Sting on BBC TV

Subject: Sting on BBC TV
From: John J
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 04:32 AM

I hope I'm not duplicating this message, I've had a quick check and can't see it:

Sting was on the box last night (Tuesday) in a very interesting and entertaining programme 'Sting's Winter songbook' available on BBCiPlayer.

John

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Hamish
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 05:43 AM

Yes - both interesting and entertaining. Thought the folkies came out of it very well: Kathryn Tickell and Mary McMaster and the young fiddle player chappie particularly. Sting can be rather pompous these days - he was an absolute hero of mine in Police and early solo days - but he was okay(-ish) last night. Worth an iPlay, most definitely.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: GUEST,eric the viking
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 06:51 AM

Liked it a lot. Always liked Police and also much of Sting when he does his solo stuff. The folkies came out really well and were a good advert for this often misunderstood genre that we all love here. It would have been nice to credit all the musicians at the end.(Don't know if growing a beard makes Sting more "folkie"?)

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: GUEST,Mr Red
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 06:56 AM

If he can do a creditable Dowland pavane he can do anything he wants. If he wants.
I was never a Police aficianado. But the man has integrity. And that is a good start for any aspiring folkie.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Suegorgeous
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 07:02 AM

I enjoyed it very much too. The album (with most of those songs and more on it) is beautiful IMHO. But know what you mean about the pomposity, Hamish!

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: GUEST,buspassed
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 07:05 AM

Interesting to know, via end credis, who the gaffer sparks was on the show, he and his crew obviously had a job on rigging the cathedral, but it would also have been nice to know who the young lady clog dancer was and whether the young fiddler was Kathryn Tickell's kid brother. Credit where credits due!

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 07:12 AM

Loved it, echo the comments above. I recommend it.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: GUEST,JM
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 07:42 AM

"it would also have been nice to know who the young lady clog dancer was and whether the young fiddler was Kathryn Tickell's kid brother. Credit where credits due!

The fiddle player was Peter Tickell (yes, he's Kathryns brother) - both a classical prodigy and incredible traditional fiddler. Meanwhile, the clog dancer was Amy Thatcher, better known as the accordion player in The Shee.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Edthefolkie
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 08:07 AM

I really enjoyed the programme, especially as at times it resembled "The Tickells and Mary McMaster, with Sting". I wouldn't have minded propping up a wall at the Ship Inn session featured in the film.

Thanks for the heads up JM, I THOUGHT that was Amy clog dancing! I do hope she at least got a taxi home after the gig, given the budget. We saw The Shee at the Nottingham riverside festival last summer and Amy appeared at the railway station afterwards, lugging the accordion and her bag across the concourse. Such is fame.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: TopcatBanjo
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 08:59 AM

Ooh, thanks for the heads-up. I will look this up on iPlayer tonight. sounds great. I loved The Police when I was a youngster and remember seeing Sting at the Manchester Apollo (front row) on his first solo tour. He's drifted into middle-of-the-road territory since (IMHO) but I do agree with the poster who says he has integrity. I think he is an interesting bloke.

I also remember seeing Kathryn Tickell at the City Hall (or was it the Theatre Royal?) some time in the early 1990s, that was brilliant. And I just discovered The Shee this year. So it sounds like a good 'un for me all round!

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Lizzie Cornish 1
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 09:08 AM

I'll watch that later, thank you for telling us about it.

I seem to recall that Sting's father never ever praised him for anything, and it hurt him terribly...so I guess his response to criticism, runs deep for that reason. Maybe that what brings on the pomposity..maybe not, who knows?

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: G-Force
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 11:25 AM

Loved the music - I really enjoy watching musicians at the top of their game.

But I thought the bloke doing the singing could have been better. Some of the songs were pretty much ruined, or lost altogether, by inappropriate vocals. Maybe the cathedral acoustics didn't help, but it was much the same in the rehearsal footage too. But his background contributions added well to the overall effect.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Steve Gardham
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 12:49 PM

Loved the whole programme. Despite the intros claiming the music/musicians were from all genres, folk dominated and shone. Well done to all concerned. Nice to see Julian Sutton on his box on the box!

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: GUEST,nickp (cookieless)
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 01:44 PM

Enjoyed it very much. Will invest in the dvd (the full concert plus the programme discussed here, as I understand). Have had a quick listen at some of the mp3 extracts of the cd but they don't have quite teh same magic.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: George Papavgeris
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 02:19 PM

I agree, the studio album will be dry - the DVD of the concert now, that would be worth the money.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 03:20 PM

Thanks for pointing it out. I've just enjoyted on the iPlayer.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Tattie Bogle
Date: 30 Dec 09 - 03:25 PM

Currently downloading it to I player(before I read the thread!)

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 05:30 AM

I have looked for the rest of the cast on Google but can't find them. Perhaps those of you who recognise people could name them, as people have started to above.

L in C

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Steve Shaw
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 06:34 AM

All the bits without Sting were brilliant. He ruined everything he sang on and, well, as for his frequent bouts of holding court...buttock-clenchingly awful.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: TopcatBanjo
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 08:37 AM

I enjoyed much of it, didn't like all the music but thought the majority of the programme was interesting, especially enjoyed the bouts of great fiddling from Kathryn and Peter Tickell. Personally I thought Sting was very generous to his crew of musicians.

The only person that I found vomit-inducing was one of the backing singers who was continually mugging away and trying to draw extra attention to herself, everyone else was very understated. Interesting programme and why on earth was it stuck on at 11pm (or even later?). I didn't see it trailed at all either, despite searching desperately for something decent to watch on BBC TV over the festive period.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 09:00 AM

Was that the same backing singer who made some snide-sounding remark about people's talent being in inverse proportion to their egos? I thought that was a bit strange...

I only heard about this programme from Mary Macmaster who is a Facebook friend and put a little blurb about it on her wall. Otherwise I would not have known.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: TopcatBanjo
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 09:10 AM

No, the blonde one who said that was OK. But she may well have been making a barbed remark about the one I am referring to!!

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: GUEST,Mr Red
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 09:23 AM

Well - as I never saw the programme and unless it is repeated never likely to:

If the man shows a bit of pomposity and that gets him to where he is at - that is what I call the "price of genius".

If you don't consider the genius level to be high enough - maybe the pomposity quotient was hardly a barrier to liking the musicianship either. The man has catholic musical tastes, and everyone and his brother wants to hang on to his coat-tails. He needs distance for his own sanity.

I will be watching for the repeats...........

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Tradsinger
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 09:29 AM

I watched the programme and enjoyed it. The musicianship was great as were the arrangments. It certainly was pleasant to see a pop singer embracing a lot of the folk idiom. The only thing that grated on me was Sting's phony American accent on everything.

But a good effort.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: GUEST,erbert
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 09:55 AM

long may Sting continue his latest & any future "talented rich man's" musical vanity projects..


He brings positive publicity and some short term income to those expert co-workers
of any esoteric music genres he feels the fancy to patronise and alight on;

and at least it distracts him from movie acting !
























vanity projects

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Folknacious
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 10:00 AM

I think most of the musicians got a verbal credit at some point, if you were paying attention. You could certainly hear Sting give a namecheck to Amy Thatcher at the end of her clog dance.

It was an excellent programme. Yes, Sting's singing is a bit daft but his fans obviously like it to buy all the records he's sold and his heart's obviously in the right place - so it can have done nothing but good for all the participants, the folkies in general and the Tickells in particular.

You have to remember that mainstream TV programmes are made for the mainstream TV audience, not us weirdos. The non-folkies I know (like my mum) who watch these things see them in a different way to us - she greatly enjoyed the Bellowhead Christmas Show too, precisely because it was different, interesting, entertaining, done by clearly talented people and she doesn't have any axes to grind or offences to choose to take.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 10:15 AM

I have looked for the rest of the cast on Google but can't find them. Perhaps those of you who recognise people could name them, as people have started to above.

L in C

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: GUEST,erbert
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 10:20 AM

please could mod clone on duty clean up that accidental editing error

- long gap and repetition of 'vanity project' at the end of my post.


thanks.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 10:31 AM

Sting: A Winter's Night, live from Durham Cathedral

Sting was joined by guest musicians including Kathryn Tickell (Northumbrian pipes and fiddle), Peter Tickell (fiddle), Julian Sutton (Melodeon), Dominic Miller (guitar), Vincent Ségal (cello), Scottish harpist Mary Macmaster, Ira Coleman (bass), Chris Gekker (trumpet), David Mansfield (violin and mandolin), Cyro Baptista, Bashiri Johnson and Rhani Krija (percussion) and vocalists Laila Biali, Lisa Fischer, Jo Lawry, and Steven Santoro. Producer Robert Sadin conducted the ensemble of 35 musicians, which includes additional string and brass sections. The clog dancer was Amy Thatcher.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Les in Chorlton
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 10:52 AM

Thanks Bonnie that's most informative

L in C

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: double stopping
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 12:30 PM

I have just watched this (had recorded it) and thoroughly enjoyed it. What a wonderful mix of musicians and styles - there was quite clearly great rapport between the musicians. Kathryn and Peter obviously impressed the others they were working with who seemed to be quite bowled over by the vitality of their playing. It was also interesting to see how the project developed. I personally don't have any issues with either Sting's voice or attitude - I found the bits between the music interesting.
Have saved the recording to show to my pupils - I teach music in a secondary school. A great example of mixing styles and genres successfully.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: GUEST, Poxicat
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 01:49 PM

I read the description in the Radio Times and ran a mile.

"Newly created folk songs"!

Just how ignorant of one's subject matter can one be?

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Smedley
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 02:22 PM

'Created' by being put through the vocal mangle of El Stingo, I expect..........

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Linda Kelly
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 02:30 PM

I enjoyed the settings-who wouldnt kill for a gig in Durham cathedral? On the whole it was good but I found Mr Sumner's accent irritating and it put me off. If anything it was a little precious but I guess you had to be there. Nice to see something original from the BBC even though it was on at an hour that most wouldnt be watching it!

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Smedley
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 02:53 PM

And how kind of the BBC to broadcast such a long advertisement for a multi-millionaire's new album.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: fat B****rd
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 03:48 PM

Loved it !! Could somebody please recommend a lively Kathryn Tickell album.
Happy New Year to you all from Dunfermline.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Hamish
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 05:00 PM

"Was that the same backing singer who made some snide-sounding remark about people's talent being in inverse proportion to their egos?"

The one who was continually mugging away and trying to draw extra attention to herself had sung with The Rolling Stones and other mega-stars so I guess she thought she was something. But the remark about inverse proportion was okay - just open to misinterpretation. What she meant was that everyone was very talented and everyone was ego-less. At least that's how it came across to me.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Suegorgeous
Date: 31 Dec 09 - 08:21 PM

That's how I understood it, Hamish.

But.... I don't get this criticism of a singer apparently "trying to draw extra attention to herself" - to me, she seemed to be simply really enjoying singing the song, and expressing herself more physically than the others. To me, that's a good thing.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 01 Jan 10 - 04:58 AM

If my experience of "Songs of Praise" is anything to go by, BBC producers encourage singers to "try.... to draw extra attention to herself". They reckon it makes better television.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: fat B****rd
Date: 01 Jan 10 - 01:13 PM

Kathryn Tickell ?????? Somebody, somewhere.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 01 Jan 10 - 05:49 PM

As far as I'm conderned, all albums by the lively Kathryn Tickell can be highly recommended.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: GUEST,Mr Red
Date: 02 Jan 10 - 06:52 AM

Views of the cathedral would be motivation enough for me. Nearly all Norman with Saxon heritage. Wish I was going to the IVFDF w/e this year. (Wall to wall dancing, ceilidhs, squares & contra etc).

I will be looking for those repeats.

Expectation is half the enjoyment and I would expect an eclectic mix of music from Sting. It looks like my expectations will be rewarded.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Wolfhound person
Date: 02 Jan 10 - 07:21 AM

Fat B*****d:

www.kathryntickell.com

Depends what you want - the more trad stuff she does or the more experimental.

There's a CD on there called "what we do" which is advertised as KT and Peter and has a fairly trad. or "composed in the tradition" mix of tunes on it. Might be what you want, I don't know - but there are sound samples.

I haven't heard it.

Paws

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: GUEST,eric
Date: 02 Jan 10 - 03:34 PM

Her sister Tess isn't bad either!

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: fat B****rd
Date: 03 Jan 10 - 10:02 AM

Thankyou, I've now got a selection of Ms. T's work which is fascinating and varied.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Catherine Jayne
Date: 03 Jan 10 - 10:11 AM

I got the album for xmas and it's beautiful. I recommend it.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: banjoke
Date: 03 Jan 10 - 10:28 AM

Suggest a look at the DVD of the concert. 90mins long and very good sound. Also it is not interrupted by 'talking heads' and the booklet credits everyone. Got mine from HMV (website)for £9.99!

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: GUEST,punkfolkrocker
Date: 03 Jan 10 - 12:05 PM

i get this instinctive feeling that sting
is a by-product of the good old fashioned tradition of working class self education
and self advancement;
despite
the negative impedements of regressive peer discouragement
and institutionalised societal glass ceilings..


.. probably accounts for why he appears to be such a pompous knob..

.. overcompensating for his ingrained insecurities and isolation from any meaningfull genuine good old school mates network..

needing to impress all the upper middle class oxbridge media biz twats who've shaped his life this last 30 years..


poor sod.


a lot of what he does aint too brilliant, but i got empathy and respect for him
and his well deserved success

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Bonnie Shaljean
Date: 03 Jan 10 - 12:41 PM

I dunno... I really don't find him pompous or pretentious - he just strikes me as an artist who likes to step outside the box and try different things. Why should he stay confined to one genre? This same point came up in a thread about his Dowland project too, and playing a lute in a song accompaniment. To me, he's an interesting and creative musician who keeps on moving and developing - OK, with varying degrees of success, but I admire his spirit of adventure and willingness to take chances, and I like a lot more things of his than I don't. I can't see that psychology or class-consciousness necessarily have to enter into it.

He's got fine taste in backing musicians, that's for sure.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Suegorgeous
Date: 03 Jan 10 - 03:57 PM

Well said, Bonnie.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Gervase
Date: 03 Jan 10 - 04:22 PM

I wonder if he treats 'em as well as he treats his domestic staff.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Dave MacKenzie
Date: 03 Jan 10 - 05:49 PM

I was trying to link the Scotland on Sunday review, but it doesn't seem to be online yet. Basicly it says great musicians, great venue, shame about Sting.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Suegorgeous
Date: 03 Jan 10 - 08:53 PM

What's he do to them then, Gervase?

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Gervase
Date: 04 Jan 10 - 02:45 AM

From what I recall, the egregious examples include him ordering one of the several nannies to his children to drive from Wiltshire to London to heat up some organic soup for the family, and a cook being forced to work 14-hour days while pregnant. The cook later won her case at an industrial tribunal where the judge had many harsh things to say about the regime imposed in Mr Sumner's seven luxury homes.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: evansakes
Date: 04 Jan 10 - 03:33 AM

One of the most interesting (and illuminating) sections in the documentary for me was when Sting was demonstrating his 'man of the people' touch by leading the film crew around Newcastle's quayside market. They stopped at a second hand book stall and someone picked out a copy of Sting's autobiography (don't think it was particularly 'well thumbed' either!). Meanwhile our hero has come across an old book on Newcastle United FC and asked the seller how much he wanted. The answer was ten quid...but in an instant the poor man inexplicably crumbled and followed up with "nine for cash". (who the hell offers Sting a cash deal!)

You could see it coming a mile off. As sure as eggs are eggs Sting then turns round to his posse of lackey gophers and asks "Anyone got ten pounds?" (surely no-one expects a rock god of his calibre to carry loose cash...do they?).

On handing over the duly supplied tenner the poor man is then seen proffering a pound coin in Sting's direction....only to be told "That's allright my man.....keep the change!"

Well....it's Christmas I suppose.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: Diva
Date: 04 Jan 10 - 05:10 AM

Cracking programme, not a huge fan of Sting...but interesting collaboration. I found myself thinking that a couple of hours wi faither Tickell would sort out his voice.

Subject: RE: Sting on BBC TV
From: C Stuart Cook
Date: 05 Jan 10 - 09:36 AM

Well after all the comments I finally got round to watching it on Iplayer. THat's what happens when you're snowed in and not inclined to do the jobs the bosswoman wants doing.

Very interesting, certainly makes me want to take in the end product. As a "how do they do that" it was interesting. I see what some peoples grouses were and wouldn't disagree with them but what I saw I liked.

However at the top of it all my first thought would be that Sting is a classic case of "knows the words, doesn't know the song". When you've got all that talent and excellence on the music front I think the vocals needed to be at least rising to the the same levels. As it was he gets nowhere near, too straight up and down for me despite his efforts.

I would suspect that the root of that stems from his arranger who seemed to be totally lacking in the subtlety of the base folk music when he does his directions early on in the proceedings.

Better than nothing though.