website revamp please comment

Subject: website revamp please comment
From: Mr Red
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 10:53 AM

Mr Red's Mid West This is live but not my main homepage yet.

Basically I have tried to incorporate as much clutter as possible into drop-down menus. So :
1) any comments about the menu system and the way it works.
2) any comment on the links - particularly off-site eg "other Lists" and "Magazines"
3) If there are any links I could add for other listing sites - bearing in mind I don't anticipate a widening of the area covered (attached bits to my nebulous remit) only a deepening. In this respect there are a few that will be changed/corrected tonight.
4) are there any people who can't see the dropdown menus. They run using JavaScript so it is a salient issue to some folks.

The JavaScript is my own because 2 rip-off systems failed live. On my own PC they were OK. The problem was the use of the "this" object.
Any insights from JavaScriptwriters?

Subject: RE: website revamp please comment
From: bfdk
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 11:22 AM

A few observations:

The JavaScript menu works on my PC which runs IE 6.0.

The link to 'callers' tips' on http://www.users.waitrose.com/~cresby/songs/ChelFestival.htm doesn't work - leads to doc. not found.

On the individual pages it would be helpful with a 'home' link to take me back to the front page.

Best wishes,

Bente

Subject: RE: website revamp please comment
From: Leadfingers
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 11:28 AM

Looks OK to me Cres !! I know few venuesthat are not listed , but its not MY job to do publicity for clubs I dont run .

Subject: RE: website revamp please comment
From: Mr Red
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 11:28 AM

Bente the menu system is intended to be the same across the site, but until it is fettled I don't want to waste time redoing it a hundred times, after every change (as yet unspecified). But that was the plan.

I trust the flags are equally descriptive and less in yer face. See you at Sidmouth.

Subject: RE: website revamp please comment
From: Mr Red
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 06:49 PM

Terry as long as they are in my area I can list. Just give me the clues.

Subject: RE: website revamp please comment
From: GUEST,Shaneo not logged in
Date: 29 Jan 09 - 06:57 PM

How long is the site going ? you certainly have a lot of material.
Jave menu is difficult for search engines to navigate, do you get much traffic ?

Subject: RE: website revamp please comment
From: semi-submersible
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 01:49 AM

I can see the drop-down menus, with this 10-year-old iMac. Oddly, at the bottom of each page appears a cryptic phrase right after the "in case of difficulty tell Mr Red" link, and just above "today is the 5th & Last Thu of this month":

in case of difficulty tell Mr Red & quote - browser = Netscape ...... version = 5.0 (Macintosh; en-US) ..... (undefined)
today is the 5th & Last Thu of this month

I note on this homepage there's a lonely quotation mark in the paragraph, around the link to "the others page".

Subject: RE: website revamp please comment
From: Rasener
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 01:58 AM

I notice that a very busy folking Lincolnshire is not included :-)

Subject: RE: website revamp please comment
From: Jack Campin
Date: 30 Jan 09 - 05:24 AM

The content's fine but I don't like the presentation at all.

I normally use either an old machine that doesn't support Javascript very well (the menu items don't do anything there) or else a modern one with it turned off by default. And when you do turn it on, what you get is something that could equally well be done in pure HTML (more efficiently, and with better indexing from search engines).

There are places where data is laid out in a grid but isn't logically a grid at all - the rows make sense, the columns don't. It would have been better to structure that as a list of lists.

And bright red lines on a white background don't look very attractive.

What gives with lines 18 & 19 of the source? The same thing written once correctly and once with essential quotes left out? My error checker shows lots more like that - best run it through a few validation utilities.

At least provide a Javascript-free alternative.

Subject: RE: website revamp please comment
From: Mr Red
Date: 31 Jan 09 - 12:51 PM

I have just loaded the latest version.

I will peruse comments now to see if the apply.

one comment I saw. quotes
I leaveout quotes as much as possible to reduce the size of the file.
I haven't yet found a browser that doesn't like it. And there are still those on dial-up so file size and download time are important. In the latest version I even leave out http://www and add it in JavaScript. I may do more similar wheezes but the code works (AFAIK) and the savings will become less dramatic.

the whole menu is now generated in JavaScript. My only reservation is the effect it has on Search NEgine rating so I may leave the homepage as mostly HTML.

Subject: RE: website revamp please comment
From: Jack Campin
Date: 31 Jan 09 - 02:00 PM

one comment I saw. quotes

I leaveout quotes as much as possible to reduce the size of the file.

NO. You will only save a few bytes doing that, which doesn't matter even on the slowest dialup. Instead you are likely to slow the browser down, since interpreting incorrect HTML will probably take longer - the parser has to correct the code before rendering it.

Run it all through a couple of validators and keep fixing things until you get no error warnings at all.

I don't see why you believe all that Javascript is making things easier for anybody. It's not doing anything essential that I can see - just compromising portability, search visibility, disabled accessibility and maintainability.

Subject: RE: website revamp please comment
From: Mr Red
Date: 03 Feb 09 - 05:29 PM

Well, I hope this sticks. From a public PC at the library I couldn't post. The PC's are strapped down for security and the buckles are tight - mate.
Which demonstrates the problem nicely. You can't catch all the permutations that the net offers. And if Max can't expend the effort as a more expert webmaster I am pretty sure I am not going to cater for all my potential audience no matter how thoughtful I am.
Judging by the comments I get from the naive webmasters who don't even know what I am saying about legacy equipment - I do more than most out there.


Anyways - latest attempt is live. The next phase will be to add noscript tags - or more of them.

Subject: RE: website revamp please comment
From: Mr Red
Date: 08 Feb 09 - 06:48 PM

OK NOSCRIPT added so non JavaScript browsers have a sort of navigation bar. The prototype HomePage has the full set of link blocks at the bottom, until the JavaScript (if running) moves them to the top. However the main homepage does not have it yet, only the prototype page which isn't linked to as a homepage (yet).

However it does have a floating navigation bar that is always at the top. If it is really annoying to people it will be left fixed. Please comment.

I want to try it with a few more constricted browsers before I commit fully to the new system.

& if Villan wants HyperLincs (sic) tell me what they are and I will add them to my further a-field page. My normal lists are limited to the greater area I live in (and nearby environs).