Allan Taylor mystery

Subject: RE: Origins: Morning Lies Heavy (Allan Taylor)
From: Zimmerman
Date: 19 Feb 10 - 09:27 PM

Allan Taylor complaining about unpaid royalties is a bit rich coming from someone who did the very same thing to Brighton songwriter Miles Wootton who co-wrote some of his early songs.

---

Note from Joe Offer: some messages were moved from another thread to consolidate all messages on the subject, which appears to be a personal matter between Allan Taylor and Miles Wootton. I will reopen this thread only on request from Allan Taylor or Miles Wootton.
-Joe Offer-

Subject: RE: Origins: Morning Lies Heavy (Allan Taylor)
From: Effsee
Date: 19 Feb 10 - 11:16 PM

Oooooooh!..."Allan Taylor complaining about unpaid royalties is a bit rich coming from someone who did the very same thing to Brighton songwriter Miles Wootton who co-wrote some of his early songs."...

This could be good!
More info Z?

Subject: RE: Origins: Morning Lies Heavy (Allan Taylor)
From: GUEST,Tony C
Date: 20 Feb 10 - 06:21 AM

Is this true? Who is Miles Wootton?

Subject: Allan Taylor mystery
From: srothman
Date: 20 Feb 10 - 06:59 PM

In a previous thread there were some questions raised as to Allan Taylor's probity. In response to a question about the origin of one of his songs Mr Taylor himself clarified its meaning and then added:

The Record company B.G.O. have released "The Lady" on which this song is recorded (it's a double CD, twinned with "Sometimes"). Dave Bulmer has bought the rights to "The Traveller", which he has released on CD and never paid royalties, "Roll on the Day" and Circle Round Again".

To which Zimmerman cryptically replied:
Allan Taylor complaining about unpaid royalties is a bit rich coming from someone who did the very same thing to Brighton songwriter Miles Wootton who co-wrote some of his early songs.

What's all that about?

The full thread is here

Subject: RE: Origins: Morning Lies Heavy (Allan Taylor)
From: Acorn4
Date: 20 Feb 10 - 08:43 PM

Don't know much about the Alan Taylor/Miles Wootton situation but I seem to recall that there was a bit of a problem between Miles and Fred Wedlock about not being given due credit as writer of one of his songs.

Miles was one of the founders of folk comedy and wrote some incredible funny songs and parodies. I remember being in stitches at a club he used to perform at in Preston Circus Brighton in the early seventies - "The Village Production of Hamlet" was a masterpiece of comedy.

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: GUEST,Allan Taylor
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 07:09 AM

To Zimmerman whoever the hell you are; Get your facts right; All songs written by Allan Taylor and Miles Wootton were copyright by Warlock Music with royalties split evenly between Allan and Miles. Check with the Performing Rights Society and you will be informed that there is no way royalties can be denied to one party of the agreement. To confirm; all royalties due to Miles have been paid. As for my claim about Dave Bulmer; check with the Mechanical Copyright Protection Society and you'll find that at no time has Dave Bulmer applied for a licence to press The Traveller, thereby resulting in no royalties being paid to Allan Taylor.
I rarely reply or correspond on this forum, but when someone (who will not identify himself) makes such unsubstantiated claims about my conduct I feel I have to put the record straight.
Allan Taylor

Subject: RE: Origins: Morning Lies Heavy (Allan Taylor)
From: s&r
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 07:30 AM

I hope Allan doesnt't mind my copy pasting his letter on a separate thread:

"To Zimmerman whoever the hell you are; Get your facts right; All songs written by Allan Taylor and Miles Wootton were copyright by Warlock Music with royalties split evenly between Allan and Miles. Check with the Performing Rights Society and you will be informed that there is no way royalties can be denied to one party of the agreement. To confirm; all royalties due to Miles have been paid. As for my claim about Dave Bulmer; check with the Mechanical Copyright Protection Society and you'll find that at no time has Dave Bulmer applied for a licence to press The Traveller, thereby resulting in no royalties being paid to Allan Taylor.
I rarely reply or correspond on this forum, but when someone (who will not identify himself) makes such unsubstantiated claims about my conduct I feel I have to put the record straight.
Allan Taylor"

Stu

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: Leadfingers
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 08:21 AM

Well Said Allan ! Knowing Miles , I am sure he wouldnt lie back and let anything go , so its nice to know the facts !

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: Rasener
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 08:37 AM

Well said Allan. See you later in the year.
Les Worrall

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 10:20 AM

Well spoken Allan.

This kind of forum is not the right place for third-parties to raise this kind of issue, whether there's any truth in it or not. It's a private matter between the parties directly concerned, and should remain so. Their arrangements and agreements are their own business, no-one else's.

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: MC Fat
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 10:33 AM

I've always found Allan to be a genuine guy so it is nice when someone is spreading pure bollocks about something that they are put in their place. Anyway apart from that my missus spotted Allan at the Beth Neilsen Chapman gig at York the other week hope Allan enjoyed it a much as 'our gert' did.

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: The Sandman
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 11:50 AM

well said Allan,quite frankly I am really fed up by the personal attacks ,made by guests[who are hiding behind a cloak of anonymity],and who persistently get their facts wrong.
why dont they just fuck off.Dick Miles

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: Georgiansilver
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 12:03 PM

srothman... I guess you have just been labelled troublemaker... flamer.... maybe a little more thought before posting would not go amiss. Why did you feel you needed to raise this a an issue???. Beats me!!!!!

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: SunrayFC
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 12:08 PM

yet another Madcat thread going into the adversarial abyss

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: Leadfingers
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 01:57 PM

Hang On Lads !! srothman simply asked for clarification of zimmerman's post ! If you want to slag any one , try him !

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: The Sandman
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 04:25 PM

that is who I was slagging and all the other pathetic[guests hiding under a cloak of anonymity] tossers who make personal attacks on this forum.

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: alex s
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 04:35 PM

It's a disgrace that potentially libellous statements are allowed on this forum.
We really need more editorial control to stop this nasty nonsense.

I once asked Allan if we could sing his songs and he said "feel free, just give me a mention". Does that sound like a grabber?

He's Mr Nice Guy - leave him alone!

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: SunrayFC
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 04:41 PM

I was reprimanded for using CAPITALS and also for not including "UK" in my titles.

that's the extent of editorial control!

others who make this a forum for slaggin people off seem to be more welcome.

Crazy, or what!

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: Leadfingers
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 06:19 PM

Far too much 'What' !

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: Zimmerman
Date: 27 Feb 10 - 08:03 PM

My apologies are due to Allan Taylor. His reply on the subject of royalties is unequivocal and based on fact.

My earlier post was based on rumours that were circulating years ago when I lived in Sussex. After years of working in an office full of of tittle-tattle I should be old enough to know better.

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: Backwoodsman
Date: 28 Feb 10 - 01:40 AM

Nasty things, rumours. And frequently completely untrue. Best ignored and not perpetuated.

Time to let this one die, eh?

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: doc.tom
Date: 28 Feb 10 - 05:05 AM

And graciously apologised, Zimmerman. Respect.

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: alanabit
Date: 28 Feb 10 - 05:35 AM

Time to bury this thread?

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: GUEST,Allan Taylor
Date: 28 Feb 10 - 06:16 AM

ToZimmerman, thanks for having the good grace to offer your apology which is accepted on the same terms. End of subjuct.
Allan

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: Betsy
Date: 28 Feb 10 - 07:15 AM

Well said Allan , I've known him well for many years and my opinion he's as straight as any one around .I trust this matter has not caused him undue upset.

Joe Offer - as Allan has written above - End of Subject

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: GUEST,Miles Wootton
Date: 28 Feb 10 - 04:01 PM

I have no wish to be involved,but, as my name appeared, here are 2 hard and verifiable facts:
(1)Francoise Hardy recorded "Sometimes" (by myself and Allan Taylor) but my name did not appear on the discs.

(2) On her lyrics website it says: "Sometimes" - "Paroles/Musiques Allan Taylor."

The "Paroles" are mine.

Miles Wootton

Subject: RE: Origins: Morning Lies Heavy (Allan Taylor)
From: Bernard
Date: 28 Feb 10 - 04:43 PM

Link to other thread.

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: srothman
Date: 01 Mar 10 - 08:30 AM

Well, well. Miles Wootton's post seems to vindicate the much vilified Zimmerman, whose apology for his earlier remarks now seems very generous.

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: GUEST,Allan Taylor
Date: 01 Mar 10 - 09:17 AM

This is becoming tiresome! What Miles says is no doubt true, but it must be obvious to anyone who understands this business that I have no control over Francoise Hardy's album cover design or her lyrics website. I was not even aware of it. It is the publisher's job to control these things (this is one of the reasons Miles and I signed the publishing contract more than 40 years ago) - I do not control any of the songs Miles and I wrote together; I have never claimed sole authorship and I have no control over how the royalties are paid - this is solely controlled by the publisher, PRS and MCPS. As far as I know there are no royalties due on any of the songs Miles and I wrote together but if there are they will be paid by the publisher, PRS and MCPS.and shared equally. Also I have no control whatsoever over how our songs are accredited in public.
Finally, I would ask anyone (srothman?)who feels they have to involved in this (surely there must be other things to do in your life) not to make unsubsantiated accusations, but to check your facts, identify yourself, stand by your statements and prepare to be sued.
Once again, Zimmerman's apology was appreciated. This will be my last communication on the subject.
Allan Taylor

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: Tim Leaning
Date: 01 Mar 10 - 09:43 AM

Hey up Betsy are you gonna go to Staithes this year?

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: GUEST,Miles Wootton
Date: 01 Mar 10 - 02:56 PM

Tiresome though it is, Allan,we are concerned only with the truth.
I forgot to mention two things.
(1) You accompanied Francoise Hardy on her recording of our song, so you must have mentioned me. Or did you?

(2) I sent you an e-mail at 22.43 on the 18th Oct. 2009 asking: "Have you received royalties from my lyrics to "Sometimes" as recorded by Francoise Hardy?"I added:" I would be very happy to be proved here, from someone who was once a close friend, that my assumptions are wrong" You never replied.

If you have the nerve to reply now on this website, this "Tiresome" broadcast might cease.

Miles Wootton

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: srothman
Date: 01 Mar 10 - 08:22 PM

Allan Taylor has declared: This will be my last communication on the subject Which is a pity because if he were reading this forum I would like to see his response to Miles Wootton's post.

And since Mr Taylor got nasty and threatened to sue me I would also ask him in relation to the Francoise Hardy recording: did you share the royalties with Miles Wootton or not? You didn't reply to his email - maybe you have fallen out with him - so maybe you could do so publicly, here.

And I would also remind him that it wasn't me who made "unsubstantiated accusations" - I was only picking up on an implication in the aforementioned Zimmerman post that royalties had not been paid to a co-writer - and in the fraternal, idealistic world of folk music this sounded a jarring note, an explanation of which I felt to be in the public interest.

Further, I would suggest to him that he appears to have a track record of airbrushing Mr Wootton out of his musical career. I don't own any A.T. albums but, having checked his own website, notice that there are no writing credits for his first album. In the meantime I having made some enquiries regarding his discography I am told (by friends with more catholic tastes than mine) that this album contained several songs co-written with Miles Wootton but that this is the only one that does not have the meticulous authorship acknowledgements of every succeeding one. And then, when it was reissued in a later compilation, all tracks are credited to him.

Lastly, I would accuse him of obfuscation when he says:
I have no control whatsoever over how our songs are accredited in public.
I simply don't believe this. Are we to understand that, if another musician recorded one of his songs and claimed it as his own, he would simply shrug his shoulders and ignore it?

What a pity that he won't be here to put the record straight.

Subject: RE: Allan Taylor mystery
From: Joe Offer
Date: 01 Mar 10 - 08:28 PM

Well, Comrade Rothman is certainly out of line, as is "Zimmerman" (although I note that Zimmerman has apologized, while Rothman continues to stir the pot). If either Miles or Allan were to ask me to close the thread, I'd do so in a second. If Miles or Allan hadn't participated, I would have closed the thread. But if they wish to continue the disagreement, that's their business.
On second thought, here's what I think I'll do: I'm going to move all the messages on this subject over to this thread, and then I'm going to close the thread. If either Miles or Allan wants it reopened, they can contact me by e-mail. It's up to Miles and Allan to settle this themselves, and it's none of Rothman's business, is it?
-Joe-
[e-mail]