folders full of stuff, but it doesn't tell you how much you've dragged over, so if you overdo, it won't burn it until you delete enough out again. Nero gives you a line to watch and when you get close to the capacity of the CD then you can quit. I use Nero the way Bill suggests, to make a data CD, I don't use the backup mode. I've never even tried it.

SRS


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: eddie1
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 01:32 AM

I use the free version of RealPlayer for burning CDs. I don't find it at all intrusive and it's pretty speedy.
BillD mentions Media Monkey which I also have for one feature. It allows you to print out a tracklist. As I make up two composite CDs for a 3-hour radio show each week I find this facility invaluable.

Eddie


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 04:44 AM

Windows, at least from WinXP on, claims to provide "drag and drop" CD burning, although I haven't given it much of a try.

While Nero has been a preferred program for audio (and perhaps now for video), as has been noted nearly every program you add to do one thing feels compelled to do everything, so more recent versions may compete with each other to index everything and report everything you do to "the web."

With older versions, I found Roxio much better than Nero for burning data files; but when I was forced to get a newer version for Vista it's been "Neroed" for multimedia and totally flunks out on data. One difficulty is that my new Roxio cannot be set back to less than 24X so you can't force a "slow burn" - which seems to be pretty much necessary for reliable data burns.

CD and DVD data file burning performance has been so poor with both Vistactimized Nero and Roxio that I've given up on optical disks and just use portable external hard drives for backups and archives.

(It was getting hard to find stuff quickly on those 800 archive CDs anyway.)

Obviously, for media stuff, you do need a good burner. I don't do much of that, but I'll watch to see who the winners are here. And I'd be particularly interested if someone finds a really good data file burner (which probably would be crap for media if it does what I need).

John


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: GUEST,Gus
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 08:28 AM

DaveO: To put hard drive files onto a CD, you first have to convert the files and folders into a mass of 1's and 0's that will look like files and folders on a CD. That's an "image" of the CD.

Then you can burn that image to the CD, or you can save it on the hard drive as a "disk image file." That's the 'one big lump' you mentioned. If you burn an image file to a CD, Windows Explorer won't show you the image file on the CD as a single file; it'll show whatever files and folders were used to create the image file.

Some burning programs do it in two steps:
1. pick all the files you want to put on the CD and make a disk image file out of them; and
2. burn that image to the CD.
You can think of the disk image file as an intermediate stage.

Even programs that don't require the two-step process usually have it as an option. It may reduce the risk of errors to do it that way. If you do it all in a single step, that's called burning "on the fly."

Full Nero can do everything on the fly. But there are all sorts of partial Nero packages that are given out for free with burners. They try to make a nuisance of themselves so you'll want to buy the full package.

The free program I use, InfraRecorder, can copy files to a CD on the fly, but not to a DVD. I have to make a disk image file first, and then burn that to the DVD.

I've never been able to figure out how to get ImgBurn to do anything except burn an image file to a CD or DVD. I can't figure out how to get it to convert a set of hard drive files into a disk image file, or to do anything on the fly. After reading what everyone wrote here, I tried again, but it's over my head.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 12:25 PM

Now IF anyone should wish a genuine backup program, I can recommend Cobian

This is the sort of thing you'd use to do as John in Kansas suggests...to backup files or drives to an external hard drive....(or even a 2nd internal drive.)

Cobian is an incremental backup, with setting you control. This means it will make a copy of what you wish, then next time you run it, it will ADD whatever is new....ignoring what it already has. After a certain amount of time, you can start over (disks DO get full, and you may have deleted some of the original stuff)

Cobian is well respected and has been used for many years...by ME for about 3 years.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 12:29 PM

That link isn't working.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 12:55 PM

No? Strange...works for me.... just Google "Cobian"...it can be found several places.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 02:10 PM

Bill D -

I "segregate" the files I need to back up, on my own system drive in a folder C:\BUP\, on one permanently connected drive K:\, and (so far as I can get cooperation to do so) in a shared folder on each of the other computers on our LAN.

Each of the shared folders not directly connected to my machine is mapped as a drive on my local machine.

When I plug an external USB drive into my machine it appears as a new drive, perhaps M:\.

At a command prompt, M:\ switches me to the backup drive.

CD CBUP puts me in the folder M:\CBUP\ folder where I want to backup files from C:\BUP\

The simple command (including the location shown at the command prompt - M:\CBUP>):

M:\CBUP>XCOPY C:\BUP\*.* /s /d /c

does exactly what your backup program does.

The /s tells it to copy everything in subfolders in the source.

The /d tells it to copy only things that are newer on the source than in the existing target folder.

The /c tells it to "continue on error" so that if it hits one of those rare "copy protected" files it skips that one and continues copying. (Most external drives have a "System Volume Information" folder that can't be copied easily, and the /c lets the process skip over those, and one of my "other users" has one !$@#! mpc file that's DRM protected so once a backup copy has been made it blocks any further copying.

Windows, at least since XP and probably Win2K, also has a command prompt thing called "ROBOCOPY" (for Robust Copy) that's apparently even more "powerful" than XCOPY but it requires "scripting" for some things that XCOPY can do with switches, and the script format/requirements are only vaguely described in documentation that I've found thus far. I haven't had a spare empty backup hard drive to test it on, so I haven't played with it.

The "backup" in Vista Business, Premium, and Multimedia versions includes a "synchronize" that offers the ability to automatically keep two drives "identical." (It's not in Home versions.) This lets you automatically remove files from the backup if they've been deleted on the source; but it opens the possibility that a file accidentally deleted (or corrupted) on one drive will be deleted from both. Microsoft's only instructions on backup - and especially on sync - are limited to "I am the Lord thy Microsoft. Trust me." and I'm not quite that true a believer, especially since the two separate prior cases where Microsoft backups were true "backups to WOM."

John


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 02:14 PM

It came up this time. Maybe they were offline momentarily.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 02:44 PM

John... I realize that there are several ways to do many of these things...(Dick Greenhaus regularly informs me how easy it is to do stuff in DOS *grin*)....but my head simply resists adding the command line formulas to my already crowded GM1 drive. For better or worse, I am a GUI weakling. I also do not take to music theory or auto repair (beyond changing the oil) [though I can get in and drive almost anything.] {but ask me about woodworking!}


1)Grey Matter

It's amazing how different our various minds work...and how fortunate it is that there DO exist ways to cope that admit these variations. It is always relevant for you to post & clarify not only the alternatives, but clear explanations of WHY it works. (Several years of info on how fonts & the myriads of characters operate have helped me personally a lot!)


I have just recently added flash drives to my 2 Iomega external HDs to move, save and run various files. I am going to read about ROBOCOPY and see if it is something I can follow...

Thanks for all the effort!


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 05:40 PM

The "help" on Robocopy informs that for some things a "script" is needed, and apparently the script consists of a text file with instructions in it for what the Robocopy routine should do.

It appears to be quite powerful, and would be of great utility to an IT manager who needs to run the same changes to a number of devices, but the requirements for what goes into a script (and what doesn't) are sufficiently vague that I've been reluctant to make much of a try at using it - especially on a backup drive that already has a couple of million files on it. And some things that you can do with the older XCOPY with a couple of switches "/x" appear to require you to write a script in ROBOCOPY(?).

At a command prompt: "ROBOCOPY /?" (without the quotes) will get you the basic "definition." There isn't a lot more in Microsoft's help files or Knowledge Base that I've found.

If you run the similar: "XCOPY /?" the description will tell you that you should use ROBOCOPY instead, but the "setup" to run XCOPY, with the few useful switches, is quick and does what's generally needed for a "cumulative backup" where you don't need to remove files from the backup that have disappeared in the source.

I find it easy enough to just type the XCOPY command*, but if you wanted it's quite easy to make a text file containing the "XCOPY F:\*.* /s /d /c" and save as a text file - something like FBACKUP.txt - in the target folder. Change the .txt to .bat, and when you double click the FBACKUP.bat (In Windows Explorer) it will open the command prompt window, run the command, and then (usually) close the command prompt window, and with only a little luck you'll be all backed up (maybe not even painted into a corner).

I'd recommend, for simplicity, a separate .bat in each target folder with the proper source inside and with a filename that suggests what it's going to copy, although you could put all of them in one place, if you put the full path for both source and target in them. You could also combine several source/target pairs into a single .bat; but sometimes not all the sources are hooked up when I want to back up just one or two.

* I back up about 8 different drives/folders, each to a separate folder on the backup drive, usually at least once a week, and alternate at least two backup drives, so it gets easier to remember the keystrokes. My fingers do most of it by muscle memory - - usually.

John


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 06:00 PM

I 'know', as in see posts from, a guy on the freeware newsgroup, who had recommended xcopy...and maybe 'xxcopy' or some such, for years. It all seems opaque to me, but my wife used DOS professionally for years, and I'm sure she could figure it out.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 06:55 PM

Bill D -

There are only a few DOSSY commands (technically, they're not really DOS anymore) that I still use fairly frequently, and some old-timers might get in trouble trying to use old ones that have been removed or changed. There also have been lots of add-on programs "back when more people used DOS" that are "DOS-like" but that did other things for people too lazy to learn the proper use of the usual ones.

There are a few things that are very easy to do with the command prompt that are really clumsy to achieve directly in the Windows "graphic interface," and with Vista there are more things that can only be done with the command prompt.

A bit of familiarity is highly recommended, but if you're uncomfortable with using them there's the old standard advice - - "don't bother."

Of course having a family member who is proficient enough to be helpful, and not using the available resource perhaps speaks to a failure of communication on which I will not comment lest I interfere in the fragile stability of someone's interpersonal relationships ....

(Sorry - couldn't resist. And members of a "healthy family" do not necessarily share all the interests of all the other members; and some subjects are best not discussed with dear ones - but of course you two do talk to each other?)

(I'd put a "wink" emoticon here, but you probably use some strange font that would make it look like someone being strangled.)

John


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 07:10 PM

everything looks great in Palatino Linotype!


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 07:10 PM

[sigh]

There are times when I wish it was possible to see and/or use the old DOS commands (without jumping through a lot of hoops to get there). Though sometimes opaque if you were learning a new function, they were usually pretty straightforward and very tidy.

SRS


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 09:48 PM

Stilly -

If you're really interested you might try:

Command-line reference A-Z at the Microsoft Tech Net.

This "index" is returned in Vista Help as being "specific for WinXP" but is pretty much applicable from Win2K thru at least Server 2003 and Vista.

It includes lots of stuff that's a bit beyond "DOS commands" you're likely to need, but one can browse for hours ... or days ... or weeks.

In most cases, if you know the command name you can type it into a Command Line window on your own machine, followed by "/?" and you'll get the same info as given at the link. The problem is knowing which command to type in.

John


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: JohnInKansas
Date: 02 Feb 09 - 10:05 PM

In my Vista Business, Help on the Start menu, search for "command line" brings up some results that include a "Command Line Help for IT Pros," leading to the link in the previous post, along with several other things that range from helpful to inscrutible. There's another link, similar to the one in the post above, for Command Line Help for Server 2003 that might be interesting for some of our people who really are "IT Pros." The link goes to somewhere in the middle, but the left sidebar allows some navigation.

Some stuff at Tech Net is blocked for copy/save, but I think the pages linked offer a "printable" and if not you can usually highlight, Copy, and then paste some notes to Word or Notepad.

John


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 07 Apr 09 - 11:31 PM

Poking around looking for Bill's recommendation for "Super" (link is above) so thought I'd bring this back up to the top. There are some useful links in here.

SRS


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Girl Friday
Date: 08 Apr 09 - 06:32 PM

Seems nobody has mentioned MAGIX. We used to use Nero, but it wouldn't work with newer compuiter. Now using MAGIX 2004. So far, all we have copied has been on audiotape. Vinyl to follow.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 09 Apr 09 - 03:43 PM

Is this a free download or a program you purchased, or is it one that comes as both?


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Bill D
Date: 09 Apr 09 - 07:44 PM

A search shows MAGIX as a music editing program. Sometimes these will also do burning, but this would hardly be a substitute for Nero.

MAGIX seems to be shareware, as it gets a few hits on Torrent downloads.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Paul Burke
Date: 20 Sep 11 - 01:55 AM

Without reading every post, has anyone mentioned
CDBurnerXP yet? I've used it for several years now, and though it's slower than Nero as I remember it (last used with Windows 98), it is free and reliable.


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Subject: RE: Tech: Substitutions for Nero?
From: Acme
Date: 20 Sep 11 - 11:24 AM

I have a Blu Ray burner drive on my computer but realized recently that it won't play blu ray movies. I'm looking for a player (I probably need to start by looking in the box, there might have been some software on a disc). Anyone using a PC blu ray player (I use Win7 Ultimate) or a ripper (DVDFab, etc.)?

SRS


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