Lyrics & Knowledge Personal Pages Record Shop Auction Links Radio & Media Kids Membership Help
The Mudcat Cafemuddy

Post to this Thread - Sort Descending - Printer Friendly - Home


Origins: Red Haired Boy (Melody)

autoharper 27 Dec 09 - 06:53 PM
GUEST,999 27 Dec 09 - 07:19 PM
Jim McLean 28 Dec 09 - 05:38 AM
TheSnail 28 Dec 09 - 07:20 AM
Jim McLean 28 Dec 09 - 08:01 AM
Tattie Bogle 28 Dec 09 - 11:04 AM
PHJim 28 Dec 09 - 01:14 PM
Share Thread
more
Lyrics & Knowledge Search [Advanced]
DT  Forum
Sort (Forum) by:relevance date
DT Lyrics:




Subject: Origins: Red Haired Boy (Melody)
From: autoharper
Date: 27 Dec 09 - 06:53 PM

What is the earliest publication of the mixolydian melody "The Red Haired Boy" (AKA: "Gilderoy" or "Little Beggarman")?

I find "The Beggarman" in Edward Bunting's _A Collection of the Ancient Music of Ireland_ (1840), but Bunting's melody is so different from the one played today I hardly recognize it.

Thanks,
-Adam Miller


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Origins: Red Haired Boy (Melody)
From: GUEST,999
Date: 27 Dec 09 - 07:19 PM

Page you may wish to read.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Origins: Red Haired Boy (Melody)
From: Jim McLean
Date: 28 Dec 09 - 05:38 AM

If you look under Gilderoy here Gilderoy and look at the various tunes, you'll find that the 'Little Beggarman' is a variation of 'Gilderoy' found in many older publications than Bunting's. One well known variation is known as 'The Star of the County Down' and that melody (close enough) was printed by Lucy Broadwood in 1893 under 'Lazarus: from English Country Songs'. I have traced this tune family back as far as an 11th century Gregorian chant "En Gaudeat"


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Origins: Red Haired Boy (Melody)
From: TheSnail
Date: 28 Dec 09 - 07:20 AM

Jim McLean

I have traced this tune family back as far as an 11th century Gregorian chant "En Gaudeat"

Tantalising. Have you made your research available anywhere? I've been looking into this in a vague way for ages starting from the Cuckko's Nest/Jacky Tar side, a connection which the Fiddler's Companion doesn't seem to have made.

Another member of the family is King of the Fairies which came as a surpriose to me when Jack Campin pointed it out.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Origins: Red Haired Boy (Melody)
From: Jim McLean
Date: 28 Dec 09 - 08:01 AM

The Snail: I studied at Edinburgh University over the period 2007/2008 and part of my research involved tune families. I did the degree for personal satisfaction and although I gave a talk specifically on Tune Families I don't think I still have the notes but I will have a look through the piles and piles of papers plus computer files.


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Origins: Red Haired Boy (Melody)
From: Tattie Bogle
Date: 28 Dec 09 - 11:04 AM

In one of my Scots Music Group classes we do "The Red-Haired Boy" followed by "King of the Fairies" as a set. Another tune with some resemblances is "The Rights of Man".
Incidentally, the tune used by Matt McGinn for his song "Lots of Little Soldiers" is "The Red-Haired Boy".


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate

Subject: RE: Origins: Red Haired Boy (Melody)
From: PHJim
Date: 28 Dec 09 - 01:14 PM

There are so many names for this tune. The Little Beggerman has words that are quite common. My friend John's dad used to call it The Old Soldier With The Wooden Leg. He sang:

There was an old soldier and he had a wooden leg
And he had no tobacco so tobacco he would beg...

A version from Newfoundland called The Old Ragadoo goes:

I'm a hearty Newfoundlander; Michael Chaser is my name.
I was born on Green Island I'm a fisherman by trade
I was born on Green Island 'bout a quarter after two
With my hands in the pockets of my old ragadoo...


Post - Top - Home - Printer Friendly - Translate
  Share Thread:
More...

Reply to Thread
Subject:  Help
From:
Preview   Automatic Linebreaks   Make a link ("blue clicky")


Mudcat time: 22 November 6:11 AM EST

[ Home ]

All original material is copyright © 1998 by the Mudcat Café Music Foundation, Inc. All photos, music, images, etc. are copyright © by their rightful owners. Every effort is taken to attribute appropriate copyright to images, content, music, etc. We are not a copyright resource.