BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source

Subject: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Penny S.
Date: 12 Nov 09 - 12:16 PM

There is what appears to be a military badge stuck on the window of my new home. It is surmounted by a crown, with a cross hanging below it, is circular, with an eagle outstretched, crossing th4e circle. It has a Latin motto, which, from memory, is PARVUM NUMERO MAGNUM ACTIVO, and a scroll below the circle and above the cross with two words I did not recognise but which appear to be German.

Google has thrown up nothing but Cicero and Aquinas. Any ideas?

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: theleveller
Date: 12 Nov 09 - 12:20 PM

Literally: Small numbers big action.

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: SINSULL
Date: 12 Nov 09 - 01:22 PM

Maybe a family coat of arms. Similar to Prussian Order of the Red Eagle:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Order_of_the_Red_Eagle

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Rapparee
Date: 12 Nov 09 - 04:41 PM

What sort of crown? One of the circlet sort? Or one with arches meeting in the middle? If it is a circlet, is it above the cross or hanging on it?

Bleeding heraldry....

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 12 Nov 09 - 08:50 PM

Could also be a Catholic or other religious group.

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Rapparee
Date: 12 Nov 09 - 08:54 PM

That's what I'm a-thinkin'. I've cleared Opus Dei, if that helps set your mind at ease.

If the crown is a circlet ON the cross, it probably is a religious group. Could be a lay order or an order of nuns.

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Acorn4
Date: 13 Nov 09 - 04:08 AM

Could it be saying:-

"Too many cooks spoil the broth" ?

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Bryn Pugh
Date: 13 Nov 09 - 04:15 AM

In faecam aeternam summus : soli profundi variat.

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: GUEST,Lighter
Date: 13 Nov 09 - 01:03 PM

"Few in Number, Great in Effect"?

"Activo" looks wrong, at least by Classical standards. Are you sure this is the spelling?

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: GUEST,Helen, cookieless
Date: 13 Nov 09 - 03:28 PM

That's funny, Bryn!

Lighter, that's what I thought, too. It's a long long time since I studied Latin, but is it perhaps "I achieve action" or "I activate"?

My Latin dictionary is packed away, and Google didn't show me anything on the words "activo" or "activare". I'm assuming it would be "activare" as we have the English word "activate".

But then again, mottos etc are notorious for using ungrammatical Latin, because people make them up but may not have a good understanding of Latin. Or the Latin has evolved in usage over the centuries in situations such as the Roman Catholic church, which was still using Latin for Mass until relatively recently, so the Latin language has probably evolved even though it is considered to be a dead language.

Helen

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Jim Dixon
Date: 13 Nov 09 - 04:00 PM

Whether it's grammatical or not, if it was used as a motto by a famous person or organization, you would expect to find it somewhere on the Internet or in Google Books. See this search for "subject:Mottoes" for a list of searchable books in this category.

I found nothing even close to "Parvum Numero Magnum Activo."

Penny S mentioned that she posted the motto "from memory." I hope she checks again and comes back with a report.

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: GUEST,Lighter
Date: 13 Nov 09 - 05:26 PM

Helen, I find no verb "activo." I'd be surprised if any first-person singular verb would make sense there since the phrase should parallel "few in number." That seems to exclude anything complementary with "I" for a subject.

But we'll have to see.

Mad Magazine once translated their motto "What, me worry?" into Latin as "Quid, me anxius sum?" This is (very) subtly hilarious because whether or not a Latin subjunctive is necessary (I think it is), the thoroughly ungrammatical Latin "me" is substituted for the prescribed "ego" to give a feeling of illiteracy resembling that in the English.

Isn't that, like, a riot?

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Penny S.
Date: 14 Nov 09 - 03:13 AM

Lighter, that translation is what I thought, and writing it after driving home meant I was remembering the Latin through that filter, hence lack of grammar - which I was bothered about. It did seem to me that it was the sort of motto which would go with a group like Commandos, or the Paras. This visit I will take paper - though I'm not sure today is a day for leaning out of a high window.

It was an arched crown. Like the King symbol in chess.

And if anyone has an idea about how to scrape it off, I'd be grateful. I'm a pacifist!

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Penny S.
Date: 14 Nov 09 - 03:33 AM

It is similar to the RAF badge, but the eagle is facing its right instead of its left, and is a more natural looking bird. Its wings reach outside the circle. The crown is similar. The motto is in a plain sanserif typeface.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Penny S.
Date: 14 Nov 09 - 03:36 AM

And "activo" did show up in several Latin texts in google - some of which appeared to hail from the Vatican quite recently.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Penny S.
Date: 14 Nov 09 - 03:40 AM

The cross was portrayed as if hanging from the badge like a medal. It had equal arms.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Paul Burke
Date: 14 Nov 09 - 03:50 AM

A few people have great assets.

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Penny S.
Date: 14 Nov 09 - 08:52 AM

I've found it.

The ill remembered Latin was actually Parvus Numero, Magnus Merito.

The crest, with an RAF-like eagle facing the other way, is surmounted by an arched crown with five visible supports, unlike the three of the RAF.

I read the Germanic scroll as Koninkluke Luchtmacht, but it was actually Koninklijke, which is a giveaway, or would be if I had worked it out before googling the rest.

It's the Royal Netherlands Air Force, small in number but great in merit.

They have an eight pointed cross beneath another crown as a medal hanging from the crest by a ribbon and bar.

Pity I didn't write the thing down accurately at first.

I did not buy the house from anyone from the Netherlands, so its history is a mystery.

And it will come off with a razorblade.

Thanks for the interesting discussion.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: Penny S.
Date: 14 Nov 09 - 09:05 AM

And motto in Dutch is wapenspreuk, which I rather like.

Penny

Subject: RE: BS: Linguam Latinam: translation and source
From: GUEST,Lighter
Date: 14 Nov 09 - 09:30 AM

Ah! "Merito" makes perfect sense!

"In Number Few, In Merit Great."