If you don't like x-factor you're weird

Subject: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Lox
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 09:56 AM

I wasn't paying much attention to the whole X-Factor v Rage Against The Machine stunt until i saw how the machine is fighting back.

If you support the anti x-factor movement you are apparently "weird".


When I heard this I suddenly realized that the issue of choice and media control is in fact a serious issue.

The only reason that people are interested in Joe McElderry (or whatever his name is) is that he has had months and months of pre release publicity and advertising.

I am at a university doing a jazz degree where I am surrounded by 18 - 25 year olds who are fantastic musicians and singers with a full and comprehensive understanding of music, a deep and abiding love and commitment to their art, who play and sing like angels and who have worked hard for years to develop their excellence.

They sing with more heart and sensitivity to their songs than the Jedward twins could ever hope to dream about, yet the Jedward twins are embarking on a career as multi millionaire "musicians".

This is because of hype and media attention that makes who wins a talent show front page news.

Why does it get on the front page? Media cronyism is the answer ... all busy scratching each others backs.

The media make no attempt to seek out and promote anything truly creative or original but follow cowell around kissing his arse and in return for his ability to sell papers, they promote culture according to a man with no musical background or knowledge, flanked by a group of similar ignoramuses.

A member of the public decides to protest against this and starts up a facebook page encouraging people to buy a copy of the song "killing in the name of"

You might like this song, many f you probably don't.

But lets find out why ...

... he chooses this song because it expresses his frustration with the industry behemoth and he wants to see if others feel as strongly about Simon 'Smug' Cowell.

It turns out that there are hundreds of thousands of people who agree and feel strongly enough to back that song choice and find that it expresses their distaste with pperfet eloquence.

So many people back it that the RATM song is ahead of the X-factor song in the polls.

Simon Cowell calls all those people "stupid"

Alexandra Burke calls them "weird"


As I said, when this campaign first started I paid it very little attention, but when Cowell and Burke start telling people what is and isn't normal, and categorize those who are different to them as "weird" social misfits ... when the people they are slagging are in the majority, they are displaying arrogance that I cannot stomach.


Who the hell do they think they are.

Something to remember about this campaign, care or not, agree or disagree, is that it happened spontaneously. It had no advertising and it was not choreographed.

People did not have it forced ito their living room every saturday night and people did not have to read about it on the front page every morning and evening going to and from work.

So while the x-factor represents the only choice most people have day to day, and while it represents a choice they were "given" and which they are constantly pressured to make, the RATM campaign represents something that people did spontaneously and is therefore more genuinely reflective of the will of the people.


I bought the RATM mp3 today for a few pence online. I'll probably never listen to it, but I believe in the point being made.


Whats more, to add credibility to RATM, their share of the profits will go to "shelter".

They didn't have to do that, they could have just laughed all the way to the bank.



The alternative is to bow down to cowells new cultural order and to pump the bank account and ego of an average entertainer.


No - sorry folks but F&%$ that!!

Rage Against The Machine.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: GUEST,matt milton
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:07 AM

What's the X Factor? Who are Rage Against The Machine?

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: GUEST,matt milton
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:09 AM

Less flippantly, what about if you don't really give a stuff about X Factor? What about if, far from seeing it as some terrible pernicious thing undermining the very fabric of society, you just barely notice it exists, because you don't happen to watch Saturday night telly and you never listen to chart music anyway?

I never liked RATM anyway. I figure they've already sold enough albums for their retirements to be secure, and figure it's pretty dumb to single them out just to make some silly point about the popularity of light entertainment.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Dead Horse
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:14 AM

Here, Here! sir.
Dont give a damn for X Factor, Big Brother or any of that ridiculous garbage.
It is not worthy of even being discussed..............what am I doing?
I am out of here..............

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: GUEST,No Fixed Abode
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:14 AM

Not sure but I think RAM are on the same label (sonny) as Joe McElderry.. if so then anyone buying the RAM single is contributing to SC's already vast fortune...could SC have arranged this? If so another piece of clever (or cynical depending on your view) marketing

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: MGM·Lion
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:16 AM

GUESTmatt just beat me to saying that I don't watch X-Factor, I have just about heard of this Cowell person & someone called Jedward but have no real idea who they are, don't even know what the abbrevtn RATM stands for — & in fact have not had all this apparently universally followed controversy penetrate my consciousness at all.

Who was it you quoted as saying this means I am 'weird'? & who TF may he/she be anyhow?

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Lox
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:18 AM

All fair points matt, butyou obviously haven't read my post.

"I figure they've already sold enough albums for their retirements to be secure"

RATM's profits are going to a homeless charity.

"what about if you don't really give a stuff about X Factor? What about if, far from seeing it as some terrible pernicious thing undermining the very fabric of society, you just barely notice it exists, because you don't happen to watch Saturday night telly and you never listen to chart music anyway?"


Answer, as above ...


"I am at a university doing a jazz degree where I am surrounded by 18 - 25 year olds who are fantastic musicians and singers with a full and comprehensive understanding of music, a deep and abiding love and commitment to their art, who play and sing like angels and who have worked hard for years to develop their excellence.

They sing with more heart and sensitivity to their songs than the Jedward twins could ever hope to dream about, yet the Jedward twins are embarking on a career as multi millionaire "musicians".

This is because of hype and media attention that makes who wins a talent show front page news.

Why does it get on the front page? Media cronyism is the answer ... all busy scratching each others backs.

The media make no attempt to seek out and promote anything truly creative or original but follow cowell around kissing his arse and in return for his ability to sell papers, they promote culture according to a man with no musical background or knowledge, flanked by a group of similar ignoramuses."


The mudcat is full of musicians, some average, some bad, but a few who have immeasurable quality.

They'll never do as well as Jedward.


An easy dismissive answer to that would be "well that's how the industry is, we all know that, who cares."

Well i care, I'm a musician and i know many great musicians who you'll never hear of.

The fact that the media pays them no attention but operates as cowells vending machine is objectionable.

The fact that people are called "weird" for thinking so is insulting.

The fact that nearly a million people have been called "weird" for showing suppport to this view is disgusting.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Lox
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:20 AM

"Dont give a damn for X Factor, Big Brother or any of that ridiculous garbage.
It is not worthy of even being discussed..............what am I doing?"

That ridiculous garbage is onbe of the reasons why folks clubs have no audiences.

Full of weirdies you see ... and not sexy.

And no media interest.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Leadfingers
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:22 AM

I MUST be totally weird as I have not even owned a television for more than twenty years !

And I dont notice the loss of Crap in my living roo thank you !

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Lox
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:24 AM

"Not sure but I think RAM are on the same label (sonny) as Joe McElderry.. if so then anyone buying the RAM single is contributing to SC's already vast fortune...could SC have arranged this? If so another piece of clever (or cynical depending on your view) marketing"

Sony makes money from both, Cowell makes no money from RATM.

Besides which, RATM wrote their song, arranged it and perform it themselves and did all that when they lived in a tough part of LA with no hype, and were originally signed to a small label, so their popularity comes from public demand unaffected by mdia hype.

X-factor is all over the media beng on primetime tv and being front page news daily.



The protest isn't against the distributor, its against the man who thinks he is the arbiter of taste.

This protest is about bringing him down a peg.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: theleveller
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:28 AM

"All t'world's weird except thee 'n' me - and even thou's a bit queer"

Old Yorkshire saying.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Mavis Enderby
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:30 AM

A synonym of weird is fantastic...

I like being weird!

Pete.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Mr Happy
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:35 AM

You've a living Roo instead of a telly?

Prpbably much more entertaining!! 8-]

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: GUEST,Banjiman
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:37 AM

I've bought the RATM download (I've already got it on CD and Vinyl).

It's great.

But that's not the point, the point is I dislike what X Factor and Cowell stand for. Cookie Cutter blandness. Whatever you've got against Rage Against The Machine they're not cookie cutter or bland.

This may be a futile protest but at least it is a protest!



Oi Lox, I run a folk club as well......... and my wife says I'm sexy (sometimes!).

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 10:56 AM

Amen Lox!

I think the thing that many sceptics fail to recognise, is that this is a spontaneous home-made ordinary people's internet campaign, that has simply adopted RAtM's classic anthem as a fitting reaction to Cowell's electronically reclaimed muzak machine. I'm sure there's lots of criticism could be leveled at their campaign, but I love it for the fact that it's simply an unplanned gathering of regular music loving folk, who are collectively 'rebelling' (in token form) against the oppressive control of their media masters, in rude and unsophisticated 'pitchforks and scythes' fashion.

Prior thread here: Rage Against the X-Factor

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: GUEST,The Folk E
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 11:01 AM

This crap is what you guys accept as folk music?

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: theleveller
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 11:02 AM

"in rude and unsophisticated 'pitchforks and scythes' fashion"

I love that! Pretty much what folk music is, in my opinion.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: GUEST,Banjiman
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 11:05 AM

"This crap is what you guys accept as folk music?"

er, no.... are we only supposed to like one kind of music to be "proper" folkies.... like you I assume?

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 11:06 AM

Plus Killing in the Name, is pure gold.

Even a few of my classical 'music snob' friends dig it for the interesting rhythms, & they usually hate my kinda music.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 11:39 AM

Think I'm gonna have a go at "folking up" Killing in the Name, just for a laff to bung up on MySpace :-)

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: GUEST,Banjiman
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 11:40 AM

Funny that, I've just been messing about with it on the banjo......

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Lox
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 12:01 PM

"This crap is what you guys accept as folk music?"

No one has indicated that they think RATM is folk.

You are free to make whatever comment you like, but it could be useful to respond to either the issue being discussed or points that people have made rather than just flights of fancy.

Though I would add that I would rather you had a flight of fancy of your own than subscribe to Simon Cowells criteria on what constitutes cuturally acceptable fantasy.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Lox
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 12:11 PM

"Oi Lox, I run a folk club as well......... and my wife says I'm sexy (sometimes!). "


I think Your wife is probably a much better judge than any of the x factor panel.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: GUEST,leeneia
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 12:13 PM

Meanwhile, I have been whimsying on a side issue. It goes like this:

You get a whole bunch of machines - earthmovers, rigs, derricks, and you extract fuels. You build more machines - turbines and generators. You send electricity out over the world.

You buy furhter machines - a tour bus, some lorries. Amps, lights, electric instruments.

Then you start a band and what do you call it? "Rage against the Machine"   !!!

hardy-har-har

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: GUEST
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 12:30 PM

For me, RATM make bad art and the singers on X Factor make bad art. And that's all there is to it. Different types of bad art. I think the best way to protest bad art is to make good art, or shout about why it's bad art. If I want to donate money to charity I'll donate money to charity. Come to think of it... I do.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: melodeonboy
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 01:46 PM

"Cowell's electronically reclaimed muzak machine."

CS: I'm afraid my imagination's not quite wild enough to consider RATM as being anyway near "pure gold", but I love your expression "electronically reclaimed" (above). How appropriate to compare Cowell's products to those extremely dodgy meat products that one finds that contain precious little nourishment and a whole load of crap! The musical equivalent of connective tissue!

That's now on my list of expressions one can use to impress people at dinner parties! (Not that I get invited to any, but one must be optimistic!)

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Q (Frank Staplin)
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 02:28 PM

Dunno what this thread is about and don't care.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Lox
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 02:34 PM

Leeneia,

Your observation would be more astute if they had done all the above themselves,

But closer scrutiny shows that they claim to come from an industrial slum in Los Angeles.

So they could be said to have been born into the Machine in its already developed state ...

... something with which they are apparently not satisfied ...


So as you point out, their existence is inextriicably linked to the Machine.

And it is consistent with your observation that they should express any rage they have with their environment against the Machine.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Crow Sister (off with the fairies)
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 02:35 PM

"Dunno what this thread is about and don't care."

Mmmm. Dunno what that post is about and don't care.


Go Rage Against the Machine!!!
Wooo!! ;-)

Otherwise to my appreciative fans (insert shuffling & coughing sounds), I always did have ambitions of being some kinda arty lout!
Eh oh tho', real life intervened. Back to Thomas the Rhymer.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Lox
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 02:38 PM

"Dunno what this thread is about and don't care. "

But care enough to read it through and then rubbish whats in it.

Sounds like you care to posture as being superior in some way to those who do know what its about and do care.

And if that's all you have to offer then that makes you pretty uninteresting.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 03:07 PM

Don't know what all the fuss is about; I quite like Sam Cowell's stuff. Some of it's quite folky although a lot of it is send-ups of folk songs. He wrote a lot of his stuff while touring in America. I've even heard some of it sung in folk clubs, Villikins for instance. He seems to have been very popular.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: SINSULL
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 03:11 PM

I had to GOOGLE x factor to figure out what this thread was about. Have to admit I have no tolerance for reality TV or Best Whatever shows. Don't know that this proves me weird. I suspect it just proves me older than the average TV watching crowd.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Spleen Cringe
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 03:35 PM

I have the say that weird is good. It's how I like my music and how I like my friends. If non-weird equals X-Factor, then bring on the weirdos!

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: GUEST,Betsy
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 03:40 PM

Then I'm weird - I don't subscribe it or that other dancing programme either.
Both resemble in a "weird" way "One man and his dog" in their sheep-like audiences.
Crap - and for any intelligent person underlines that the popular music industry is totally about MONEY.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: MikeL2
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 03:55 PM

Hi

Oh come on !!! RATM ....grrrrrrr

This is as much a scams Cowell's lot.....

The thing that no-one can dispute is that for some reason Cowell ( and I don't like him either ) is popular with the general TV audience and he has aimed his shows right at them.

This is a fairly bland but very popular form of entertainment that appeals to ( unfortunately ) a higk percentage of the TV viewing public.

Simon Cowell will only gain from this supposed alternative to Cowell. He is laughing all the way to the bank.

I don't like RATM but at least it is giving the public a choice and not an automatic entitlement to yet another Christmas No 1 for Cowell and the X Factor.

It shouldn't surprise anyone that "folkies" don't like Cowell - he is the very antithisis to what they stand for.

cheers

MikeL

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Mrs.Duck
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 04:21 PM

You cannot compare X factor and Strictly. One is about unknown wanna bes most of whom can't sing trying to make it big without the graft. The other is about a bunch of people who can't dance who are willing to have a go, enjoy themselves, possibly learn something and keep us entertained along the route. Guess which I watch on Saturday.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Jack Campin
Date: 18 Dec 09 - 05:28 PM

Well, I just bought the RATM track.

So far I can hardly figure out a word, though. Subtitles, anyone?

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Mr Red
Date: 19 Dec 09 - 05:00 AM

If you support the anti x-factor movement you are apparently "weird".

Well that makes me normal then. You can be so cruel.................

Oh - hang on - I prefer to sing than listen and dancing to watching prancing knaves. You know - doing it, giving pleasure or moving the old cardio-vascular instead of slobbing on the sofa. I guess that redeems me.

Mr Red is glad to be abnormal to want to participate rather than consume.


X factor is only mental wall paper. Participation is real life.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Mavis Enderby
Date: 19 Dec 09 - 05:19 AM

There ya go Jack: Lyrics

Explicit lyrics and Oedipus reference warning!

Banjiman & Crow - be interested to hear what you've worked up for this - I'm sorley tempted to try an old-timey version.

Pete.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: GUEST,Roger Knowles
Date: 19 Dec 09 - 05:29 AM

HTBW - happy To Be weird. It's all pre-meditated crap!! So-called 'reality' TV shows are anything but.
Every act has been auditioned, and their result understood by the producers before the show ever goes on the air.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Mooh
Date: 19 Dec 09 - 07:17 AM

Rage Against The Mudcat?

Commercial music isn't the only music, never was, never will be. Some of it's good, but much of it is not. I don't dig anyone dictating to me what is hip for my ears, eyes, hands, nose, or mouth. Dictating is not the same as suggesting or extolling the virtues of. There is way too much music for one person to digest in a lifetime, and it's as accessible as its ever been in history right now.

If some one wants to listen to commercial music, that's okay by me. If someone needs another person to guide them to music, that's okay too, though it shouldn't be assumed by either party that it's a requirement.

As for me, (taking a look at my most recent rotation) Bela Fleck, Joscho Stephan, Tonio K, Derek Trucks, The Good Lovelies, Rodrigo y Gabriela, The Flogging Mollies, Sharon Shannon, Simon Mayor, J.S.Bach, Savoy Brown, Jeff Beck, Led Zeppelin, Jean Ritchie, Bruce Cockburn, may or may not be commercial or whatever, and I don't need a consultant to make my choices. If I like it, it's like a good meal or a pretty girl, I don't need to be told if it's appealing.

If anything makes me weird, that's okay, some folks delight in being weird.

Peace, Mooh.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: bubblyrat
Date: 19 Dec 09 - 07:53 AM

TV is crap anyway.I put it on this morning for something to do,and started to watch a cookery programme with Nigella Lawson ( Junoesque,buxom,busty,glossy-lipped seductress of the black kitchen arts,for the benefit of USA 'catters). Normally,I drool,quiver,and hang,goose-pimpled,on her every word,but---Oh dear !! The "incidental music" was that bloody awful and nowadays ubiquitous "Let it Snow",which A) annoys me intensely and B) reminds me of "Die Hard",which I don't need right now.
                  So I turned the TV off.Everything on TV this Christmas seems to include either "Let it Snow " or Frosty the Fucking Snowman.I can think of nothing worse. Except A) Simon Cowell and / or B) The X Factor. As they say in Germany, " Bah ! Hamburg !".

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Reinhard
Date: 19 Dec 09 - 08:20 AM

Hey! We people of Hamburg like neither this kind of comment nor The X Factor.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: GUEST,Lady Nancy
Date: 19 Dec 09 - 10:29 AM

Er, what's the X factor?

LN

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Helen Jocys
Date: 20 Dec 09 - 04:12 AM

I just watched a teeny bit of X Factor once. Simon Cowell's feigned surprise (raised eyebrows) as though he'd never heard the acts before just turned my stomach. Never watch Strictly either. If you want a good laugh, watch the Australian Film 'Strictly Ballroom'. Now that IS something worth watching.

Helen Jocys.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: bubblyrat
Date: 20 Dec 09 - 04:31 AM

Sorry, Reinhard ! I will change it to " Bah ! Bielefeld! ", where I used to live, if you like,but it isn't quite as Dickensian, somehow.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Acorn4
Date: 20 Dec 09 - 04:33 AM

If you survey the commercial pop scene, very few of the lasting successes have come via X factor or the like. Even the winners often sink into oblivion swiftly. Leona Lewis and Will Young are exceptions here.

The effect of the programme on the music scene is thus ephemeral as people have short memories.

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: banjoman
Date: 20 Dec 09 - 06:52 AM

What is X Factor - never heard of it although I saw a repeat of Top Gear a few days ago and they had some pompous git called Simon Powell or something like that who mentioned a show about x factors.
I always thought X Factor was one of those values which I struggled with in maths many years ago when a race of weird monks tried to beat algebraic equations into me. I am not weird

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Spleen Cringe
Date: 20 Dec 09 - 10:07 AM

Good news...

1. According to the bookies "killing in the name" is on track for the Xmas number one.
2. RATM guitarist Tom Morello is donating his "unexpected windfall" to a UK charity that gives kids from deprived areas access to musical making opportunities: Youth Music
3. Simon Cowell describes this as "cynical". Now that is weird!

Subject: RE: If you don't like x-factor you're weird
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 20 Dec 09 - 10:43 AM

I now realise I've been getting the X-factor and the Kryton Factor confused. But I've always thought being called weird was a compliment.