 sj |
||
|
||
BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization??
|
|
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Bobert Date: 27 Jun 11 - 08:53 PM And 900, to boot... B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Don Firth Date: 27 Jun 11 - 09:08 PM "Propaganda Minister Firth gives a link to a character assassination hit piece aimed at Ayn Rand." pdq, I KNEW you were going to respond with something like that. Believe me, if I'd wanted to find a "character assassination hit piece," there were some really fierce ones out there I could have chosen. I picked this one because it gave the facts (ouch!) about her background, and it was a FAIR and—may I use the word?—OBJECTIVE article on Ayn Rand and her ideas. You wouldn't be happy with anything less than a glowing article written by one of her most dedicated disciples. Well, those are pretty hard come by these days. While she was alive, she managed, one by one and in groups, to alienate the various members of her "inner circle." One main bone of contention was that she always counseled them that they should think for themselves. But whenever they did and it didn't necessarily agree with what she thought, she wouldn't discuss it. She would start screaming insults at them (not unlike some of the folks here on this thread). If they held the line, she "repudiated" them and put an article in the Objectivist Magazine to that effect. Proof? Right on my bookshelf, along with the other books by and about Ayn Rand, I have a complete run of first the Objectivist Newsletter, then the Objectivist Magazine. Complete list of the people she "repudiated." Why, for example, did she "repudiate" and excommunicate Nathaniel Brandon? He was married, but she insisted that Barbara Brandon step aside so she (Rand) could have an affair with her husband Nathanial. He wimped out and agreed to the arrangement (it ended his marriage; Barbara was not exactly a shrinking violet), then after some years, Nathanial met and fell in love with a young woman. Rand found out about it. Hissing like a cat, she wrote a really vicious article in the Objectivist about what a turncoat and hypocrite Brandon was, accusing him of every kind of betrayal possible (but not itemizing or explaining what those "betrayals" were). Branden subsequently sent a letter to all the subscribers of the magazine, explaining that he "could no longer participate in an affair with a woman whom, although I admire her mind, I do not love her, and who is twenty-five years my senior." One thing I insist on is that anyone who tries to tell me how I should live my life, and what I should believe, should, at the very least, follow their own precepts. Hypocrisy is not acceptable. By the way, pdq, if so few Tea Party members have ever heard of Ayn Rand, why is it that they quote her all the time? Eh? You really ARE a faithful little disciple, aren't you? I've run into this kind of vitriol before. I recognize its source. Don Firth |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Bobert Date: 27 Jun 11 - 09:30 PM The Tea Party folks are quoting her because the Koch brothers and Dick Armey are injecting Rand into the Tea Party... I'd bet you that 99% of the Tea Party folks never heard of her until the last year... Actually, lots of folks who aren't Tea Party puppets probably hadn't heard of Ayn Rand either... But the next move for the Koch/Armey folks is to try to do what rich people have tried to do for 60 years and that is us "Starve the beast" to kill the "New Deal"... The Tea Partiers are just pawns in a gme they have absolutely no understanding and in the end will hurt them and their children... Much like Hitler used the "brown shirts"... Ignorant pawns... Nothing more, nothing less... I feel sorry for the folks here in Mudburg who have become ignorant pawns of people who couldn't give a flying fuck about them... This is a much larger game that is so far over the Tea Partiers heads that it is pathetic... "Oh, gee, Ralph... How did all this occur???" It occurred be cause stupid people were, ahhhhh, stupid... That how Hitler came to power and that is the same game plan for the Koch brothers, Rupert Muldock & Dick Armey... They have one mission and one mission only: Kill the New Deal!!! No other mission is on their plate!!! B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Don Firth Date: 27 Jun 11 - 09:32 PM Here, pdq. If you have the guts for it, here is an article written by quite probably the one human being who knew her and her philosophy better than anyone else on earth. CLICK Pour yourself a cup of coffee and put your feet up before you start. It runs about 11,000 words. Don Firth |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 27 Jun 11 - 11:32 PM Bobert: "Secondly, GfinS, while you may think that you are so "classless and free" you are aligning yourself with the radical and emotional right of the Republican Party with the Tea Party..." Actually, I just understand their feelings, as well as those from the 'far left'. Everybody has their valid points..everybody!...It is the lack of understanding, that the 'manipulators' from all sides, are counting on to keep us divided, while those 'bullshit solutions' are foisted upon us!...and in the end, final analysis, EVERYBODY gets cheated...EXCEPT the 'manipulators'....who are more in agreement with each other, than the blind-sided, unwittingly deceived, 'true believers'....who, though their hearts are divided, against each other, are generally well intentioned folks....just deceived....so they fight..like on here... What happens is they put their agendas ahead of the fact, that America has been, and could still be a kick-ass country, like no other! All the sides, were NOT the reason the nation grew, nor could they be the reason a nation could develop, as ours did...but they ALL want to steer it into their 'corners', if you will, and they all share an agenda which to accomplish their goals, require the stripping away of our liberties and freedoms to facilitate their manipulators!....including the 'far left'..as well as the 'far right', and the offshoots of both of them. The key is, instead of finding fault in each OTHERS eyes, why not make those same adjustments on YOUR side of the street, and where you find error, stop making excuses for them, and acknowledge them, and back away, where you find manipulations, half truths, and out front lies! Hey, if someone wants to gain control of me, by lying to me, FUCK THEM, and the horse they rode in on. If I blindly buy into it, 'for the party's sake', well, fuck me! .......... I got too much real creating to do, to give any of them any serious part of my mind, and those whose lies are just too out front to ignore, I just 'throw them the crazy', and usually, those who promote their bullshit....no matter which party, or faction, at that particular time! As it stands now, ALL of them, and ALL their 'final' solutions defy gravity, in their long-winded, falsely 'astute', sloppily slapped together rationalizations. I'd rather compose stuff that grabs the heart, BEFORE the place where is gets cluttered, with political nonsense!...and speak to us there!! This is the part that needs to be built up...so if anyone is going to save their asses, their ass better be worth 'saving'!! Oh well...nice to hear back from you, in a more cohesive tone..... Regards, GfS |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 28 Jun 11 - 01:12 PM Don Firth: ".....but something like Nessun Dorma from Puccini's "Turandot" is totally inappropriate for her voice on a couple of counts. First, it was written for a tenor (the part of Calàf in the opera), and second, it is not a very easy aria to sing, even for a full-voiced tenor (signature piece for Luciano Pavarotti). I did notice, however, that she sang a much abbreviated version of it." Personally, I thought her performance of 'Nessun Dorma' was not only phenomenal, it was a downright 'historic'!! Did you notice the expression on her face, after completing the last note??!!..Somewhere between ecstatic, and emotional, as if she just had just had the best EMOTIONALLY orgasmic sex of a lifetime and gave birth..all at the same time!...and offered it to her beloved! (Now I know she is a minor, and nothing more should be read into my prior statement, other than the 'emotional' part..and how she gave it her all! That being said, I know Pavarotti had this piece as his signature piece, even did a movie about it('Yes Giorgio!')...and i loved when he sang it....BUT THAT performance that Jackie did, grabbed me far more than Luciano's. I've listened to it several times since recording it off the PBS special, on our large flat screen, as late as yesterday...and holy shit, I get choked up toward the final notes!! Jackie is just plain GIFTED, and like you, I really hope she does not get exploited, abused or messed with...or fall into the crap Charlotte Church fell into. I'd be interested in your thoughts about her performance, if you'd care to share more of them...as much as we go 'round and round', I would appreciate YOUR thoughts in regard to this. I had several, that I thought about, that may be of interest....or at least a thoughtful exchange with you! Bobert, The tone of your last posts were getting easier to put up with and digest....don't forget to comment on the posts that Sawzaw wanted you to comment on, as with mine. Regards, GfS |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Bobert Date: 28 Jun 11 - 02:43 PM Yo, GfinS... It's one thing to understand what people are feeling and quite another to support policies which will hurt the country... Sure, the Tea Party folks are scared and pissed off... Fine... Those are legitimate feelings that lots of folks have left, right and in between... However, when these scared and pissed off Tea Baggers are organized into a big mob to threaten people, to thwart dialogue, to not be willing to compromise and to carry out the wishes of their masters (Koch brothers, Dick Armey, Freedom Works, Fox, health insurance lobby, etc) without so much as an ounce of respect or understanding for those not "like" them, I have a big problem... And so does the country... There is a reason there are no black faces at the Tea Party rallies... There is a reason there are no Democrats... This mob is not inclusive at all... They are intolerant... They are like Taliban-Lite except when they get carried away and put on their thug hats... The worst part of this is that the folks who pull the strings of the Tea Party purdy much fly under the radar... They have spent hundreds of million$$$ hiring "community organizer", paying rent in office, furnishing buses and literature, etc. and what they have is a lynch mob ready and willing to shout you or me down over any policy that the masters want done away with... In other words: dupes!!! Yes, the Tea Party folks are complete dupes... They are working against their own interests and don't even have a clue what they are doing... What we need in this country is the ***truth***... What we get are lies, lies and more lies... If people are given the truth about a policy then they tend to show their intelligent side... When people are fed horse manure they show their moron side... Right now the Tea Party is being fed 100% USDA Choice horse manure by their masters... As for Sawz, GfinS... Nah, I don't need to address him or read his horse manure... He is a rude person, a cyber stalker and has a severe personality disorder... He is also not honest... The Bible syas there are people like that and tells us to "shake the dust from our robes"... I tried a long time with Sawz and the various people/handles he has been over the years and he is not worth my time... I don't write people off easily but once I do, it's done... B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Don Firth Date: 28 Jun 11 - 07:38 PM Temporary recess from throwing chairs at each other for a little discussion of things musical. I know it's thread drift, but if anyone objects, they can always write their congressional representative, which you should be doing as a matter of course anyway. #### GfS, I agree that Jackie Evancho's singing of Nessun Dorma was excellent. But— Well, let's put it this way. I've been an opera bug since I was in my mid-teens. I have several full length operas on records that I bought back then, and more [CDs] that I've bought recently—and my wife and I have bought season tickets to Seattle Opera (Seattle Opera is supposed to be the fourth largest opera company in the country) since we got married 34 years ago. There is nothing inconsistent about liking opera and singing traditional folk songs and ballads, as some might think. When some folkie comments on the nutty plots of some operas, my response is, "Take a look at some of the nutty plots in the ballads!" In my view, a ballad is like a mini-opera. And an opera is like a ballad on steroids. No inconsistency there at all! I can't help but associate the arias with the characters in the opera who sing them. For example, the well-known aria, La donna è mobile, from the final act of Verdi's "Rigoletto" is sung by the lecherous young Duke of Mantua (tenor), trying to seduce Maddalena, the innkeeper's sister, after having had his way with Gilda. the daughter of Rigoletto, his hunchbacked jester, in the previous act. To hear a woman sing that ("Women are fickle!") along with the rest of the lyrics generally denigrating women, would just be kinda weird. In "Turandot" (taken from an old Persian legend), the title character is the Empress of China. She is obligated to marry and produce an heir, but due to something ghastly that a man did to one of her female ancestors, she has vowed never to have anything to do with men. She has set up a test: any man who comes a-courtin' must answer three riddles. If he answers them, she will marry him. If he fails, she has his head lopped off, put on a pike, and left there for all to see. Quite a deterrent! But she is very beautiful, and also, she IS the empress, and a measure of power goes with being the prince-consort, so guys keep sticking their necks out, so to speak. She's got quite a collection of heads outside her residence, the Forbidden City. Calàf, a young traveler (actually, the Prince of Persia) sees her and falls madly in love. He rings the gong. She lays the three riddles on him, and to her horror, he answers them correctly! She's aghast! But she can't help but notice that he is kind of a hunk, so things could be worse. Neverthless, she's so upset that Calàf offers her an out: a riddle of his own. If she can learn his name before the following sunrise, he'll let her out of the deal and go quietly to the headsman. So on the Empress's orders, the whole palace, all the servants, soldiers, everyone, is up and scurrying about all night, asking people, even torturing people, trying to find out who this young upstart suitor is. With all this running around and general activity in the wee small hours of the morning, Calàf is himself awake and watching. This is when he sings the aria, Nessun Dorma. Rough translation from Italian to English: No one shall sleep! No one shall sleep!Here's the aria in context, sung by Franco Corelli, a handsome young tenor from a few decades back, in a live performance from the stage of the Metropolitan Opera: Fasten your seat belt! Now, musically and vocally, Jackie did a very nice job of singing the aria, and she really got into it, which, I think, is the mark of real talent and real promise. But considering the number of soprano arias there are that she could sing just as well, and which would be thoroughly appropriate to a young woman's singing voice, Nessun Dorma was a really weird choice. On the "Great Performances" broadcast, David Foster indicated that he was "helping" Jackie pick her repertoire, and as I mentioned earlier, I'm sure he chose Nessun Dorma, not because it would show off Jackie's voice to advantage, but because—due to Pavarotti's doing it at the drop of a hat over the last couple of decades—the aria is well known. But—what it's actually all about is not, except to someone who is either familiar with the opera it comes from, or who can understand Italian. I can think of a couple of fairly well-known arias that Jackie could try on for size if she were so inclined. One is Ebben? Ne andrò lontana (please excuse the brief but intrusive commercial at the start) from an obscure opera called "La Wally" by Alfredo Catalani. After many trials and tribulations, the heroine and her lover decide to leave their home village, and it all ends rather badly. They're killed in an avalanche. The aria is well-known, in that it was dug out of obscurity and featured in the French movie "Diva" (1981), that played in art theaters in the U. S. and a number of times on television. Although, to my knowledge, the opera is rarely if ever done anymore, but since the movie, many sopranos have picked it up as a concert or recital piece. Another that is pretty well known these days is Song to the Moon from Dvorak's "Rusalka." A "rusalka" is a water sprite, and this particular one is in love with the local Handsome Prince (strange how they rarely seem to fall in love with the local ugly garbage collector!). She can only come out of the water at night, and he, of course, has no gills. Nor does he even know of her existence. So she is invoking the power of the moon to somehow intercede for her. The opera is based on a Slavic legend or folk tale, and it may be the story that Hans Christian Andersen based his well-known fairy tale, "The Little Mermaid" on. Renée Fleming (the young lady on the videos I linked to) was absolutely furious at Disney Studios for prettying the story up and giving it a happy ending. It's supposed to be a real tear-jerker! Anyhow— I think these two arias are ones that Jackie could do quite well with. That is, if her young voice can handle their vocal demands without pushing it beyond where it should go at this stage of her development. But that would be for her voice teacher, NOT David Foster, to decide. And, of course, if they are songs she might want to sing. #### Okay folks, musical interlude over for now. Back to the usual insults, put-downs, nastiness, and displays of total lack of civility and the ability to reason, and generally behaving with the collective intelligence of a school of excitable piranhas. Don Firth |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Bobert Date: 28 Jun 11 - 10:30 PM Danged!!! Went to a music website and a discussion on, ahhhhhh... ...music broke out!!! Fact is stranger than fiction... B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 29 Jun 11 - 02:38 AM Yeah, well, Bobert, things like that just happen!!........(Praise God!) Don, Thank you for your wonderful response!!! Time constraints, right now, from adequately responding back with all my thoughts, as I read your post..and BOY!..Did some thoughts get triggered!!!..so allow me to better respond tomorrow. I can say, in this brief moment, that from the 'what it's worth department..., For about two years, every school day, on the way to taking the kids to school, I had breakfast with Giorgio Tozzi and his wife Marti. Tozzi is world renown as being in the 'top drawer' of basso/baritones, in the world...and his stellar performance role in 'Faust'. He and his wife were the vocal coaches for,(among others) Neil Diamond, Robert Plant, Barbra Streisand and Frank Sinatra. He also did the voice-over, for the Rogers and Hammerstein's film 'South Pacific', and has toured quite a bit with Howard Keel and Richard Kiley..plus a lot more stuff. During that time, he was the official host to the The Royal Opera from London's Covent Garden, when they visited Los Angeles. I believe, at this time he is living near Scottsdale, Arizona. When we knew him, he and his wife were living in Malibu, California, as was our family. We have since moved. OK, for now...I'll get back to you...and I've got a 'dilly' of a question for ya'! Regards! GfS P.S. ....and all of 'Mudcat' are rubbing their eyes in astounding surprise bewilderment!......Don and GfS???? Yes folks, gravity is just a rumor!! |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Greg F. Date: 29 Jun 11 - 09:08 AM Group linked to billionaire Koch brothers seeks end to New York role in greenhouse gas curb Group linked to oilmen billionaires sues state to pull out of program By BRIAN NEARING Staff writer, Wednesday, June 29, 2011 ALBANY -- A group tied to conservative Kansas petrochemical billionaires who fund campaigns to deny man-made climate change is pushing a lawsuit to kill New York's participation in a program to cut greenhouse gases. The lawsuit seeks to bounce New York out of the Regional Greenhouse Gas Initiative, a 10-state program applied to electric power plants in the Northeast. Filed Monday in state Supreme Court in Albany County, the suit's lead plaintiff is Lisa Thrun, a Buffalo leader of Americans for Prosperity, a conservative political action group supported by oilmen David and Charles Koch that is linked to the tea party movement. RGGI is the nation's first state-level greenhouse gas cap-and-trade program, in which power plants must buy enough state-issued permits to cover emissions of carbon dioxide, which an international scientific consensus blames as the cause of man-made climate change.... Read more: http://www.timesunion.com/local/article/Group-linked-to-billionaire-Koch-brothers-seeks-1445005.php |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Sawzaw Date: 29 Jun 11 - 02:35 PM Profile of racist bigots: Subject: RE: Minority Ignorance From: Bobert - PM Date: 17 Feb 03 - 05:40 PM First of all, I do find the term Negro offensive and patronizing. With that said, I too am concerned about the continued variance on educational and emplyment between blacks and whites. I believe a national discussion on "race" is long overdue and America very much needs to not dance around *slavery*. Slavery still haunts our society some 140 years after the Emancipation Procamation. We also need to refocus resources that will provide hope to the inner city population, black and white. We are not doing a very good job on the. I remember when the "summer jobs" program was funded somewhat adaqutely and it had a level of success. We also need to spend oney on a PR program that offers some alternatives to the "cool" to be either *less cool* or *more cool* depending of ones defination. I think that people who feel disenfranchised are not going to walk the extra mile for acceptance. I'm not say that some won't but the most won't. Unfortuately, we're not going to move on creating a more hopeful society under the current administration. Not that the last one was all that great, but it was way beyond the current administration. Bobert From: Bobert - PM Date: 20 Feb 05 - 09:12 PM I don't consider Condi a "token Negro" but very much a "house Negro" I consider Condi squarely in the "house Negro" category. No racism here [writes himself a pass]... Just fact [another Bobert "fact"]... Condi Rice would be no safer in some of the nieghborhoods I know down in D.C. than Bush, Boss Hog or George Wallace, fir that matter... [does this mean the people in those areas are violent racists?] Bobert From: Bobert - PM Date: 22 Feb 05 - 08:28 AM In a world dominiated by *white guys* it's highly unlikely that a person of color will ever rise to power. Whitey [a pejorative] jus' has the deck stacked against that ever occuring. Oh sure, he'll promote lots of folks to the position of "House Negro" but you can be sure that these folks won't get any higher than that position, Condi being Exhibit A... Bobert From: Bobert - PM Date: 22 Feb 05 - 06:58 PM First of all, Dougie, I know my way around a dojo, so neither House Negro Condi of House Negro Colin scare me in the slightest. If either or both of 'um make a move toward me you'll be helping them up off the floor.[physical threat] No brag. Just fact. Secondly, if they were standing right here, right now in front of me, yeah, I'd confront 'um. They are House Negros. Study a little "History of the South". I took it in college. And that was in Richmond, Va., the capitol of the Confederacy. C & C are very much House Negros in that they do the massa's bidding... They are not folks in power but probably less powerful than the average guy on the street since they have both sold out to whitey [a pejorative]... That's what House Negros do... Sell out... Problem I have with Clarence Thomas isn't that he's trying to get along but with whom... His decisions are not world view decisions... They are, excuse me, "Uncle Tom" decisons... He is, IMO, what was once know as a "Porch (house) Negro" Well danged, pdc, shes a lot easier on the eyes than the other porch negro, Colin Princeton wordnet: whitey, honky, honkey, honkie ((slang) offensive names for a White man) [PM] Sawzaw BS: Popular Views: the Obama Administration (2556* d) RE: Popular Views: the Obama Administration 07 Jan 09 Al Qaeda Plays the Malcolm Card By Salim Muwakkil When media reports emerged that al Qaeda's second in command, Ayman al-Zawahiri, disparaged President-elect Barack Hussein Obama as a "house negro," it angered many in the black community. However, it also struck a chord. The Egyptian physician who is reportedly Osama bin Laden's confidant actually used the phrase "house slave," but it was later translated as "house negro." Al-Zawahiri said, "You [Obama] represent the direct opposite of honorable black Americans like Malik al-Shabazz or Malcolm X," who "condemned the crimes of the Crusader West against the weak and oppressed, and he declared his support for peoples resisting American occupation." The al Qaeda leader said Obama, Colin Powell and Condoleezza Rice "confirmed" Malcolm X's definition of a "house slave." He was referring to Malcolm X's distinction between slave-era "house Negroes," who lived comfortably in the big house abetting white supremacy, and "field negroes," who toiled in the fields under the whip, plotting resistance. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Bobert Date: 29 Jun 11 - 03:54 PM No reason trying to explain race to you, Sawz... Like I have said a thousand times: Take the body of my writings to any professor on race studies and they may have better shot at busting the concrete in your head... BTW, I stand 100% behind everything I have written and have real life experiences to understand things are obviously beyond your intellectual grasp when it come to race, civil rights and farnkly, most everything else in the universe... Now either take my writings to a Professor or Race Studies or shut the heck up... You are like a gnat in many respects and... ...my apologies to gnats every where... B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 29 Jun 11 - 05:11 PM Paul Ryan leases land to Oil Companies who receive subsidies he votes to give them 29. June 2011 - 3:58 A Shocking Conflict of Interest? When Republican Congressman Paul Ryan was asked at a town hall meeting in Waterford, WI, about the need to end subsidies to oil companies, he responded, "I agree." [1] But just one week later, Ryan voted to give Big Oil billions in taxpayer-funded handouts. [2] Now comes the shocking revelation that Congressman Ryan and his family are making thousands of dollars from oil companies that lease their land companies that stand to benefit from the same tax breaks Ryan is pushing. "Newsweek" and the "Daily Beast" reported recently on what appears to be Ryan's shocking conflict of interest: "The financial disclosure report Ryan filed with Congress last month and made public this week shows he and his wife, Janna, own stakes in four family companies that lease land in Texas and Oklahoma to the very energy companies that benefit from the tax subsidies in Ryan's budget plan. "Ryan's father-in-law, Daniel Little, who runs the companies, told Newsweek and The Daily Beast that the family companies are currently leasing the land for mining and drilling to energy giants such as Chesapeake Energy, Devon, and XTO Energy, a recently acquired subsidiary of ExxonMobil. "Some of these firms would be eligible for portions of the $45 billion in energy tax breaks and subsidies over 10 years protected in the Wisconsin lawmaker's proposed budget." [3] Not only has Ryan voted to give Big Oil companies like ExxonMobil billions in government handouts, but as the article notes he has also proposed a 2012 budget that also gives Big Oil billions in special tax breaks. [4] And as the point person on the budget for the Republican House leadership, Ryan has significant sway and influence on the congressional budget process. At a time when middle-class families are feeling the pinch of an economy still on the rebound and state governments are facing massive budget shortfalls, Ryan is asking American taxpayers to continue providing massive government handouts for some of the world's most profitable companies all while his family stands to benefit from some of those same companies' profits. Tell Congressman Paul Ryan that championing special tax breaks for Big Oil while profiting from the oil industry is wrong. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Greg F. Date: 29 Jun 11 - 05:35 PM Jeezis, Sawz, wouldja get a new freakin' hobby horse to ride? |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 29 Jun 11 - 05:36 PM But perhaps there should have been one more corporate catagory. Corporation pays lobbyist hundreds of thousands to funnel millions, to petition politician to rezone your land and 2 cows as a public park, State Governor in exchange for millions in campaign contributions sells newly acquired public land, including 2 public utilities, to corporate fat cat for $1 and other considerations. DEMOCRAT You have two cows. Your neighbor has none. You feel guilty for being successful. You push for higher taxes so the government can provide cows for everyone. REPUBLICAN You have two cows. Your neighbor has none. So? SOCIALIST You have two cows. The government takes one and gives it to your neighbor. You form a cooperative to tell him how to manage his cow. COMMUNIST You have two cows. The government seizes both and provides you with milk. You wait in line for hours to get it. It is expensive and sour. CAPITALISM, AMERICAN STYLE You have two cows. You sell one, buy a bull, and build a herd of cows. BUREAUCRACY, AMERICAN STYLE You have two cows. Under the new farm program, the government pays you to shoot one, milk the other, and then pour the milk down the drain. AMERICAN CORPORATION You have two cows. You sell one, lease it back to yourself and do an IPO on the 2nd one. You force the two cows to produce the milk of four cows. You are surprised when one cow drops dead. You spin an announcement to the analysts stating you have downsized and are reducing expenses. Your stock goes up. FRENCH CORPORATION You have two cows. You go on strike because you want three cows. You go to lunch and drink wine. Life is good JAPANESE CORPORATION You have two cows. You redesign them so they are one-tenth the size of an ordinary cow and produce twenty times the milk. They learn to travel on unbelievably crowded trains. Most are at the top of their class at cow school. GERMAN CORPORATION You have two cows. You engineer them so they are all blond, drink lots of beer, give excellent quality milk, and run a hundred miles an hour. Unfortunately, they also demand 13 weeks of vacation per year. ITALIAN CORPORATION You have two cows but you don't know where they are. You break for lunch. Life is good. RUSSIAN CORPORATION You have two cows. You drink some vodka. You count them and learn you have five cows. You drink some more vodka. You count them again and learn you have 42 cows. The Mafia shows up and takes over however many cows you really have. TALIBAN CORPORATION You have all the cows in Afghanistan , which are two. You don't milk them because you cannot touch any creature's private parts. You get a $40 million grant from the US government to find alternatives to milk production but use the money to buy weapons. IRAQI CORPORATION You have two cows. They go into hiding. They send radio tapes of their mooing. POLISH CORPORATION You have two bulls. Employees are regularly maimed and killed attempting to milk them. BELGIAN CORPORATION You have one cow. The cow is schizophrenic. Sometimes the cow thinks he's French, other times he's Flemish. The Flemish cow won't share with the French cow. The French cow wants control of the Flemish cow's milk. The cow asks permission to be cut in half. The cow dies happy. FLORIDA CORPORATION You have a black cow and a brown cow. Everyone votes for the best looking one. Some of the people who actually like the brown one best accidentally vote for the black one. Some people vote for both. Some people vote for neither. Some people can't figure out how to vote at all. Finally, a bunch of guys from out-of-state tell you which one you think is the best looking cow. CALIFORNIA CORPORATION You have millions of cows. They make real California cheese. Only five speak English. Most are illegal. Arnold likes the ones with the big udders. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Bobert Date: 29 Jun 11 - 06:10 PM Forget Paul Ryan fir a minute... Michelle Bachmann not only takes federal farm subsidies money but has also come up with her own BIG LIE about it... Even though the money goes into the partnership account for which she takes "draws" (money) she says that the money she takes isn't the same money that the feds give her family... Hey, it is co-mingled with other funds and that makes her statements about it very suspect... Thanks, Greg F... Yes, Sawz does need to get another hobby horse... B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Sawzaw Date: 29 Jun 11 - 07:07 PM "Take the body of my writings to any professor on race studies" Who? where? Like I have asked a thousand times. You won't answer. Another bluff. Another excuse for racist comments and bigotry. You take your racist, hatefilled statements and project them on other people. You are bigoted and you will not tolerate anyone elses point of view you you try to demonize them for things you concocted. Is that what these professors on race studies do? Blame other people for shit they said? The guy you projected the KKK and Al Quaeda on has more in common with you than the KKK or Al Quaeda. You tell people they have to be afraid of those Tea Party racist killers and then claim THEY are the ones spreading hate and fear. This is a Marxist tactic known as "ritual defamation". Perhaps the professor I need to see to approve your racist statements is in Lenningrad. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: John P Date: 29 Jun 11 - 07:26 PM Sawzaw, calling Bobert a bigot defines how thoroughly you are willing to assign incorrect meanings to things you read. It appears that this disability affects other aspects of you intellectual life, like your understanding of politics, economy, and science. You may want to see a doctor, or apply for a disability pension. Or you could just pay more attention . . . |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Bobert Date: 29 Jun 11 - 07:40 PM That about sums it up, John... When I was a social worker in "adult services' in Richmond my caseload was heavily tilted toward clients with mental illnesses... And I learned more than I'd like to know about metal illnesses... There was a clinical term, "personality disorder", that kinda became the catch-all for illnesses that couldn't be better defined... Sawz, at the very *least* has a "personality disorder"... Maybe worse than that, I donno... But, I agree that he needs some serious counseling and maybe some med for his OCD (obsessive compulsive disorder)... It's sad... I mean, if you look at his 2:35 post what jumps out is that Sawz is well beyond discussions... He probably has pieces of paper all over an entire wall of things I have said not only here in Mudburg but at other websites as well... This post alone would get a judge in Virgina considering a "green warrant" to have him hauled in for "evaluation" at the mental health facility... Like I said, "It's sad" but... ...glad it ain't me... B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Sawzaw Date: 29 Jun 11 - 08:02 PM Tell us professor of race studies Bobert, are these racist statements? "Is you their black-haired answer-mammy who be smart? Does they like how you shine their shoes, Condoleezza? Or the way you wash and park the whitey’s cars?" "Blacks and Hispanics are 'too busy eating watermelons and tacos' to learn how to read and write." "Kiss A Nigger Good Morning." Or an example of Ritual Defamation? Were these the words of a Tea partier or a redn**k racist? A liberal or a conservative? A democrat or a republican? You have the podium and we are anxiously waiting for your learned response. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Sawzaw Date: 29 Jun 11 - 08:18 PM "You may want to see a doctor, or apply for a disability pension." Or stand up for the truth. Bigot: a person who is intolerant of any ideas other than his or her own, esp on religion, politics, or race. Now please show me where Bobert has shown any understanding or tolerance toward anyone who has a different opinion? He calls them ignorant, mentally ill, evil, they don't understand what he said, liars. Does A real intellectual person make personal attacks instead of supporting their assertions with any facts. I understand Bobert's position. He is a product of his environment. He can have any opinion he wants. What I object to is his constant false claims about other people's position including mine. He hates him. They want to kill so and so. I can determine such things on my own and I don't need a self righteous racist stoner 'shine guzzler drumming up racist ideas and statements and attaching them to others. Bobert keeps claiming racism is so prevalent and it is getting worse etc. yet he is the one promoting it. If it is getting worse it is because of people like him that can never get it out of their mind. Racism will never die with racists like Bobert perpetuating it. I think he needs a new hobby horse to ride. Something else to make him feel important and better than other people. Something else to feed his ego. Just read right here in this thread how many people have told him he is wrong. And how many have agreed. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Bobert Date: 29 Jun 11 - 08:42 PM Hey, GfinS... My computer still don't want to play any music but keep firin' my way... I'll get a teenager to fix it soon enough and then go back and enjoy 'um all... B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Don Firth Date: 29 Jun 11 - 09:48 PM Sawzaw, I have not followed all of this thread. It's getting more and more tedious, and my hip-waders are being repaired. But as a historical thing, I've been on Mudcat since late 1999, and Bobert arrived here about two years later. I've read a lot of his posts. He has a colorful way of expressing himself. But I think I know him well enough to know that he is, in no way, shape, or form, a racist. In fact, he characteristically shows care and concerned for all people regardless of race or circumstances. But he does not suffer fools gladly. Nor, for that matter, do I. Now, you often do not answer questions he puts to you (you keep accusing him of the same thing, so that's a wash), but you DO have a history of being very insulting to those who have the temerity to disagree with you. AND of trying to divert a discussion that you find a bit uncomfortable by throwing accusations. So I put your own question back to YOU:"Does A real intellectual person make personal attacks instead of supporting their assertions with any facts.[?]" I must confess, I have not read all of Bobert's posts. Nor do I generally read yours, because by now, I already know pretty much where you are coming from and what you are going to say—and, for that matter, where you got what you say. But as one who has been accused often of being things I'm not or believing things I don't by people such as you (those who, when backed into a corner without a good answer, pull out the red herrings and start firing accusations), I am asking you to provide solid evidence for your accusations. Go back and find the posts where Bobert said these things and link to them, or note the date and time when he is alleged (by you) to have said them, so that we can go to them and read them ourselves—and if he actually DID say what you say he did, we can read the context within which he said them (that can make a huge difference) and determine for ourselves whether YOU are telling the truth or if you are following your frequent practice of dodging an issue by slandering someone else. In short, Sawzaw, put up or shut up! Don Firth |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Bobert Date: 29 Jun 11 - 10:15 PM Thank you, Don... I have repeatedly asked Sawz to keep things in context... That is exactly why I felt that if he would run off a copy of all of my statements regarding race and take them to a real college professor who teaches "race studies" that maybe, just maybe, Sawz would actually learn what I am talking about... Hey, Bill Clinton tried to get tghis conversation started back in '96 and America wasn't up to it... With our history and our here-and-now we owe it to ourselves to have this conversation... But I am preaching to the choir with you, Don, because you are fully aware of what I am talking about here... Sawz??? No so... He is clueless... The problem with Sawz is that his mind closed down a long time ago and so he is stuck with a Value system that cannot be changed no matter the circumstance... In other words, he is a reactionary meaning that anything new is the enemy that must be dispatched... When I said that it is "sad" I meant it from the depths of my heart... It is sad when ever people kick their lives into nuetral, accept everything that think they know as the "truth" and are unwilling to learn new stuff... Paul Simon got it right in "Sounds of Silence" when he wrote "Sealed dead in my armor, I touch no one and no one touches me, I am a rock, I am an island"... Very sad... Will Sawz take you up on your proposal, Don??? No, he won't... He is an "Ah-hah-gotcha" ballgamer and my body of work here (and elsewhere) regarding race doesn't play into his ballgame and even if he were to put together my entire body of work he has so marginalized himself that no one would read it... That's his problem... Not mine... B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 29 Jun 11 - 10:45 PM Jeez!! GfS |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Don Firth Date: 29 Jun 11 - 10:52 PM Okay, Sawz, the ball's in your court. Don Firth |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Sawzaw Date: 29 Jun 11 - 11:09 PM "Go back and find the posts where Bobert said these things and link to them, or note the date and time when he is alleged (by you) to have said them, so that we can go to them and read them ourselves." I already have but here it is again: Subject: RE: Minority Ignorance From: Bobert - PM Date: 17 Feb 03 - 05:40 PM First of all, I do find the term Negro offensive and patronizing. With that said, I too am concerned about the continued variance on educational and emplyment between blacks and whites. I believe a national discussion on "race" is long overdue and America very much needs to not dance around *slavery*. Slavery still haunts our society some 140 years after the Emancipation Procamation. We also need to refocus resources that will provide hope to the inner city population, black and white. We are not doing a very good job on the. I remember when the "summer jobs" program was funded somewhat adaqutely and it had a level of success. We also need to spend oney on a PR program that offers some alternatives to the "cool" to be either *less cool* or *more cool* depending of ones defination. I think that people who feel disenfranchised are not going to walk the extra mile for acceptance. I'm not say that some won't but the most won't. Unfortuately, we're not going to move on creating a more hopeful society under the current administration. Not that the last one was all that great, but it was way beyond the current administration. Bobert From: Bobert - PM Date: 20 Feb 05 - 09:12 PM I don't consider Condi a "token Negro" but very much a "house Negro" I consider Condi squarely in the "house Negro" category. No racism here [writes himself a pass]... Just fact [another Bobert "fact"]... Condi Rice would be no safer in some of the nieghborhoods I know down in D.C. than Bush, Boss Hog or George Wallace, fir that matter... [does this mean the people in those areas are violent racists?] Bobert From: Bobert - PM Date: 22 Feb 05 - 08:28 AM In a world dominiated by *white guys* it's highly unlikely that a person of color will ever rise to power. Whitey [a pejorative] jus' has the deck stacked against that ever occuring. Oh sure, he'll promote lots of folks to the position of "House Negro" but you can be sure that these folks won't get any higher than that position, Condi being Exhibit A... Bobert From: Bobert - PM Date: 22 Feb 05 - 06:58 PM First of all, Dougie, I know my way around a dojo, so neither House Negro Condi of House Negro Colin scare me in the slightest. If either or both of 'um make a move toward me you'll be helping them up off the floor.[physical threat] No brag. Just fact. Secondly, if they were standing right here, right now in front of me, yeah, I'd confront 'um. They are House Negros. Study a little "History of the South". I took it in college. And that was in Richmond, Va., the capitol of the Confederacy. C & C are very much House Negros in that they do the massa's bidding... They are not folks in power but probably less powerful than the average guy on the street since they have both sold out to whitey [a pejorative]... That's what House Negros do... Sell out... Problem I have with Clarence Thomas isn't that he's trying to get along but with whom... His decisions are not world view decisions... They are, excuse me, "Uncle Tom" decisons... He is, IMO, what was once know as a "Porch (house) Negro" Well danged, pdc, shes a lot easier on the eyes than the other porch negro, Colin Princeton wordnet: whitey, honky, honkey, honkie ((slang) offensive names for a White man) If you are refering to these: "Is you their black-haired answer-mammy who be smart? Does they like how you shine their shoes, Condoleezza? Or the way you wash and park the whitey’s cars?" "Blacks and Hispanics are 'too busy eating watermelons and tacos' to learn how to read and write." "Kiss A Nigger Good Morning." I did not attibute them to Bobert. I merely asked him to tell us if they were left or right wing racist statements. Of course anyone with a modicum of computer savvy can go to Google and put the phrase in quotation marks and usually find out where a quote came from. Not always true with mudcat content but sometimes it works. And while you are Googling up who said what, find out where I have ever issued a racist remark or called Bobert ignorant. I have always said we should drop all references to race so we can put racism behind us. I have always said we need to find thing we agree on so we can have a return to civility. I have always treated Bobert with respect for his view points unless he is claiming (projecting) hateful racist viewpoints on others. Bobert is not an evil person. He thinks he is doing something good and he has a lot of zeal but it is misguided. He promotes the very thing he claims to hate, racism and he cannot detect a fact from propaganda. Nor can he back up anything the asserts. He just makes a wicked assertion. refuses to back it up, attacks anyone that dares to ask him to back up what he says and moves on to the next assertion. The most amusing thing is he does exactly what he is accusing other people of doing but he grants himself the right to do so. Note that in Feb 03 Bobert makes a great humanitarian speech about how racism is wrong but by Feb 05 he is rolling in it like a hog in mud. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 29 Jun 11 - 11:10 PM http://www.2012theawakening.com/?p=1459 Oh, and Don, I still want to ask you a couple questions about your opinion on Jackie's performance of 'Nessun Dorma'. One question, would be, Do you think Puccini would disapprove or be offended, of her, or a female vocalist performing it...even after hearing that performance? Same question to you....I have written some pieces that a friend suggested the same, and I've considered it..but I wanted to know YOUR opinion. GfS |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Sawzaw Date: 30 Jun 11 - 12:30 AM In true Bobert style he claims someone else's "mind closed down a long time ago and so he is stuck with a Value system that cannot be changed no matter the circumstance... In other words, he is a reactionary meaning that anything new is the enemy that must be dispatched..." when it applies exactly to him. When has Bobert put forth any proposal on how people can come together and get along peacefully? Is that in his value system? Any solutions to racism? Are racist statements in my value system? Is racism in my value system? You are welcome to point it out. I agree with the guy that said" I have already condemned, in unequivocal terms, the statements of Reverend Wright that have caused such controversy. For some, nagging questions remain. Did I know him to be an occasionally fierce critic of American domestic and foreign policy? Of course. Did I ever hear him make remarks that could be considered controversial while I sat in church? Yes. Did I strongly disagree with many of his political views? Absolutely - just as I'm sure many of you have heard remarks from your pastors, priests, or rabbis with which you strongly disagreed. But the remarks that have caused this recent firestorm weren't simply controversial. They weren't simply a religious leader's effort to speak out against perceived injustice. Instead, they expressed a profoundly distorted view of this country - a view that sees white racism as endemic, and that elevates what is wrong with America above all that we know is right with America; a view that sees the conflicts in the Middle East as rooted primarily in the actions of stalwart allies like Israel, instead of emanating from the perverse and hateful ideologies of radical Islam....." Notice where it says "a profoundly distorted view of this country a view that sees white racism as endemic" Is that my view or Bobert's view? Amen Mr. Obama. People who keep making everything into a racial issue are the racists and bigots. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 30 Jun 11 - 03:11 AM Sorry, I got the 'linky' working.....UI was going to correct it sooner.. Meanwhile, back at the ranch.................... GfS |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 30 Jun 11 - 03:21 AM Oh, and just a thought, being as the tone is who is a bigger 'racist', "One man's ceiling is another man's floor! Love for your fellow man is really quite color-blind. The degree in what level you're at, may have something to do with your 'peer environment'...If that it part of the problem, make adjustments, and move forward..taking whatever wasn't 'love for your fellow man', and just throw it away....make the correction, and thank each other for pointing that out, for each other, because it might be better to be a racist, who corrected, than stuck with denial, and arguing about it!!...besides, it is limiting as to gaining higher intelligence!! GfS |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 30 Jun 11 - 04:42 AM Don, Allow me to re-phrase: Oh, and Don, I still want to ask you a couple questions about your opinion on Jackie's performance of 'Nessun Dorma'. One question, would be, Do you think Puccini would disapprove or be offended, of her, or a female vocalist performing it...even after hearing that performance? Same question to you....I have written some pieces that a friend suggested the same, and I've considered it because I write for both male and female vocalists...just that some were suggested to be sung by the other, than which it was originally created...but I wanted to know YOUR opinion. GfS |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Bobert Date: 30 Jun 11 - 08:07 AM See??? More cherry picking by our resident screwball... Ho hum... B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Sawzaw Date: 30 Jun 11 - 12:30 PM Ho Hum="anything new is the enemy that must be dispatched" You are welcome to present some facts cherry picked or not if you can back them up. I find Obama's words on racism uplifting. I find Bobert's disturbing and depressing. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 30 Jun 11 - 01:58 PM Bobert: "See???" What is this?..blind leading the blind??..OR.. ' Take the beam out of your own eye, before trying to remove the splinter, out of your brother's'....(You recognize that don't you?).. Absolutely no offense intended! Here, re-read this and consider it deeper..... From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 30 Jun 11 - 03:21 AM Oh, and just a thought, being as the tone is who is a bigger 'racist', "One man's ceiling is another man's floor! Love for your fellow man is really quite color-blind. The degree in what level you're at, may have something to do with your 'peer environment'...If that it part of the problem, make adjustments, and move forward..taking whatever wasn't 'love for your fellow man', and just throw it away....make the correction, and thank each other for pointing that out, for each other, because it might be better to be a racist, who corrected, than stuck with denial, and arguing about it!!...besides, it is limiting as to gaining higher intelligence!! GfS |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Don Firth Date: 30 Jun 11 - 06:04 PM Sawzaw, much of what you are citing as evidence of Bobert's "racism" are his observations on the way things ARE, whether we like it or not. Some people might be offended by some of the terminology he uses (quotes), but I find it interesting that most of the people who seem to get their noses out of joint over what they perceive as "racism" are white. Examples: I used to sing a song called "Black Girl" (or "In the Pines") that I learned from a Lead Belly record. And I've heard other white singers sing it as well. Some, out of fear if possibly "offending" someone, have castrated the song by changing "black girl" to "little girl." I'm not inclined to do that sort of thing. Within recent years, I've had people come up to me (wearing their PC Police badges) and display various degrees of outrage for singing a "racist" song, telling me at the very least that, as a white man, I have no right to sing that song. ALL of these people were WHITE. I sang this song for Lynn and Rosetta, both young black women, one of whom I worked with for over eight years, and for Harold and Verlon, two black men of my acquaintance, and they told me that they found nothing offensive about the song, nor did they feel that the race of the singer made any difference whatsoever. "By all means, go ahead and sing it," Rosetta told me. "It's a very touching song." Richard Dyer-Bennet was criticized once for singing "John Henry," saying that this was a "black song" and that he, as a white man, had no right to singing it. Dyer-Bennet responded by informing his critic that John Henry was a legendary black man, and that by singing the song, he (Dyer-Bennet) was a narrator telling the story of John Henry—and that the racial or ethnic background of the narrator is irrelevant. I have heard Condoleezza Rice referred to as a "house Negro" (and even as a "house nigger"—and you will note, Sawzaw, that like Bobert, I am quoting, and this says nothing about MY views at all) by blacks themselves, many of whom considered her something of a sell-out. Sawzaw, DO toss your PC Police badge in a drawer and get some perspective on the real world. And instead of dodging the issue by going off on ad hominem attacks, try sticking to the point. Don Firth |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 30 Jun 11 - 07:51 PM Listen to the WHOLE commentary . The last part was interesting..for MSNBC! GfS Hey Don??..No comment about the 'Nessun Dorma' post?? |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Bobert Date: 30 Jun 11 - 08:50 PM Again, Don hits the nail on the head... This thread is about the terror-istic tactics of of the Tea Party... Much of what they have done or have threatened to do goes back to the KKK... It is entirely appropriate for me to talk about race because I have a perspective that I doubt anyone here in Mudburg has which includes: 1. Coming from a family that was engaged in civil rights very early... My mom's first demonstration was in 1961 and her first arrest in 1963... 2. Having a black kid brought into our family and live with us as a brother and family member... 3. Attending an inner city college with black people... 4. Organizing anti-war and civil right demonstrations in the 60s with black folks, SOC, the Black Panthers, the White Panthers (Free John Sinclair), SCLC, etc... 5. Worked one year during college for the local CAP (Community Actipon Program) as a community organizer in a black housing project... 6. After graduation from college working 3 years in an inner city drug rehab half way house and working in as a jail house GED teacher in the Richmond City jail... (Note: In both of these I was a lone white face...) 7. Working the next 14 (or so, might have been 13 or 15 years) years as a social worker working with predominately black clients... 8. During most of these years I lived with or among black folks... 9. Since then I have lived in and around mountain people, hillbillies & rednecks... 10. But also since then I have made several pilgrimages to Mississippi where I met and learned to play blues from the older black musicians and put in 7 years (every Saturday) as a regular at Archie Edwards barbershop in NE Washington D.C playing music with black blues players... Bottom line??? All of my life's experiences have given me a perspective on race that I'd dare say few white guys my age have any idea of... Yeah, sometimes I do take shortcuts in my explanations of how things are because I think I am talkin' with folks who have some level of understanding about race, civil rights, our own history, including slavery, Jim Crow, Brown v., Plessy v., the 14th amendment, the Civil Rights Act, Dixiecrats, the Southern Strategy, nooses in high schools, ect., etc... I lived and worked and partied and loved almost exclusively with black folks, including my brother, the late Joesph Washington who lived as part of our family for almost 30 years and when things changed there I continued my relationship with black people with with my music right up until now... But it isn't what I have done but what I have learned and read and internalized... I mean, with very little work I could probably teach "race studies"... Maybe without any work... These are the things I have brought to Mudcat, a lily white folkie website where the single black person who ventured in ventured back out... I keep in touch with her and she knows just who I am... That is something that a lot of white folks don't get... There's a rhythm and a look that I learned way back when that is part of me... When I see black folks who I don't know (especially with the folks who remember the terrorism of Jim Crow and the KKK) and make eye contact there is a little nod (secret handshake) between us that lets us both know that we ***were there***... I wouldn't expect sawz ot too many folks here to understand what I am talking about but any professor in "race studies" could talk about it... It's a non-verbal connection that we both understand what has gone down... This is the last post I am going to post on my past and why when I talk about race I am actually talking about the kinds of things that any "race studies" professor would be talking about... Yes, I do use language that people might find offensive... You can't teach "race studies" without stepping on some toes and offending some people... It is impossible... Lastly, I stand behind everything I have ever written here or on any website... Taken out of context, yeah, it can be twisted much the way the right wing creep twisted Ms. Sherrod's statements about her initial reactions to trying to help white clients... That was twisted to serve a political point... I don't care about political points... They will win you battles but won't win any wars... They are temporary... What I offer is from my soul and my history... It is of value to anyone who is willing to push aside their egos to score points and has any interest in learning things about race and civil rights that they missed along the way... Too bad that the Tea Party has so overtly filled in where the Klan left off... It's bad for everyone... Bad for America... I can't change that... All I can do is offer my knowledge in the hopes that someone (any one) gets it... Enough said... There won't be a repeat of this testimonial... B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: GUEST,Guest from Sanity Date: 01 Jul 11 - 12:04 AM Gosh look what happens, DURING A COMPETITION, when these two, and you see it, begin to blow off the fact that they are competing, and just sing TOGETHER!! I saw them do it live, and it blew me away!! remember now, only one could win..and look what happened! GfS |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Sawzaw Date: 01 Jul 11 - 03:53 AM "This thread is about the terror-istic tactics of of the Tea Party" It is about Bobert's terror tactics to try to discredit the Tea party using a person that had nothing to do with the Tea party. Bobert was the originator of the racist comments. He was not quoting anybody. He uses racist terms and is therefore a racist. His comments are in direct conflict with obama's comments do either Bobert id full of shit or Obama. Which is it? I am going with Oabma. I don't always agree but I am able to to say what I agree with and what I don't agree with unlike the tribal thinking Bobert. Bobert is too chicken shit to say Obama is wrong or to admit he is wrong. He beleives he can over ride the opinion of a black person with his own "superior" thoughts. Right there is the proof of racisim. Democrats act as if they "own" black people because they "saved" them from slavery by opposing the Republicans when in fact they fought to keep them in slavery as long as they could in opposition to Republicans who voted in Civil rights laws and then enforded them in opposition to Democrats. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Sawzaw Date: 01 Jul 11 - 04:33 AM Still not finished with that last post. Because Democrats believe they "own" black people, they get blinded with rage when they see a black person that does not fit into the stereotype they have created for black folks, dumb, incapable of running their own life and devoted to Democrats who take care of them. When they see a Condi or a Clarence Thomas whom they consider off the reservation, uppity negros, not following their rules for blacks, the racial slurs come out and their racism is exposed. Right there is your institutionalized racism. in the Democratic party. LBJ: "I'll have those n***ers voting Democratic for the next 200 years" Tea Party Member Kevin Jackson: "As a black man, I love it when ignorant white women like Janeane Garofalo speak for all blacks. It's thrilling to me that Janeane would take time out of her busy Hollyweird life to protect me and my peeps-the downtrodden, the oppressed-the lowly Negro. For her efforts, I thank Garofalo, and anoint her Janeane Garofalo: White Chick Protector of the Lowly Negro. Who better than she to offer such protection? Garofalo, after all is an American hero! And I bet you were wondering who could possibly replace the likes of Barbara Streisand or Susan Sarandon-Madonna? Garofalo is so in touch with the black condition, that she is uniquely qualified to assess and understand my people's "condition." Her intimate knowledge of blacks allows her to interpret how blacks think, and then translate "black-think" for the rest of America. "Cuz Lawd knows, we kaints do dis for ourselfs." One source of Garofalo's insights into the black community, ergo the "black condition" is no doubt from Hollywood, as she is a product of that culture. Garofalo probably has in her movie collection films like Cleopatra Jones, the black heroine who is oppressed by the man. What 'White Chick Protector of the Lowly Negro' collection would be complete without Superfly. Talk about learning how to stick it to the man, Superfly is the boilerplate, dare I say the 'White Chick Protector of the Lowly Negro' roadmap on how to stick it to the man. Further, Ron O'Neal, the actor who played Superfly, the black protagonist of the movie could easily be the predecessor for our first half-black president. Who can argue that Obama is indeed 'sticking it to the white man?' The irony of Garofalo's comments is that they point directly at her own racist party: The Democrats! I am always amazed at how well Democrats argue the tenets of racism'against themselves. The party that founded the Ku Klux Klan has the nerve to proselytize to Republicans about racism. Democrats have done nothing, repeat nothing for blacks, except to exploit blacks for Democrats' own racist agendas. If you don't believe me, look at, well'Janeane Garofalo! Garofalo is a failed comedian, a hack of an actress, a failed radio talk-show host, and essentially has been out of the mainstream since making B-movies that had the viewership of an Olbermann segment on MSNBC! I get more views on my YouTube videos of racist Democrats picking lent from their navels and eating Cheetos. Admittedly those are funny, and the hit count is rising. In typical racist Democrat elitist fashion, Garofalo feels the need to meddle in the black community. I can't imagine a life where I wake up in the morning and say something like, 'I think today I will read an article on [insert oppressed here], and then go on [insert oppressed here] TV to protect those pitiful, stupid, weak [insert oppressed here]. Kevin you are a wonderful man for caring about these people who obviously have no spokesperson, and can't protect themselves! I love me some ME! Such is the life of a racist Democrat elitist. Protectors of the World oh, and their own agendas! Here's the wrap: Black people should be up in arms over the idea that Garofalo thinks we are so weak, that we cannot defend ourselves. A group of people who survived slavery and the institutionalized racism of the Democratic Party, but we need the White Chick Protector of the Lowly Negro. Further we should be offended that she is meddling not for us, but for her own benefit. She thinks we are stupid enough to support her lame attempt to exploit us. Are there not real black issues on which Garofalo could have been working in the black community that could have positive impact? I doubt it, since five decades of blacks voting Democrat have fixed all of the black community's problems. Finally, and perhaps most absurd of all is Garofalo actually proves herself to be not only a racist, but the worst kind of racist an ignorant racist. She obviously knows nothing about the overwhelmingly racist history of her own party, and its decimation of black people. Black people, wake up. What you have here is a no talent racist hack arguing for you, when there is no real issue. And it doesn't take a genius to connect the dots on this one. Garofalo is the prototypical elitist, who believes blacks to be weak and stupid. With those perceptions of blacks, she is the perfect representative of the racist, elitist Democrat Party. How did we survive without them?" |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Bobert Date: 01 Jul 11 - 10:42 AM BTW, Sawz... You a a LIAR of the HIGHEST ORDER!!! You are so ignorant that you are clueless as to just how eat-up stupid you are and the worst part about it all is that you... ...are proud to be eat-up ignorant and stupid... Get off your high horse and learn something, man... Take a course in "race studies" and until then just SHUT THE FUCK UP!!! People here don't need to see you act out your stupidity, your ignorance, your obsessive compulsive disorder and what ever other mental problems from which you suffer... Have a nice day, LIAR of the HIGHEST ORDER!!! B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Don Firth Date: 01 Jul 11 - 05:04 PM It seems pretty obvious to me that Sawzaw has started a FLAME WAR against Bobert. A quick check shows me that he has been posting on Mudcat since September or 2008, and out of over 2,600 posts, he has posted on a MUSIC THREAD and that was to ask what the difference is between Steeleye Span and Steely Dan. Other than that, what, exactly, is Sawzaw actually doing here on a Music website? Much of the time he has been here, he has fairly obviously been making it a special point to rag on Bobert at every opportunity. It looks a whole lot like STALKING to me! I suggest totally ignoring him. At least until, and unless, he learns to behave like a civilized human being. #### OKAY, EVERYONE! BACK TO YOUR CORNERS! IT'S TIME FOR A MUSICAL INTERLUDE!! Hey, GfS! You still there? My opinion, for what it's worth: I don't think Puccini would disapprove, necessarily, of Jackie Evancho's performance of Nessun Dorma , and he certainly wouldn't be offended. I think he would identify her as a very promising singer, and one to keep his eye on as she grew and developed as a singer. He, and other opera composers, often wrote the parts in their operas with a specific singer in mind. For example, Mozart wrote the part of The Queen of the Night in "The Magic Flute" with a particular coloratura soprano in mind. He wanted the aria to be a show-stopper, and he knew the singer he was thinking of could hit all the high notes he wanted to put in it (practically dog-whistle range, and the highest note for a soprano in any opera written so far!). But as to Jackie's singing that particular aria, I'm pretty sure Puccini would think pretty much as I did. That she did it very well, but other than singing it in a concert situation, she would never really be able to do anything else with it. She certainly couldn't sing it in the actual opera, because she would also have to sing everything else written for the part, wear the costumes, and act the role as well. Not real convincing if done by an eleven-year-old girl. And whenever she sang it in concert or recital (as a regular musical performance rather than being presented as, essentially, a child prodigy, the audience members who are familiar with it (and that would be almost all of them) couldn't help but think, "That's a tenor aria. Why is she singing it?" No matter how marvelously she did it, there would always be a noticable "clank!" there. She would be far better off learning arias that she might actually be able to use later on if she goes into a career in opera. Or musical theater. And there are quite a few songs and arias from both genres that she could sing quite impressively, without having to dip into songs written specifically for a male singer. Puccini wrote operas that are quite popular with opera-going audiences ("La Bohème," "Madama Butterfly," "Tosca," "Girl of the Golden West," and a number of others), and beautiful and dramatic as they are, with a few exceptions, they are generally considered relatively easy on the voices of opera singers. In addition to o mio babbino caro from "Gianni Schicchi" that that Jackie burst into the limelight with, there is Chi il bel sogno di Dorettafrom his short opera, "La Rondine" ("The Swallow"). I think this would be within her abilities, but her voice teacher should be the one to make that determination. Here's one of the world's great divas, Kiri Te Kanawa, singing it: CLICKY. I'm afraid I don't quite grasp the rest of your question. As far as writing songs for a specific gender or type of voice is concerned, I think who should sing the song and who really shouldn't depends on a number of factors. It would be a bit odd to hear a male singer sing Nelly Forbush's song from "South Pacific," "I'm Gonna Wash That Man Right Outta My Hair!" Would kinda make you wonder a bit (but let's not go there!). Or for that matter, a light soprano singing "Ol' Man River." Although I have heard female singers do "Some Enchanted Evening" and bring it off quite well. A lot depends on the song and the context. Don Firth Okay, everybody! Back to your customary uncivilized behavior!! |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Sawzaw Date: 01 Jul 11 - 05:14 PM "Let a black man become president and it's time for the "revolution" buy guns, lots of ammo and learn to shoot straight 'cause these rednecks mean to kill people who ain't like them... they are out there preachin' violence, people feek empowered to think that violence is perfectly okay. If the rednecks want out that bad then don't let the door hit ya'll on the way out... Ya'll allready have the highest divorce rates, the highest obesity rates, the highest health care costs, the dumbest people, the most per cpaital federal tax dollars returend to ya'll so ya'll becoming a drain on the rest of the country.... Yeah, if ya'll want out then fine with me... I rather live in an ara where people ain't brought up thinking that the government owed them everything while criticizing the hand that feeds 'um... I mean, these people couldn't survive 30 days without the northweat and west coast paying in the bigass $$$s that in turn got dooled out to them... Bunch of ungratefull crybabies as far as I can see... BTW, the US now is 18th in high school graduation rates in the top 24 industrialized countries... Come to where I live an' you'll understand in about 10 minutes... I mean, I never thought I'd see our country so dumbed down... I mean, eat up with stupidity and ignorance and the worst part about it is that the Repubs have lived at the "Elitist (eductaed) plate" for so long that there are entire regions that think that education is stupid???? Gee what a refreshing new humanitarian slant on "reality" First of all Bobert, you do know how education works in other countries don't you? Being so learned you must know that if a student does not pan out academically they are shunted off to Vocational school can never graduate from high school and are not included in those stats of yours. Sometimes they are split 3 ways, high school, general education and vocational. Now suppose you, having learned all about bogus statistcs in a **college course**, add them to the number of people that did not graduate from high school in those other industrialized countries. The US is the only country that tries to force every student through high school and many of them drop out. But I am not going to arrogantly assign you homework and demand that you have to prove I am right. I am actually going to reject blowhardism and back up my facts. The majority of Europeans spend at least nine or ten years at school. It is where they gain the basic knowledge, skills and competences that they need throughout their lives, and the place where fundamental attitudes and values develop. Schools should set their pupils on the path to a lifetime of learning, if they are to prepare them for the modern world. A sound school education system also helps ensure open and democratic societies by training people in citizenship, solidarity and participative democracy. Dang, you know right there off the top, it sounds like over half of Europeans never get past 10th grade. Even less if they count Kindergarten. The United States public school system is so different from public school systems in other nations that comparisons of student achievement almost certainly lack any validity. For one thing, enrollment rates differ sharply. Elementary school education is compulsory throughout the world and enrollment rates approach 100% as they do in the United States. Enrollment rates at the middle and high school levels, however, average a mere 58% in the rest of the world, compared to a rate of more than 96% in the United States, where academic secondary school education is compulsory and universal. Thus, most secondary school systems in other countries are self-selective, automatically weeding out low achievers when they reach the age of 12 or 14 and either sending them off to labor, as they do in thirdworld countries, or to apprenticeships or vocational schools, as they do in the more advanced, industrialized nations such as France, Germany and Japan, among others. The process allows only the academically gifted to remain in academic high schools to compete in international testing with a far more average cross-section of American high school students. The American public school system is unique in that it is the only system in the world attempting to provide universal, academically oriented education to a massively heterogeneous student population of rich, poor, English- speaking, non English-speaking, white, minority, handicapped, learning disabled, hearing or visually impaired, emotionally disturbed and mentally retarded sometimes all in one building or classroom. Average achievement levels rise in schools with relatively advantaged, homogeneous student populations. It is not difficult to understand that the achievement level will be higher in classrooms with students who speak the same language, are equally healthy and wealthy, and from whom all disruptive children have been culled. The chances are nil of achieving the same academic results in a student population without similar advantages. If such comparisons have little statistical validity, they do, however, bring to the fore the question of whether the American public school education system should be doing what it is trying to do or whether it should convert its system to one more akin to those of Europe or Japan. So now perfesser Bobert, you can take the podium and support your "facts" |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Sawzaw Date: 01 Jul 11 - 05:27 PM Dear Me Firth: Take check on how many times Bobert has flamed me and I have resisted flaming him back. And your once only once is incorrect plus BS is separate from the music and tech forums. I have never once called him stupid or ignorant which he is not. I am not the only one that has assailed his "facts" or drew his anger because he could not shut them up. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Bobert Date: 01 Jul 11 - 05:41 PM Tahnks, Don... Stalking is exactly what it is... Sawz would like folks to think this is a two way thing... If it was then I'd go back and refresh threads just to attack Sawz when in fact I have never done that... I really don't give a rat's ass about sawz except when he's going thru his little cyber-psychotic episodes... Here's the real deal: check out how many times Sawz has refreshed an old thread just to stalk me??? Dozens... Perhaps a hundred, I donno and don't much care... BTW, before he came here as Sawz he was Dickey (or something like that) and before that he was Old Guy (or something like that)... I mean, he does constantly marginalize himself here with various handles and then has to re-register as someone "new"... Oh well, enough... You an' GfinS knock yerselves out with that "highbrow (lol) music"... I'm just a bluesman and the P-Vine's love slave (lol), I mean, chauffeur & gopher... B~ |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Sawzaw Date: 01 Jul 11 - 07:13 PM Borelli: "I'm a black, female conservative. I'm often targeted by individuals who call me all kinds of names: racist, an Uncle Tom, a traitor - you name it. I'd like to know if the NAACP will issue a statement condemning those individuals who were doing that." Shelton: "Why, yes, ma'am Just give us some details The very broad answer is yes, we repudiate anybody calling you a bad name in the political arena." Shelton added that the NAACP repudiated past assaults on Bush Administration cabinet members General Colin Powell and Dr. Condoleezza Rice. In 2004, then- NAACP President and CEO Kweisi Mfume said, "attacks on Rice by the radio host and political cartoonists who use stereotypes and racial caricatures are just as bad as those who hide under sheets and burn crosses. This is something the NAACP has fought against for more than 95 years and something we will continue to oppose." Mfume was understood to be referring to WTDY-Madison radio host John "Sly" Sylvester calling Rice "Aunt Jemima," cartoonist Ted Rall calling Rice President Bush's "house nigga," cartoonist Garry Trudeau calling her "Brown Sugar" and cartoonists Pat Oliphant and Jeff Danziger drawing her with accentuated black features and a rural dialect. Sylvester also called Colin Powell "Uncle Tom" on the air. In response to Shelton's request to Borelli for details, a letter from Borelli was delivered to Shelton's office on July 28. In it, Borelli described some racist statements made against her and other Project 21 members and attached a packet of e-mails and postings on the Internet in which she and other Project 21 members have been called "Uncle Tom," "Auntie Tom," "Sambo," "house negro," "treasonous," "black tea-bagging ni**er," "sell out," "retarded," "hypocritical," "coon," "Stepin Fetchit," and a "modern day mammy," "despicable piece of garbage," "black cancer" and "black bitch." Among the samples of emails sent to Borelli and forwarded to Shelton was this: You faggot niggas need to be lynched by the Klan. I pray a nightrider strings up every one of you no count good for nothing niggas, it would serve you right for trying to think that these crackers love you. I hate a house nigga worse than I do a Klansman. Rot in hell you scurvy dogs. I would laugh to see you body strung up. It would save us real brothers the time and trouble to do it. Borelli also told Shelton: As we both seek a more civil debate, I am sure you are as appalled by these statements and the many others like them as I am. And I once again want to thank you for your on-air agreement on July 17 that the NAACP will specifically condemn the slurs made against me because I am an outspoken black conservative woman. We very much appreciate having the weight and prestige of the NAACP behind an effort to stop this unwarranted, unfair and uncivil treatment of people based solely on their political beliefs and skin color. |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Don Firth Date: 01 Jul 11 - 07:56 PM This comes from the web site of the The National Leadership Network of Black Conservatives' "Project 21," from a document complaining to the NAACP, demanding that they somehow put an end to black conservatives receiving e-mails containing messages of this type. Since Sawzaw has not made clear what his intent is by posting this material here, from his history, particularly on this thread, it appears to me that what he is trying to do is imply that Bobert is somehow associated with sending these messages. I'm beginning to find Sawzaw's transparently vicious attempts at slander absolutely contemptible. Don Firth |
|
Subject: RE: BS: The Tea Party a Terrorist Organization?? From: Don Firth Date: 01 Jul 11 - 08:06 PM From an article on trolling and flaming on the internet: "One motive (of trolls and flamers) is the desire for attention and for self-entertainment derived at the expense of others. Posted flame-bait can provide the poster with a controlled trigger-and-response setting in which to anonymously engage in conflicts and indulge in aggressive behavior without facing the consequences that such behavior might bring in a face-to-face encounter.The article goes into considerable detail as to the kind of techniques that trolls and flamers are prone to, but it concludes with the best way to handle trolls and flamers. "Follow the oft-given but rarely taken advice, 'Don't feed the troll!' No matter how outrageous or insulting they are being, don't respond.Works for me. Why don't we all give it a shot? Don Firth |