BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009

Subject: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Wesley S
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 05:10 PM

At the risk of giving the religion bashers here more fuel for the fire - here's the Obit on Oral Roberts. Certainly an influential man - even if you disagreed with his viewpoint.

MSNBC Story

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Bill H //\\
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 05:16 PM

They were not able to play recordings at his ministries since whenever he touched the records the holes healed.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Sandy Mc Lean
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 05:35 PM

Well I hope not to be a religion basher, but I never believed that he was anything more than a fake. He lived a long life and if he was sincere in his belief perhaps he is in Heaven. However in my opinion Heaven is no richer!

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 05:40 PM

This is another instance of being reminded of my own progressive ageing (progress in ageing?). The last time I heard of Roberts I was young- and now I find that he was 91 when he died. And I am 74. Where do de time go?

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: GUEST,bankley
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 05:45 PM

put your hand on the television screen and feel the POWER...

I always thought Oral was an unusual name, but I suppose it's better than Anal

RIP

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Amergin
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 05:53 PM

Yeah but Anal Roberts would have been closer to the truth....

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 06:00 PM

anal roberts hahhahah

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: mmm1a
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 06:09 PM

I guess He was telling the truth when He said that if everyone didn't send 'I forget the exact amount' but it was millions' that God said He would die ................

Sorry Had absolutely no respect for the guy

         mmm1a

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: gnu
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 06:11 PM

Wait.... PI jokes are now acceptable? Just after I swore I would try my best to refrain for fear of being torn a new asshole by.... well, you know.

No... I ain't gonna. It's all just a ruse.

I know if I post sommat like that Oral Robber got a lot of money from gullible folks that shit would rain down upon me.

Let it rain.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: JennieG
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 06:14 PM

I can remember his bible-bashing radio program was on the radio when I was a child, it must have been syndicated to Oz.

Cheers
JennieG

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: frogprince
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 06:22 PM

When I was a kid, we saw a little of him on TV, with the hand-on-head routine, hollering "heal" as if assuming God was deaf. Don't know why we even saw that much of him; my folks were devout Christians, but they didn't buy that stuff. The last I really heard of him was sometime in the '80's, when he announced that God had told him that he (Oral, not God) would die if people didn't send in a certain number of millions to his "ministries". Somewhere along then he saw Jesus standing 900 feet tall over Tulsa. I'm not certain that he was the very first popular televangelist, but to the best of my knowledge he would have been. I have yet to see one who impressed me as anything close to a worthy representative of Christianity.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 06:30 PM

I don't bash religion. I bash idiocy and hypocrisy. Oral Roberts was a hypocrite and anyone who followed him is an idiot.

I sincerely hope that if some of those followers still feel the need for spiritual guidance, they turn to a more enlightened source.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Amos
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 06:55 PM

We have a dozen second hand ones around here we could sell them cheap, and fund the 'Cats next server in the process!!!


A

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 06:59 PM

hahhah I must be easily amused this afternoon (I did just get over a bad cold that laid me low for a week.) but this is a funny line: "...hollering "heal" as if assuming God was deaf".

Reminds me of reading, some years back, an account of the 'great earthquake' in Alaska. This couple was thrown to the ground and as the earth heaved up and down under them sometimes they looked down on the cabin and sometimes they looked up, the woman started to pray aloud. Her husband shouter into her ear: Louder! Louder!

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: olddude
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 07:08 PM

But at least he did heal Art Thieme's dog Blue when Art mistakenly cut him in half with a haying knife !! So I think Art really believe his healing power !! (by the way, the dog did turn out upside down however) but you can ask Art to tell it.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Art Thieme
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 08:55 PM

In the days of thirty-three and a third record albums, we had an Oral Roberts record.

But the hole kept healing up!!!!!!!!



(We never did hear it.)

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 09:01 PM

So, Art, what is the story about Old Blue?

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 09:06 PM

If one prays loudly, one obviously does it to strengthen one's own emotional commitment TO the prayer...not so that God can hear it.... How silly can you get as to think someone else would think it's so God can hear it?

And too... one does it to greatly impress the human audience, of course.

I figure that Mr Roberts did it mostly for the latter purpose, but I can't say for sure, because I don't have a window into his soul. Maybe he fully believed in his own prayers. If so, he would speak louder as he got more emotionally intense. That's normal. So it could have been "for real" or it could just have been showmanship or it could have been both.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 09:07 PM

Well, I recall Oral going before his people on TV tellin' them that he had a dream where a 600 foot tall Jesus appeared and told him that if his people didn't send in a bunch of money that this 600 foot Jesus was gonna come get him...

Guess the fundraisin' musta fallen off of late...

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 09:10 PM

That would be a mighty impressive sight... ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Bobert
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 09:13 PM

What, LH??? No 600 foot Jesuses in yer dreams???

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: frogprince
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 09:24 PM

"How silly can you get as to think someone else would think it's so God can hear it?"

Sheesh, L.H.; did you think that was what I was literally implying?
The praying was pointlessly, annoyingly loud, because Roberts was wound up like a spring, or wanted to get the audience wound up like a bunch of springs, or both.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Art Thieme
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 09:29 PM

Above the line I have refreshed the thread called A LITTLE VINTAGE ART THIEME so, you who want to, may listen to the track from my first LP with the OLD BLUE-Split Dog Tale in tandem.

Art

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Ebbie
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 09:34 PM

I don't know if I can bear it, Art. Tell me the dog survives? :)

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: catspaw49
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 09:37 PM

Aw geez Art.......I'd completely forgotten that healed hole joke. There was another healed hole of a sexual nature as I recall as well.......

Spaw

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 09:41 PM

No, frogprince, I did not think you were literally implying it. But I thought you might be implying that some religious people are stupid enough to believe that God will hear a prayer better if you holler it louder...

I think you have it right. He was either wound up like a spring...or he wanted to wing up his audiences...or both.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 09:45 PM

wind up

not wing up

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Don Firth
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 10:56 PM

Healing hands can be a mixed blessing and shouldn't be used casually.

Nothing sexual intended, of course, but Oral Roberts once gave a acquaintance a friendly pat on the butt. The acquaintance became horribly constipated and required emergency surgery. . . .

Don Firth

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Bee-dubya-ell
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 11:03 PM

I was going to post an exerpt from a song I wrote back in 1987. There are some lines I had the song's main character say about Oral Roberts. But rather than explain the context for the exerpt, I thought I'd just post the whole damned song.

Bear in mind that this was written a while back and some of the lines are of a "short shelf life" nature. If I were to sing it today for any audience other than a bunch of old farts, half the audience wouldn't get those lines.

It was done as a talking blues. Not really a melody to it. Just talkin' over some simple guitar chords

.....................................

It was early in nineteen eighty-seven
When Jesus of Nazareth came down from Heaven
And there weren't any claps of thunder or flashin' lights
He just appeared by the side of Interstate Ten,
When who should arrive but me in my van
And he just jumped in the back and we drove off into the night

Well, he told me who he was and, yeah, I had some doubts
But he said he'd just come back just to check things out
Seems he'd been gone someplace near about two thousand years
He said things were a mess when he'd been here before
And that he'd tried to show us folks the way to the door
But he'd had to go away before any of us ever got there

Well, I asked him if he had a place to stay for the night
He said "No," and it just didn't seem right
To leave such a nice fellow on the road out near Cantonment*
So I asked him if he'd like to stay a few days
Hell, I had an extra room I wasn't usin' anyways
And he wasn't no fool, he took that deal up in a moment

Well, I had to be to work about six the next day
So I told my new friend that while I was away
He could do anything that he wanted, just make himself at home
And when I got in about half past three
He said he'd spent the whole day watchin' cable TV
And callin' up television evangelists on the phone

He said, "Boy have they ever turned things around
They've made left into right and made up into down
And they've made everything I ever said seem to suit their needs
Why, they even tell you they're gonna save your soul
If you add enough money to their bankroll
I think all they really believe in is power and greed

Now you take this fellow Bakker, he's a liar and a thief
And his buddy Jimmy Swaggart's a perverted little creep
And there's some fool named Robertson runnin' for President
And ol' Brother Oral Roberts says if you don't send your pay
He's gonna die and go to Heaven and he's leavin' right away
If that sonovabitch gets to Heaven I'm gonna move out and live in a tent

And even the ones who are sincere in what they say
Seem to have it all mucked up somehow anyway
Boy, someone musta took a wrong turn a long time ago
Seems like they're so bogged down in the words from a book
That they won't take the time to just sit up and look
At what's goin' on inside themselves, if they'd just let it grow."

He said, "Son, when I was down here before with you all
I just put up a sign pointin' the way, that was all
And it makes me so mad I could just about explode
They done polished the signpost so doggone bright
That you can see that sucker shinin' in the middle of the night
But nobody's doin' any travelin' doen the road"

And then he said it was time for him to go
I asked him if he'd stay, but he just said "No."
Said he couldn' t help this time, he'd done all he could years before
And then he said, "Thank you very much my friend
You can rest assured that we'll meet again."
Then he turned around and he walked on out the door

Well, it's been a few years now since my friend went home
I guess he was really always here so he's never really gone
And I sure don't know any answers, I'm just a fool tryin' to find 'em
But maybe one day the people on this lonely ball of stone
Might get smart enough to figure out for themselves what's goin' on
Instead of needin' somebody like Jesus to come 'round and remind 'em


*Cantonment is a town near Pensacola. It's a line that got a lot of laughs from locals but makes no sense to anyone else. It rhymed with "moment". What can I say?

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Janie
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 11:10 PM

I dunno, LH, he may have also believed he was giving them a "wing up." He may have thought that separating people from their money was teaching them important spiritual lessons. He pretty obviously came to believe in the myth of himself - but that can be said for a lot of public personalities. It is entirely possible to be a religious zealot and an egomaniac.

Be that as it may, I am certain there are many good people who are grieving his passing.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Little Hawk
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 11:18 PM

Yes, Janie. "Wing up" may indeed have actually fit the scenario in a certain sense. ;-)

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Janie
Date: 15 Dec 09 - 11:52 PM

*grin*

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Amos
Date: 16 Dec 09 - 02:32 AM

I really like BWK's song. Bu IMHO, self-deluded or not, OR was a two-faced sonofabitch who messed with Infinity in a most self-serving way, a treacherous move for anone.


A

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Little Hawk
Date: 16 Dec 09 - 08:54 AM

Any move made by anone is a treacherous move. You can't trust anone these days.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Mrrzy
Date: 16 Dec 09 - 09:00 AM

heh heh heh

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Bobert
Date: 16 Dec 09 - 09:12 AM

Evangical with one "wing up" flies in circles...

Nevermind...

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Little Hawk
Date: 16 Dec 09 - 09:41 AM

As a matter of fact, most evangelicals don't even have a left wing...

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Wesley S
Date: 16 Dec 09 - 12:47 PM

Here's Oral talking about the one place in a womans body that creates "multiplication".


From Orals own mouth

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Ebbie
Date: 16 Dec 09 - 01:15 PM

"multiplacation"? hahhahah

How anyone could sit still for that 'sex talk' from that demented and perverse old man is beyond me. I couldn't even watch the whole thing.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Art Thieme
Date: 16 Dec 09 - 01:25 PM

No arguing with those who liked this man.

Thay are Oral Retentive !!

Art

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: olddude
Date: 16 Dec 09 - 01:31 PM

You folks know my faith, and frankly I just could not ever handle the guy in any form. Two things that disturb me the most, those who prey on the faith of others for their own selfish gain by using the Gospel for greed and/or power, and those who prey on the illness of others for their own greed and/or power. He had both going for him IMO. I shouldn't say such things it isn't right, and I don't like myself much when I do get angry and say such things... It is one of my faults, but it is what it is. I have seen an elderly neighbour give her much needed SS money to him over and over again.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: frogprince
Date: 16 Dec 09 - 03:10 PM

I thought I had heard some sick stuff passed off as Christian teaching on sex before, but I've never heard anything quite as sick, and sickening, as the "sermon" Wesley linked.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: olddude
Date: 16 Dec 09 - 04:39 PM

Absolutely correct Dean, so many of these guys any more that pass so much on as "Christian" teaching when they themselves have no clue of what that mean. Make up their own rules as they go along because when they can strip their congregation of their ability to think and understand the teaching, when they alone must interpret it for them, then you see they have the power over others and the collection basket. It makes one cry actually.

So many of these guys any more. They don't get it, the only law ever given "Love one another as I have loved you"

No wonder so many of us say I don't need or want a leader, nor do I need or want a building. Both mean nothing to me.

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: olddude
Date: 16 Dec 09 - 05:08 PM

One final thought from this old Christian. I always found the new testament to be a really easy read, actually really simple to understand. A small child can get it, things like "ya can have all the knowledge and wisdom etc but you have nothing if you don't have love" kinda easy message to get. But too many people for some reason fall in with some guys that says, Hey he could not possibly have meant those Muslim guys, or those gays or those Jewish guys, or some minorities, or women's libers .. or worse of all Liberal non believers !.. or .. or ... Make me a leader, and I will tell you what he meant ... and contribute to my xyz ministry and you go right in the pearly gates cause you get it cause you followed me...

so many of these any more ... so very sad...

Subject: RE: BS: Obit: Oral Roberts - Dec 15th 2009
From: Amergin
Date: 16 Dec 09 - 06:11 PM

People like to think they are are special....and better than other groups....