Licensing consultation announced!

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: Tootler
Date: 29 Dec 11 - 09:56 AM

http://www.midweekherald.co.uk/news/victims_of_bullies_1_1148896

Just a thought,

Nowhere in the article does it say whether or not anyone actually measured the noise levels as there are statutory limits.

As a result there is no objective comment on whether there was an actual noise nuisance rather than the council assuming that because there was a complaint there must be one. I would be surprised if a pub's air conditioning was that noisy even if it was old or in need of servicing nor would I expect it to create a high pitched whine which can be intensely annoying even at quite low noise levels.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 29 Dec 11 - 09:37 AM

http://www.m-magazine.co.uk/views/music-and-pubs/

On the regulation of music, however, there is a somewhat brighter picture. The government deserves credit for its current proposals to deregulate live music, something we have been calling for over a number of years. The current regime is unnecessarily restrictive and hampers small gigs.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 28 Dec 11 - 11:55 AM

http://www.midweekherald.co.uk/news/victims_of_bullies_1_1148896

This is a good example of where the Licensing Act can be of no possible use to EHOs to tackle a noise complaint, as it concerns (not noise from a chain-saw but)noise from air conditioning. They would have to find another piece of existing legislation to use.

If this legislation is considered to be adequate to deal with an actual complaint about noisy air conditioning - In what way is this legislation not also adequate to deal with any possible complaints resulting from live music?

ENDS

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 28 Dec 11 - 11:37 AM

http://www.midweekherald.co.uk/news/victims_of_bullies_1_1148896

John King comments:East Devon Council accused of bullying a social club

"Our EHOs always seek an amicable solution to problems where they can be found and spend a good proportion of their working lives advising and supporting businesses to find such solutions.

"Records will confirm that very few of the 1,000 of so noise complaints we receive each year end in formal action."

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 27 Dec 11 - 10:55 AM

http://www.ehn-online.com/news/article.aspx?id=5928

John King comments: CIEH principal policy officer Howard Price said: "music at licensed premises was the third most common source of noise complaints received by environmental health departments". This is a pack of lies.

But responding to a consultation run by the Department for Media, Culture and Sport, the CIEH said the Licensing Act had proved to be a success in tackling noise complaints.

The Licensing Act is not designed to tackle noise complaints. How would this legislation tackle a complaint made about a noisy chain saw?

You can't have a complaint about noise - until some measurable noise pollution has ACTUALLY OCCURED for someone to complaint about.

What these fools are saying is that the Licensing Act has proved successful in encouraging residents to make objections about noise -in advance of a note of music being sounded and for council employees to then feel obliged to respond with the imposition of actual limitations under binding licensing conditions, also before a note has been sounded.

This is only successful in needlessly deterring all live music in advance, whether this will ever cause measurable noise pollution or not.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 27 Dec 11 - 10:29 AM

http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.tauntondeane.gov.uk%2Firj%2Fgo%2Fkm%2Fdocs%2FCouncilDocuments%2FTDBC%2FDocument

John King comments:Thanks to the half-baked Police Reform & Social Responsibility Act, here's Taunton Deane Council giving "approval" for harmless events such as: Taunton Choral Society, a Rotary Lunch, a carol singing evening, RSPB film and fundraising, and more.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 27 Dec 11 - 04:58 AM

http://www.examiner.co.uk/news/local-west-yorkshire-news/2011/12/23/wedding-marquee-dispute-in-honley-86081-29999750/

John King Comments: Neighbours object to plans to create jobs for "20 to 30 people". Weddings are actually exempt from the Licensing Act, but many councils ignore this.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 24 Dec 11 - 09:58 AM

http://www.efestivals.com/news/11/111223a.shtml

John King comments:Merry Christmas from Westminster Council Licensing Dept: "Future concerts in Hyde Park by Live Nation could come to an end under controversial new restrictions proposed by Westminster Council."

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST
Date: 23 Dec 11 - 10:35 AM

http://democracy.brent.gov.uk/mgConvert2PDF.aspx?ID=1720&T=10

John King comments:Thanks to the Police Reform and Social Responsibility Act (so much for the coalition agreement to cut licensing red-tape), here's Brent Council Licensing Sub-Committee meeting to discuss Temporary Event Notice applications.

One TEN application was refused on the grounds that a risk assessment had not been prepared. http://democracy.brent.gov.uk/ieListDocuments.aspx?CId=135&MID=1709

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 23 Dec 11 - 10:31 AM

http://www.osadvertiser.co.uk/news/ormskirk-news/2011/12/08/burscough-fc-s-live-music-plans-suffer-blow-as-council-refuse-licenc

John King comments:Cllr Brian Bailey, of Burscough Parish Council, said: "We're not against bringing things to Burscough" Oh yes you are...

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 22 Dec 11 - 01:54 PM

http://www.yorkpress.co.uk/news/9427129.Licence_threat_for____noisy____pub/

John King comments:Complaints about a DJ (which is RECORDED music) lead to York Council's Licensing Sub-Committee deciding whether to ban LIVE music.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 12:53 PM

http://www.sevenstreets.com/blog/loud-allowed-static-gallery-hit-with-abatement-order/

Static Gallery today revealed on Facebook they'd been hit with a Noise Abatement Notice – by someone who's recently moved into Roscoe Lane. Right next to Static.

Although the venue are formally appealing the notice, the space, which houses gigs, clubnights and exhibitions as well as being home to design and creative studios, confirmed all future events will go ahead. But they'll be keeping a close eye on the decibel levels.

John King comments: One person moves next door and complains...

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 20 Dec 11 - 12:48 PM

http://www.bournemouthecho.co.uk/news/9424526.Meeting_over_nightspot_noise_postponed/

John King comments: One person moves next door and complains...

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 19 Dec 11 - 03:43 PM

http://services.parliament.uk/calendar/#!/calendar/Commons/MainChamber/2012/1/20/events.html

The Live Music Bill is 2nd on the order paper for Report Stage/3rd Reading on the 20th Jan. The Bill then returns to the Lords for agreement of amendments followed by Royal Assent.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 19 Dec 11 - 08:41 AM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-oxfordshire-16231842

An Oxford drumming tutor has been told to stop using his shed as a teaching venue after complaints about the noise.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 19 Dec 11 - 05:05 AM

Most of the music at the venue would be unobtrusive background music.

This should qualfiy as exempt as incidental live music and should not have been subjected to this process in the first place.

Why were the premises not advised of this by the licensing authority?

My recent local experience was that the applicants were not aware that there was such an exemption, until the Licensing Manager mentioned it in passing, at the hearing. Had they been so advised, this may have prevented the whole process and saved the applicants a lot of money.

Sadly what live music may or not qualify under this exemption is entirely in the head of each Licensing Manager and would seem to be a matter only for them to decide............

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 18 Dec 11 - 03:33 PM

John King comments: "Without thinking, Basildon council have banned unamplified music (eg carol singers) between Sunday and Wednesday. Carol singing quartets are criminalised at any time - but a quintet of DJs is apparently OK."

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 07:30 PM

http://www.basildonmeetings.info/ieDecisionDetails.aspx?ID=1680

John King cmments:Basildon Council allow DJs to work at any time, but restrict live music to Thu to Sat, maximum of three performers and a noise limiter and a personal licence holder to be present on the premise whenever regulated entertainment is being provided. In a tapas-style bar.

The above is a fairly standard example of what those employed to enforce licensing legislation would consider to be - not a licensing failure - but a success for additional entertainment licensing. As this would show up statistically as a venue with permission to provide live music.

In fact - as a result of being exposed to the requirement - not as a result of any actual problems and before a note has been sounded - only the live music is limited to only being able to take place on three days (2 of which when alcohol can be served for an hour longer), to a maximum of 3 performers, with a noise limiter and a personal licence holder to be present - not for the serving of alcohol - but for when any live music is taking place!

It also fairly standard in that prior to the hearing, the applicants have further self-limited parts of the application, in an attempt to placate the objections, that the application process tends to encourage to be made. There may have been representations made which supported the application but if there were, this was not identified.

The point about this is that anyone making a representation of support would be supporting the original application and not the self-limited application that would either be presented at the hearing or which could even result in acceptance of this self-limited application without a hearing.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 06:56 PM

John King comments:This licensing dept has generated an annual income of £276,242. http://www.southsomerset.gov.uk/media/356238/agenda.pdf

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 11:15 AM

This link to South Somerset Council's submission should work - even if this region's highly-priced pub performers do not.

http://www.southsomerset.gov.uk/media/383891/click_here_to_view_agenda_as_one_document.pdf

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 11:09 AM

http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.southsomerset.gov.uk%2Fmedia%2F383891%2Fclick_here_to_view_agenda_as_one_docume

John King comments:South Somerset Council's response to the consulation. "Live music and performers can be less predictable and harder to control".

"The cost to the venue of providing Regulated Entertainment.

It is our opinion, that it is this reason, which prevents venues from putting on live and recorded music, not the cost of applying for authorisation. In this area the cost of a local (not well known) band is approximately £200, with the cost rising to the thousands for those that are well known. The cost of a TEN is set at £21."

I wonder what salary the person speaking for the whole of South Somerset Council, is on? I suspect that were their workplace subject to any cost, which needed to be paid by another party, to enable them to work - I wonder if they would be quite so sure?

They simply do not understand that on top of the practical problems being presented, it is the basic principle behind it that is unacceptable. That their support of the idea that live music is presenting some sort of risk that can only be dealt with by ADDITIONAL entertainment licensing and which is ADDITIONAL to that which is required for alcohol and other activites, that is the real problem.

For the LGA Group lobby have still yet to identify the risk associated with live music that only ADDITIONAL entertainment licensing can address and which other legislation is unable to deal with or is not already doing.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 10:46 AM

http://www.manchester.gov.uk/egov_downloads/Reg_entertainment.pdf

John King comments: Manchester City Council's response to the licensing consultation. "We have no experience or evidence that the current licensing regime has actually prevented performances from being arranged."

Really NO evidence? Manchester Council was successfully sued for a large sum of money after illegally cancelling a Bob Marley Tribute Concert last year
http://www.nme.com/news/bob-marley/52322

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 17 Dec 11 - 10:36 AM

http://www.local.gov.uk/c/document_library/get_file?uuid=61f5629e-4ef2-48e9-a386-82cf2b5f6a98&groupId=10161

John King comments:Southwark Council have a strong track record. Here they are licensing a piano for one day a week between 7 and 10pm. (page 17 - Simon the Tanner PH). DJs are allowed at all times, while poetry reading remains a criminal offence.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 09:17 AM

http://www.local.gov.uk/c/document_library/get_file?uuid=61f5629e-4ef2-48e9-a386-82cf2b5f6a98&groupId=10161

Here is the LGA's Briefing Document.

Councils already have a strong track record of working in partnership with communities to run successful events that can be enjoyed by all and which deliver substantial benefits for local areas.

Who is saying this? The LGA Group lobby don't really seem to understand that communities do not need or even wish to work in partnership with council employees - they simply wish to be allowed to enjoy such events without needing permission at every step from the council for every little aspect and for the events to be placed at risk as a result.

Only those who cannot see beyond regulation and control would consider this over regulation to be desirable. It is a bit like football referees who seem to think that the spectators have paid to come and see them. Regulation and control, at football games is most effective when no one notices that there is even a referee on the pitch.

The public areas for which my local authority has applied to itself for and granted itself additional entertainment licensing to, has an automatic 8.30pm curfew - whatever the form of entertainment taking place, even a mime act!

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 05:49 AM

http://www.kerrymccarthymp.org/news/westminster_news/news.aspx?p=109994

Significantly, the Local Government Association which represents councils has also announced that they are now fully supporting the Bill, following some important amendments. In a statement, the LGA said: "We are pleased that the Bill will leave councils with more levers to protect residents than other proposals currently being consulted on by DCMS, and that is has more stringent requirements on group size and a pre-determined finish time of 11pm."

I don't like to put a damper on things but the writing is clearly on the (LGA Group lobby) wall.

I see no real hope of the Govt's proposals bringing any more benefit to live music, than what eventually surfaces from the Live Music Bill.

The 11pm curfew, where all live music is to subject to additional entertaiment licensing, whether it is a cause of noise pollution or not, will be set in legislation.

I suspect that even should the Govt's proposals go on - that all the measures for live music will be excluded and the group size will remain at the figure set by the LMB. The argument being that the level of red tape has already been sufficiently lifted from live music but that other activities may still require some help.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 05:33 AM

http://www.kerrymccarthymp.org/news/westminster_news/news.aspx?p=109994

The MP for Bristol East, Kerry McCarthy, has welcomed news that the Live Music Bill is now one step away from becoming law

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 16 Dec 11 - 05:24 AM

Mr Foster and all those behind the LMB and the Govt's own proposals both need to openly recognise the elephant in the room.

The LGA Group lobby is the reason the Licensing Act so comprehensivly covered so much and it was they who provided the redtape for local govt enforcement to finish the job of strangling so much live music and other activities.

The LGA Group lobby is the reason why these proposals need to be made, why they have been so delayed and why future local govt enforcement of whatever changes may eventually be made, can still find ways of rendering even the fairest - worded legislation totally ineffective in providing any intended benefit to live music.

Behind this approach seems to be the hope of some sort of return to the days when local athorities would set their own licence fees.

This along with what can only been seen as a deep-seated prejudice against live music, a refusal to accept the added value that live music brings to all of our lives and that its treatment needs to be different to with how they would treat street-trading and taxis.

I have yet to see any direct criticism of the way that the LGA Group Lobby has acted and more importantly - no real attempt to ensure that this self-interested lobby cannot carry on exactly as before in obstructing all attempts to finally provide live music with controls that are propotionate to any direct risks which it may present.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 05:20 PM

http://www.politicshome.com/uk/article/42006/don_foster_live_music_bill_needs_a_fair_wind.html

Don Foster: Live Music Bill needs a fair wind

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 10:29 AM

John Penrose (Parliamentary Under Secretary of State, Culture, Olympics, Media and Sport; Weston-Super-Mare, Conservative)

It is a pleasure to have you here in the Chair looking after us this morning, Mr Scott.

I echo both sides of the Committee in congratulating my right hon. Friend the Member for Bath and Lord Clement-Jones, who initiated the Bill at the other end of the corridor. The Bill is tremendously welcome, and I am delighted that it has had cross-party support in both Chambers of Parliament. It is greatly to everybody's credit that we can create such a level of cross-party unanimity to back up this important measure. I am delighted that it has been introduced, and I urge everybody to support it when we reach the end of our deliberations.

I want to address the issue that my right hon. Friend the Member for Bath asked me to clarify in his response to questions from the hon. Member for Bristol East about noise control. I confirm that my right hon. Friend was entirely right about how the changes in the Bill will affect the previous legislation, and we are happy to reissue or provide any necessary guidance to make it clear how that can be used in future. I echo him in confirming that, as a result of the Bill, there will be plenty of ways for local communities and local licensing authorities to continue to exercise effective control via licence conditions, particularly for alcohol on premises.

In the very few or theoretical circumstances in which isolated licensed premises have grandfathered rights, which are unusual—we think there are few of those—a simple solution is to have a quick licence review, which local authorities do all the time, and that would also fix the problem. If problems arise, plenty of solutions and powers are still available to local communities, should they need them, to ensure that there are sufficient protections.

The Bill is a welcome and overdue step in the right direction. As everybody here is aware, the Government have been consulting on other proposals over the past few months. As an update, we have had about 1,400 responses to those proposals. They are somewhat wider than the measures we are debating today; many were extremely positive, but some legitimate concerns are being raised, and we will evaluate and address them carefully during our consideration of the consultation responses.

The fact, however, that wider potential amendments are out there should not distract from this being a sensible, contained Bill that moves us firmly in the right direction. I commend it to the Committee and add that the Government are very happy to support it as it stands.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 06:40 AM

http://services.parliament.uk/bills/2010-11/livemusichl.html

Next date.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 15 Dec 11 - 05:44 AM

http://www.theyworkforyou.com/pbc/2010-11/Live_Music_Bill/01-0_2011-12-14a.2.0

Committee Stage. Mike Gapes: "Some of the concerns that residents' associations have expressed are overblown. People who move next to a pub or a club often seem shocked when people start attending that facility"

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 07:31 PM

http://www.audioprointernational.com/news/read/live-music-bill-passes-committee-stage/03847

http://www.musicweek.com/story.asp?sectioncode=1&storycode=1047869&c=1

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 09:25 AM

http://www.local.gov.uk/web/10161/live-music-bill/-/journal_content/56/10161/3222993/ARTICLE-TEMPLATE

John King comments:The LGA announce support for the Live Music Bill. While this is entirely welcome, the LGA has suggested an innocent looking amendment which could take months of redrafting for little benefit to live music.

Although mindful of Parliamentary time, the LGA proposes an amendment to extend the exemption for provision of late night food to also include low risk regulated entertainment. For example, under current proposals a theatre wanting to host a small unamplified live music event in a room adjacent to a play being performed, would still be subject to the Licensing Act even though the PMB deregulates unamplified live music in other circumstances.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 14 Dec 11 - 09:08 AM

The following from Hamish Birchall

In a remarkable u-turn the Local Government Association has announced
qualified support for the live music bill, which has today passed its
Committee stage in the House of Commons: http://bit.ly/ve6Uu0

Two minor technical amendments were agreed during Committee which
require the bill to return, briefly, to the House of Lords. But there
is every expectation that it will move to Report and 3rd reading in the
Commons early next year. If enacted, entertainment licensing would no
longer apply to most performances of live music to audiences of up to
200, between 8am and 11pm. In alcohol-licensed premises, that freedom
could be subject to conditions if there were problems.

For years the LGA has been hostile to any relaxation of entertainment
licensing for live music. But faced with a government committed to
cutting red tape, and the more radical exemptions recently proposed by
DCMS in a public consultation, it would seem that the bill represents an
acceptable deregulatory compromise - for live music at least.

One factor in the LGA u-turn is likely to be their belated recognition
that, under the existing Section 177 of the Licensing Act, many
conditions relating to live music are not in fact enforceable in bars
and restaurants where the maximum permitted capacity is 200.

The complexity of the s177 provision has been widely criticised and
indeed misunderstood by licensing authorities and residents' groups
alike. The Act's live music provisions generally remain difficult to
interpret - one reason, no doubt, why the LGA itself mistakenly suggests
today in its press statement that a small unamplified gig in a room
within a theatre would not be covered by the bill's exemptions.

ENDS

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 12 Dec 11 - 05:44 AM

When defending additional entertainment licensing, what those who are employed to enforce the legislation are in effect saying is that:

The playing of any type of live music in a pub, club, school etc, which must have aleady been made safe for the public by Planning, Environmental and Health and Safety legislation - will present an additional concern to the public's interest that only the advance requirement of additional entertainment is able to provide.

None of the submissions that I have read, which make all sorts of scaremongering claims about the dire consequenses which will result if the Govt's proposals be come law, actually state what this concern is or what is defective in the raft of existing legislation, which is considered to be sufficient where no form of live music takes place or where this live music (or TV sport) is already exempted from the requirement for additional entertainment licensing....

Until the proposals's opponents provide this - we can safely dismiss all of their claims as the self-interested calls of turkeys who are in no hurry to be eaten and who, understandably, do not want to be seen to be voting for an early Christmas.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 10 Dec 11 - 12:00 PM

http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/bills/cbill/2010-2012/0241/cbill_2010-20120241_en_2.htm#l1g1

The Live Music Bill.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 09 Dec 11 - 07:21 AM

https://www.bristol.gov.uk/committee/2011/wa/wa004/1123_5.pdf

John King comments:Bristol Council's response. Not very interesting, but then again Licensing Officers aren't...

However, Bristol's officers along with many others, with their professional and the LGA Group lobby - are prepared to provide what I could most kindly describe as, somewhat less than impartial advice about these proposals and especially omit to mention the many imposed conditions which currently limit, needlessly deter and currently strangle all forms of live music.

The LGA submission actually tries to place ALL of the blame on the Licensing Act, claiming that it does not allow council enforcement to be flexible. It is the very flexible and variable interpretations that live music suffers from and which are entirly dependent on where you happen to live.

As can be seen from the nature of the responses - the only thing that they are in agreement about is that the total control of all live music must remain with them and be unchanged. All this of course is disguised as only being a concern for the public's interest. A public that seemingly does not include anyone who makes or appreciates live music.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 09 Dec 11 - 05:17 AM

Last post was from me (also)

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST
Date: 09 Dec 11 - 05:16 AM

http://www.cieh.org/WorkArea/showcontent.aspx?id=39900

John King Comments:Response from the Chartered Institute of Environmental Health. That fine body of professionals famed for: issuing a noise abatement to an autistic man for humming, banning running in a pancake race, and now they've even banned Santa.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2070352/Santa-Claus-aint-coming-town-health-safety-monsters-attack-Christmas.html

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 09 Dec 11 - 05:10 AM

Try this link:

http://www.stedmundsbury.gov.uk/sebc/live/documents/reports/C178%20Consultation%20Proposal%20to%20Examine%20the%20Deregulation%2

Poor old turkeys...

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 09 Dec 11 - 05:07 AM

http://www.facebook.com/l.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.stedmundsbury.gov.uk%2Fsebc%2Flive%2Fdocuments%2Freports%2FC178%2520Consultatio

John King Comments:St Edmundsbury Council concoct the most pathetic reason for keeping licensing for plays: "Smoking is still permitted on stage where it is integral to the plot of a play, and this could present safety risks were plays to be de-regulated and there is no other mechanism in place for ensuring this objective."

How about an exemption for smoking that is incidental?

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 08 Dec 11 - 02:34 PM

http://www.thecmuwebsite.com/category/cmunews/gigstoursnews/

John King comments:Islington Council objects to plans for a Jamaican-themed festival planned to coincide with the Olympics.

Islington's licensing policy states: All licensees and applicants that intend to allow live performance of music, by either musicians, DJ's, MCs or other artistes, are recommended to undertake comprehensive risk assessment. The Licensing Authority recommends that the Metropolitan Police Promotion/Event Risk Assessment Form 696 be used for this purpose.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 08 Dec 11 - 09:56 AM

http://services.parliament.uk/bills/2010-11/livemusichl/committees/houseofcommonspublicbillcommitteeonthelivemusicbillhl201011.h

The Public Bill Committee has been named: Attendees include Don Foster, John Penrose and John Whittingdale.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 08 Dec 11 - 09:50 AM

http://services.parliament.uk/bills/2010-11/livemusichl.html

A Bill to amend the Licensing Act 2003 with respect to the performance of live music entertainment; and for connected purposes

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 07 Dec 11 - 01:42 PM

It would appear from the general concern about the current situation that additional entertainment licensing is NOT ensuring that everyone can have a peaceful night's sleep.

Or are you now saying that this type of regulation is effective in ensuring that we can all have a peaceful night's sleep?

It is a good way for uncaring licensing employees to carry on limiting and detering all live music by imposing actual conditions and before a note has even been sounded, as to them all live music is simply becoming another way of saying noise pollution.

To create an exemption for non-amplified live music alone would simply mean that all amplified live music would be limited and deterred as if it were always noise pollution on all occasions, at all times and in all venues.

At least where the legislation does not currently make a distinction (except in the Morris exemption) between amplified and non-amplified live music - the claim can safely be made, that not all live music is noise pollution and that the attempt to treat it as such, often before a note is sounded is totally unjust.

It is a bit like claiming that locking up those who look like they may be likely to commit a crime is a measure that will prevent crime and that, although you may have locked-up more than a few innocent people - is acceptable

It is not acceptable to impose conditions in advance, which limit and deter all live music on the grounds of it causing noise pollution. This what additional entertainment licensing is currently doing and much live music that will never present any form of noise pollution, is needlessly limited and deterred as a result.

This is a pretty poor way of treating something that should be celebrated for the added value it brings into our lives. This is why all live music must be taken out of the hands of those who are more comfortable issuing licenses to street traders and taxis.

As with crime, you can take sensible prevention measures but the imposition of actual conditions and punishments must wait at least until a crime has been committed. After some form of measurable noise pollution has occurred and hopefully stopped, it is sensible to take measures to prevent it happening again on other occasions.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 07 Dec 11 - 12:53 PM

Shambles, have you heard how hard a kid with a guitar amp can crank it?   Do you remember?

I nearly took the roof off Meopham village Hall when I was about 17 using one 30 watt Geloso and one probably 20 watt Selmer bassist Major - enthusiasts for the sort of music I was disco-ing were coming in from the road 100 yards away and heaven only knows what the neighbours were doing.

Stick to defending the defensible - unamplified music.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 07 Dec 11 - 12:23 PM

http://newsfrombrighton.co.uk/brighton-hove-city-council/council-strongly-rejects-governments-unlicensed-venue-proposal/

The council's letter said: "Members agreed unanimously to ask officers to write to you to in the strongest terms to object to these proposals. The committee consider that deregulating regulated entertainment is not justified, unlikely to assist entertainment pubs and removes necessary protections to local residents.

"Regulation is needed to provide necessary protection for audiences and residents in terms of prevention of disorder and public nuisance and protection of public safety."

I seriously question if any of these council members had actually read the Govt's proposals? What are they being advised by their officers, is being proposed?

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 07 Dec 11 - 07:55 AM

http://www.morningadvertiser.co.uk/General-News/Licensee-fears-drop-in-trade-after-breathalyser-licensing-condition

Chief Inspector Robyn Mason said: "Thanks to the determination of our officers we have now removed the premises' ability to hold youth discos, which were largely the root of the problem. The evidence from Aberaeron and Cardigan officers made this protracted case have a successful outcome possible.

"In addition to sending out a clear message to licensed premises who attempt to fall out of line, this challenging episode is an excellent example of efficient and effective neighbourhood policing."

To solve porblems associated with an activty (a youth disco) - the efficient and effective neighbour hood policing answer - is to simply end the activity.

So the young people who once attended the youth disco are back out roaming the streets.

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: GUEST,The Shambles
Date: 07 Dec 11 - 03:46 AM

I can't really believe that anyone who has had first-hand experience of and has been through the all processes involved with live music and additional entertainment licensing and knows how this process damages it by actually encouraging all manner of people to come up with all kinds of objections (many which have nothing to do with the live music in question) and which process still exists mainly because of and for the benefit of those who are employed to enforce it, and their various organisations - can actually support a situation where any live music should be subjected to it.

For that is the form of 'regulation' that is being proposed for all amplified activities (which would include PA at school concerts etc.)

Subject: RE: Licensing consultation announced!
From: Richard Bridge
Date: 06 Dec 11 - 06:32 PM

Nonsense. Find me somewhere in South East England where on a quiet night a man with decent sized guitar amp cannot be heard in the nearest house. Sic utere tuo ut alienum non laedas.

By way of contrast the occasions when unamplified music will be so annoying are scant.