Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?

Subject: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: BobKnight
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 11:03 AM

I'm a singer/songwriter from Aberdeen/Scotland. I've only been involved in the folk/trad scene for the last four or five years, but have played in different types of bands over the last 30+ years - mostly country, and country rock. My family (cousins, uncles, aunts, grandparents) have always been involved with traditional music but mostly just at family gatherings, so folk music is something that has always been around.

After years of singing in a "trans-atlantic accent," I started writing songs in traditional style using my own Scots/Aberdeenshire accent. Until now I have only performed within Scotland, but am now thinking of trying to find work further afield. (make me an offer)Bearing in mind a review I read of Jim Malcolm which said, "one of the few Scottish singer who can be understood outside his native Scotland," I just wondered if my songs/language are too strongly accented for the wider world? Given that Mudcatters seem to be worldwide, I thought this the best place to ask. You can hear some of my songs at www.myspace.com/bobknightfolk

Any feedback would be appreciated - thanks - Bob

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: GUEST,mack/misophist
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 11:19 AM

I could only understand about half the words, which may reflect more upon my cheap speakers than your accent. Your voice, however, was sweet and true and the accent added a very attractive quality to the sound. Perhaps song sheets would satisfy those who insist on understanding every word.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 11:21 AM

Singing in a 'Strong Scottish Accent' doesn't seem to have done Dick Gaughan any harm - he's recognised widely as a great performer. I'd say go for it and be proud, you are what you are.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: katlaughing
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 11:28 AM

I've listened to and enjoyed each song. I don't find your accent strong and was able to understand quite well. I do have some experience at hearing and reading a Glaswegian accent, so maybe that helps?!:-)(Used to speak almost daily with a Glaswegian which really trained my ears, es. when she got excited and spoke fast!)

Well done, beautiful songs and I agree with the above comments re' your voice...sweet and true.

Thanks for sharing,

kat

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Rasener
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 11:28 AM

I could understand your lyrics and didn't think the accent was too strong (however, I did live in Scotland for 3 years so maybe that helped).
I enjoyed listening to your songs. Nice one.

You could always do what some performers do, and that is to explain any words in a song (before you sing it) where you think people may not understand.

Good luck to you

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Joe Offer
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 11:31 AM

Well, you can certainly be understood, Bob. I like the recordings very much, and you have just the right touch of accent.
-Joe-

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Banjiman
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 11:31 AM

Sounds understandable and very pleasent to me.

But then I'm married to a Scot!

Paul

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Maryrrf
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 11:34 AM

If you're doing country, rock, etc. then probably a neutral accent is best, but the songs on your myspace are in the traditional style and are enhanced by your regional accent. I found it pretty understandable, in relation to some Scots songs I've heard. What you might want to do, if performing to audiences who could have trouble understanding, is just explain briefly what the song is about, and define any terms that might not be obvious. If you were to use the word 'greet' for example, in the sense of 'weeping' - most North American audiences would not get it. If you issue a CD it would be a good idea to include liner notes which include 'translations' of anything that might be difficult. I'm glad you're going back to your roots - good for you!

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: gnomad
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 11:49 AM

I live in N England, and find I have difficulty with some Scotts accents (Dick Gaughan, for instance, can sometimes be near-incomprehensible for me, though I still enjoy his work) I found no such difficulty with your songs, Hawkerladdie.

I liked your voice, and the accent was no problem.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Jim McLean
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 12:13 PM

I'm afraid I could hear no trace of a 'strong, Scottish accent', just a sprinking of Scottish words here and there. Reading you were from Aberdeen I expected something sounding like Jeannie Robertson or Jimmie McBeath but no such luck. You should be aware of who you are writing for .. if it's for yourself then the language should be yours and don't worry about Anglizising/Americanising your lyrics or pronunciation. Maryrrf (posting above) makes a good point about a glossary in your liner notes although there were very few words which I thought could not have been understood by the majority of the English speaking world.
The best of luck with your CD.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: RTim
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 12:57 PM

I was just given a CD by Steve Byrne of Malinky - his own record called Songs From Home - I can hardly understand a word he says - but it's a great CD!
Tim Radford

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Bruce MacNeill
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 01:06 PM

I wouldn't call yours a "Strong" Scottish accent at all. I could understand most of the words with no difficulty and could probably have understood all if I were listening closely, which I don't when listening to songs generally since I'm listening to the music as well. Frankly you're a lot more understandable than my grandmother was and more than many of the people here in Virginia are. Liner notes may help sales I suppose. They'll also help anyone wanting to lift your songs get it right.

I enjoyed them.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Diva
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 01:14 PM

I would say NO but then I'm thrawn like that. I heard you at Cullerlie last year and you were just fine

Best wishes with the cd

Kathy

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: BobKnight
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 01:14 PM

Sorry to disappoint you Jim. May I say however, that Jeannie was a product of her time, the late ninteenth century and early twentieth. As a traveller, her accent was a blending of Aberdeenshire and Perthshire and not at all a typical Aberdeen accent. Even travellers don't talk like her anymore.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: goatfell
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 01:17 PM

nothing wrong with your accent, and to to these people that they can't understand you well if you go to Australia or America I sometimes find it hard to understand them

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 01:32 PM

Bob - fine singing and good backup music. I understood everything.

A strong Scottish accent never hurt Ed Miller, Brian McNeill or Alex Beaton here in the U.S.

PM me and I'll give you a few festival contacts over here.

Seamus

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Jim Lad
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 02:43 PM

You seem to have done a masterful job of softening up your accent for a broader audience.
That's a must for Scots and far better than listening to some eejit laying it on.
Nicely done.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 02:52 PM

Oh yeah, it didn't hurt Jim Brannigan in Canada either.

Seamus

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Malcolm Douglas
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 03:22 PM

Stick to your real voice. Far too many people in Britain and Ireland in general seem to think that 'contemporary' songs have to be sung in a fake mid-atlantic accent; it seems to be especially common in Scotland, though. I know a lot who do it without even realising, and I think that's a pity.

Scottish accents are no harder to understand than English ones; it's just that a lot of people compare the stronger Scottish regional accents with 'standard' English, which isn't comparing like with like. Barnsley can equal Aberdeen in impenetrability any day, for example. Your accent is really only quite light anyway; you could afford to lay it on thicker if that felt right to you. I suppose that the occasional word might possibly need a gloss in sleevenotes, but only the ones that aren't used outside Scotland any more.

I don't usually pay much heed to singer-songwriters (there are so many) but I do like the way you structure your tunes. A good Scottish style, in fact, and positively enhanced by a natural Scottish accent.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Sandy Mc Lean
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 04:36 PM

I love your stuff Bob! Sometimes with a Scottish accent you can make a song your own. You say that you do country songs. The Carter Family were as country as anyone could hope to get. Our own Jim Brannigan (Jim Lad) recorded The Curtains Of Night a few years ago and as much as I respect and love The Carters I like Jim's version better. In Cape Breton where I live people say we have an accent as well, but I find that is mostly "they" with the accent. Very subjective...........
I also love Gaelic songs very much although my limited comprehension prevents me from understanding every word. As well there is an Aberdeen in Cape Breton and I understand my friends and relatives from there just fine!
Slainte and failte,
                  Sandy

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: robomatic
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 04:42 PM

I had an opportunity to work with a Scot with a pronounced accent. Our discussions went on long enough for me to adapt to his mode of speech and was well worth the effort. Still sometimes had some misunderstanding over the phone.

My advice, if you like it, proceed with abandon, your listeners will probably like it, too.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Catherine Jayne
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 04:54 PM

I listened and I enjoyed very much. I could understand you perfectly well don't worry about your accent.

Best of luck with your CD!

Khatt

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Tangledwood
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 05:39 PM

It sounds great and is perfectly understandable by this Aussie. Generally speaking I don't usually find accents a problem - vocabulary from regional dialects is a different matter. As Maryrrf suggested, sleeve notes quickly solve that.

I don't think that I would enjoy the songs as much if they were in a "trans-atlantic accent" or were "sanitised" by replacement of dialect; much of the character would be lost.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: InOBU
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 06:57 PM

Och no...

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Peace
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 07:10 PM

I'm listening to you now and holy flying ostriches, Batman, you are one of the finest singers I have ever heard. Your voice is absolutely stunningly beautiful, expressive and emotive. Your writing is excellent and the music is fantastic. Bob Knight, I seldom give computers standing ovations, but it's getting one now. You are great. I mean that from the heart. Do not quit singing. The world could use more of you. Best wishes.

Bruce

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Peace
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 07:12 PM

Incidentally, I have no difficulty with the accent.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Ed T
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 07:40 PM

Try these accents out:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3UgpfSp2t6k&feature=related

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Peace
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 08:17 PM

Bob Knight lyrics here for anyone having accent difficulties.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Jeri
Date: 09 Mar 09 - 08:18 PM

No problem with the accent, and I think your singing and the songs are wonderful.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: GUEST,Marie
Date: 10 Mar 09 - 12:23 AM

Does it matter? It does to me. I absolutely LOVE Scottish accents. The stronger the better. And when it's your real voice, it's even better.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: BobKnight
Date: 10 Mar 09 - 06:03 AM

Well.... It seems my accent isn't as strong as I thought it was. Just to clarify a few things - it's neither laid on, nor watered down. Basically I decided that I was going to write and sing as I speak, and that's pretty much it.

I've been pleasantly surprised by the very favourable reaction to the songs, so I'd like to thank you all. I might even get to meet some of you one of these days - I look forward to it.
Bob

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: GUEST,LTS pretending to work
Date: 10 Mar 09 - 09:01 AM

Hey, if Sean Connery can play a Russian submarine captain, a Spanish metallurgist to the Egyptian court, and an Irish/American cop in the 1940's, all with the same Scottish accent, then I would say it doesn't matter at all... in fact, an accent is a positive boon in these days of generic, sanitised pap.


Chas and Dave (duo popular in the 1980's) used to sing in American accents because they believed that's what people wanted to hear. Then they decided they wanted to sing the way they spoke and so the Chas 'n' Dave phenomenon was born!

LTS

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 10 Mar 09 - 09:03 AM

I think I rather object to put on accents.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: GUEST,kp
Date: 10 Mar 09 - 09:33 AM

Bob,
nice songs and lovely singing voice. Reminded me of the late Tony Cuffe, and that's high praise.

For all those who wonder just how broad the Aberdeen country dialect ('Doric') can be there's a lovely clip here.

Doric Call Centre

When I first went to the north-east in the 1970's I remember being quite lost trying to chat with some of the locals........

KP

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Will Fly
Date: 10 Mar 09 - 09:37 AM

There was a Scottish chap at last night's singaround - he sung absolutely magnificently, in a broad Scots accent. Having lived in Scotland for some years after the war(WWII) I understood what he was singing. The person next to me murmured, "I couldn't understand a word of it, but it sounded wonderful." Nuff said!

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Spleen Cringe
Date: 10 Mar 09 - 09:40 AM

Nice stuff. Perfectly understandable - even Alasdair Roberts sings in a stronger Scottish accent. Not that I think it's that much of an issue anyway. 'Specially as two of my favourite singers are Lizzie Higgins and Davie Stewart!

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: GUEST,kenny
Date: 10 Mar 09 - 12:55 PM

Keep doing what you do, Bob, and remember, Billy Connolly allegedly got booed off the stage in Elgin because they couldn't understand him.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 10 Mar 09 - 12:56 PM

Are you sure that was the only reason?

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: BobKnight
Date: 10 Mar 09 - 01:54 PM

It was actually Banff. He said later, "it even sounds like a dull thud."

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Marje
Date: 10 Mar 09 - 02:15 PM

I didn't have any trouble understanding your accent but I am Scots born myself. I truly believe that many Scottish accents are clearer and more phonetic than most English accents - the pronunciation tends to be closer to the spelling, with fewer dropped letters and slurred sounds. I can't think that many non-Scots speakers of English would have much of a problem with your accent, and in live performance it would be even less of an issue.

What causes bigger problems for a wider English-speaking audience is broad Scots dialect involving the use of words and expressions that are unfamiliar to the listeners (e.g. some of Burns' songs). But even they can be smoothed out by a brief explanation of key words before the song begins (or by a glossary in a CD's liner notes).

And I enjoyed your lovely singing, too - there's a genuineness and clarity coming across, which I just don't think would be there if you were using a phony mid-Atlantic accent. Don't change!

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Peace
Date: 10 Mar 09 - 05:35 PM

When ya wake Scots up at three in the morning they sound just like Canadians.

I'll leave now.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Megan L
Date: 11 Mar 09 - 11:28 AM

Thons a grand voice ye hae beuy even an auld wifie oan Orkney kin unerstaun ye.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Barry Finn
Date: 11 Mar 09 - 01:50 PM

As an American who's not married to a Scot, doesn't have a Scottich grannie, has never been to Scotland & who has a very thick Bostonian accent that New Yorkers can't understand. I understood you very well, matter of fact had not trouble with any thing you sang. Very lovely, really well done & extremely well sung. I'm listening now & find your songs, the mix, the back up, the production & the "accent" totaly refreshing. You should broaden your horizions, with what your doing I don't know why you'd want to anything but.

Barry

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Teribus
Date: 11 Mar 09 - 02:07 PM

Absolutely fabulous Bob, really enjoyed listening to your songs, you'll travel far and be well received of that I've no doubt. I'll keep a look out for you, I'd certainly pay good money to hear and see you sing - All the very best and good luck to you.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: kendall
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 08:23 AM

As far as accents go, when I watch American TV I tend toward shows such as, Judge Joe Brown and Judge Judy. So many of those litigants are next to impossible to understand, and their grammar is atrocious. Thank God they don't sing!

Your accent is very pleasant to listen to, and your voice is right on. That combo is hard to beat. Keep it up; I'd pay to see you.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Jim Lad
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 12:46 PM

As one who has been playing to foreign audiences for thirty years, I can tell you that it matters. There are others here whom I can tell from listening to their work, have softened their accents a little.
Not much.
Just enough to be understood.
It is also something that we have to do on a daily basis, just to buy groceries.
So many words have to be dropped from the vocabulary that it becomes akin to speaking a foreign language.
As I said before, Bob.
You're doing just fine with it.
Nicely done.

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Peter the Squeezer
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 03:50 PM

Good songs, well sung! Well done Bob!
I didn't have any problem understanding the words at all.

My mother comes originally from Aberdeen (a Torry quine). When she was at school in the 1930's, the bairns were told that they should all learn to speak English clearly, as one day they might have to go to England!

In WW2 she was enlisted into the army pay corps, and was posted to Nottingham. Their first contact with the locals in Nottingham was, on getting off the overnight train, asking a railway porter where they could get a cup of tea. The response was "Oop them stairs an' ton reet at 'top, mi duck". She could just about understand the "ton reet" bit, but it took six months for them to get the hang of "mi duck"!

Peter

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: Seamus Kennedy
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 03:53 PM

Thank God I don't have an accent, so I don't have this problem.

Seamus

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: GUEST
Date: 13 Mar 09 - 12:50 PM

Sounds a bit like Paul Brady.....

There's a guy, goes by the name of Dylan.....he did pretty good. Not so much an accent, but who the hell could make him oot?

Subject: RE: Strong Scottish Accent - Does It Matter?
From: McGrath of Harlow
Date: 13 Mar 09 - 09:29 PM

My impression is that's it's only in folk of one sort or another that any performers seem to worry much about anyone being able to understand the words.