BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor

Subject: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Emma B
Date: 08 Aug 09 - 04:14 PM

"If you want to have a thread about an event like a BNP protest, start a thread about the protest and then talk about it."

Thanks Joe.

Just a week to go, any up to date information about meeting points/ time etc?

Good to hear time being given to Joanie and the organization on the main BBC radio night time news programme.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Folkiedave
Date: 08 Aug 09 - 05:10 PM

Indeed I thought they all came over very well.

It is planned to start at 09:00 on 15 August 2009 at Codnor, Derbyshire. Coaches leave Sheffield at 7.30 AM!!

I may go down by car having another priority that day.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Emma B
Date: 08 Aug 09 - 05:33 PM

According to the Facebook group 'Converge on Codnor' this years guests of the BNP are likely to include representatives of Jobbik, 'a violently racist Hungarian Nazi party that organises pogroms against Roma people.'

Apart from their use of the term 'gipsy crime' to refer to criminal acts committed by members of the Romani community (which is usually seen to be caused by prevalence of poor economic status among that group) the movement has, according to Wiki, also been accused of playing on antisemitic fears.

Krisztina Morvai, one of the party's successful candidates in the 2009 elections to the European parliament, has written in a message to Hungarian Jews posted on an online forum "I would be glad if the so-called proud Hungarian Jews would go back to playing with their tiny circumcised dicks rather than vilifying me."

Morvai did not deny that she wrote the message, but declined to comment further.

The paramilitary Hungarian Guard (full name Hungarian Guard Association for Protection of Traditions and Culture) are backed by and developed out of Jobbik
Their uniform is composed of black boots, black trousers with white shirt and black vest with the shape of a lion on its back and a coat of arms on the front.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 08 Aug 09 - 05:36 PM

Radio 4 Story Here

Official Launch of FaF at Sidmouth "Eliza & Friends": Sidmouth YouTube

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 08 Aug 09 - 05:43 PM

Radio Prog. Here

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Emma B
Date: 08 Aug 09 - 06:00 PM

I was concerned as I had read on another forum that the police had invoked the Public Order Act and put a limit on the locations of protesters and restricted them to 700!

It seems, from the publicity and number of coaches organized so far, that the number is likely to exceed this.

One trades council in London donated £500 to fund transport to Codnor and Manchester UAF activists are contacting people who came to the recent UAF national conference in the city, anti-war and faith groups, and students.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Paul Burke
Date: 08 Aug 09 - 06:57 PM

I'm happy if they limit the numbers... as long as the number of Twatzies is limited too..

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Emma B
Date: 08 Aug 09 - 10:09 PM

"Derbyshire Constabulary is warning of potential disruption over the weekend due to planned protests taking place against an event organised by the British National Party.

A number of groups will be meeting at Codnor Market Place on Saturday morning August 16th 2008 to protest against the BNP's Red, White and Blue Event in nearby Codnor Denby Lane on Friday, Saturday and Sunday.

A protest march will be held at around 11:45am on Saturday and a maximum of 700 people can be accommodated on the Market Place.

A significant policing operation is being put in place over the weekend in the area

......we have seen it necessary to bring in a number of conditions on the protest using the Public Order Act to stipulate designated points of assembly and protest, times of protest and numbers involved.

"For those involved in the procession and protests we would ask them to follow instructions of police officers in relation to orders that are in place. We will warn people if we feel they are breaking the orders and after that we may be liable to arrest."

Section 12 of the Public Order Act 1986 has been used to impose conditions on the public procession, which will take place between Codnor Market Place and Codnor Denby Lane.

Section 14 of the act has been used to provide a designated protest point for legitimate and peaceful protest for up to 30 people between 1pm and 4pm adjacent to the site of the event.

Section 14 of the act has also been utilised to identify Codnor Market Place as a designated area for public assembly prior to and following the procession between 9am and 5pm for a maximum of 700 people.

All the orders run from 9am Friday August 15th to 4pm Sunday August 17th 2008. Anyone not abiding by the legislation may be liable to arrest."

- From Derbyshire Constabulary web site 9th August

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 09 Aug 09 - 03:52 PM

Weren't the Derbyshire police amongst the worst during the miner's strike?

When do they equally protect others from the invasion and threats by the British Nazi Party?

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 09 Aug 09 - 03:55 PM

PS - moral: teaser public website. Details, login etc, on a secure site with verified names and addresses only, for access, and planned methods for outing plod if they try to join.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: GUEST,spb-cooperator - my cookie is down
Date: 09 Aug 09 - 04:33 PM

it may be useful to raise objections to the BNP gathering.

Contact is PC Stokoe - column no 2744 - via Derbyshire Constabulary. 0345 123 3333.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: SPB-Cooperator
Date: 09 Aug 09 - 04:48 PM

the last post was me - honest

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Paul Burke
Date: 09 Aug 09 - 05:36 PM

We're missing a trick, I think. Look at the way THEY organise, it's quite clever. There was a recent march in Birmingham ("not organised by the twatzies") against "Muslim fundamentalism". Who could be against that? When violence breaks out, how easy to throw up your hands in horror? Nuffin to do wiv us guv.

Codnor is just down the road from Pentrich, where there was an attempt to take on an unjust state almost 200 years ago. Their image of how to make a protest led them to take up arms and march, military style, towards Nottingham. Their march took them through Codnor, to their alnmost inevitable dispersion by a handful of militiamen. A few were hanged, a number more transported. Bill Prince wrote a good song about them.

What I'm trying to say is that direct confrontation may not be the best way of combatting the lethal junction of determined pathological hatred and wounded resentful ignorance that is the hatemongers' recruiting ground. Their prey- in Codnor, Langley Mill, Eastwood, Ripley- are the abandoned ordinary folk of this benighted country. They were communities badly wounded by the Miners' Strike- the area was on the border of the Nottinghamshire coalfield which were Thatcher's patsies. The "immigrant" population is vanishingly low- neither West Indians, Asians nor Eastern Europeans settled there in any numbers. They were solid Labour heartland- until the likes of Blair and Mandelson showed them they weren't needed anymore. The slide to the BNP (they have elected several BNP local councillors) is a move of simple desperation.

The road to the defeat of the BNP is going to be a long one, and isn't going to be greatly helped by quixotism. Those who are doing the hard work of trying to organise a real opposition in Britain, who are trying to show that the interests of ordinary people, whether Ancient British, Saxon, Celt, Asian, African, Eastern European, or whatever, are identical compared with the interests of the bonus guzzlers, the Lords of the Universe, the armsmongers, the oil barons,
and their toyboys and celob (stet) arselickers.

So I'm a bit unsure about the value of a demo. If we could get an Afro- Asian Morris side along now....

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Smokey.
Date: 09 Aug 09 - 07:59 PM

Weren't the Derbyshire police amongst the worst during the miner's strike?

Most emphatically not; the 'imported' police from the south with whom they augmented the local force were the ones. They also removed the numbers from their uniforms while they were here, which speaks for itself. There were rumours that they were actually troops dressed as police, but I'm not so sure about that. The local police were, by and large, sympathetic to the miners' cause as it was virtually impossible around here for anyone not to be either related to, be acquainted with, or live close to miners. It was hushed up, but one night at our local nick there was an almighty punch-up between the local coppers and the 'imports' which kept the A&E dept. busy all night. Believe me, you had to be on the doorstep to ever hear anything like the real truth about the miners' strike.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Peace
Date: 09 Aug 09 - 09:47 PM

My grandfather was a coal miner in England, but I never did hear from him anything about miners' strikes. Of course, this was back in the late 1890s and very early 1900s. He allowed me to follow the Springhill Mine Disaster on radio (both the 1956 and 1958 disasters). I have 'never wanted to go down under the ground' since then, but I have the greatest respect for those that do.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Peace
Date: 09 Aug 09 - 09:48 PM

Regarding the Codnor FaF: please someone say a small prayer for my grandfather. I am sure he'd be there with you or at least will be in spirit.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 09 Aug 09 - 09:49 PM

Thank you Smokey that is interesting.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Smokey.
Date: 09 Aug 09 - 10:49 PM

I was lucky - I never had to work down the pit, but I've huge respect for those who did. They were portrayed as greedy by the media, but the silly buggers spouting such propaganda wouldn't have lasted two minutes faced with the reality of the job. You're right to be proud of your grandad, Peace; miners and farmers were the lifeblood of this country. Perhaps I'm being naive, but it worries me that no-one seems to be actually producing stuff any more, and most of the money they're spending isn't actually real.. How long can that carry on? I think it's the effect of losing all the industry that has given rise to the apparent concentration of right-wing twattism around Codnor though. Once upon a time, people knew who and what they were; now they're all doing what I call non-jobs which provide them with no real sense of worth or identity. That psychological gap has to be filled somehow. Not that I'm defending them - line up the BNP and I'd happily pull the trigger. Even pacifists need a day off now and again. :-)

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Peace
Date: 09 Aug 09 - 11:45 PM

Thanks, Smokey. Indeed miners and farmers and others: lumberjacks, open pit miners, truckers, railroad people: here THEY built the place. Even today Canada has a few farms or ranches that are pretty big. The Douglas Ranch for example has about 800 square miles of territory.

"With 500,000 acres in the Thompson Nicola region of British Columbia, Douglas Lake Ranch is Canada's largest working cattle ranch. It's a short four hour drive (320 Km or 192 miles) northeast of Vancouver."

Some Saskatchewan farms are HUGE.

64,903,830 acres of Saskatchewan are under cultivation: wheat, barley, rye, corn (maize), oats, canola, lentils, etc.

The town I live in depends quite a bit on a pulp and paper mill, lumber mill, some coal mines and the timber industry. Oil was going great until about five months back. It's a shame that so many people lost jobs. They have families to feed or otherwise look out for. I hear you and agree. These people are the backbone of this place.

As a btw, I have never taken note of skin colours or religions, even languages. That just isn't the way people should be judged.

As for my grandfather, he died in 1960. I have missed him a great deal for most of my life. A one-in-a-million kinda guy. Thank you very much for your kind words, Smokey.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Penny S.
Date: 10 Aug 09 - 04:04 AM

Someone of my family went to Sasketchewan - when a cousin died we found a photograph of a family in front of a wooden farmhouse at the turn of the last century, but there was no information about who it was, and it has now disappeared. What impressed about it was the smallness of the farm and the family, and the hugeness of the flat landscape. It was so different from the Sussex hills they had left behind them.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Emma B
Date: 10 Aug 09 - 08:53 AM

After reading further about the police actions last year when the number of people expected was far less than the likely numbers this year I decided against trying to travel by private car.

One phone call from this useful list has meant I now have a coach seat :)

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 12 Aug 09 - 05:25 AM

Refresh. With only four days to go.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: GUEST,livication
Date: 13 Aug 09 - 11:36 AM

we need to get close to alan warner's land and make them fully aware of our presence. a peaceful protest will mean more of their meetings will be allowed.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Fred McCormick
Date: 13 Aug 09 - 12:06 PM

I strongly suspect that livication is a troll attempting to stir things. Since the camp is on private land, I doubt they need the permission of anyone to hold it. And the BNP would just love a load of trouble from our end. They would revel in it. It would be playing right into their hands.

What's more, if you go into Google Maps and look for Codnor Denby Lane, Ripley, Derbyshire DE5, you will see that the only access to the farm is down an easily blockable narrow lane and the police are not going to let anyone near it.

However, a peacful protest in Codnor will help to alert the country to the danger of the BNP. It will also confine the BNP to the site for the duration of the protest. What's more some of their members will be staying bed and breakfast in the area, while others will be going down just for the day, and still others will be looking to eat out in Codnor or Ripley. Therefore, by using sensible tactics we stand to cause the BNP a major inconvenience.

On the other hand a non-peaceful protest will simply alienate people. Turn this thing into a punch up and the good folk of Codnor will simply end up wondering what the difference is between the BNP and us.

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Jamming With Ollie Beak (inactive)
Date: 13 Aug 09 - 02:03 PM

"On the other hand a non-peaceful protest will simply alienate people"
- Fred McCormick

In as much as most of us (come ON admit it!*LOL*) would love to punch a BNPer on the nose, that direction is definitely a non-starter, as Fred and others have pointed out, on related threads, the folk of Codnor, and, indeed, anywhere else, will simply end up wondering what the difference is between the BNP and us.

Mr GUEST,livication, or whatever name you're using this hour, if you wish to engage in fisti-cuffs with any of the BNP membership in attendance, feel free to do so, but please remember that you're on your own and do not have the backing the FaF or any other reputable anti-fascist organisation.

Stand and Be Counted!

Olivia Beak (Ms)

Subject: RE: BS: Folk against Fascism @ Codnor
From: Emma B
Date: 13 Aug 09 - 08:18 PM

Our 'power' is in numbers NOT in punches!
See you there
'Em'