BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: gnu
Date: 03 May 09 - 05:21 PM

A duck winged... big penalty...... I am biting my webs....

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: gnu
Date: 03 May 09 - 05:25 PM

??? oops... what a kill.

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: gnu
Date: 03 May 09 - 05:29 PM

Wow! I swore I would not start watching until the finals, but this is amazing hockey!

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Beer
Date: 03 May 09 - 05:36 PM

Great first overtime.
ad.

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Beer
Date: 03 May 09 - 05:37 PM

I can't believe you swore. No way.
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Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: gnu
Date: 03 May 09 - 06:32 PM

The skating, the puck control, the anticipation... gosh! And, Gadzooks! Where did this guy come from? Can he rag a man or what? He's like a shadow!

Yes, Beer... I swore... and I am gonna continue... damn... I am hooked! Gonna have to accept the fact that less work is gonna get done until the Cup. I just hope I can stay away from the other matchups for a while.

And, I see the Canucks are doing okay in the world's.

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Beer
Date: 03 May 09 - 07:00 PM

We will rise again.
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Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: gnu
Date: 03 May 09 - 07:19 PM

Resurgo or not... that was an amazing game. Real hockey. Nearly no chippy. And, the penalties for chippy were minor and behind the play. Just good skating, hustle, strategy... um, has it been this good so far? I just happened to check it out.

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Michael Harrison
Date: 03 May 09 - 10:35 PM

The sun is not shining in Hockeytown South right now, but fortunately it will come up again tomorrow. OT losses on your home ice are hard to swallow, especially when the loss comes so deep in the overtime periods. Damn Ducks! GO RED WINGS - LET'S GET 'EM!

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: wysiwyg
Date: 03 May 09 - 11:26 PM

Waaaah! All THREE games on the DVR we tried to see today, the recordings ended before the GAMES did!

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Beer
Date: 04 May 09 - 06:36 AM

You know Michael it was a a hard one to loose. They had real hot goal tending. The kid was great. But Osgood made me proud as well. He made some fantastic stops and the team as a whole can hold their heads up high. I also think that they have proved that they will not be pushed over. The Avalanche have a good team but we have a great one.
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Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Beer
Date: 04 May 09 - 09:42 PM

What a finish and two Hat Tricks as well. Unreal.
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Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: wysiwyg
Date: 04 May 09 - 10:59 PM

:~(

Great game though.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Beer
Date: 04 May 09 - 11:09 PM

Sure was.

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Michael Harrison
Date: 05 May 09 - 12:04 AM

Yeah, Susan & Beer, that was as fine a game as it gets; but, I have to ask the question - are Crosby and Ovechkin the only scorers on those teams? Also, when in the third period it was tied at two apice, Ovechkin scored twice on two shots that Fleury had a clear sight line on; Kelly and I just sat there and looked at each other in disbelief. Are we on another planet? Shouldn't Fleury have had one or both of those?

Ovechkin is entertaining to watch as he often gets as excited as a child on Christmas morning. And Crosby, in that third period when he scored his hat-trick goal - his tenacity on that play where he whacked that puppy three, four or five times before it finally went in, was really on the money; great stuff.

Two questions about hat-tricks: is this the first game where two players have scored hat-tricks; and, if so, how common is it? And, I thought that hats were thrown regardless of who scored the trick, your player, or theirs; however, there was only one hat launched in honor of Crosby's third goal. You know, about the time I think that I know a little something about the game, I realize that I do know - a little,...and a little ain't much. Two more tomorrow. Cheers, and,...GO RED WINGS GO!..........................mwh

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Becca72
Date: 05 May 09 - 07:29 AM

I am a happy happy camper this morning. Let's Go Caps!

Michael, I don't think there were any hats left within throwing distance after Ovi's hat trick...

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: 3refs
Date: 05 May 09 - 07:41 AM

You don't throw your hat for a "hat-trick" that the opposing team scores. Kind of like a homerun in baseball, if the enemy hits the 4 bagger, you throw the ball back on to the field!

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: gnu
Date: 05 May 09 - 08:04 AM

Well... great time to get hooked on hockey... Wings play at 11:30PM my time. >:-(

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Beer
Date: 05 May 09 - 08:11 AM

Easy on the beer tonight if I want to see all of the Wings game.
You got it 3refs, I wouldn't throw my hat if an opposing player got 3 goals against my team.
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Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: wysiwyg
Date: 05 May 09 - 09:23 AM

1. Away hat tricks are always less hatful, but the record book is the record book.

2. We talk in terms of shoe tricks at our ECHL games-- toss shoes if the trick is an opponent's.

3. The Crosby thing. I have a lot to say there. Work with me here--

What bothers me most about Sid-worship is that it leaves a young kid without proper coaching. You cannot mold what you worship.

Specifically, Sid and his linemates. The established pattern is that potential linemates do great the first week or two, with Sid. Then their scoring drops off sharply and a schneid develops. This morning, I think I know why and how.

When they first arrive they are inspired and Sid is hopeful. They elevate their game without quite knowing how. He simplifies his. They meet in the middle. Magic happens. The coach is thrilled.

Then Sid quite naturally gets itchy to have even more fun, more magic-- he's a kid! He starts to fancy up his game. He has the talent for it, and the youth. They don't. The scoring begins to drop off.

This freaks out everyone. They all TRY HARDER.

The downward spiral accelerates-- everyone tried harder and it works less and less, as confidence plummets. Eventually that affects Sid's playing as well, and his goals vanish, too.


During the whole thing you hear the exact same things from Sid. His comments, while appearing to be reasonable and mature, are less and less accurate and relevant as this spiral descends.


How can you have a kid as the Team Captain if he cannot fathom the world of the skilled journeyman, because he has never been one?

He would need to simplify his own game, and then raise his expectations of the linemates and stop making allowances for what he must logically know is a talent gap.

He needs to be able to assess what they might actually be able to do, and then expect one level above that.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Beer
Date: 05 May 09 - 09:57 AM

I think your assessment is very good Susan. The one thing I cannot understand is why they made him Captain. I think if they had waited a few years first would have made a difference. As you say and others, he is still a kid. He also shows his emotions way to much. In a negative way. Not when he scores but when he is not playing or the team is not playing well. He was very obvious in last years match up with Detroit. If I was Washington I would go after the kid and get him really upset. I think that this would work in the Caps favor.IMHO.
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Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: wysiwyg
Date: 05 May 09 - 12:03 PM

Again, I want to emphasize-- I do not blame him for all this, but the coach, GM, and OWNER/landlord for sublimating their own hockey dreams into Sid-worship such that a really good kid is left to carry the weight he cannot, in fact, carry.

It's also not Sid who seeks the NHL-marketing spotlight, the Ovechkin rivalry, etc.

He's like a child movie star who will not quite see how this has hurt him until later.

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Michael Harrison
Date: 05 May 09 - 03:22 PM

Susan - I think we are much closer to agreement about hockey than we are apart; and, I agree with Beer - Sid should not be the captain, it would've been better to have a solid veteran wear the "C" for several reasons that have been mentioned here.

I blame "hockey" for putting Sid where he is, and by that I mean mostly Bettman. I think he was looking for an NHL version of Kobe, but for me - I don't like it. There are too many excellent players in the NHL and fans, and potential fans, need to know that there are more than one or two teams to watch for excitement.

I'll miss a lot of players here but I'll start with my guys: Datsyuk, Zetterberg, Hossa, Lidstrom; then Campbell and Taews; then Luongo; then Pronger, Getzlaf; then Thornton; then Iginla and CheeChoo, and on, and on, and on. Finally, IMHO, if the league were going to put it's success on the shoulders of one guy, I would rather see them do it with Ovechkin because he's already "out there," and personally, I think he can handle it - probably better than anyone else in the league; but again, the league should be giving away games on television and talking about how great the whole league is and not just one or two players.

Hey - time to get ready for tonight. GO RED WINGS - EAT DUCKS!
Cheers,...........................mwh

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: wysiwyg
Date: 05 May 09 - 03:34 PM

Yes, yes.

Here is one aspect of how it is so DUMB: that Versus poll, where Crosby/Ovie was said to be the most-wanted matchup? So then they market that MORE, and so of course it polls higher and then they market it some more and then it polls higher-- gimme a break!

I mean, Little Hawk proved THAT strategy with his Shatner threads. Just the constant mention created an "icon" (LH's stated goal) out of someone we mostly don't even actually WATCH.....

So I say make Shatner the poster boy for hockey! :~) Or LH-- serve him right! :~)

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Beer
Date: 05 May 09 - 04:46 PM

Lets not discuss Shatner please. I think it is on of the most ...... oh forget it.

Back to hockey.
Great observation by both of you.
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Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Beer
Date: 06 May 09 - 07:36 AM

Guess I missed a good one. Well not so good that the Wings lost I guess.
I was disappointed in the Chi./Van. game. Not as good as the previous one.
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Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: 3refs
Date: 06 May 09 - 07:36 AM

I'm not sure who might have and who might not have, but here's a cute commercial with Ovechkin and......well you'll get it!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cp1DMQ-x33k

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Becca72
Date: 06 May 09 - 07:45 AM

LOL! That was great!

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Beer
Date: 06 May 09 - 08:20 AM

That was great. Thanks for the morning laugh.
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Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Michael Harrison
Date: 06 May 09 - 04:31 PM

Well folks, again, it shows how little I know of hockey rules; I mean, if the referee blows his whistle after the puck has already gone over the goal line - why is that not a goal? I don't get it? On the other hand, the Red Wings are not playing like,...well,...the Red Wings. I am, however, comforted by the notion that you cannot wing the cup every year; but then - why not? Cheers,..........mwh

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Beer
Date: 06 May 09 - 04:44 PM

Haven't seen as yet the disputed goal. Don't know if I want to.
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Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: wysiwyg
Date: 07 May 09 - 12:01 AM

:~)

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: 3refs
Date: 07 May 09 - 08:00 AM

"Well folks, again, it shows how little I know of hockey rules; I mean, if the referee blows his whistle after the puck has already gone over the goal line - why is that not a goal? I don't get it?"

As an on-ice-official, I can answer that question!

First of all, having to make a split-second decision in the fastest game on the planet, is not as easy as it sounds! We don't skate around with our whistles in our mouths(or anywhere else). On any given play, an official must determine whether or not the whistle should be blown. Then they have to put the whistle in their mouth without chipping a tooth(happened to me). Finally blowing the whistle and make the right signal(wave off frantically)!

In this case, the referee has lost sight of the puck and has made the decision to blow his whistle for that reason.

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: 3refs
Date: 07 May 09 - 08:01 AM

ps
Go Vancouver!

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: wysiwyg
Date: 07 May 09 - 09:09 AM

Yer an ice official!?!?!?!?!? (What league?) Kewl! (No "you-suck-ref" talk HERE please folks.) Can we have a hockey-questions thread after it's all over for the season? if I collect Q's out of some of the older threads?

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: gnu
Date: 07 May 09 - 01:31 PM

So... should I watch the Canucks Hawks tonight? Can't stay up to watch the Ducks Wings (11:30 start again).

So, what do you think the new team in Halifax should be called? I say The Halifax Privateers will be the name that wins, if they have a contest, if they get a team.

And, where will The Coyotes go (without The Great One)? Winnipeg, I should think. I heard rumour of London, but, three teams in SO?

There is talk about town that Moncton would be a great location for a CFL or NHL team, but I doubt it. Maybe a CFL team... maybe... nah. People yap it up because of the crowds we get for concerts like The Stones, ACDC, Bon Jovi, Elton John... But those are oneoffs. Not gonna draw a regular crowd big enough for the CFL or NHL.

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Beer
Date: 08 May 09 - 06:17 AM

Oh!, that is nice to wake up to. A Red Wing win.
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Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: 3refs
Date: 08 May 09 - 09:14 AM

Yep, I's a referee! Senior On-Ice-Official with Hockey Canada! So are my two sons, with my oldest being a higher ranking official than his Dad!

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: wysiwyg
Date: 08 May 09 - 10:28 AM

Good, SOMEbuddy gotta keep you guys honest!

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: wysiwyg
Date: 08 May 09 - 11:33 AM

threefer,

OK, here are a couple of older threads that focused specifically on questions. Can you take a look (and answer there not here) anything that warn't covered right?

BS: Hockey - Plus and Minus?

BS: NHL: help on hockey stick rules


There MIGHT have been some questions in other hockey threads, but we have been running one each year for the regular season (that gets really long), and then one for the playoffs. I don't have time today to go comb through the older ones and I would not dream of imposing on your time to ask you to do it and then, on top of that, answer them.

In general, I think it would be best to keep questions in other threads, and keep this one for Cup-talk.

Anyway-- only answer what you feel comfortable tackling. This should still be a place of recreation for you, and not a place to answer for every hockey policy people like to argue over.


Thanks! I think I can see now why you might have appreciated the reduction in trash talk-- I am sure I know what you more usually hear through the glass-- but gosh, doesn't that leave you with no place to express it yourself?!?!?! (PM trash anytime, any team, mine several included.)

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: gnu
Date: 08 May 09 - 12:34 PM

Da rules are da rules. What kind of rules? Dey are rules. A rule is a rule, and when you have a good rule, it's because it's a rule.

With apologies to Jean Chretien... kinda eh?

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: wysiwyg
Date: 08 May 09 - 01:22 PM

Yabbut we have had a number of Q's from peeps who did not wade thru the long and hard-to-find NHL RuleBook. Also whatcha see on ice don;t allus match up with da woids.

And, lotta new hockey folx these days, Crosby hype, eh?

~S~

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: gnu
Date: 08 May 09 - 02:35 PM

Cool. I guess I just grew up with it so I know the rules. Of course, this is playoff time, so the rules can actually ebb and flow a bit. Up to the Refs. And, DEFINITELY not an easy job to "feel" the situation... let em play or call everything? Tough stuff.

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: gnu
Date: 08 May 09 - 04:00 PM

Now... THERE is a question for the man!

Do you Cherry and "let them play"? Do you Bing and call everything? Do you... what do you do?

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: Michael Harrison
Date: 09 May 09 - 01:16 AM

I think it would be GREAT to have a permanent hockey "question and answer, discussion" thread that would be separate from the "regular season" and "cup" threads. Having said that, I just don't have time for it now because the Red Wings won last nite in fine fashion; and, since they (NBC nor Versus) are not to be televising Game 5 of the Red Wings game on Sunday (well, not down in Hockeytown South, anyway)
I've got to spend all my time finding a satellite bar that will be showing the game; or, just going nuts until Sunday when I can go on line and scramble to find a streaming video broadcast or a radio station that is carrying the game. Life is tough for hockey fans.
GO RED WINGS.........GO RED WINGS.........GO RED WINGS,.......mwh

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: gnu
Date: 09 May 09 - 06:58 AM

I gotta stop going to nhl.com early in the morning. This morning, I read that one series is tied at 2 to 1 after the last game in which the score was 7 to 5 in the first OT. Methinks the admins are enjoying too many brown pops whilst watching the games. Oh... next game in that series is scheduled for last night.

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: gnu
Date: 09 May 09 - 12:44 PM

I watched the Ducks Wings t'other night. Great hockey! Real hockey.... skating, strategy, finesse... like I said, some chippy but it was minor and behind the play.

Last night I watched the Penguins Caps... thuggery, penalties, chippy crap over and over... I mean, cross checking a guy trying to get up off the ice in front of the net when the puck is 30' away?? And, no penalty??? Does anyone else find such offensive?

I know I asked about the Bing Cherry thing, but the officiating and the play and the coaching I saw last night were ludicrous to me. It was a waste of my time to watch it. Piss poor!

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: wysiwyg
Date: 09 May 09 - 02:10 PM

The Bing comment was actually a tasty treat here, gnu, but may I say somehting else.... and yes I saw a lotta crap last night, hard to sort out.... I responded to your no-nhl-mornings idea below, myself, by going over to Hockey Canada's website to see just what 3refs' frame of reference is.... I came to the conclusion that it's important we remember that 3refs is a hockey pal, here at Mudcat hockey threads, first and foremost, and I hope we can all agree that he's not responsible for NHL decision-making, policies, etc.... we need to be sure we do not put a fellow hockey-pal in an awkward situation.

This may be one of few places where a ref in any league can just "be," eh, and there may be some questions he might not address.

~Susan

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: gnu
Date: 09 May 09 - 03:50 PM

Agreed.... hey... everyone is human. BUT, it still pisses me off that cross checking a man in the short ribs while he is on the ice in plain view of a ref is not called. Matter of fact, if I had been reffing, there would have been a double penalty with interference added. And that was not the only incident... on both sides.

Sorry for the rant, but, I'm just sayin.... PLAY hockey!

Sigh... Canucks play at 11:30PM my time tonight.

Subject: RE: BS: Hockey: Stanley Cup 2009 (08-09 Season)
From: wysiwyg
Date: 09 May 09 - 04:05 PM

Yes, I know.... I like to try to keep in mind that the league reviews it ALL. It's not just up to the refs on the ice. At the War Room they can add their own little opportunities for justice. Sometimes we even get to hear about them.

One example-- take the Ovechkin/Gonchar knee hit. If OvieWanGoalobie had hit Gonchar's healing shoulder, that would have been one clear intent to injure. If he had done a hit like he did on either of the D-men assigned to impede his availability to receive passes, same conclusion. From one camera angle of what he did, same conclusion.

From another angle.... uh.... I love my Pens, but I have to admit it was too fast, at that angle, even with slo-mo (over and over), to be sure.... and I dunno what the refs' angles of view were, or what each ref's eyes were actualy looking at in that instant.....

The mind boggles. So I have to say that using the camera to support or overturn the on-ice officials' view seems, to me, the only practical way to go about it.


After an hour of intermission-time, I came to think that the best league decision would be a stiff fine to Ovechkin (and maybe the coach) with a strongly-crafted and legally-delivered warning. He IS a marquee player. Is any league REALLY going to rush to totally change the marketing imnage of a marquee player, with a hasty decision?

Could a ref have been unsure what to do? Might cooler heads prevail after a morning meeting wrestling with it? I look forward to updates-- and another game, tonight.


Try it this way-- can you really see fans understanding how, overnight, Alexander Ovechkin becomes Sean Avery?


That's just ONE of a million or more "moments" the on-ice officials had to address. I would not want their job for ANY money. And without their willingness to attempt the job, we would not have our beloved sport to enjoy.

Checks and balances are a bitch, eh.

~S~