BS: Separated by a common language

Subject: BS: Separated by a common language
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 11 Mar 09 - 09:01 PM

The more I look at the threads by Mudcatters from different sides of the pond, the more amazed I am that we are bothe members of the same species.
We laugh at different things [mostly] we are offended by different things.
Maybe that's why all the various UK attempts at Oprah style TV programmes fail miserably. Certainly Kilroy was a disaster, and there have been others, which were so forgetable, I can't remember their names, even to hold them up to ridicule.
I'm not denigrating anybody, I'm just curious. What do others think?

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Peace
Date: 11 Mar 09 - 09:30 PM

About what?






























I HAD to do that.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 11 Mar 09 - 09:45 PM

Peace, you don't read the books on Oprah's list?

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Peace
Date: 11 Mar 09 - 09:46 PM

LOL

Good one, Q.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: GUEST,heric
Date: 11 Mar 09 - 09:54 PM

You can't possibly be suggesting that the joke about the priest, the rabbi, and the ten year old boy in a lifeboat wasn' funny. . .

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 11 Mar 09 - 10:03 PM

Did the 10-year-old boy have to jump off the lifeboat to save his skin? Or his ....

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity
Date: 11 Mar 09 - 10:05 PM

Press 'one' for English....

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 11 Mar 09 - 10:14 PM

I don't know quite what you mean by "Oprah style". What do you consider to be unique about her style that differs from British chat shows? There are some successful British talk shows, aren't there? What about Graham Norton? (I get him on BBC America, a cable network, Sunday evenings.) Sure, he's not much like Oprah, but every chat show is different, according to the personality of the host. Is there an American style that differs from the British style?

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 11 Mar 09 - 10:35 PM

'various UK attempts at Oprah style TV programmes fail miserably.'

I don't know what to respond to this, because I've never watched Oprah, and not one person I know, either friend, family or acquaintance, has ever mentioned watching Oprah.

In my doctor's office, there is usually a TV going, and rarely does anybody look at it. (I see the same thing in airports.) In fact, people are usually at the other end of the waiting room from the TV.

I suspect there are only about 1000 people left in America who actually watch TV.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: GUEST,marks (on the road)
Date: 11 Mar 09 - 10:54 PM

We watch Okra in our garden every year. It really grows well. All it takes is//////////er//////////never mind.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: artbrooks
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 12:26 AM

I see Oprah on the cover of tabloids occasionally - usually something about her weight gain or loss. I can't say that I've ever seen her TV show. Does she endorse books?

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 12:29 AM

John, I think this thread got off on the wrong foot. People at mudcat mostly do not watch Oprah.
I remember that long ago there was a Kilroy (was here), but I know nothing of the show.

I watch British mysteries and suspense, I find them very good. Some of the older dramatic shows, like Jewel in the Crown, Brideshead Revisited, The Le Carre spy dramas, Upstairs,Downstairs, I consider classics of television, and I have bought DVDs of some.
As Time Goes By I consider excellent; perhaps I will buy the DVDs.
There are other series that I could watch again.

The "Eastenders," running on a BBC-Canada cable channel, doesn't hold my interest. Perhaps it is this type of situation drama that doesn't appeal in USA-Canada.

On the U. S. side, I watch almost none of the current shows. The old U. S.-produced westerns I liked very much. U. S. comedy, as far as I am concerned, has died. Where is a Ralph Cramden, Burns and Gracie Allen and other greats of earlier television?   I don't like the late night shows. Leno leaves me cold.

Graham Norton is sometimes good, but I don't go out of my way to watch. We get two cable "BBC" channels (plus BBCNews), but the selection of English shows is not very good.

I am a poor one to get comment from; I almost never watch anything on the regular TV channels except some sports, and some news and comment shows (mostly PBS and BBCNews).

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: GUEST,Ingrid the Crafty
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 01:13 AM

Are you referring to the different meanings we seem to have for the same words? Like Randy? In America its a boys name, in England its his condition.

Ingrid

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Spleen Cringe
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 04:15 AM

I don't know if as many of the Americans suffer from Victor-Meldrew-in-my-Daily-Mail-hell syndrome as the Brits do. They have their own problems.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Acorn4
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 05:18 AM

I've never really appreciated American humour, with one or two exceptions. I think the Simpsons is wonderful, and used to love the series "Cheers", set in a Boston bar, and "Roseanne", starring Roseanne Barr - never really got into "Friends" though - not sure what it is that sets some US humour apart - then again , it's all a matter of individual taste.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Spleen Cringe
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 05:33 AM

For me, "Curb Your Enthusiasm" has to be some of the best American humour out there - it treads a fine line between laugh-out-loud funny and too-excruciatingly-painful-to-watch funny. A bit like a darker, more grown-up Frank Spencer without the slapstick.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Michael
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 05:45 AM

I think that this discussion is based on a false premise, It isn't so much UK v US as me against thee, or (to risk a generalisation) Mudcatters against the world. I like, and find funny, certain things on TV. You like, and find funny, certain things on TV.On some points we agree, on some we don't.

On the whole, reading previous posts, we all appreciate the same humour.
And we all dislike the same programmes(I said "on the whole").

There is good and crap TV on both sides of the pond.


Mike

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 07:14 AM

It's not so much the TV aspect as the cultural differences which are evinced by the things which amuse and annoy us.
For instance, the only transponder I can remember getting upset about the BNP threads on Mudcat was Peace, similarly the unlamented Jade Goody thread aroused a lot of ire in the UK, but none in the US.
Now you have your social misfits and misanthropes in the US, but I can't remember any prurient threads on the lady who had the octuplets for instace. Just general disapproval.
You have the KKK and the John Birch Society, and they seem to be largely ignored by US Mudcatters.
Could it be that the comparative sizes of the two countries is a factor. With we Brits living in each others pockets,figuratively speaking, and while a plane is required to get across the USA, we can drive from one end of the country to the other on less than 24 hours?
It's difficult to quantify what I mean on this one, but basically it's my view that in spite of the number of non US residents posting on Mudcat,it still remains an American website, with the commensurate values attached thereto.
I await the brickbats.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 07:56 AM

The main reason I don't get upset about Jade Goody is that I don't have a clue who Jade Goody is! Never heard of him (or her?) except by seeing that name in a Mudcat thread title.

Similarly, I have only a vague idea of what the BNP is, and what I know, I know mainly from seeing them mentioned in Mudcat threads.

Such things simply aren't mentioned in the US media.

I'd say Brits seem to know more about Americans than vice versa; but Brits can be misled, too. You mention the KKK and the John Birch Society. At least you've heard of them, but I have a hunch you overestimate their importance. Americans (not just Mudcatters) mostly ignore them because they really are a tiny segment of society, and they are much less significant today than they were in the past.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Micca
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 08:11 AM

The big difference I've noticed is Irony, it seems a lot less common in the US than in the UK especially on TV. Many, if not most, of the mudcatters I have met both on here and in 3D seem to be possesed of a well developed sense of Irony, and in many cases its "companion" skill the ability to laugh at themselves and not to take themselves too seriously, it is, I believe, these that seperate Most Mudcatters from the "common herd" and may appear to be the difference between US Humor and UK Humour, In this respect, for example, Maine, wwhich has a unique style of sort of self-deprecatory humour is much closer to the UK than to the rest of USA IMHO When Kendall performed at Sharps FC here in London the ENTIRE audience where with every nuance and change of direction in his stories and were laughing so much it hurt. I thought the guy next to me was going to have a seizure during the "Hunting for Winter" story (If you havent heard this gem, Buy, beg, borrow or steal a copy.)

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Stu
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 08:44 AM

The Americans can do quality in a way we don't here in the UK, although the production values are beginning to seep down into our own programming. Hack

Doctor Who is living proof that good scripts and high production values like those seen in US show like the X-Files etc make for excellent entertainment.

As for humour, Americans must see Father Ted as it's a work of genius, listen to I'm Sorry I Haven't a Clue to gain insight into our sense of humour, and have a listen to Count Arthur Strong to hear we can still do brilliant original comedy.

I love US comedy, and as far as I am concerned Curb is brilliant but the jewel in the crown is Arrested Development - the funniest show ever, possibly. Certainly up there with Fatty Owls, Ted, Mr. Brent and Del boy.

Also, the US gave us Twin Peaks, the best television series ever. Something like that would never be made in the UK.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 09:53 AM

Somewhat subjective Jack, but then all personal preferences must be so, by nature. However it';s not really about the relative merits of our respective TV programmes.
The reason I brought up Oprah was as an example of a type of programme, not the programme itself, although the programme would be yet another Jerry Springer genre thing, were it not for the personality and style of Oprah herself.
It's the public self examination aspect I was trying to convey. Brits aren't comfortable airing their foibles and freaks on TV, whereas it would appear to be more common in the USA.
I find this at odds with Americans I know personally, who on the whole, do not like taking about themselves. This might account for the reputedly high number in analysis ;)
Micca is right on the irony front, although it is all to often the given reason for differences in what makes us laugh. I think there are other, and deeper reasons, but I'm not sure what they are.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Dave the Gnome
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 10:02 AM

I thought this was more about language and why I got some funny looks when I told a waitress in Chicago that I was going out to roll a fag...

:D (eG)

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 10:33 AM

Why not lay the table as an encore?

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: GUEST,heric
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 10:40 AM

I heard an Italian tourist demanding of a waitress: "I wanna two fokella on da table!"

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 10:48 AM

Things sure are complicated now that we have cable TV.

Curb Your Enthusiasm was produced for HBO, which is considered a premium channel on cable TV. In other words, it's an optional channel (or group of channels) that you have to pay extra for, over and above the basic cost of cable TV. I get something like 120 channels, but I don't get HBO, so I've never seen Curb Your Enthusiasm.

I suppose I could rent a DVD, or request it from Netflix, but I haven't done so.

How do you get it in the UK? Is it free?

I've never seen Arrested Development, either, unfortunately.

By "Fatty Owls" do you mean "Fawlty Towers"? That wasn't obvious to me at first. I did see, and love, Fawlty Towers.

The idea of having nicknames or abbreviated names for TV shows is a custom that hasn't caught on here, either, to my knowledge. Maybe you have to watch a lot of TV, and discuss it a lot, for that to appeal to you. I don't do that much, and neither do my friends. At least, we don't often discuss "entertainment" shows. If we discuss anything about TV, it's likely to be news and documentaries.

I am very interested in comparisons between British and American culture, and maybe that's why British TV shows appeal to me more than they do to most Americans, and why British TV shows often appeal to me more than similar American TV shows. I appreciate the insight and information they give me about British customs. For instance, I might never have heard of Eurovision if it hadn't been for Father Ted.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 10:52 AM

'You have the KKK and the John Birch Society...'

I haven't heard of the John Birch Society in years, and the KKK is almost dead.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Mr Red
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 11:20 AM

have a nice day................

we laugh at that in the UK. While rolling on the floor.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 11:23 AM

John Birch Society, still extant it seems.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 11:35 AM

Went looking for the KKK too, and found this instead.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: GUEST,heric
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 11:43 AM

Well yeah they're here but so is every other weirdo group under the sun, so most fall of the general public's radar (unless some magazine or TV show decides to change that.)

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: HuwG
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 12:02 PM

To the best of my knowledge, the German hi-tech engineering firm of Kulhne, Kopp und Kausch are far from dead.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: CarolC
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 12:25 PM

I've had heated arguments with some of the BNP types who have posted here at times. I just didn't use any expletives while doing so. I'm pretty sure there were other people from this side of the Atlantic who also argued with them. I don't think the lack of insulting language should be construed as a lack of disapproval.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: John MacKenzie
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 12:37 PM

Sorry Carol should have included you, but I did say 'the only one I could remember was Peace' but I'm an old man you know, and we forget things.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Megan L
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 12:46 PM

Carol he is so auld and decrepit Historic Scotland are thinking o pittin a preservation order on him

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Bill D
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 01:20 PM

"...the US gave us Twin Peaks"

I had almost forgotten that... it WAS exceptional, but even here it got only a cult following. You really needed to see all episodes in order to follow the plot...much as I guess it is with "Doctor Who". I have friends who follow THAT fanatically, but I never was able.

John is correct that 'humor' and cultural norms differ widely in various areas of the US, and advertising on TV shows is often contrived and changed for the same program in different parts of the country. I simply could not live in parts of the Deep South.. I know HOW to avoid certain issues and jokes, but it's too much strain to do every day.

I see very few American comedy shows that I consider really funny any more here...they are either totally based on sexual innuendo or aimed at stereotypes so blatant that they are painful. The UK has sent us several that were truly 'different', and several that were just UK versions of stereotyped running jokes..("Are You Being Served")
The shows which depend on knowing the accent, vernacular and slang of the UK go right by me.

Yes John, it IS amazing we are able to communicate at all!

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: bubblyrat
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 02:46 PM

I am still unable,at the age of 62,to understand how ANYONE,but especially Americans,could possibly find Lucille Ball even REMOTELY funny. I thought Vincent Price in "The Fall of The House of Usher" was funnier than Lucille Ball------The best thing about her show was Gale Gordon doing a cartwheel--now that WAS funny !!

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: VirginiaTam
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 03:06 PM

UK attempts at Oprah style TV programmes fail miserably
What a blessing that is. Trisha Goddard is still driving the burberry bus on Five and occasionally being vilified on comedy game/panel shows. I bet the original plan was that she would be the UK's answer to Oprah. Be grateful that didn't happen.

British comedy is so much richer, darker just better quality than American. Brass Eye, Coupling, Black Adder, One Foot in the Grave. That Mitchell & Webb Look, Bremmner, Bird and Fortune. I could go on and on. Very little in the US compares. God! Even Red Dwarf and Keeping up Appearances beats out Friends and Seinfeld and other embarrasingly, flaky, candidates for the analysts couch, unfunny 'comedy'.

I will give on Simpsons. It is simply brilliant. Maybe my problem is I have not been exposed to much American comedy, especially since moving to UK. When I lived in US, I had little time or energy or interest in TV, except what I found on PBS on Saturday nights (namely excellent British comedy).

Think I will watch some Python, Black Adder or Coupling tonight. I need a good laugh.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Peace
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 03:15 PM

"The big difference I've noticed is Irony"

Something at last I understand.

"The grenade exploded near his leg and now his leg is very irony."

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: meself
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 03:28 PM

And how do we feel about puns?

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 03:39 PM

Some of the routines by Desi Arnez and Lucille Ball, on TV years ago, I still recall. Most of the shows did suffer from poor scripts, however.
"The Honeymooners" was great comedy, with great characters.
"Fawlty Towers" was excellent English comedy with a master at the helm. Another British hotel series is running now on cable, but I find it very second-rate. Can't remember the name.
"Last of the Summer Wine" was a British show I really enjoyed, but I don't know anybody else who liked it.

"The Vicar of Wakefield" is running on both PBS and BBCCanada at the moment- a few good bits, but not a show I go out of my way to watch.

To comment on something posted earlier, randy is common in U. S. as well as UK. A very old word, 17th c.
The main differences I see are the English uses of the plural- Army are, or Chelsea are, rather than Army is (American and most Canadians), and the placement of the main stress in some polysyllabic words.

Did the "Beverly Hillbillys" show in England? If so, what was the reaction? I thought it was rather tired comedy, but so much on TV is (was).
Is "Eastenders" popular all over the UK?

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: gnu
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 04:01 PM

Wingfield. I had some great chuckles last night. Bravo TV. Two half hour shows. Wednesday. 10PM ASDT.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: meself
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 04:03 PM

Hey, but that's Canuckian. Not sure how that fits into this. But I agree, a great show.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: gnu
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 04:10 PM

How? I don't really care. It's better than most. Just a head's up for our buddies far and wide.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: CarolC
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 04:46 PM

Canadians are, of course, the funniest of all (as compared to USAns and UKs).

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Peace
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 05:19 PM

"And how do we feel about puns?"

IMO, if she has nice puns we feel about them gently . . . .

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Al
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 05:31 PM

When I watch a DVD movie with British actors, I almost always have to turn on the English subtitles to understand them.
Al

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Rowan
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 05:45 PM

Peace, I never knew you were really a New Zealander. Well, well.

Cheers, Rowan
also from the other side of the rather larger lake.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: Azizi
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 07:56 PM

Here are some comedy videos that I like:

Sinbad stand up comedy about his mother

(If you can, ignore Sinbad's 1970s or so outfit which is worth some laughs all on its own).

**

Bill Cosby---Grandparents

**
These two segments harken back to the days when storytelling-especially telling tall tales (exagerrated stories) used to be one of the main forms of entertainments.

Nowadays it seems to me that there's much less stortyelling in stand-up comedy, and comedians rely on putdowns, cursing, and raunchy jokes to get laughs.

Tommy Davidson is a contemporary comedian who can be dirty, but who also has some funny, dramatized/storytelling aspects to his stand-up acts.

Here's a link to one of his shows:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=738t_x56WBY&feature=related

**

**
Here's another comedy video I think is funny:

Eddie Murphy- James Brown/Hot Tub

**
I think that the humor (humour) in these videos transcend racial and national lines. I'm curious if you agree.

Subject: RE: BS: Separated by a common language
From: M.Ted
Date: 12 Mar 09 - 10:14 PM

Personally, I have two problems with those trans-ponders who allegedly share a language with us. First, they shoot, stab, and rob each other and say, "This is the sort of that would happen in America." Second, Benny Hill.